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Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


Splicer posted:

I'm not sure how familiar you are with hyphzposting but based in his previous posts his players appear to be sociopaths whose primary hobby is destroying hyphz ability to function as a social being under the guise of playing RPGs

Yeah I just...I just don't want to post about that anymore, and I'm afraid that engaging that directly at this point is a party foul.

MockingQuantum posted:

Maybe I'm too cynical but I feel like you can't ever depend on the rules to make the combat fun no matter what, or really to make any aspect of the game fun no matter what. That seems like a pipe dream, and is putting a lot of reliance on the system to basically run the experience, and all its social and interpersonal requirements, for you.

It's analogous with requesting that a language be such that all random combinations of phonemes will be not only intelligible but interesting, as a way of removing relying on writers & editors having to be attentive to whether or not what they're committing to publish is interesting as a matter of human judgment.

Even games that have a lot of expressive space involve a lot of possible dead ends. Even chess - it's very easy to make boring board positions. Infinity is robust enough that there are people who play with a random army list generator (and win against non random armies), but even in Infinity it's not just possible but common to, in the parlance of the game, "lose during deployment." Which, granted, Infinity games tend to involve a LOT of time spent on the deployment phase, but it still means that at many given slices of the game state, the tactical situation is uninteresting because Player A flubbed their deployment so bad that the plays available to them are all terrible and Player B has a bunch of simple slam-dunks to land.

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Humbug Scoolbus
Apr 25, 2008

The scarlet letter was her passport into regions where other women dared not tread. Shame, Despair, Solitude! These had been her teachers, stern and wild ones, and they had made her strong, but taught her much amiss.
Clapping Larry

Ettin posted:

Alright folks: who here has run a scenario (ideally in a fantasy setting, but I'll take any) set in a fancy party? How did it go? I'm currently running a score for my Blades in the Dark group and I could use some stories for inspiration.

I ran one in a Dishonored universe game (using a variant of the Qin ruleset) which ended in one duel for honor, a hilariously failed seduction attempt, and two grifters who went through, stealing as much as they could carry.

MockingQuantum
Jan 20, 2012



Tulip posted:

Yeah I just...I just don't want to post about that anymore, and I'm afraid that engaging that directly at this point is a party foul.

It's analogous with requesting that a language be such that all random combinations of phonemes will be not only intelligible but interesting, as a way of removing relying on writers & editors having to be attentive to whether or not what they're committing to publish is interesting as a matter of human judgment.

Even games that have a lot of expressive space involve a lot of possible dead ends. Even chess - it's very easy to make boring board positions. Infinity is robust enough that there are people who play with a random army list generator (and win against non random armies), but even in Infinity it's not just possible but common to, in the parlance of the game, "lose during deployment." Which, granted, Infinity games tend to involve a LOT of time spent on the deployment phase, but it still means that at many given slices of the game state, the tactical situation is uninteresting because Player A flubbed their deployment so bad that the plays available to them are all terrible and Player B has a bunch of simple slam-dunks to land.

Yeah and when you start talking about miniatures games and more traditional board games, it becomes even more of a closed system, but even then there's no guarantee of a perfect situation, like you said. I feel like with TTRPGs you have, if anything, significantly more space in which to resolve problems of dead-end play. But I think part of the problem here is the classic trap of taking rules systems that are written to manage/simulate a situation within the game, and twisting them to also resolve issues that are fundamentally out of game issues.

I see this a lot on other RPG forums, where there's an attempt to get the rules or design to legislate a problem that should be addressable by the GM just saying "hey I want to have fun with this too, this approach isn't fun for me and undercuts the time and effort I spend trying to bring you an enjoyable experience, how do we fix this in a way that works for all of us?" I get that not every group can work that way, but I think it's a lot lower hurdle to get there than a lot of groups seem to insist it is.

Precambrian
Apr 30, 2008

I'm sympathetic to hyphz because I have real problems with anxiety and DMing was really bad for triggering it, even though I genuinely liked running games... so long as things went right. My problem wasn't combat encounters, but that I was really bad at creating NPCs on the fly, and if the party diverged from the original path and started asking logical, sensible questions ("Is there anyone in town who'd recognize dwarfen armor?") I either had to tell them "no" and feel like I was railroading them or I'd start panicking as I tried to come up with a name because, again, I have an anxiety disorder that made me think I was ruining everyone's fun when I couldn't perfectly improvise a new NPC and no game design is ever going to fix that.

But what I found that helped was first, being upfront and honest with my players about my issues as a DM. I'm not good at coming up with NPCs on the fly, and so there's going to be parts that may feel more railroady or less populated because, well, that's the spectrum of what I feel comfortable working within. The DM's a player too, and their comfort level matters just like anyone else's. The second thing that helped actually was switching from D&D to Blades in the Dark, a game that more encourages the full table to have a role in worldbuilding. So we hit fewer tripwires of my anxiety, because it's a lot more supported to just ask the table, "Okay, you picked up a rumor that might lead to a heist—anyone want to tell me what it is?" or encourage them to suggest "Oh, hey, my character has a friend, Donny Eight-Fingers, he's a demolitionist who's friendly with me, I'll call him." Having a more reactive style of game that shifted some of the world-building work onto the rest of the players let me shift into a role that I found much more suitable.

Again, no game design is going to fix what was fundamentally a mental health and comfort issue, but a combination of a game that moved us away from what roused my anxiety and openly discussing with my players on how we can all get what we want did a lot to help make gaming more enjoyable.

Ettin posted:

Alright folks: who here has run a scenario (ideally in a fantasy setting, but I'll take any) set in a fancy party? How did it go? I'm currently running a score for my Blades in the Dark group and I could use some stories for inspiration.

As a case in point, had a game where the crew was infiltrating a party, and when the party Slide managed to reestablish their footing with a good roll after a slip-up, I suggested that the roll reflected her taking advantage of something else happening at the party taking attention away from her. She suggested that basically not-Mrs. Bennet had just made a scene and now everyone else at the party was trying to pounce on the gossip opportunity. Then the rest of the crew became super invested in how the drama was going down, but instead of them asking me questions while I tried to spin up some answers, I was more overseeing a roundtable discussion of narrative opportunities and a complex web of social drama that my players specifically wanted to exploit. It was a fast paced bit of unexpected worldbuilding that everybody enjoyed.

So I think my suggestion is is that in a setting like Doskvol, people are going to parties to be catty and dramatic and somebody is going to be the Victorian equivalent of the Main Character of Twitter when people gossip about it tomorrow. Whether it's from a hideous dress, an abortive romantic gesture, or a man proving himself to be a cad, there's drama completely unrelated to your crew that is going down that night.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


Precambrian posted:

I'm sympathetic to hyphz because I have real problems with anxiety and DMing was really bad for triggering it, even though I genuinely liked running games... so long as things went right. My problem wasn't combat encounters, but that I was really bad at creating NPCs on the fly, and if the party diverged from the original path and started asking logical, sensible questions ("Is there anyone in town who'd recognize dwarfen armor?") I either had to tell them "no" and feel like I was railroading them or I'd start panicking as I tried to come up with a name because, again, I have an anxiety disorder that made me think I was ruining everyone's fun when I couldn't perfectly improvise a new NPC and no game design is ever going to fix that.

But what I found that helped was first, being upfront and honest with my players about my issues as a DM. I'm not good at coming up with NPCs on the fly, and so there's going to be parts that may feel more railroady or less populated because, well, that's the spectrum of what I feel comfortable working within. The DM's a player too, and their comfort level matters just like anyone else's. The second thing that helped actually was switching from D&D to Blades in the Dark, a game that more encourages the full table to have a role in worldbuilding. So we hit fewer tripwires of my anxiety, because it's a lot more supported to just ask the table, "Okay, you picked up a rumor that might lead to a heist—anyone want to tell me what it is?" or encourage them to suggest "Oh, hey, my character has a friend, Donny Eight-Fingers, he's a demolitionist who's friendly with me, I'll call him." Having a more reactive style of game that shifted some of the world-building work onto the rest of the players let me shift into a role that I found much more suitable.

Yeah totally. It's a lot of why whenever somebody asks for GM advice, my first answer is "read the MC chapter from AW, no matter what system you're running." And a lot of that is specifically because people take "disclaim authority" a lot more seriously when it's coming from an extremely successful RPG rulebook than when it's coming from a random SA poster. I specifically struggle with coming up with names for NPCs (I once used "Samantha" three sessions in a row), and that can spin out into making the rest of the NPC flat. I have a player that is fantastic at making up those bit characters, so when I have her in a session I tend to have an easier time of that.

It's just generally valuable to keep in mind that the GM isn't special. All the players at the table are there to have a good time with their friends, and it's OK to ask your friends for help. A GM may have specific roles and approaches at the table, but both the GM and the players at any functioning table are all mutually invested in having fun together.

Humbug Scoolbus
Apr 25, 2008

The scarlet letter was her passport into regions where other women dared not tread. Shame, Despair, Solitude! These had been her teachers, stern and wild ones, and they had made her strong, but taught her much amiss.
Clapping Larry

Tulip posted:

Yeah totally. It's a lot of why whenever somebody asks for GM advice, my first answer is "read the MC chapter from AW, no matter what system you're running." And a lot of that is specifically because people take "disclaim authority" a lot more seriously when it's coming from an extremely successful RPG rulebook than when it's coming from a random SA poster. I specifically struggle with coming up with names for NPCs (I once used "Samantha" three sessions in a row), and that can spin out into making the rest of the NPC flat. I have a player that is fantastic at making up those bit characters, so when I have her in a session I tend to have an easier time of that.

It's just generally valuable to keep in mind that the GM isn't special. All the players at the table are there to have a good time with their friends, and it's OK to ask your friends for help. A GM may have specific roles and approaches at the table, but both the GM and the players at any functioning table are all mutually invested in having fun together.

I usually GM and I absolutely rely on the players to come up with fill details for emergency NPCs.

Siivola
Dec 23, 2012

Pick your favourite piece of advice from the Apocalypse World MC chapter. My game is entirely built on "always say what your prep demands" and "play to find out", which combined make running a premade adventure a stress-free breeze.

It's not me, it's the adventure author's fault! :v:

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

I more or less exclusively run play-by-post now, specifically because I don't feel very comfortable with improvisation. That said, I've totally run live games, and done fine, by doing flexible pre-prep.

By that I mean, and to simultaneously address Hyphz' monster-in-a-clearing proposal: I put together 2-3 flexible encounters in advance of gametime. If we're exploring a dungeon map this is less necessary, but when the characters are in a spot such that over the next game session the players could go in various directions, not totally predictably, then I can handle this sort of situation by having a "single bad guy in a larger open space" scene, a "lots of dudes in a zone with several attached rooms/passages/areas" scene, and maybe a "moving scene through areas with noncombatants" scene.

These are "flexible" in the sense that the flavor details aren't nailed down (and this plays to my strengths, because I'm much better at improvising flavorful setting dressing) but not flexible in the sense that they're generically boring fights. I can intentionally arrange cover, dangerous terrain, a surprise or two, etc. to make sure that the PCs should find the scene tactically engaging. I make a map, but the objects on the map have generic labels and are keyed to specific combat mechanics. And then if they decide to sneak up on an armed merchant and attack his wagon when I expected that to be a peaceful trading scene, well, I can grab one of my pre-made encounters, drop the merchant and his wagon into it, place the PCs at the edge, and we're ready to go. I can use my ability to adlib flavorful descriptions for the obstacles, terrain, effects, etc. that are already carefully placed on the encounter map.

This is strongly facilitated by being run in a system where it doesn't take time to put together enemy stats. D&D 4e was the most recent system I did that in, but I managed it in 3e with additional prep by making a card-catalogue of fully-statted NPCs I could pull from at any time.

SO my answer is still "you do not actually have to improvise a lot of combat scenes, regardless of what your players keep doing" but that should be glued on to all the other advice here, about talking to your players and not being a pushover when it comes to what you are willing to do during a game, and also selecting a system that you're comfortable playing.

But I'll end this post where I started: if you really have a crippling fear of improvised play, play-by-post is a wonderful mode of RPGing because you always have at least hours or typically a whole day or two, to think about and toy with what you're gonna post before you post it, and that also means that if the players surprise you by attacking something you didn't think they would, you can literally sit down and spend a few hours building an interesting combat and then have it ready the next day or so and that's not a noticeable delay in the game at all.

Although, a huge drawback of course is that tactically complex combat takes weeks or months to play out in PbP. So uh, strongly recommend looking for games where tactical combat is resolved in 2-4 rounds of player action (or less!) if you do that.

Leraika
Jun 14, 2015

Luckily, I *did* save your old avatar. Fucked around and found out indeed.
As a player, I absolutely love it when the GM asks me for details because I love improvising bits of off-the-cuff worldbuilding.

Absurd Alhazred
Mar 27, 2010

by Athanatos
You can also do it in hybrid form, kind of like the Tony Bath wargaming campaigns - the non-tactical-combat parts can be done PbP, but once you've committed to a tactical combat, schedule a synchronous meeting to hash it out relatively quickly. Gives you time to gauge whether there's a potential for interesting tactical combat, and then sit down and build it before the special session.

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

Absurd Alhazred posted:

You can also do it in hybrid form, kind of like the Tony Bath wargaming campaigns - the non-tactical-combat parts can be done PbP, but once you've committed to a tactical combat, schedule a synchronous meeting to hash it out relatively quickly. Gives you time to gauge whether there's a potential for interesting tactical combat, and then sit down and build it before the special session.

Yeah I've thought about trying to do that. I tend not to have a flexible gaming schedule, though, so it'd be like... OK, is everyone available from 6-8 pacific time next thursday? No? Ok, hmm, how about two weeks from friday, unless my wife decides between now and then that we're doing a thing?

But if you're PbPing with folks in similar time zones, and if you have more free spots in your schedule, it's a great way to avoid the most frequent way that PbP games fizzle out.

Siivola
Dec 23, 2012

Leperflesh posted:

By that I mean, and to simultaneously address Hyphz' monster-in-a-clearing proposal
Hyphz's issue is kind of not really related to improvisation. I'm pretty sure all he wants to do in an RPG is present an encounter that is 100% consistent with everything that led to it. That's why he likes maps of places and planning dungeons ahead and all that stuff we've posted about for pages. And that's why he always pushes back when somebody suggests he should just make a couple of random encounters beforehand so he has something to fall back on: It's simply not the actual encounter that would happen. And there's also the issue of player character capabilities: If one of them can, I dunno, smell dragons, then she should be able to smell the dragon well in advance and the players should get the drop on it.

(Edit: And at that point "let's do this the Harry Potter and That One Weird Fanfic way" and "let's do this the genre-appropriate way" are both completely supportable player reactions.)

And all the while he's somehow trying to marry this idea of what an RPG is with the idea that RPGs are about having cool tense action scenes with robust board game rules that are fun to play. I kinda sympathize, I too want a pony.

Dear hyphz: It's basically mathematically impossible to make every possible choice the players could make be the input for a cool setpiece encounter. Some of those choices must logically lead to things that are not encounters.

I'm starting to think that you should stop worrying, learn to love the funnel, and go Fantasy loving Vietnam on your group. Sharpie "Losing is fun, y'all" on your DM's screen and roll some d30s.


(Edit: To go back to your (hyphz's) original question, yes, there are a number of "solved" tactical situations and yes, most RPG combat systems pretend those don't exist.

On the one hand, the set of not-encounters is infinitely huge so that limited scope is just a fact of gaming and you should maybe have a social contract sort of talk about what kinds of things your players want to actually see in the game. If the players say they want to have setpiece fights and then when given the opportunity actually bail on them, they should maybe have a think whether they'd like to play DCC instead.

On the other, yeah it kinda sucks that games don't really have backup solutions to game situations that fall just barely out of their scope.)

Siivola fucked around with this message at 21:05 on Mar 18, 2022

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


Siivola posted:

Pick your favourite piece of advice from the Apocalypse World MC chapter. My game is entirely built on "always say what your prep demands" and "play to find out", which combined make running a premade adventure a stress-free breeze.

It's not me, it's the adventure author's fault! :v:

Ask provocative questions and build on the answers.

What do you hate about being on the road?
Oh, I see, why are they getting under your skin?
How much longer can you take it?
Alright alright, well I'm giving you the chance to do something about it, do you?

Leraika posted:

As a player, I absolutely love it when the GM asks me for details because I love improvising bits of off-the-cuff worldbuilding.

Legitimately, all GMs should do it, and frequently. It's not just stress of the GM, it keeps players both engaged with the world and feeling like they have ownership over the session. Plus often they're good ideas!

Halloween Jack
Sep 12, 2003
I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!
Hyphz seems to want a Universal Combat/Star Citizen style tabletop game where every conceivable outcome can be handled and regulated with mechanics. I get it; I like the idea of a game where an overarching set of mechanics can handle e.g. combat, mass combat, vehicle combat, and organizations and domain management. Unfortunately, a tabletop ruleset that can manage any interaction at any scale can't even theoretically exist. That way lies HYBRID.

Hyphz, as for your gaming group, I recommend Power Kill by John Tynes

hyphz
Aug 5, 2003

Number 1 Nerd Tear Farmer 2022.

Keep it up, champ.

Also you're a skeleton warrior now. Kree.
Unlockable Ben

Halloween Jack posted:

Hyphz, as for your gaming group, I recommend Power Kill by John Tynes

Has anyone ever actually played that in earnest? It seemed like a definite “reader”.

(Edit: I do get that you’re making a joke about my group but I do also wonder if anyone ever earnestly played Power Kill.)

hyphz fucked around with this message at 21:34 on Mar 18, 2022

Halloween Jack
Sep 12, 2003
I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!
Jesus loving Christ

Antivehicular
Dec 30, 2011


I wanna sing one for the cars
That are right now headed silent down the highway
And it's dark and there is nobody driving And something has got to give

Better Tynes question: has anyone ever played Puppetland? It's a fascinating game, but I've never been clear on how it plays. (Multiple PC types that can't interact with objects seems like it might be a problem?)

hyphz
Aug 5, 2003

Number 1 Nerd Tear Farmer 2022.

Keep it up, champ.

Also you're a skeleton warrior now. Kree.
Unlockable Ben

Siivola posted:

And all the while he's somehow trying to marry this idea of what an RPG is with the idea that RPGs are about having cool tense action scenes with robust board game rules that are fun to play. I kinda sympathize, I too want a pony.

I'm just tired of PF2e and its complex rules that come down to doing several hours of math prep and then using the horrible Hero Lab Campaign Stage interface just to have 90% of encounters go the same way because they put dominant strategies in the rules. And of it being a highly tactical system but with AP authors who transplant a bunch of encounters written for a dungeon into a jungle without even thinking through the implications of that. I'm tired of pretty much every d20 system not being able to correctly model the start of a battle.

I'm tired of 90% of the systems I was interested in being locked out by improv requirements. I'm tired of indirect rejections. I'm tired of "abilene or outcast".

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


MockingQuantum posted:

Yeah and when you start talking about miniatures games and more traditional board games, it becomes even more of a closed system, but even then there's no guarantee of a perfect situation, like you said. I feel like with TTRPGs you have, if anything, significantly more space in which to resolve problems of dead-end play. But I think part of the problem here is the classic trap of taking rules systems that are written to manage/simulate a situation within the game, and twisting them to also resolve issues that are fundamentally out of game issues.

I see this a lot on other RPG forums, where there's an attempt to get the rules or design to legislate a problem that should be addressable by the GM just saying "hey I want to have fun with this too, this approach isn't fun for me and undercuts the time and effort I spend trying to bring you an enjoyable experience, how do we fix this in a way that works for all of us?" I get that not every group can work that way, but I think it's a lot lower hurdle to get there than a lot of groups seem to insist it is.

I meant to respond to this but then got lost like an idiot. Anyway,

This compulsion is one that is extremely salient to me recently, because I work in a municipal civil service and a huge percentage of what we do is develop increasingly elaborate ways to relieve ourselves of any decision making power, because doing so also relieves us of personal liability and personal liability is the only meaningful fail state. But of course the purpose of a bureaucracy is to use skilled human judgment instead of a big inflexible price schedule.

There's an appeal to it - Utopia of Rules is a sarcastic title but it's still invoking the idea that people want big complicated rules because when you have enough of them you're permitted to just not think. But I think it's generally an impossible ask, an if the goal is to create things that are human-interesting it's profoundly counterproductive.

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

hyphz posted:

I'm just tired of PF2e and its complex rules that come down to doing several hours of math prep and then using the horrible Hero Lab Campaign Stage interface just to have 90% of encounters go the same way because they put dominant strategies in the rules. And of it being a highly tactical system but with AP authors who transplant a bunch of encounters written for a dungeon into a jungle without even thinking through the implications of that. I'm tired of pretty much every d20 system not being able to correctly model the start of a battle.

I'm tired of 90% of the systems I was interested in being locked out by improv requirements. I'm tired of indirect rejections. I'm tired of "abilene or outcast".

I understand, I think. And yet, lots of other people seem to have fun playing PF2e, other d20 systems, and lots of other games. I'd never claim these (or any) games are free from problems, far from it; but if the mechanisms provided here and in other threads don't work for you, that doesn't mean those games fundamentally can't be played.

Your perception that these games all have insurmountable problems is a misperception. They have problems, some of them, some of which you actually identify: but goons post all the ways to surmount them, and you largely dismiss, ignore, or fruitlessly nipick at them, instead of ever acknowledging that it's just that you can't or won't use these techniques for playing these games.

I appreciate that you're nice about it. That's why you don't get probes, you don't break rules. But your frustration, which I think is very real, is at least in part coming from your own stubbornness in the face of walls of good advice.

dwarf74
Sep 2, 2012



Buglord

hyphz posted:

I'm just tired of PF2e and its complex rules that come down to doing several hours of math prep and then using the horrible Hero Lab Campaign Stage interface just to have 90% of encounters go the same way because they put dominant strategies in the rules. And of it being a highly tactical system but with AP authors who transplant a bunch of encounters written for a dungeon into a jungle without even thinking through the implications of that. I'm tired of pretty much every d20 system not being able to correctly model the start of a battle.

I'm tired of 90% of the systems I was interested in being locked out by improv requirements. I'm tired of indirect rejections. I'm tired of "abilene or outcast".
Why not ask someone else in your group to run a game? It's clear that you don't find running a game rewarding at all, at least not with your group.

But yeah - it's the same story. You want the rules to handle all the social bits that make an RPG an RPG. They won't and can't.

If nobody is willing to do that, go for tactical board games that don't ask for a game master to do anything. Gloomhaven, Descent 2e, or any number of newer campaign games may fit the bill.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Does hyphz hate running games or are they just kind of neurotic and always expect the worst outcome from any real or imaginary situation?

Leraika
Jun 14, 2015

Luckily, I *did* save your old avatar. Fucked around and found out indeed.

BattleMaster posted:

Does hyphz hate running games or are they just kind of neurotic and always expect the worst outcome from any real or imaginary situation?

as far as I can tell, yes

grassy gnoll
Aug 27, 2006

The pawsting business is tough work.

Siivola posted:

Just use GURPS. :v:

Or Phoenix Command. :unsmigghh:

This is also good advice for the party question.

Gray Ghost
Jan 1, 2003

When crime haunts the night, a silent crusader carries the torch of justice.

Ettin posted:

Alright folks: who here has run a scenario (ideally in a fantasy setting, but I'll take any) set in a fancy party? How did it go? I'm currently running a score for my Blades in the Dark group and I could use some stories for inspiration.

So for my own BitD game, I had the party go to a Tycherosi banquet celebrating Doskvol war veterans. While drinks and entertainment (Tycherosi carnival performers) happened downstairs, members of the party raided the office of the host upstairs. Halfway through this operation, Lord Scurlock (a powerful vampire in my game) arrives to patronize the event and support the veterans he commanded. The event became a test of avoiding both Scurlock and a Tycherosi blade-dancer and dashing across rooftops to avoid being seen.

Grizzled Patriarch
Mar 27, 2014

These dentures won't stop me from tearing out jugulars in Thunderdome.



Getting tired enough of GW's complete lack of ability to balance games, and so I'm putting out some feelers for some other miniature games that might suit me better. Ideally I'd like something that has a large enough competitive scene that I'd actually be able to find games, costs a bit less (this part shouldn't be hard, at least), and has at least some semblance of balanced play so that I can play events without either having to chase an entirely new faction / army composition every few months or get stomped by people that do.

Is there anything at all that fits the bill? I haven't played in person since covid kicked off so I have no idea what else is floating around nowadays.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


Grizzled Patriarch posted:

Getting tired enough of GW's complete lack of ability to balance games, and so I'm putting out some feelers for some other miniature games that might suit me better. Ideally I'd like something that has a large enough competitive scene that I'd actually be able to find games, costs a bit less (this part shouldn't be hard, at least), and has at least some semblance of balanced play so that I can play events without either having to chase an entirely new faction / army composition every few months or get stomped by people that do.

Is there anything at all that fits the bill? I haven't played in person since covid kicked off so I have no idea what else is floating around nowadays.

Infinity!

Goon Thread
https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3854674

Goonhammer introduction by high-level infinity player and local LPer of paradox games Thanqol
https://www.goonhammer.com/introduction-to-infinity/

Official Discord
https://discord.gg/ebDhqP6U

Infinity Global League discord for online tournaments
https://discord.gg/Aq6GaqQ4

The rulebook is free (N4 is the "full" rulebook, Code One is a simplified ruleset that's more intended for your first couple games)
https://infinitytheuniverse.com/resources

The official up-to-date unit rules are in the online army builder
https://infinitytheuniverse.com/army/infinity

My steam is fighting me so sorry for the lack of link but there is a very good TTS mod of infinity if you either want to play social distanced or test out armies before you buy them. Balance in the game is very good, I'd even say startlingly good, coming from a perspective from GW - the big thing that stand out to me is that Infinity units are priced based on a formula, which is not strictly linear but is "true" cross faction so if something is under/overpriced, at least it's under/overpriced for everyone. A 30 point heavy infantry in one army is going to pretty reliably be as good as a 30 point heavy infantry in another army, though there is plenty of room for variation. Compared to GW pricing things on vibes (seriously they hiked the price on Manticores just now whyyyyy) it's incredibly refreshing and reliable for the players.

e: as for in person, I've only kept track of my own locality of Brooklyn and while I haven't attended based on the discord there's about 10 people who show up to thursday night infinity pretty much every week.

e2: ok steam cooperated with me again here's the TTS mod

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2030331870&searchtext=infinity+corvus+belli

Tulip fucked around with this message at 03:25 on Mar 20, 2022

Rand Brittain
Mar 25, 2013

"Go on until you're stopped."
After a very long time, it's now possible to purchase the third edition of Nobilis again, with new art (mostly public-domain) and a new layout based on the one for Glitch.

Infinitum
Jul 30, 2004


Our DM let us go to a pet store today


Found some amazing art for them as well

https://i.imgur.com/mmucIh8.mp4
(My Monk's name is Underworld)

---------------------

They also created a stat block for our literal jar of water that does nothing but scream constantly



They're stickers for the eyes and mouth, and pipe cleaners for the hands

Infinitum fucked around with this message at 09:44 on Mar 20, 2022

Leraika
Jun 14, 2015

Luckily, I *did* save your old avatar. Fucked around and found out indeed.
Born Slippy is so cute!

Plutonis
Mar 25, 2011

Why does the puddle have CHA 20

Infinitum
Jul 30, 2004


Plutonis posted:

Why does the puddle have CHA 20

Literally all it does is scream if you open the bottle.

So we had it join the Bard Class at the adventuring school we attend, and it fell in with the Death Metal kids.

Plutonis
Mar 25, 2011

How can it scream with no lungs

Infinitum
Jul 30, 2004


A wizard kicked it in the nads obviously
We don't know, we're trying to figure it out

Foolster41
Aug 2, 2013

"It's a non-speaking role"

Grizzled Patriarch posted:

Getting tired enough of GW's complete lack of ability to balance games, and so I'm putting out some feelers for some other miniature games that might suit me better. Ideally I'd like something that has a large enough competitive scene that I'd actually be able to find games, costs a bit less (this part shouldn't be hard, at least), and has at least some semblance of balanced play so that I can play events without either having to chase an entirely new faction / army composition every few months or get stomped by people that do.

Is there anything at all that fits the bill? I haven't played in person since covid kicked off so I have no idea what else is floating around nowadays.

Marvel crisis protocol is an excellent game that is being constantly updated to fix overpowered characters. It has a very flexible faction system with lots of characters on multiple factions (called affiliations). A lot of the unit cards, power cards are available jf you look (i'd link but i think that's not allowed) to print and try out before you buy.
I don't know how much of a following it has, i live in a small town, but there's been some interest with it, so I imagine more i metro areas. It's been around only a year or so.

Foolster41 fucked around with this message at 22:40 on Mar 23, 2022

Calico Heart
Mar 22, 2012

"wich the worst part was what troll face did to sonic's corpse after words wich was rape it. at that point i looked away"



Howdy goons! I recently successfully funded and printed my first game, DEAD IN THE WEST! To celebrate I've GM'd a few episodes of an actual-play podast called RPG Roulette, a miniseries called "Martingale". The show has been extremely fun to record. Players are getting really into character, he plot is filled with loads of great twists and turns, and there's been this overall great mix of fun on the part of the players and drama and tension in the story.


If you wanna listen, the podcast is available on Appe Podcasts here!

If you understandably hate Apple, you can also listen here.

Also I run a small, kinda popular Youtube channel called Infranaut where I've uploaded the first two episodes.

This was really, really fun to record and I've had a few folks tell me they really enjoyed the podcast. If you like what you hear, please consider throwing these guys a rating/review, as I'm sure they'd appreciate it. The story I'm GMing is a mini-series that'll be about five episodes and I can't wait for folks to hear the third and fourth in particular. Give it a listen and lemme know what you think!

Amp
Sep 10, 2010

:11tea::bubblewoop::agesilaus::megaman::yoshi::squawk::supaburn::iit::spooky::axe::honked::shroom::smugdog::sg::pkmnwhy::parrot::screamy::tubular::corsair::sanix::yeeclaw::hayter::flip::redflag:
This is going to be somewhat of me just bragging about someone being nice to me, one of the players in the Pathfinder game I run told me my game is the most fun they've ever had role playing and it's been a legit boost to my mental health and general well-being to hear that something I've worked so hard to make fun is actually landing with my friends. Traditional games....are good.

Plutonis
Mar 25, 2011

Goongrats

hyphz
Aug 5, 2003

Number 1 Nerd Tear Farmer 2022.

Keep it up, champ.

Also you're a skeleton warrior now. Kree.
Unlockable Ben
Nice one!

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Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

Grizzled Patriarch posted:

Getting tired enough of GW's complete lack of ability to balance games, and so I'm putting out some feelers for some other miniature games that might suit me better. Ideally I'd like something that has a large enough competitive scene that I'd actually be able to find games, costs a bit less (this part shouldn't be hard, at least), and has at least some semblance of balanced play so that I can play events without either having to chase an entirely new faction / army composition every few months or get stomped by people that do.

Is there anything at all that fits the bill? I haven't played in person since covid kicked off so I have no idea what else is floating around nowadays.

If you're looking for tabletop wargaming, and maybe even want to keep using your investment in GW miniatures, Mantic makes some games that seem to be much better balanced. "Actually finding games" seems to take place on Facebook, if you're near a large population center it's easier. Nothing is as popular as Warhammer 40k, of course, so there's really no choice that will have quite that level of ease of finding games.
Here's the Mantic thread.

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