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16-bit Butt-Head
Dec 25, 2014
the flintstones crossover owns because its the most low effort thing ever and everyone keeps calling wrestling "sports entertainment" because vince hates the word wrestling lmao

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TheSwizzler
May 13, 2005

LETTIN THE CAT OUTTA THE BAG
That term always bugs me. All sports are entertainment!

16-bit Butt-Head
Dec 25, 2014

TheSwizzler posted:

That term always bugs me. All sports are entertainment!

its very stupid and no normal person will ever ask anyone if they watch sports entertainment but vince is crazy and has a whole list of words you cannot say on an episode of RAW or Smackdown

16-bit Butt-Head
Dec 25, 2014
you can't say the word belt on WWE television

TheSwizzler
May 13, 2005

LETTIN THE CAT OUTTA THE BAG
I remember being a fan during the monday night wars, and I remember the WWF always made a big deal about how WCW would confiscate signs/pipe in cheers etc, but since the wars ended WWE definitely leaned into that kinda undermining of the audience's preferences. Now they have sign police, weird vincespeak ("superstars and divas" is/was dumb as hell), and they literally use the same "crowd pop" audio file repeatedly, over and over again.

It's not at all weird that Vince is a hypocrite, but it is kinda weird how they did away so strongly with the fan-oriented presentation given how well it worked out for them when they made it a point to do that.

Not that I expect the post-Vince company to be much better

shadow puppet of a
Jan 10, 2007

NO TENGO SCORPIO


I miss wwe ppvs ending in instant total silence after the three count because they had to kill every single mic in the arena to stop the deafening anti-Roman boos making it to air.

Elephant Ambush
Nov 13, 2012

...We sholde spenden more time together. What sayest thou?
Nap Ghost

16-bit Butt-Head posted:

you can't say the word belt on WWE television

poo poo like this is so hilarious because like, if you can't say "belt" and you don't like the term then why have belts at all? just retire them and give people trophies or plaques or watches or anything else that's not a belt

and i think i said this before itt but if vince hates wrestling so much and he considers the wwe to be a "global entertainment company" then why is there still a wrestling ring in the middle of every show he's ever done? why not get rid of all the stuff he hates and do things he doesn't hate?

SirPhoebos
Dec 10, 2007

WELL THAT JUST HAPPENED!

Elephant Ambush posted:

poo poo like this is so hilarious because like, if you can't say "belt" and you don't like the term then why have belts at all? just retire them and give people trophies or plaques or watches or anything else that's not a belt

and i think i said this before itt but if vince hates wrestling so much and he considers the wwe to be a "global entertainment company" then why is there still a wrestling ring in the middle of every show he's ever done? why not get rid of all the stuff he hates and do things he doesn't hate?

Because as delusional as Vince is, he knows that's the only thing that he can actually make a profit off of, which makes him hate it all the more.

Sydney Bottocks
Oct 15, 2004

SirPhoebos posted:

Because as delusional as Vince is, he knows that's the only thing that he can actually make a profit off of, which makes him hate it all the more.

He's basically struck gold by tapping into the pop culture zeitgeist not once but twice with Hulkamania and the Attitude Era; and yet he still resents the knowledge that at the end of the day all he is, or will ever be, is the biggest carny on the fairgrounds

16-bit Butt-Head
Dec 25, 2014

Elephant Ambush posted:

poo poo like this is so hilarious because like, if you can't say "belt" and you don't like the term then why have belts at all? just retire them and give people trophies or plaques or watches or anything else that's not a belt

and i think i said this before itt but if vince hates wrestling so much and he considers the wwe to be a "global entertainment company" then why is there still a wrestling ring in the middle of every show he's ever done? why not get rid of all the stuff he hates and do things he doesn't hate?

its called a title not a belt... and they are called title opportunities not title shots

16-bit Butt-Head
Dec 25, 2014

TheSwizzler posted:

I remember being a fan during the monday night wars, and I remember the WWF always made a big deal about how WCW would confiscate signs/pipe in cheers etc, but since the wars ended WWE definitely leaned into that kinda undermining of the audience's preferences. Now they have sign police, weird vincespeak ("superstars and divas" is/was dumb as hell), and they literally use the same "crowd pop" audio file repeatedly, over and over again.

It's not at all weird that Vince is a hypocrite, but it is kinda weird how they did away so strongly with the fan-oriented presentation given how well it worked out for them when they made it a point to do that.

Not that I expect the post-Vince company to be much better

you can't say diva on WWE television anymore

gbs but from 2004
Oct 24, 2004

wow u rude pig

"i STarTed this TOIlEt Of A tHreaD aNd HAve sOmEHOW aVoidEd A red teXt"

16-bit Butt-Head posted:

you can't say diva on WWE television anymore

*writes AEW in the air with my finger then spits in Vinces face*

TheSwizzler
May 13, 2005

LETTIN THE CAT OUTTA THE BAG

16-bit Butt-Head posted:

you can't say diva on WWE television anymore

Not entirely against that, it was weird phrasing to start with, a Diva is a female entertainer who's difficult to deal with

Were they trying to say that Lita would slap some poor PA in the face because she got the wrong bottled water?

TheSwizzler
May 13, 2005

LETTIN THE CAT OUTTA THE BAG
Also its kinda a shame that Michelle McCool retired before they fixed women's wrestling. She was okay in the ring but a pretty fantastic heel

16-bit Butt-Head
Dec 25, 2014
its good they dont call the female performers divas anymore but most wrestlers, male and female, are divas and should be called that imo

TheSwizzler
May 13, 2005

LETTIN THE CAT OUTTA THE BAG

16-bit Butt-Head posted:

its good they dont call the female performers divas anymore but most wrestlers, male and female, are divas and should be called that imo

From experience, I'd say psychopaths

16-bit Butt-Head
Dec 25, 2014

TheSwizzler posted:

From experience, I'd say psychopaths

you have to be a pyschopath, stupid or both to want to be a wrestler in the first place

TheSwizzler
May 13, 2005

LETTIN THE CAT OUTTA THE BAG

16-bit Butt-Head posted:

you have to be a pyschopath, stupid or both to want to be a wrestler in the first place

What's odd is that I did some production work for a small promotion recently and the workers were actually p. cool/chill people you could play board games with

But when I actually was full timing in the late 90s-early 00s, yeah no it was rife with violent lunatics who'd down a fifth of vodka and talk about how it was bullshit you weren't allowed to rape rookies any more like Ronnie Garvin used to

16-bit Butt-Head
Dec 25, 2014

Jamesman posted:

But yeah, it's not surprising to me at all that WWE would gently caress it all up, especially WWE now. But I do wonder about something. Why is it things like Kane and the Undertaker worked and have stood strong for decades, but other, similar characters are short-lived? Are they just seen as Undertaker/Kane knock-offs and don't stand on their own? Would Undertaker and Kane even be things if those characters showed up in the last ten years?

i think people often forget that kane and the undertaker have been in some of the worst wrestling storylines and matches of all time and imo if it wasnt for the streak, nostalgia and a few good matches neither of them would be as well-remembered as they are now. and even the streak has the undertaker getting choloformed by Giant González and the match being ruled as a DQ lmao.

TheSwizzler posted:

But when I actually was full timing in the late 90s-early 00s, yeah no it was rife with violent lunatics who'd down a fifth of vodka and talk about how it was bullshit you weren't allowed to rape rookies any more like Ronnie Garvin used to

:kstarehair:

16-bit Butt-Head fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Mar 12, 2022

TheSwizzler
May 13, 2005

LETTIN THE CAT OUTTA THE BAG

It was some cargo-cult poo poo about "paying your dues" and "respect for the business", but there was really only a couple real "old timers" there, the guys beating that drum usually had a 2-5 years in the business but they were going all-in on some extreme (I'd say criminal) levels of hazing. There was a big rush of people trying to be wrestlers around that time, and they ran the gamut from actual athletes to tough rednecks, with some spindly nerds mixed in, so anyone who had a hint of "seniority" was trying to force any possible competitor to their "spot" out. It might have been the most toxic work environment I have ever seen.

I actually managed to have a short chat with Jim Cornette about the region, and how literally nobody from that era in the territory made it big, and even his old school, old man yells at cloud self called the place a toxic snake pit, and that he knew it was operating with the same culture as a maximum security prison

Animal-Mother
Feb 14, 2012

RABBIT RABBIT
RABBIT RABBIT

16-bit Butt-Head posted:

you can't say the word belt on WWE television

At least this kind of makes sense. The old redneck wrestlers would always come out and shout, "I'M GUNNA TAKE THAT BELT OFFA YOU, BOY!" as if the actual prize of the competition was the belt itself and not the championship it represented.

Jamesman
Nov 19, 2004

"First off, let me start by saying curly light blond hair does not suit Hyomin at all. Furthermore,"
Fun Shoe

16-bit Butt-Head posted:

i think people often forget that kane and the undertaker have been in some of the worst wrestling storylines and matches of all time and imo if it wasnt for the streak, nostalgia and a few good matches neither of them would be as well-remembered as they are now. and even the streak has the undertaker getting choloformed by Giant González and the match being ruled as a DQ lmao.

Well that's kind of my point though. I made plenty of posts highlighting some completely insane Kane stories so I'm not oblivious that he and Undertaker were subjects of terrible storytelling. I just don't really know why those characters were allowed to exist for so long (of course, Taker famously became BikerTaker for a few years, and Kane really strayed from his origins), where other characters are so quickly abandoned.

juggalo baby coffin
Dec 2, 2007

How would the dog wear goggles and even more than that, who makes the goggles?


did anyone mention the weird joker angle Sting had in TNA?

like he got so beat up for that half an hour while he waited for his guys to run in and save him that he became insane, and then he had the TNA title belt and had written like 'deception' on the belt and was saying "OOOO DECEPTION WHAT DOES IT MEAN? I AM TWISTED NOW EHEHEHEHE"

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.

TheSwizzler posted:

It was some cargo-cult poo poo about "paying your dues" and "respect for the business", but there was really only a couple real "old timers" there, the guys beating that drum usually had a 2-5 years in the business but they were going all-in on some extreme (I'd say criminal) levels of hazing. There was a big rush of people trying to be wrestlers around that time, and they ran the gamut from actual athletes to tough rednecks, with some spindly nerds mixed in, so anyone who had a hint of "seniority" was trying to force any possible competitor to their "spot" out. It might have been the most toxic work environment I have ever seen.

I actually managed to have a short chat with Jim Cornette about the region, and how literally nobody from that era in the territory made it big, and even his old school, old man yells at cloud self called the place a toxic snake pit, and that he knew it was operating with the same culture as a maximum security prison

Reminds me of, of all things, current day YA author Twitter. Complete with nobody making it big because no one wants anything to do with that snakepit.

Cornwind Evil
Dec 14, 2004


The undisputed world champion of wrestling effortposting
Gavok talked about CM Punk. Makes me think.

When I was nine years old, I was sent to a private school. It had three classes of students: normal ones who treated it like a normal school, boarders who stayed the week but got to go home on weekends, and weekend boarders whose parents lived further away and only went home on holiday breaks. I ended up being the last one permanently by the end of my time there, though this happened during the beginning. Weekends, at least, were relaxed times: you didn’t have to wear uniforms, there were no classes, we got to watch movies and go out on various funtime excursions, and we could use ‘contraband’ material that weren’t allowed in school during the week. When I started, the weekend overseer, who also looked after the older boy’s dorm, had a ‘box’ where he’d keep all the ‘pseudo-contraband’, like my Game Boy, and on Friday after classes ended and most of the students had left the school he’d bring it out and leave it on a table, keeping an eye on it. So one week I decided to poke through the box: as long as I stayed right there and no one complained, I could at least look at the items in it. Those items, I discovered? Included this.



And thus was my entry into this crazy, carny, messed up world.



This is Bret Hart.



The Hitman. The Excellence of Execution. The Best There Is, The Best There Was, And The Best There Ever Will Be.

My first ‘guy’. The one I always supported. To this day. I might have liked Hogan as a kid, but that opinion changed. My opinion on Bret Hart has never changed. I don’t much see what he could do or be revealed about him that would change it.

I mentioned CM Punk, because I’m going to sadly talk about the moment that defined Bret’s whole career, for better or for worse. Yeah, you guessed it. CM Punk, more or less, got screwed. I'm sure some of you know what that heralds.



We’re gonna be talking about the Montreal Screwjob.



I will be honest and up front, if I haven’t been already.

Like I said, I’m a Bret Hart mark. I am severely biased towards him. I am probably not the person to give a wholly neutral viewpoint of one of wrestling’s most infamous moments, especially since a lot of my information on certain things comes from Bret’s own autobiography. But I’ll at least give it a try, like Bret tended to do.

Bret Hart is not a perfect man. Bret Hart did bad things. He was an unfaithful husband, who might well have been too wrapped up in his own problems to notice his first wife might have had bipolar disorder (this is a wholly armchair assessment, but based on how Bret’s accounts had her so quickly snapping from calm to a negative extreme in seconds, I do wonder). Like Cornette, he had a certain view of the business that he was loathe to deviate from. And of course, there’s the old accusation that Bret’s someone who took the business too seriously, that he didn’t recognize it was all carny bullshit and drank his own flavor aid that he was really a hero to people, instead of playing one on TV. It’s always tempting to make excuses for the ones you personally care for (and I’ll probably do it anyway). Still, when you compare the actions, deeds, and recounts of other people of many other top wrestling stars, Bret’s a darn near saint. You’re free to disagree with me and present counter evidence. I acknowledge your position, but I won’t be changing mine. Not on this. And I think I’m allowed.

It’s a classic tragedy, actually. A man who believed in the purer parts of the business, of trust and unity to create a greater whole, being stabbed in the back by the business’ nastier, darker, and possibly, true aspects, that being of a bunch of con men who will always default to self interest. How did this happen? Did Bret, in some ways, ask for it, or really should have seen it coming, save for his own blinders?

Hard to say. Even Bret’s own word is a tad suspect. His book was released in the late 00’s, and I really feel that Bret was in a dark place at the time. While he’d somewhat mended fences with the WWE at the time, been inducted into their hall of fame, gotten his own dedicated DVD box set to the best of his career, and recovered a great deal from the stroke he’d suffered a few years after his wrestling career ended, his second marriage had also ended, and I feel like going through all the events again to put them on paper opened up old wounds. There’s a grimness hanging over the book’s last quarter, with Bret saying in the final chapter that he was never going to forgive Shawn or Hunter for what they did in the business nor to him. Of course, Bret did end up making a return to the WWE in 2011, and hopefully, like it was presented, he buried the hatchets and old grudges that weighed down the last part of his book. I think it’s been mentioned he might be working on an updated re-release or a new autobiography; maybe that would shed some fresh light on things.

Still, that’s how it ended. After it went down. How’d it start?



Did Bret Hart have an abusive childhood?



I would say under the traditional concept of the definition, no.

Did Bret Hart have a DYSFUNCTIONAL childhood?

That, I can say without doubt, is a yes. Every unhappy family is unhappy in their own way, and you can probably trace the Hart family unhappiness through Bret’s life.

Most would probably focus on Stu Hart, the patriarch of the wider Hart family of twelve, with Bret being the eighth child, and his infamous ‘Dungeon’, where he trained wrestlers or tortured them, depending on who you ask, stretching them horrendously and generally making their lives more difficult then it probably had to be. Exactly what Stu’s actions sprang from, I’ll never know. The kinder suggestion is that Stu was marked by his own upbringing, an extraordinary hard-scrabble and poverty stricken one in the cold fields of Canada’s province of Saskatchewan, and that he believed that your potential, or the fact that you were wasting his time, would be best brought out under intense duress, and he just didn’t know any other way nor was he in any situation that could have taught him otherwise. The less kind one is that the immensely hard life made him a mean bastard with a ton of negative emotions that he took out on everyone, including his trainees and his kids. Who can say for sure? I bet if I asked the surviving Hart family members I’d get a different answer from all of them. That black and white picture above? According to Bret, one of the kids (his brother Dean) is looking up instead of at the camera because Stu just cuffed him behind the ear for 'acting up'.

Still, from what I have seen, family matriarch Helen might well have played her own subtle, but also large role. On the surface, she just seemed like a normal loving mother, and maybe she was. But, if one tries to read between the lines and draws assumptions (which are just that, pure hearsay), it’s possible she was something of an enabler and a hoarder. What does being a possible hoarder have to do with her family? Well, Helen ended up having twelve kids. She allegedly wanted FIFTEEN, and only medical issues kept her from succeeding in that regard. Hoarding comes in many forms, and between that and the later state of the Hart family house as per repeated accounts from different people, it’s possible that Helen saw a giant family as part of the possessiveness she might have had, especially if you take a not so kind viewpoint on how Stu treated the family and maybe, her.

And even if we cut Stu and Helen some slack, there was the fact that they ended up a ‘wrestling family’. As the many accounts of the scumfuck nature of the business say, in the end that’s almost certainly going to end in more tears and tragedy then triumph. Hell, the Harts got off lucky compared to the Von Erichs, and I would take Stu over Fritz Von Erich, where being a ‘wrestling family’ debatably killed four of the six sons of the family (all of them driven into it by their father, and them being heroes in Texas for years not being enough to keep their demons from consuming them), one dying as a child in an unrelated incident and with one survivor. And even discounting THAT, there’s just the strange incidents that happen in life.

Case in point: the firstborn son and oldest of the Hart brood, Smith. Smith’s life, based on other accounts, can charitably be called “troubled”. You could otherwise call him “a complete gently caress up” who did numerous stupid, short-sighted things and then just blundered on to do more of them. Why was he like this? Innate personality flaws? That, combined with the dysfunctional Hart family life? Something else? There’s a something else there that Bret recounts in his book, that he didn’t find out until decades after it happened. Shortly after Smith had been born, his parents were in a severe car accident, and Smith was taken in by Helen’s mother and sisters to be looked after until they recovered. Except, when they had recovered, Helen’s mother and sisters wouldn’t give him back. Instead, they doted on him as their little angel and prince for several YEARS, until Smith was four, he had two younger brothers he’d never met with another on the way, Stu planned to move to Calgary, and had to actually drive up to New York from Florida to literally take his son back from his mother and sisters in law because they literally wouldn’t give him back to his own parents. Why they chose this, and how accurate it is, who knows? But going from such a soft, pampered life to the much harder discipline and need-to-share-attention life of the Hart family might well have shaped Smith for the rest of his life. Bret described him as “a bully who didn’t want to grow up”, and that was in spite of Stu trying to shape him into a family leader. Whatever it was, we’ll never know, as Smith passed away in 2017. Like I said. Dysfunctional.

Smith wasn’t the only one, of course, Third son Bruce would have his own demons, namely an utterly massive chip on his shoulder and a need to show off ‘what he could do’. This led to him constantly trying to gain spotlight when he didn’t ‘deserve’ it’; a good example would be the Survivor Series match in 1993 where Bret would team up with him, Owen, and other brother Keith to face Jerry Lawler and his ‘Knights’ as part of the long feud that had begun between Lawler and Hart back in June…except shortly before it happened, Lawler would be accused of sexual assault and pulled from the match, hence rendering the whole point of it moot. He would be replaced, perhaps fittingly, by Shawn Michaels, who would definitely have a role to play in many events to come. Bret recounts how Bruce had pulled aside one of the ‘Knights’, masked wrestlers (two of whom were longtime WWF midcarders/jobbers Greg Valentine and Barry Horrowitz, as well as a guy named Jeff Gaylord who made his sole WWE appearance as “The Black Knight”) and was basically showing them a two page long sheet of the stuff Bruce wanted to do with them. Never mind that 1) The match was supposed to be focused on Bret and Owen; Bruce was mainly there for ‘color’, and 2) Even if he’d gotten his way, it would have not only been pointless, but taken away from the end point of the match, that being the beginning of the Bret/Owen feud that would continue on and off for the next few years. Bruce ultimately didn’t get to do any of his suggested things, but that was his story: a need to get attention, whether it was something he deserved to get or not. Hell, in his autobiography, Bruce even claimed indirect credit for the creation of ‘Stone Cold’ Steve Austin.

Yeah.

See, early in Brian Pillman’s career, he wrestled in Canada, and formed a tag team with Bruce called Bad Company, which had the unique take, per Bruce’s assessment, of being ‘faces with a hard edge’. When Pillman eventually ended up in WCW and teamed with Austin as the Hollywood Blondes, Bruce assessed that they were doing the same thing, albeit with the more ‘organic’ notion that they were heels. Then when Austin went to the WWF and ultimately reinvented himself over 1996 as “Stone Cold”, it was clearly because Pillman had told Austin about Bad Company, they’d adapted their main aspect, and now Austin was in turn adapting it again as his ‘face with a hard edge’ Rattlesnake character.

…yeah. I suppose the lumberjack who chopped down the tree that got made into wood products that included a handle for a mining pick that mined metal that was taken and made into gun parts that Lee Harvey Oswald had in his rifle when he assassinated JFK is guilty of the murder as well, by that logic.

Still, Bruce’s ego is preferable to the sad story of middle child Dean, whose bad luck and demons ended up more severe and ended up with him spending his last years in a drug haze, drifting around the Hart family property, generally doing nothing except ‘moving junked cars around to be doing something in between using drugs’, until the drugs and an injury suffered years before that severely damaged Dean’s kidneys resulted in kidney failure that killed Dean at the tragically young age of 36 in 1990. Dean’s death actually happened one day before the 1990 Survivor Series, and I’m sure that Bret showing up to wrestle despite that ‘endeared’ him to Vince, at least in any way that Vince could feel such a thing. And while those, besides Bret and Owen’s future tragedies, were the largest examples, the whole Hart family was marked by wrestling. As one assessment in a Bret Hart biography put it, every single Hart son became a wrestler (if just briefly for a few of them) and all the daughters married wrestlers, which might have actually been the rawer deal. There’s stories in the ‘scum factory hearsay’ of pro wrestling that both Jim Neidhart and Tom Billington, nee the Dynamite Kid, who married Ellie Hart and Michelle Smadu respectively (the latter being the sister of Bret Hart’s first wife, Julie, and Billington being considered an ‘honorary Hart’ for being so involved in the territory in the late 70’s and 80’s), drugging their wives’ orange juice so they could take sexual advantage of them while they were unconscious. Or how Billington (allegedly, remember, hearsay at its truest here!) would wake up his wife by putting an empty gun to her head and pulling the trigger: when the click woke her up, he would say “One day, it will be loaded.”

(Why was Billington being such an abusive POS? For the same reasons that seemingly drove him to be a horrendous bully and ‘prankster’ in wrestling: small man syndrome, which he also compensated for via steroids and crazy bumps that prematurely ended his career and left him in a wheelchair for the rest of his life. Not even remotely an excuse, of course, but like I said. Every story sounds terrible if you’re not speaking for the one you’re biased for and have more information about).

I hadn’t even mentioned the great see-saw of the Hart family fortunes. When Stu initially moved to Calgary, with television becoming ubiquitous, he struck gold and for several years his wrestling business was immensely profitable, allowing him to buy land and build a giant brick mansion on it. But by the time Bret Hart was born, the bottom had fallen out, and the years to come would be much leaner and harder, with the Hart family forced to wear ugly identical sets of cheap clothing and shoes that rotted over the course of a winter into the summer and possibly the next winter, which brought them endless harassment from their school peers until the boys hit their growths and used the lessons taught to them to respond with violence. The great irony, of course, is that the same mocked and disparaged children would end up the heroes of the province once they grew up, but that’s the story of, that’s the glory of, children. The Hart family mansion became part home, part cat and dog home, and part general troubled kid hangout, with the place being a general mess with the animals pooping and peeing everywhere; it must have smelled utterly rank, and is partly why I wonder if Helen had hoarder tendencies. Even if Stu just had too heavy a hand instead of being outright abusive, it was definitely a hard knock upbringing, and it funnelled the family into the business.

Not that all of them wanted that, of course. If he’d had his way, young Bret Hart wouldn’t have been a wrestler. He wanted to be a film director, and actually joined college with that intention, but Bret was also an immensely talented amateur wrestler, and could potentially have also pursued that, even maybe to national or Olympic levels. But Hart didn’t feel that was the life for him, but he also didn’t want to disappoint his father. With film directing likely not seen by Stu as ‘manly’, Bret ultimately decided that with not wanting to pursue amateur wrestling up to the next level, not wanting to let his father down, and his waning interest in filmmaking due to the second one, he’d do something that would combine all aspects of it: professional wrestling. He dropped out of college, began re-training with his father and two Japanese pro wrestlers named Katsuji Adachi and Kazuo Sakurada, debuted in Stampede Wrestling in 1976 as a referee, and as an actual wrestler in 1978.



The rest, as they say, is history. I strongly feel that if Bret had felt less ‘pressured’ by his father and HAD pursued film making, I think he could have made it there. He probably wouldn’t have directed blockbusters, but his films would likely have been incredibly technically sound and well put together. He’d definitely have some Genies (the Canadian Oscars) And I also suspect that this alternate universe Bret Hart would have a reputation in the vein of Stanley Kubrick and James Cameron, though maybe not as severe as their reps go when it comes to certain behaviour in the director’s chair.

Because really, once Bret fully settled into the business and his talent began to blossom, that is what Bret became in the ring. A director, a guide overseeing a bunch of moving parts to create a better, thrilling whole. He’d end up so good at it, he did the near impossible and became a top guy.

It also likely blinded him to what happened, but we’ll get to that.

Cornwind Evil fucked around with this message at 19:30 on May 1, 2023

Mr. Meagles
Apr 30, 2004

Out here, everything hurts


Was looking up post-retirement appearances by Steve Austin and lol the way it's written makes it seem like Austin just shows up wherever people are having a good time to deliver Stone Cold Stunners

Wikipedia posted:

At WrestleMania 32 on April 3, 2016, Austin (alongside Mick Foley and Shawn Michaels) confronted The League of Nations, with Austin delivering Stone Cold Stunners to Rusev and King Barrett. While Austin was celebrating with Michaels and Foley, The New Day tried to convince Austin to dance with them in celebration. While Austin reluctantly danced along at first, he soon hit Xavier Woods with a Stone Cold Stunner.[112] During Raw's 25th anniversary episode on January 22, 2018, Austin appeared and performed a Stone Cold Stunner on Shane and Vince McMahon.[113]

On July 22, 2019, Austin appeared on the Raw Reunion episode and raised a toast alongside Triple H, Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, and various other wrestlers from his era. On September 9, he made an appearance on Raw at Madison Square Garden for the contract signing between Seth Rollins and Braun Strowman. Having been interrupted by A.J. Styles, he hit Styles with a Stone Cold Stunner. On the March 16, 2020 episode of Raw, Austin made an appearance to promote "3:16 Day" as a holiday. He shared a beer with Raw commentator Byron Saxton before giving him a Stone Cold Stunner. He then shared a beer with Becky Lynch, Angelo Dawkins, and Montez Ford before giving Dawkins and Ford Stone Cold Stunners.

Gavok
Oct 10, 2005

Brock! Oh, man, I'm sorry about your...

...tooth?


Reminds me of this time one Tough Enough winner immediately committed career suicide.

This guy Andy Leavine won the contest and was in the ring with Steve Austin and Vince McMahon. Vince welcomed him to the company and then slapped him. Leavine went down. Upon getting back up, Austin dropped him with a Stunner. Leavine rolled out of the ring, fell down to one knee, got back up, and happily walked up the ramp while slapping hands with the fans.

Other than a backstage segment, that was it for him. It's harsh, but come on. If one of the top guys in wrestling history hits you with his finisher, you should probably sell the move for more than three seconds.

Ad by Khad
Jul 25, 2007

Human Garbage
Watch me try to laugh this title off like the dickbag I am.

I also hang out with racists.

juggalo baby coffin posted:

did anyone mention the weird joker angle Sting had in TNA?

like he got so beat up for that half an hour while he waited for his guys to run in and save him that he became insane, and then he had the TNA title belt and had written like 'deception' on the belt and was saying "OOOO DECEPTION WHAT DOES IT MEAN? I AM TWISTED NOW EHEHEHEHE"

that angle drove straight into legendary "so bad it's good" status when sting made bischoff sell for the bird

Elephant Ambush
Nov 13, 2012

...We sholde spenden more time together. What sayest thou?
Nap Ghost
Pro wrestling owns

https://twitter.com/CiaranRH93/status/1502566313910161408?t=_niLaxw1Hw6ZB2g2JPM_SQ&s=19

SatansOnion
Dec 12, 2011

pro wrestling is Art

and Kota Ibushi its Rembrandt

adamantium|wang
Sep 14, 2003

Missing you

Cornwind Evil posted:

AND NOW FOR SOMETHING COMPLETELY DIFFERENT

I only every followed it very very causally but it was always a blast. Johnny Cage's music perfectly syncing up with his Shawn Michaels entrance always got me unreasonably hype:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3jXx6p4aEY
(With bonus Vegeta)

ZogrimAteMyHamster
Dec 8, 2015

Elephant Ambush posted:

poo poo like this is so hilarious because like, if you can't say "belt" and you don't like the term then why have belts at all? just retire them and give people trophies or plaques or watches or anything else that's not a belt

and i think i said this before itt but if vince hates wrestling so much and he considers the wwe to be a "global entertainment company" then why is there still a wrestling ring in the middle of every show he's ever done? why not get rid of all the stuff he hates and do things he doesn't hate?

"vince mcmahon is old"

FilthyImp
Sep 30, 2002

Anime Deviant
Aww gently caress :(

Scott Hall on life support following heart attacks post hip-replacement surgery

shadow puppet of a
Jan 10, 2007

NO TENGO SCORPIO


We should harvest the remaining viable parts of big E to save him.

16-bit Butt-Head
Dec 25, 2014

that sucks

Bum the Sad
Aug 25, 2002
Hell Gem

lol poo poo he already had an AICD, his ticker was already wrecked.

shadow puppet of a
Jan 10, 2007

NO TENGO SCORPIO


Buddy he's got a whole month of full body session DDP yoga upcoming and a snootful of LIVE FRENCH SEA SHORE SALT about to be blasted into his bloodstream.

He'll be fine.

FilthyImp
Sep 30, 2002

Anime Deviant
He threw a blood clot following surgery and was wracked with 3 heart attacks before being put on life support.

Like I know your schtik is lovely smark but put it in the box for a bit, you gently caress.

shadow puppet of a
Jan 10, 2007

NO TENGO SCORPIO


FilthyImp posted:

He threw a blood clot following surgery and was wracked with 3 heart attacks before being put on life support.

Like I know your schtik is lovely smark but put it in the box for a bit, you gently caress.

Sorry about your close personal friend scott hall that you know personally and have a familiial connection to because howdareanyone speak about a chronic drug abuser getting their due here on lowtax's own forum.

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shadow puppet of a
Jan 10, 2007

NO TENGO SCORPIO


*Posts on a a forum riddled with 9/11 gags and gifs where on the very next subforum down they post photos of chopped up drug dealers piled up neatly for laughs*

"LISTEN HERE spoa you will post with SOME GODDAMN RESPECT when a PROMINENT member of the NWO WOLF PAC falls ill you piece of poo poo MARK"

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