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So far, I haven’t noticed any problems with pretty much mining everything. Pretty sure all costs are paid by the private economy and I’ve never seen them short on cash flow.
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Mar 14, 2022 23:08
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yeah i wouldn't bother stressing about mining station efficiency I think you need to be realllllly profligate with dropping mining stations everywhere for it to really matter
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Mar 14, 2022 23:10
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adding up to 120% is a good rule for minmaxers and late game empires but you should basically be building any mining station suggested to you where the resource has a red box around it (signifying a production shortfall) and you can deny construction of a mining station in an asteroid field that is like 5% steel or something pathetic
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Mar 14, 2022 23:40
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interesting to see ppl talking about the new hotness- currently temporarily on mobile internet with a 10GB uncapped/unlimited at ~100kbps plan, so I'm biding time- so I ate 1GB by getting DW Universe- I've only played Legends, years ago, with the UEII mod that adds a bunch of alien races and other things. Spent yesterday finagling RetreatUE+Bacon Mod, and doing a making mistakes game- wow! Lots of changes from both Bacon and Universe here. The most frustrating part, however, is info on things like 'good ship design'- there are guides but they're scattershot in quality, and offer up completely opposite pieces of advice depending on that person's playstyle. I understand basic energy rules like, "have enough power for full hyperdrive", and "have enough power for Cruising+Weapons", and I've picked up a couple more, like "Specialize Starbase sizes for different roles". But I'm having a difficult time creating designs from scratch, instead just updating the automated designs because they keep insisting on using only Gravitic Beams, and feeling dissatisfied with half-assing it Some of these things might apply to DW2, so, for either game or modset, can anyone tell me things like: How should I use the different military roles? in my goof-around game I went with: Escorts as all-rounders as cheap as I can make them, Destroyers as missile boats that rely on ESs and LCs to screen them, Light Cruisers as heavily-armored gunboats to protect the field, Heavy Cruisers as long-range artillery, Carriers to primarily protect the Heavy Cruisers (and the rest, if they happen to be there). Main Fleets would be roughly 2:4:2:2:1 ES:DD:LC:HC:CV, Escort fleets would be all Escorts with maybe a Destroyer or two? seems to work okay against pirates, but never got into a major war as I set the map up for a cluster-isolation game on purpose. (I think this mod removes Frigates, adds in another kind? idk but the question remains) How much firepower should I put on civilian vessels? This might be specific to Bacon Mod- ships move around a lot more slowly in this mod, so it can be useful to have freighters be able to take on minor threats so that a wandering space slug or small pirate attack doesn't disrupt your shipping lines for months. To balance this, the modder increased the weapon limit on civilian ships from 1 to 10, and supposedly adding a lil extra shields/armor/pewpew will get the freighters to barrel-rear end through a threat long enough to drop off that carbon fiber, before fleeing across the sector. But- If I make the civvie ships too expensive, does that mean that the private sector will buy less of them? Or does it mean that the private economy will tank from all the high maintenance? How much more expensive can I safely make these things, and should I wait until I have a robust multi-system economy running? What AI Automated design decisions are actually dumb as hell? Aside from the, "always stacks one weapon type with the highest damage number", problem, are there AI design decisions baked into the game that are extremely wasteful, or even useless? What are some weird components for the role that actually work? One thing I've seen is putting mining equipment and extra docking bays on Research/Resort Stations so that they also mine the planet they're on, without building a whole nother station. Haven't tried it, but it seems to make sense! I also remember putting troop compartments on either Destroyers or Light Cruisers so as not to have to mess with Military Transports. Entertainment/Medical on Weapons Platforms? Research on Mining Stations?? Are Tourism Stations worth it outside of a Scenery bonus? I wanna go nuts with these sometimes, for flavor purposes- do I need to do anything special or can I just put these wherever? I keep wanting to put them like on the outskirts of a supernova system, or one in each system near that system's coolest looking planet. How long until the base pays for itself? Is there any way to encourage people to go to them? (in the Bacon Mod, you can build State-owned civilian vessels that cost money to build, but the private sector pays the upkeep- would it help, here, to build more passenger vessels than private industry thinks I need?) How many fuel cells do I need for a base? Are fuel cells used for anything but propulsion? If they are, do I need a huge fuel tank on a base that's usually 0m from a planet full of Caslon stocks? I'm not sure what happens to a station that's out of fuel, so is there any downside to just putting one fuel cell in even a Large Space Port? If anyone has answers, for DW1 -or- for DW2, pls post them! And also pls indicate which game/mod you're pulling experience from, lol- there are some universal guidelines but the details are rather different. Of course, any 'do exactly this thing' guideline is going to be useless- this game encourages experimenting with the baseline designs to suit your situation and victory conditions. For instance, as Humans or XHumans, I want to destroy more ships than I lose, so I make them each a little bit larger and more expensive per-unit, but with extra shields and armor. I think that's why I keep coming back to DW- you can automate everything and things run -okay-, but under the assumption of 'regular conditions'. You're playing Mario all the way through SMB2, which is fine, and doable- but as the game goes on and you diverge from the starting conditions, it's useful to be able to customize some aspects of your empire. Further, you can choose to optimize one aspect, and eschew the rest- I rarely mess around with tax rates- and still gain a significant advantage. I'm sure the tax rate adjusting enjoyer who ignores ship designs entirely gets a decent boost from the efforts, as well This, plus the game's propensity for emergent narrative, makes it rank very high on my 4X list- looking forward to taking a run at DW2 when my situation levels out/the game goes through the release bug gauntlet!
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Mar 15, 2022 00:24
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Has anyone figured out how to tell how far apart two things are? The ships have range values in the designer, but I've no idea how much range I need to get to the next nearest star, etc. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess my escort's probably don't need 50% more range than my survey ships though.
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Mar 15, 2022 00:29
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LLSix posted:Has anyone figured out how to tell how far apart two things are? The ships have range values in the designer, but I've no idea how much range I need to get to the next nearest star, etc. The only way I've found is to select a ship with a known range and extrapolate from the range circle on it.
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Mar 15, 2022 00:34
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I haven't even gotten around to playing Shadow Empires yet so I should stop reading about DW2 lol. It sounds really promising though.
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Mar 15, 2022 02:02
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LLSix posted:Has anyone figured out how to tell how far apart two things are? The ships have range values in the designer, but I've no idea how much range I need to get to the next nearest star, etc. The orange dashed line around a selected ship seems to be its maximum single jump range, you can use that to extrapolate distances.
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Mar 15, 2022 02:35
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Oh neat. I didn't have enough spacebux to purchase the ghost fleet when they showed, so choosing that option sent my cash on hand 15k into the red. Then a month later, my cash went positive again. Edit: The ghost fleet showed in December, so maybe I got a large infusion of bonus income at the end of the year? LLSix fucked around with this message at 02:50 on Mar 15, 2022 |
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Mar 15, 2022 02:48
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They really need to update the tooltip for mining stations when you build them in an asteroid field, as someone noted earlier the stations actually send out drones and those have a range they collect from. So that pathetic 5% mining station is actually getting 5%x12 or whatever.
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Mar 15, 2022 02:57
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Ardryn posted:They really need to update the tooltip for mining stations when you build them in an asteroid field, as someone noted earlier the stations actually send out drones and those have a range they collect from. So that pathetic 5% mining station is actually getting 5%x12 or whatever. As far as I can tell they actually have to be built on an associated asteroid though. I've got a mining station on a planet right next to some asteroids, but that station won't mine any of the asteriods. Which is super annoying.
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Mar 15, 2022 03:02
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DW2: I find that a lot of your income, especially early on, comes from private economy shipbuilding. Like, a LOT. I’m at 2800 now and my economy is only now starting to rebalance away from that being the biggest factor. The way the finance screen looks, seems like bonus income can’t be applied to help pay for science though. Is that right?
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Mar 15, 2022 03:05
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Yes, only positive cash flow can be used to pay for extra research and colony development investment. However, saving can be used to crash research project, doubling research speed.
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Mar 15, 2022 03:23
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DW2 is kinda weird in that it doesn't abstract away civilian economy the way that Stellaris does. Also in that my budget doesn't matter at all. I've been -15k$pacebux a month or year or whatever, but still have $130k+ spacebux thanks to all those ship retrofits and private buyers. I'm not sure I get all the automation in it either. I don't understand why I have like 40 fleets with like two ships instead of like three fleets with a ton of ships. Periodically I take over a bunch of them, send them to a meeting point and group them up to take out a threat and the minute I put them back under automatic control it splits those fleets back into like 40 fleets again. If I run at 4x speed sometimes my ships teleport outside of the galaxy and then must take decades getting back. I hope that gets patched out. I'm doing well with my fourth empire but it's only because I stopped fighting automation and sort of let it take over, only occasionally taking charge of my fleets; but now it feels less like I'm playing a game and more like I'm watching a proc gen movie.
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Mar 15, 2022 03:29
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quote:How many fuel cells do I need for a base? To run your energy needs, you burn fuel. Energy collectors are not usually effective enough, especially when the thing you're powering has lots of weapons that also burn energy in use and thus fuel. The station or ship goes completely offline without energy. No defence, no research, no mining, nothing. So you always need strong fuel tanks. Bloodly fucked around with this message at 04:01 on Mar 15, 2022 |
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Mar 15, 2022 03:56
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Re fleets: I think the AI does a generally good job at managing little firefighting fleets so once my economy is humming I let it handle them. For actual defence against major powers I maintain my own three or four custom fleets within striking distance from the relevant borders.
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Mar 15, 2022 05:14
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chainchompz posted:DW2 is kinda weird in that it doesn't abstract away civilian economy the way that Stellaris does. Also in that my budget doesn't matter at all. I've been -15k$pacebux a month or year or whatever, but still have $130k+ spacebux thanks to all those ship retrofits and private buyers. Manually change your fleet design sizes. I have little picket fleets based along my borders for the AI to do minor danger investigation and holding off enemy raids, along with larger fleets for subjugation, invasion and frontline mobile defence.
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Mar 15, 2022 06:35
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Can you no longer build monitoring stations in the middle of nowhere? Maybe I'm misrembering but i feel like a lot of my time playing DW1 was spent building monitoring stations in deep space
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Mar 15, 2022 07:57
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Sankis posted:Can you no longer build monitoring stations in the middle of nowhere? Maybe I'm misrembering but i feel like a lot of my time playing DW1 was spent building monitoring stations in deep space I think once you have the tech researched, select a constructor then holding the right mouse button should give you the option to build monitoring station.
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Mar 15, 2022 08:30
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pedro0930 posted:I think once you have the tech researched, select a constructor then holding the right mouse button should give you the option to build monitoring station. Yeah, I have the tech but I only seem to be able to make them around stars. Maybe that's how it was in DW1 and I'm just misremembering, though. edit: My big problem right now with all the suggestions is that I can never just go "Okay, please give me some more detail." Desperately need a "show me" button for that stuff so I can decide if that mining base is a great idea or if i want to send a fleet to investigate
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Mar 15, 2022 09:07
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HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:Manually change your fleet design sizes. I have little picket fleets based along my borders for the AI to do minor danger investigation and holding off enemy raids, along with larger fleets for subjugation, invasion and frontline mobile defence. This was super helpful! Is there a distant worlds 2 thread?
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Mar 15, 2022 09:43
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Bloodly posted:I remember the long, long post following that thing. Everyone was into it, then it....vanished. I forget the circumstances. If I recall correctly, he made a kickstarter against the advice of everyone in the thread and that crashed and burned and that was pretty much it. Good news is, he didn't give up, it looks like and it's... real good?
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Mar 15, 2022 10:39
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I do wish there was some more info given on why, exactly, i'm now running a deficit. Like, not even necessarily what Im doing to get +3000 income but a way to view what the AI is doing that keeps dipping me down to -40k or whatever.
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Mar 15, 2022 11:08
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NewMars posted:If I recall correctly, he made a kickstarter against the advice of everyone in the thread and that crashed and burned and that was pretty much it. Good news is, he didn't give up, it looks like and it's... real good? I can't even remember the game we were all mad at, but I remember this guy and his neat little spite game. He put together a working demo in almost no time, which was pretty impressive in it's own right. Looking forwards to having a couple of hours one evening to trying out their demo.
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Mar 15, 2022 13:46
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Sankis posted:I do wish there was some more info given on why, exactly, i'm now running a deficit. Like, not even necessarily what Im doing to get +3000 income but a way to view what the AI is doing that keeps dipping me down to -40k or whatever. At a guess it’s troops. AI builds a ton of troops: I had a 26k surplus before switching on AI troop management and next time I looked at my balance sheet it was all being spent on soldiers.
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Mar 15, 2022 14:54
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Gotta say that automating everything in DW and turning off all messages makes for a really cool screensaver.
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Mar 15, 2022 14:56
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Beefeater1980 posted:At a guess it’s troops. AI builds a ton of troops: I had a 26k surplus before switching on AI troop management and next time I looked at my balance sheet it was all being spent on soldiers. For some reason it keeps a ton of troops as garrison for the capital. Now, yes, you don't want it sniped, of course, but even so, the amounts it recruits to stay home are large and ever-increasing. And the need for troops does depend on your standard Infantry troop strength. Bloodly fucked around with this message at 15:25 on Mar 15, 2022 |
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Mar 15, 2022 15:06
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Entorwellian posted:Gotta say that automating everything in DW and turning off all messages makes for a really cool screensaver. I heard if you watch for six hours Johnny Castaway commits interstellar genocide.
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Mar 15, 2022 15:12
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HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:Manually change your fleet design sizes. 
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Mar 15, 2022 15:15
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Speaking of 4X games, did anyone pick up Wizards and Warlords when it was mentioned way back? I know I was going to do a topic about it but it seemed interest was iffy. So given the complexity of explaining parts of it I never bothered due to only a one or two people that seemed to be interested in it. It's another game that's a simulated world, similar to DW. Only it's turn based instead and is a fantasy world where you take either the role of a wizard, a warlord or (as of an update, ironically making it like an inverse of the pirate mode in DW) a nation. Basically, think Dominions if you could design the magic yourself meets a simulated fantasy world that is procedurally generated with unique gods, ancient dangers, cultures (and races. One could be a merchant state of centaurs, and another could be a nomadic group of tribalist raider elves, for instance. And that's before you get into the weird stuff that lets the game generate races. Or let them invade from other planes of reality.), and all sorts of semi-secret bullshit that'd make players that are into that go nuts. Wondering if I should bother to make that topic still, since it's been way too long. Archonex fucked around with this message at 15:38 on Mar 15, 2022 |
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Mar 15, 2022 15:34
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Archonex posted:Speaking of 4X games, did anyone pick up Wizards and Warlords when it was mentioned way back? I know I was going to do a topic about it but it seemed interest was iffy. So given the complexity of explaining parts of it I never bothered due to only a one or two people that seemed to be interested in it. My prior impression of it was that it looked too developmentally early to jump into yet, but it's on my watch list.
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Mar 15, 2022 15:49
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Splicer posted:Where is the button for this I can't find it On the military tab, the two buttons in the upper right corner are Fleet Templates and Army Templates. Those windows let you set out fleet and army sizes/compositions that the various automations will respect.
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Mar 15, 2022 15:53
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Dallan Invictus posted:On the military tab, the two buttons in the upper right corner are Fleet Templates and Army Templates. Those windows let you set out fleet and army sizes/compositions that the various automations will respect. Sankis posted:Yeah, I have the tech but I only seem to be able to make them around stars. Ardryn posted:They really need to update the tooltip for mining stations when you build them in an asteroid field, as someone noted earlier the stations actually send out drones and those have a range they collect from. So that pathetic 5% mining station is actually getting 5%x12 or whatever.
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Mar 15, 2022 16:20
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Archonex posted:Speaking of 4X games, did anyone pick up Wizards and Warlords when it was mentioned way back? I know I was going to do a topic about it but it seemed interest was iffy. So given the complexity of explaining parts of it I never bothered due to only a one or two people that seemed to be interested in it. I picked it up and gave it a shot and promptly bounced right off, would be interested in hearing some more breakdowns of it though.
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Mar 15, 2022 16:35
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Todash seems like a fun game, the Naxxilians are my new besties I think.
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Mar 15, 2022 17:05
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this thread keeps mentioning indie 4x games and as i look into them i feel like im falling down a hole and will be playing aurora 4x within a month
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Mar 15, 2022 17:14
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Sankis posted:this thread keeps mentioning indie 4x games and as i look into them i feel like im falling down a hole and will be playing aurora 4x within a month There’s a fun game hidden inside Aurora. I’ve caught glimpses of it, but the horrible presentation always wins out in the end. Maybe I need to give it another go…
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Mar 15, 2022 17:19
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chglcu posted:There’s a fun game hidden inside Aurora. I’ve caught glimpses of it, but the horrible presentation always wins out in the end. Maybe I need to give it another go… 20 years ago I feel like I would've pushed through the wall and learned to like Aurora, but now I have too many other obligations and more alternatives.
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Mar 15, 2022 17:32
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Splicer posted:If you go to the mining locations tab in resources it will tell you what's in range of each mine, and new mining locations will tell you what a potential mining location will get you. But yeah it would be great if it showed you what stuff it's currently mining underneath what it's currently storing. Oh I meant the automation popup, but it's nice that the info is in there somewhere at least.
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Mar 15, 2022 18:07
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Archonex posted:Speaking of 4X games, did anyone pick up Wizards and Warlords when it was mentioned way back? I know I was going to do a topic about it but it seemed interest was iffy. So given the complexity of explaining parts of it I never bothered due to only a one or two people that seemed to be interested in it. I played a couple of games to completion, yeah, I probably posted about it at the time. It, uh, felt really flat and static? Like I'm boggling here at your statement that it's got some sort of sim going on in the background, because I got no hint of that at all. In my first game I wasn't even seeing the regular level of AI activity you'd expect to see in a 4X. Sat back, noodled around, researched the entire tech tree and won without ever seeing a hostile army, let alone actually getting pressured by once. Second game was a little better, I at least got invaded once before winning, but by the point it happened I was so far ahead in economy and research that I just steamrolled the other wizard with endless stacks of, I think phoenixes? Magefire phoenixes, that was it. It's not like I was exploring or expanding slowly, either. Or at least, I thought I was going as fast with that as my eco would let me. The other problem I had with it was, research was just so fast and opened up so many options that it quickly became impossible to figure out what I should use for what. Endless lists of fantasy creatures. The numbers on phoenixes seem good so let's just spam those I guess?? I didn't hate the core gameplay exactly so I just put it down to EA jank and moved on.
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Mar 15, 2022 18:14
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