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mrmcd
Feb 22, 2003

Pictured: The only good cop (a fictional one).

kingcobweb posted:

this is cool but if they’re “quietly working” why is WaPo putting a target on their backs??

WaPo is owner by Jeff Bezos.

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MrYenko
Jun 18, 2012

#2 isn't ALWAYS bad...

Six weeks of paid parental leave is pretty stellar for a private sector job, even if the rest of that package veers wildly between mediocre and loving atrocious.

ekuNNN
Nov 27, 2004

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
How We Turned the Tables On Starbucks Union-Busters
:sun:

Lazy_Liberal
Sep 17, 2005

These stones are :sparkles: precious :sparkles:
re: Starbucks, you love to see it.

we've been making a lot of gains in Portland, OR the past few years. got some labor harmony legislation passed at the county level that we've been trying to get rolled out to the state. it died in committee unfortunately. we can finally eat at Burgerville again as of last year (boycotting them for years).

JAY ZERO SUM GAME
Oct 18, 2005

Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.


has anyone ever been involved in open bargaining sessions? if you're not familiar, essentially allowing any member of the bargaining unit to sit on on bargaining sessions as observers. typically, it would only be members of the bargaining committee, and management side whomever

...on the face of it, i like the idea. it encourages participation, removes some perceived mystery, and allows for some more immediate feedback

at the same time, i can see it getting really messy and slowing things down a lot.

there's a lot to consider, and circumstances/unit size/etc. can determine a lot of how it goes

any experience?

some locals like to keep things secret, especially contract details, and i've been struggling with that lately. i see both sides, unfortunately.

AnimeIsTrash
Jun 30, 2018

https://twitter.com/reiunionsoho/status/1496648372614320140

weast
Nov 7, 2012

not quite sure where to post this but here seems good

i got a job recently as a cashier and to my surprise i am now a member of a union, i've never been in one before what should i expect? its UFCW if that helps anyone answer better.

kingcobweb
Apr 16, 2005

weast posted:

not quite sure where to post this but here seems good

i got a job recently as a cashier and to my surprise i am now a member of a union, i've never been in one before what should i expect? its UFCW if that helps anyone answer better.

are you at a grocery store? UFCW 21 is the biggest union around here, they’ve organized a ton of grocery and retail jobs.

I’d give this advice regardless of the union, but you gotta participate. go to union meetings, make connections with other people that are involved with it. I’ve talked to people that have had bad experiences with UFCW 21, which doesn’t make the union bad per se, just that they don’t have that many active rank and file members.

pick up the book “strike for America” about the Chicago teachers union for inspiration about organizing within the structure of an existing union.

MrYenko
Jun 18, 2012

#2 isn't ALWAYS bad...

People (including a ton of dues-paying union members) frequently think that a union exists to negotiate a contract every couple years, and does little or nothing else.

Thing is, that's absolutely true if you allow it to be true. Union membership is very much what you make of it. If you get involved, and get others to get involved, you can absolutely make a difference in your working conditions.

weast
Nov 7, 2012

kingcobweb posted:

are you at a grocery store? UFCW 21 is the biggest union around here, they’ve organized a ton of grocery and retail jobs.

I’d give this advice regardless of the union, but you gotta participate. go to union meetings, make connections with other people that are involved with it. I’ve talked to people that have had bad experiences with UFCW 21, which doesn’t make the union bad per se, just that they don’t have that many active rank and file members.

pick up the book “strike for America” about the Chicago teachers union for inspiration about organizing within the structure of an existing union.

im in UFCW 770 down near Los Angeles, in retail. i'll pick up that book and give it a read. thanks for the recommendation.



MrYenko posted:

People (including a ton of dues-paying union members) frequently think that a union exists to negotiate a contract every couple years, and does little or nothing else.

Thing is, that's absolutely true if you allow it to be true. Union membership is very much what you make of it. If you get involved, and get others to get involved, you can absolutely make a difference in your working conditions.

id love to get involved, i think tomorrow i should probably email the union rep on my break or something and ask how i can get involved.

Konstantin
Jun 20, 2005
And the Lord said, "Look, they are one people, and they have all one language; and this is only the beginning of what they will do; nothing that they propose to do will now be impossible for them.
My union is pretty bad about getting people involved. I had to affirmatively seek them out and ask to join, when they do ask for help I express interest and never hear back, they will have online events but give only 1-2 days notice, and the bulletin board hasn't been updated in months. The only person I really know is my union steward, and when I come to him with an issue he usually responds with "ok, I'll talk to person X about that." Still better than no union, and I appreciate the negotiated raises and job protections, but they need to improve their outreach, especially since we're in a right to work state and need to have an active and visible presence.

kingcobweb
Apr 16, 2005

Konstantin posted:

My union is pretty bad about getting people involved. I had to affirmatively seek them out and ask to join, when they do ask for help I express interest and never hear back, they will have online events but give only 1-2 days notice, and the bulletin board hasn't been updated in months. The only person I really know is my union steward, and when I come to him with an issue he usually responds with "ok, I'll talk to person X about that." Still better than no union, and I appreciate the negotiated raises and job protections, but they need to improve their outreach, especially since we're in a right to work state and need to have an active and visible presence.

Sounds like you need to organize your coworkers as though there isn't a union at all, so you have a "caucus" or something.

kingcobweb
Apr 16, 2005
this is how you win a mf contract

https://twitter.com/gmgunion/status/1498437431221272583

Jaxyon
Mar 7, 2016
I’m just saying I would like to see a man beat a woman in a cage. Just to be sure.

I know like all the AV Club writers bailed/fired/quit a few weeks ago.

Last GMG blog they did that to was Deadspin which went on to create the pretty good blog Defector.

poopinmymouth
Mar 2, 2005

PROUD 2 B AMERICAN (these colors don't run)
I've been meaning to read this thread and *then* post but between financial meltdown, climate change, and war, I've just not had time so I'm going to post my update without having read the thread.

Icelandic Union Update:

First some background. We don't have legislated minimum wage or benefits here. Each person works under a collective agreement between their employer (if private under a business organization umbrella, if public then the municipality or the Icelandic state) and the union to which they belong. We have specialist unions for doctors and teachers and other specialists, but also each major area has a general union, where the "unskilled" fall. Think fast food, food processing, child and elderly care assistants, cafeteria staff (that's me!) etc.

The general union for the capital area is called Efling. We are 27,000 members in a total labor pool of 160,000 (Iceland's pop: 370k). We are majority immigrant (55%), majority female. The union has 115 members of it's council, another 15 members of the board, a full time chair, and the only union with a full time vice-chair. Each year there is a board election, one year for 7+chair, and the next year 6+vice-chair, round robin.

This union had the same chair for 18 years, gained almost no wins, and functioned as what we call a "yellow union" until 2018, when Sólveig Anna, and her B-list challenged the sitting chair and the union had it's first election ever. She and her team won with 2100 votes to under 400 for the incumbent. Since then, the union has been whipped into shape. The website is modern and in Icelandic, English, and Polish, grants can be requested online, there is online voting, and more. We went on multiple strikes, I myself participated in striking against Reykjavík city, and we won the strikes. The census bureau's latest data dump shows the largest percentage increase in pay went to our members during that time. In my strike I won a raise, 5 extra vacation days (30 total now) and a shorter work week for same pay.

Then in fall of last year, there was a conflict in the office place, and our elected leader was pushed out. 2022 was an election year for Chair+7, so we on the council voted to bump up the election, and transfer of power, to get the position sorted before our contract negotations this year. I was asked to run with Sólveig Anna on the "battle list" or B-list (to the incumbent's A-list and another C-list). We had to gain 120 signatures (we got 350) to be an official list, then we set up a temp-HQ to do campaigning. I baked cinnamon rolls for morale, a honduran immigrant made us tacos, we printed fliers and posters, and tried to get out the vote. We increased participating from 10% in 2018 to 15% this year, but we were disappointed it was so low. Still, the B-list won, and our deposed chair will be seated again, along with a new mandate and a 7 member team. We are of one mind, agreed on a platform and polished it before running, and have a clear vision of how to proceed. The board needs only 8 to have quorum and to pass resolutions. Some of our goals are to make wage-thievery illegal and with hefty fines, to increase housing security, and to take control of our pension funds. Our website has the platform (use the dropdown upper right to change to English): https://www.efling22.is/stefna

The interesting part was how much classism ran through the conflict. We are the low paid immigrant union, but our dues fund an office of 50 who are middle class workers with the salary and tasks that reflect it. They took umbrage with how things were run, and a few trouble makers created a huge drama that the rest of the office was dragged into, but never showed the backbone or convictions to object to or testify it was false. Now we have to resolve this coup going forward, and we have good plans to do so. No one will be surprised that the media gladly elevated the drama and tried to paint Sólveig as a terrible monster who bullied the office staff unfairly.

Coming up is the contract negotiations and an umbrella organization parliament where a leftist leader and neoliberal PMC are vying for control. It's an exciting year but as someone who grew up in America and always longed for a union to participate in, being on the board of an active union with a badass leader who has already lead successful strikes is invigorating. The energy for working class revolution is here on this tiny rock, we just have to organize it more.

poopinmymouth has issued a correction as of 11:13 on Mar 1, 2022

Tom Smykowski
Jan 27, 2005

What the hell is wrong with you people?
That's badass. Thanks for the detailed post on it.

dxt
Mar 27, 2004
METAL DISCHARGE

The more time goes on the more right the old Deadspin team was to walk out and form Defector.

kingcobweb
Apr 16, 2005
lol get hosed union busters

https://twitter.com/CommerceUni/status/1499417111902437380

DAD LOST MY IPOD
Feb 3, 2012

Fats Dominar is on the case


can’t believe that podcast didn’t move the needle

DAD LOST MY IPOD
Feb 3, 2012

Fats Dominar is on the case


fun union story: my sister is a grad student at Harvard and is heavily involved in the HGEU. she has a grad student friend who works for a very senior and well regarded (among the establishment, at least), professor. he called her in and asked if he could talk to her “off the record” about the union. not clear what that meant. anyways, he tried to convince her that it was a bad idea, and his actual pitch to her (a woman in her 20s) was “what if your friend was falsely accused of sexual harassment and the union railroaded him?”

the rarely seen inverse of “invent a guy and get mad at him:” “invent a sexual predator and defend him.”

kingcobweb
Apr 16, 2005

DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:

fun union story: my sister is a grad student at Harvard and is heavily involved in the HGEU. she has a grad student friend who works for a very senior and well regarded (among the establishment, at least), professor. he called her in and asked if he could talk to her “off the record” about the union. not clear what that meant. anyways, he tried to convince her that it was a bad idea, and his actual pitch to her (a woman in her 20s) was “what if your friend was falsely accused of sexual harassment and the union railroaded him?”

the rarely seen inverse of “invent a guy and get mad at him:” “invent a sexual predator and defend him.”

why didn’t the anti-union person go with “what if the union defended someone who was sexually harassing people,” that seems much easier

kingcobweb
Apr 16, 2005
https://twitter.com/CODE_CWA/status/1499506842589876225

DAD LOST MY IPOD
Feb 3, 2012

Fats Dominar is on the case


kingcobweb posted:

why didn’t the anti-union person go with “what if the union defended someone who was sexually harassing people,” that seems much easier

why indeed

Carthag Tuek
Oct 15, 2005

Tider skal komme,
tider skal henrulle,
slægt skal følge slægters gang




went to check the reactionaries at hackernews and lol some real brain genious takes there, but also a surprising (to me) amount of pro-union talk


https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30548508

kingcobweb
Apr 16, 2005
https://mobile.twitter.com/VzwUnion/status/1500886512782622724

this is what I’ve been working on nonstop for the last month or so. it’s not actually including my store (yet) but I started the effort in this area and that’s my twitter account. please boost boost boost

JAY ZERO SUM GAME
Oct 18, 2005

Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.


Incredible. That's gonna be a lot of work

In Training
Jun 28, 2008

kingcobweb posted:

https://mobile.twitter.com/VzwUnion/status/1500886512782622724

this is what I’ve been working on nonstop for the last month or so. it’s not actually including my store (yet) but I started the effort in this area and that’s my twitter account. please boost boost boost

Awesome work, good luck with the campaign

dxt
Mar 27, 2004
METAL DISCHARGE
https://twitter.com/CaroRCummings/status/1500990783469539330

Minneapolis public school teachers are on strike starting tomorrow. St. Paul teachers got a tentative agreement earlier tonight, they had planned to go on strike tomorrow as well.

Xaris
Jul 25, 2006

Lucky there's a family guy
Lucky there's a man who positively can do
All the things that make us
Laugh and cry

kingcobweb posted:

https://mobile.twitter.com/VzwUnion/status/1500886512782622724

this is what I’ve been working on nonstop for the last month or so. it’s not actually including my store (yet) but I started the effort in this area and that’s my twitter account. please boost boost boost

goongrats. good poo poo.

i recently got a new public job that's been long-unionized and it's great. i'm trying to get a little more active in it but i'm still too new to feel comfortable but ive attended some contract negotiation meetings. maybe after ive been here for a year i'll try to run for some various leadership roles

everyone should unionize. unionize your fuckin' work place

JAY ZERO SUM GAME
Oct 18, 2005

Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.


anyone have a good book/source on .... i'm not sure, general union history? specifically, when unions (largely) adopted flag waving patriotism etc. etc.

it feels like a response to accusations of communism and/or a public relations play in response to outsourcing, but i really have no idea

DAD LOST MY IPOD
Feb 3, 2012

Fats Dominar is on the case


this article is a decent start:

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2019/09/25/reut-s25.html

I think it’s a bit unfair to Reuther who, according to everything I’ve read, was a committed union man who was trying his best, but the Treaty of Detroit really was a turning point for the labor movement and the decline in labor militancy really started soon after

e: also this article is obviously written by trots and full of their inane feuding but you can get a decent sense of the history reading between the lines

MrYenko
Jun 18, 2012

#2 isn't ALWAYS bad...

JAY ZERO SUM GAME posted:

anyone have a good book/source on .... i'm not sure, general union history? specifically, when unions (largely) adopted flag waving patriotism etc. etc.

it feels like a response to accusations of communism and/or a public relations play in response to outsourcing, but i really have no idea

Labor in America is the go-to. I’d also recommend This one, for how Regan hosed my profession specifically, and labor in the US generally.

kingcobweb
Apr 16, 2005
Verizon is loving TERRIFIED right now. they’re playing real dirty with union-busting tactics, telling me that receiving a call from a coworker of mine and talking for an hour was “harassing women late at night.”

here’s a thread from a coworker of mine:

https://twitter.com/VzwUnion/status/1503849455077888004

Xaris
Jul 25, 2006

Lucky there's a family guy
Lucky there's a man who positively can do
All the things that make us
Laugh and cry

kingcobweb posted:

Verizon is loving TERRIFIED right now. they’re playing real dirty with union-busting tactics, telling me that receiving a call from a coworker of mine and talking for an hour was “harassing women late at night.”

here’s a thread from a coworker of mine:

https://twitter.com/VzwUnion/status/1503849455077888004
incredible. i suppose next line is going to be "many lived experiences of LGTQBIA+ marginalized BIPOC immigrants will be irreparably harmed by regressive actions such as unionizing, infact, free unregulated right-to-work labor market is the best thing for the disabled. to take that away by unionizing is doing a no growth fascist action"

stay strong friend

JAY ZERO SUM GAME
Oct 18, 2005

Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.


it’s fun making the bosses mad

it’s good to get you and your coworkers paid more

this is called a ‘win-win’

DAD LOST MY IPOD
Feb 3, 2012

Fats Dominar is on the case


has this weirdass progressive buzzword anti union shtick ever worked? sure didn’t at REI. Amazon’s been successful with good old fashioned brute force union busting

theflyingexecutive
Apr 22, 2007

DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:

has this weirdass progressive buzzword anti union shtick ever worked? sure didn’t at REI. Amazon’s been successful with good old fashioned brute force union busting

I feel like this is the first time we're really seeing it in force. Most of the older campaigns were simple "unions will take your money make you have lovely coworkers"

JAY ZERO SUM GAME
Oct 18, 2005

Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.


DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:

has this weirdass progressive buzzword anti union shtick ever worked? sure didn’t at REI. Amazon’s been successful with good old fashioned brute force union busting
it has worked, and that’s why it has to be taken seriously.

if responded to well, and organizers have done a good job preparing the bargaining unit in advance, anti-union campaigns can backfire on employers in a huge way. workers can show up to anti-union meeting with their own talking points, correct management in the assertions, etc. that sort of thing goes even further, by demonstrating to bargaining unit members that yes, you actually do have a voice now.

Alkydere
Jun 7, 2010
Capitol: A building or complex of buildings in which any legislature meets.
Capital: A city designated as a legislative seat by the government or some other authority, often the city in which the government is located; otherwise the most important city within a country or a subdivision of it.



It works at Amazon because Amazon takes it seriously. They create diversity groups that are actually given power/a voice at Amazon warehouses. The whole reason they do this is because Amazon did the research years and years ago and found there's an actual correlation between how diverse a workplace is and a reduction in a desire to unionize.

Give minority groups a safe-ish space and they'll bitch, whine and moan but don't want to rock the boat of a place where they feel relatively safe. Also drives a wedge between them and any conservative assholes when it comes to worker's solidarity. I've seen both effects in person.

Of course it has to be done right or your progressive anti-union tactics become awkward cringe anti-union tactics that undermine the union busting.

Oh and obviously Amazon still does the normal union busting, mainly involving how a lot of people are actively nervous about how Big Brother Peccy is always watching. Seriously the warehouses are security panopticons.

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DAD LOST MY IPOD
Feb 3, 2012

Fats Dominar is on the case


I think at Amazon and other places it’s largely the latter. you can draw a pretty direct line between “woke corporate” union busting at REI and elsewhere, and the old racial wedge used to union-bust in the early 20th century—the more you raise the salience of race in your employees’ minds, the harder solidarity becomes. the background racism of American culture does a lot of the work for you (which is, indeed, why it exists, and why it was cultivated). these days you can’t nakedly race bait your white employees the way you could in 1922, but you can do a lot to make white and POC employees distrust each other.

still, though, the most effective union busting tactic is and always will be naked threats to destroy people’s livelihood if they organize. Amazon can be subtle when they want to be but that’s still the main thrust of their tactics. arguing “but you don’t need a union because we’re ~so progressive~” may have an effect on the margins, but it’s definitely a second best tactic compared to “try it and get fired, pleb”

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