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SimonChris posted:Yeah, procedural and declarative memories are stored separately. One of the most famous examples is the case of Clive Wearing, who suffered brain damage preventing him from remembering more than 30 seconds into the past. He still knows how to walk, talk, play music, etc., but constantly believes that he has recently awoken from coma. He has even been able to learn new skills through repetition, even though he does not remember learning them. The "name a state" thing from Episode 1 was supposed to establish this, I think. Helly doesn't know what state she's from, but she knows what a state is and knows that Delaware is one of them. Cojawfee posted:All we know about Irving is that he has a bluray player and the other things from the wellness session. Do we even know that? There's been nothing to establish that what's said in the wellness session is partially or even at all accurate. At the very least Dylan seems to have a wildly different idea of who his outie is than who he actually is. Not sure if it's confirmed he's had a wellness session, or that exact wellness session before though. enki42 fucked around with this message at 18:30 on Mar 21, 2022 |
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Mar 21, 2022 17:19
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Khanstant posted:...surely you can see how the former would very much lead to information about the latter But the characters are already investigating that, we don't need another side story that also does it, that's just wasted time.
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Mar 21, 2022 17:39
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SimonChris posted:One of the most famous examples is the case of Clive Wearing Another famous example is Jonus Grumby who upon receiving a blow to the skull by a falling coconut believed his friends were all Japanese soldiers, but was otherwise unaffected. Amnesia is a real danger and happens more often than you would think. Also quicksand.
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Mar 21, 2022 17:42
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Cojawfee posted:But the characters are already investigating that, we don't need another side story that also does it, that's just wasted time. I think this is silly since it wouldn't be a side story it'll be part of the main story & mystery inherently, but anyway, we're arguing in circles. I'd wager :tenbux: I am closer to what they will have filmed than what you're hoping for.
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Mar 21, 2022 19:19
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Jerusalem posted:In regards to Dylan stuff, it does seem that based on their reactions/fears, it seems like the code detector CAN be beaten with images/symbols after all, or at least they think it can given they took the pretty wild action of "activating" him outside of the building. There probably isn’t a code detector. Unless I’m forgetting something, it came off more like Santa’s watching than anything real. ghostwritingduck fucked around with this message at 23:49 on Mar 21, 2022 |
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Mar 21, 2022 23:28
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If there is a code detector, it apparently only picks up actual letters and not images.
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Mar 21, 2022 23:36
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Yeah the stuff in the book implies pretty heavily that the code detectors are real and they can be fooled.
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Mar 22, 2022 02:48
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Yeah, I'm wary of relying on that ebook, but they released it as part of the marketing and there's a bunch of effort put into it, so there has to be some truth in the pages. I'm cautiously taking it as canon until the show directly contradicts it.
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Mar 22, 2022 02:55
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I've spent too much time thinking about how Devon and Rickon couldn't contact Mark when she went into labor during the workday. It doesn't make sense to me that there would be no way, like a special company phone number for family members, to contact Lumon in an emergency and have them bring the innie up early, and regardless of whether such a system exists or not, I feel like they would all be aware of whether Mark would be able to receive such a message or not. Being completely cut off from emergency communication (such as "Your loved one was in a car accident and is on their deathbed at the hospital") all day every workday is not an insignificant burden (Dylan is okay being out of touch if something happened to his kid, for example?), and I don't think Lumen would impose that on people they're recruiting for severance unless it was totally necessary. I doubt this will be addressed, it just bothers the part of my brain obsessed with logistical detail. Re: discussion of Helly's name, I'm almost certain that someone said Helena in one episode, maybe when Cobel was getting reamed by the Board. Have we ever seen a picture of Gemma? If not, I feel like there must be a reason. Completely baseless theory: Gemma is Helly, and Mark was severed again so as to somehow think she's dead and not recognize her.
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Mar 22, 2022 04:29
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Propaniac posted:I've spent too much time thinking about how Devon and Rickon couldn't contact Mark when she went into labor during the workday. It doesn't make sense to me that there would be no way, like a special company phone number for family members, to contact Lumon in an emergency and have them bring the innie up early, and regardless of whether such a system exists or not, I feel like they would all be aware of whether Mark would be able to receive such a message or not.
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Mar 22, 2022 04:49
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Propaniac posted:Have we ever seen a picture of Gemma? If not, I feel like there must be a reason. Completely baseless theory: Gemma is Helly, and Mark was severed again so as to somehow think she's dead and not recognize her. This theory makes outie Helly like double stone-cold, that's a severe divorce, but that would be a good mindfuck haha
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Mar 22, 2022 05:03
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Propaniac posted:Being completely cut off from emergency communication (such as "Your loved one was in a car accident and is on their deathbed at the hospital") all day every workday is not an insignificant burden (Dylan is okay being out of touch if something happened to his kid, for example?), and I don't think Lumen would impose that on people they're recruiting for severance unless it was totally necessary. I doubt this will be addressed, it just bothers the part of my brain obsessed with logistical detail. An employees sister going into labor probably doesn't count as an emergency.
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Mar 22, 2022 05:29
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I think Cobell would just let everything go to voicemail purely to spite Mark. She's going to have a meltdown when she realises that Rickon's book has inspired an uprising, and that it's all her fault. Just putting the two of them together in a small space is gonna lead to some amazing fireworks.
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Mar 22, 2022 05:41
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Propaniac posted:
I think he would have just forgotten she existed not just what she looks like.
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Mar 22, 2022 12:28
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Open Source Idiom posted:I think Cobell would just let everything go to voicemail purely to spite Mark. Arguably not Cobell's fault as much as Milicik, since he's the one who was told to get rid of the book and left it in the conference room. Since he and Cobell aren't severed they both rolled their eyes at it and probably didn't even think about how revolutionary even the most basic and badly written self help book would be to someone who's never read a book before.
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Mar 22, 2022 12:52
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Isn't it on her for taking it downstairs and then not bringing it back? She's kinda a terrible spy.
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Mar 22, 2022 13:00
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I really don't get how Lumon successfully runs this place. Presumably severing has been going on for a while, did they not consider what would happen in a scenario where the workers united? They seemingly have no security whatsoever or even any staff beyond Cobel, Milchick, the therapist, and the other guy. They didn't have any protocols in place to prevent suicide. What would happen if Mark decided that he didn't want to go into the loving break room? Does the chip have like a snooze button that just allows them to incapacitate everyone immediately if something really bad happens? Erase their memories? I feel like they should have a whole team of handlers ready to deal with any outie issues like Petey or whatever the gently caress they're doing with the baby, but is this tiny middle-aged lady doing infiltration work really the thing that is going to keep the company safe? It really makes the whole thing feel like the Stanford prison experiment, where everything is just held together purely by belief and there's no actual power being wielded by anyone.
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Mar 22, 2022 13:15
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I mean it's impossible to say what's going well or badly when there is no idea what the goal is of anything that is happening.
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Mar 22, 2022 13:44
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Hakkesshu posted:I really don't get how Lumon successfully runs this place. Presumably severing has been going on for a while, did they not consider what would happen in a scenario where the workers united? They seemingly have no security whatsoever or even any staff beyond Cobel, Milchick, the therapist, and the other guy. They didn't have any protocols in place to prevent suicide. What would happen if Mark decided that he didn't want to go into the loving break room? Does the chip have like a snooze button that just allows them to incapacitate everyone immediately if something really bad happens? Erase their memories? I feel like they should have a whole team of handlers ready to deal with any outie issues like Petey or whatever the gently caress they're doing with the baby, but is this tiny middle-aged lady doing infiltration work really the thing that is going to keep the company safe? I feel like with a company like Lumon built on devotion to the founder with a lot of history behind it people just end up believing that none of these would ever be issues, and it's something you see all the time in real world tech companies. Well no our big revolutionary company project doesn't need these things thought about because no-one ever thinks about them happening. You saw it in Walt Disney's projects like Epcot where he never originally thought about what happens to residents of the city when they retired.
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Mar 22, 2022 13:45
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Hakkesshu posted:I really don't get how Lumon successfully runs this place. Presumably severing has been going on for a while, did they not consider what would happen in a scenario where the workers united? They seemingly have no security whatsoever or even any staff beyond Cobel, Milchick, the therapist, and the other guy. They didn't have any protocols in place to prevent suicide. What would happen if Mark decided that he didn't want to go into the loving break room? Does the chip have like a snooze button that just allows them to incapacitate everyone immediately if something really bad happens? Erase their memories? I feel like they should have a whole team of handlers ready to deal with any outie issues like Petey or whatever the gently caress they're doing with the baby, but is this tiny middle-aged lady doing infiltration work really the thing that is going to keep the company safe? The cards Devon was looking at were instructional security takedown cards, and that department said they had been making "aggressive" stuff recently. I suppose you could assume hatchets are for fires, but I'm gonna take the word of the people that were making the stuff when they themselves thought it was aggressive.
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Mar 22, 2022 14:06
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XboxPants posted:The cards Devon was looking at were instructional security takedown cards, and that department said they had been making "aggressive" stuff recently. I suppose you could assume hatchets are for fires, but I'm gonna take the word of the people that were making the stuff when they themselves thought it was aggressive. What are the implications of that though? Just seems like more psychological deterrent stuff like the weird painting they planted. Surely they don't want their workers actually fighting each other with hatchets. I mean maybe they fuckin do.
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Mar 22, 2022 14:30
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Hakkesshu posted:What are the implications of that though? Just seems like more psychological deterrent stuff like the weird painting they planted. Surely they don't want their workers actually fighting each other with hatchets. I mean maybe they fuckin do. I assume they have a security department of possibly severed workers on hand to deal with another violent uprising. edit: Actually they probably are severed. If they were trained security guys, they wouldn't need the cards. Only severed workers would need Babby's First Chokehold instructional cards. XboxPants fucked around with this message at 14:41 on Mar 22, 2022 |
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Mar 22, 2022 14:35
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Hakkesshu posted:What are the implications of that though? Just seems like more psychological deterrent stuff like the weird painting they planted. Surely they don't want their workers actually fighting each other with hatchets. I mean maybe they fuckin do. This might be the point, maybe the severed floors in each Lumon office are like the bunkers in Fallout. Each one is set up differently as a social experiment and the one we're seeing is what happens when active conflict is a potential outcome of inter-departmental rivalry.
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Mar 22, 2022 14:39
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It’s going to end up being God and angels and goons will have a BSG redux moment
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Mar 22, 2022 14:40
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Edit: nm, I don't like arguing on the internet
Propaniac fucked around with this message at 15:07 on Mar 22, 2022 |
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Mar 22, 2022 15:00
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euphronius posted:It’s going to end up being God and angels and goons will have a BSG redux moment If it does go that dumb it'd be in season 2, reviewers saw the entire first series and pretty much all of them say the ending is good but doesn't answer everything.
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Mar 22, 2022 15:26
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I mean this really could be an Arsenal Gear type thing where the point is really just observing these employees and ironing out their idiosyncrasies in order to tweak and tune a consumer version of severing. The only thing that gives me pause here is that The Board seems invested in MDR making their quota, and also that short story seems to link completing files with real world accidents. That reminds me of a Stephen King novella about a kid with mild psychic powers who's recruited by a mysterious organization to draw shapes on a computer, which they e-mail to people and causes them to commit suicide: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everything%27s_Eventual_(novella)
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Mar 22, 2022 19:50
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Oh man, thank you. I've retold that story to a few people in the past couple years trying to jog their memory of it, but I didn't know the name or author, and I was convinced it was a short story we read in grade school like in a lit textbook. I probably just read it in class on my own lol. Feels good to have a title and confirmation it's real, I probably could've looked it up at any point from a loose description but never made it to that step, and now I feel sudden relief from a pressure I forgot I had.
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Mar 22, 2022 23:10
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Thanks to whoever mentioned Counterpart. The (early small spoiler) pandemic plotline seems now very prescient.
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Mar 24, 2022 01:21
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Cult of Kier stuff kinda reminds me of this scene in Network: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=V9XeyBd_IuA
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Mar 24, 2022 12:07
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Propaniac posted:Have we ever seen a picture of Gemma? If not, I feel like there must be a reason. Completely baseless theory: Gemma is Helly, and Mark was severed again so as to somehow think she's dead and not recognize her.
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Mar 25, 2022 03:06
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holy motherfucking poo poo that dance party scene
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Mar 25, 2022 03:11
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The speech Burt’s outie gives is loving hilarious. This show just gets better and better
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Mar 25, 2022 03:23
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Propaniac posted:Have we ever seen a picture of Gemma? If not, I feel like there must be a reason. Completely baseless theory: Gemma is Helly, and Mark was severed again so as to somehow think she's dead and not recognize her. LOL so close!!!!! gently caress that was a good episode
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Mar 25, 2022 03:34
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the start of the episode is already so exciting edit: chekov's vomit
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Mar 25, 2022 03:46
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Escobarbarian posted:LOL so close!!!!! lmao right? God drat that last scene, what the gently caress
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Mar 25, 2022 04:00
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Withnail posted:I'm guessing the 'music/dance experience' is going to be awkward af
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Mar 25, 2022 04:14
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The whiplash in this episode is incredibly powerful I thought the penultimate scene was going to be the last and then they WHIPLASHED ME AGAIN
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Mar 25, 2022 04:17
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Escobarbarian posted:LOL so close!!!!! Ugh, I probably won't be able to watch the new ep until at least Saturday so I don't know yet how close I apparently was with my deliberately-nonsense Gemma-is-Helly theory. Sounds like I was right to think it was notable we'd never seen a picture of Gemma? I'm going to guess they were twin sisters (and I won't be opening the thread again until I've watched it myself).
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Mar 25, 2022 04:18
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unsurprisingly the most 70s looking person on the show has some dance moves HOLY poo poo OMG so huffy over one bite Haha drat "I liked all these things about her... equally" Khanstant fucked around with this message at 04:46 on Mar 25, 2022 |
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Mar 25, 2022 04:20
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