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Radical 90s Wizard posted:I'm waiting for some farmer to show up towing a captured KV-5 or something
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Mar 23, 2022 03:51
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Are you guys aware of/have an opinion of Beau of the fifth column? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWCgFVmkgOs Dude's got a point about these war tourists and the fuckers who stir up poo poo here.
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Mar 23, 2022 04:01
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Tekne posted:an IS-3 would be cool as hell but it wouldn't deserve getting blown up for this clown show pretty sure isreal captured a few of those a long time ago
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Mar 23, 2022 04:02
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Farking Bastage posted:Are you guys aware of/have an opinion of Beau of the fifth column? There's been some discussion of his video, yes. Maybe within the last 10 pages. E: I haven't watched it but I know I've seen that beard in this thread. The amount of right wing poo poo popping up in my youtube feed unsolicited has me blocking so much poo poo right now that I'm just not watching youtube ukraine related videos. CRUSTY MINGE fucked around with this message at 04:14 on Mar 23, 2022 |
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Mar 23, 2022 04:12
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Hyrax Attack! posted:I'd have thought the main Russian priority with tanks wouldn't be manufacturing new ones but instead getting their existing inventory where it can be useful and repairing those already in place. It's not like WWII where they need to produce tens of thousands of modern tanks and a production disruption could be crippling, I'd assume even if they were making new ones it would probably be at least a month from the start of manufacturing to getting it shipped to Ukraine, probably more. Building a new tank is going to take up many more man-hours and resources than repairing an older one sitting in a depot, but the two are probably not overlapping much. The people in the factory are probably not able to get old tanks running and the mechanics scraping together T-72s whose engines still turn over probably can't build new ones. If Russia still has the resources to do both then it probably makes sense to do both. The problem is that there's no evidence to suggest that the new tanks will be any more effective than the older ones, since they're mostly being engaged by ATGMs, which seems to easily take out anything with treads. Then again their tank factories are able to churn out low double-digit units per year, and probably fewer given the lack of parts and potentially tools Fielding newer tanks though might be detrimental to Russia's logistics since their introduction means they now need people and equipment that are trained/suited for them, adding more strain to their supply lines.
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Mar 23, 2022 04:13
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Commie talk me down. https://twitter.com/toialerts/status/1506474325125214213?s=21 Also the radiation monitors aren’t working anymore.
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Mar 23, 2022 04:46
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHpX6_B8ArE Killing Russians is the activity that brings the whole town together.
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Mar 23, 2022 04:55
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CRUSTY MINGE posted:There's been some discussion of his video, yes. Maybe within the last 10 pages. Good news he's very left wing
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Mar 23, 2022 05:02
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NightGyr posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHpX6_B8ArE “Friends who slay together, stay together” was right there!
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Mar 23, 2022 05:02
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NYT did an interview with a Ukrainian fighter pilot. It's pretty light on details due to opsec, but some parts really stand out: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/22/world/europe/ukraine-air-force-russia.html quote:Andriy hustles into his Su-27 supersonic jet and hastily taxis toward the runway, getting airborne as quickly as possible. He takes off so fast that he doesn’t yet know his mission for the night, though the big picture is always the same — to bring the fight to a Russian Air Force that is vastly superior in numbers but has so far failed to win control of the skies above Ukraine. quote:“Every time when I fly, it’s for a real fight,” said Andriy, who is 25 and has flown 10 missions in the war. “In every fight with Russian jets, there is no equality. They always have five times more” planes in the air. quote:“I mostly have tasks of hitting airborne targets, of intercepting enemy jets,” he said. “I wait for the missile to lock on my target. After that I press fire.” quote:“I had situations when I was approaching a Russian plane to a close enough distance to target and fire,” he said. “I could already detect it but was waiting for my missile to lock on while at the same time from the ground they tell me that a missile was fired at me already.”
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Mar 23, 2022 05:11
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Andriy we love you
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Mar 23, 2022 05:25
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Say, was posting on D&D about stuff I'd been seeing in the DoD press briefings, and I realized that I could probably get some clarification about a couple of points from people who actually know stuff about the military. What do you folks make of the following statements from said press briefings? Have I badly misunderstood what the "senior defense official" is saying? Is my analysis way off?Tomn posted:Ah, there I must disagree, and I have evidence to disagree with!
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Mar 23, 2022 05:29
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:Andriy we love you The real ghost(s) of Kyiv.
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Mar 23, 2022 06:01
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Zamujasa posted:The real ghost(s) of Kyiv. The ghost of Kyiv is real drat you
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Mar 23, 2022 06:02
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:The ghost of Kyiv is real drat you well, yes, they just interviewed one 
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Mar 23, 2022 06:05
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Tomn posted:Say, was posting on D&D about stuff I'd been seeing in the DoD press briefings, and I realized that I could probably get some clarification about a couple of points from people who actually know stuff about the military. What do you folks make of the following statements from said press briefings? Have I badly misunderstood what the "senior defense official" is saying? Is my analysis way off? He's kind of vague, but he's likely referring to pre-positioned stockpiles from the Western and Southern Military Districts. Theater doesn't necessarily mean a specific country, but rather a broad geographic area which represents the operational demarcation point for combat operations and support. In that case, it would include Western Russia and Belarus.
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Mar 23, 2022 06:38
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Are you making GBS threads me, Russia? https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-march-22 quote:Russian forces are unlikely to successfully resolve their command and control issues in the near term. A senior US defense official stated on March 21 that Russian forces are increasingly using unsecured communications due to lacking sufficient capacity on secured networks.[9] CNN additionally quoted multiple sources on March 21 that the United States has been unable to determine if Russia has appointed an overall commander for the invasion of Ukraine.[10] These sources stated that Russian units from different military districts appear to be competing for resources and are not coordinating their operations.
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Mar 23, 2022 09:03
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psydude posted:Are you making GBS threads me, Russia? That would explain a lot. Especially the competing for resources part.
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Mar 23, 2022 10:00
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Madurai posted:When someone complains about uptiering in WT, my go-to example is the presence of T-34/85s in the inventories of WP countries reserve units into the Eighties, and the Sherman not leaving the inventory of some Western nations -- including Canada-- into the Seventies. The last country to use the Sherman was Paraguay and their last three Shermans were finally retired in 2018.
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Mar 23, 2022 11:44
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psydude posted:Are you making GBS threads me, Russia? Jesus, it's an army of libertarians
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Mar 23, 2022 11:45
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psydude posted:Are you making GBS threads me, Russia? So what you are saying is that Russia could have won this quickly if they had started this show with actual command and control, training, proper logistics and maintenance on their equipment? But because they lacked all those things Ukraine might actually pull this off?
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Mar 23, 2022 11:51
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Cimber posted:So what you are saying is that Russia could have won this quickly if they had started this show with actual command and control, training, proper logistics and maintenance on their equipment? But because they lacked all those things Ukraine might actually pull this off? Eliot Cohen had a good piece in The Atlantic arguing that everyone should drop the act and start admitting that Ukraine is winning. They've fought the Russian Army to a standstill and have even started some minor reversals, all without losing the resolve of their own people nor most of the rest of the world. The only strategic objective Russia has achieved has been taking Kherson, and even that failed to sustain their momentum. They will eventually take Mauripol, but only after completely destroying the city and tying up and grinding down their forces that would have otherwise been committed to taking the rest of the Donbas and Odessa. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/03/ukraine-is-winning-war-russia/627121/
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Mar 23, 2022 11:56
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psydude posted:Eliot Cohen had a good piece in The Atlantic arguing that everyone should drop the act and start admitting that Ukraine is winning. They've fought the Russian Army to a standstill and have even started some minor reversals, all without losing the resolve of their own people nor most of the rest of the world. The only strategic objective Russia has achieved has been taking Kherson, and even that failed to sustain their momentum. They will eventually take Mauripol, but only after completely destroying the city and tying up and grinding down their forces that would have otherwise been committed to taking the rest of the Donbas and Odessa. Ukraine may be turning the tide, but I am not going to call what’s happening “Winning”.
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Mar 23, 2022 12:47
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LightRailTycoon posted:Ukraine may be turning the tide, but I am not going to call what’s happening “Winning”. Yeah, I would go with a 'courageously not losing right now' rather than 'winning'. If I see major counter offensives, many towns liberated and the Russian invader fleeing back to their own borders I'll then switch things over into the 'winning' column.
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Mar 23, 2022 13:02
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psydude posted:Eliot Cohen had a good piece in The Atlantic arguing that everyone should drop the act and start admitting that Ukraine is winning. They've fought the Russian Army to a standstill and have even started some minor reversals, all without losing the resolve of their own people nor most of the rest of the world. The only strategic objective Russia has achieved has been taking Kherson, and even that failed to sustain their momentum. They will eventually take Mauripol, but only after completely destroying the city and tying up and grinding down their forces that would have otherwise been committed to taking the rest of the Donbas and Odessa. Ukraine might very well drive the Russians out of a lot of the "captured" territory, but it's still quite possible that an eventual peace settlement ends with Ukraine losing access to the Sea of Azov, which is difficult to see as a victory. That said, Russians are definitely losing more than the Ukrainians.
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Mar 23, 2022 13:06
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LightRailTycoon posted:Ukraine may be turning the tide, but I am not going to call what’s happening “Winning”. What they are doing is the very definition of "Winning". Successfully stalled a Superpower during a planned invasion, check. Denied air superiority of a Superpower, again, during a PLANNED invasion, check. The closest Russia has come to achieving ANY of their goals is the capture of Kherson and the soon to be destruction of Maripol. Maripol is a draw, they actually wanted that city, now it's just a spot on the map. Their supply lines, when they exist, are harrassed by Ukraine. In some cases, Russian units have been surrounded by the UA. At no point has the Russian military made a move that shows their control over the battle space, everything they do is half assed. Unless the metric for success is the destruction of Russia's own personnel and equipment, there is no world in which you can say Russia is "Winning". Edit: To be clear, Ukraine has a long way to go. That being said, just because Ukraine isn't decisively moving Russian troops out of their borders doesn't equate to Russia necessarily being the victor. Right now, this is a draw, with Ukraine on the advantage. ASAPI fucked around with this message at 13:12 on Mar 23, 2022 |
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Mar 23, 2022 13:09
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have you considered that some wars might have no winners?
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Mar 23, 2022 13:11
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pmchem posted:have you considered that some wars might have no winners? Contrary to what you've just seen, war is neither glamorous nor fun. There are no winners, only losers. There are no good wars, with the following exceptions: the American Revolution, World War II, and the Star Wars Trilogy.
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Mar 23, 2022 13:14
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Yeah even if they push the Russians back to Moscow, they’ve still got a few destroyed cities and their infrastructure is in ruins. It’s going to take a decade to rebuild Ukraine, even if they win.
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Mar 23, 2022 13:14
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When was the last time in modern history that an aggressor actually won their war of aggression? I can only think of one, the 2003 invasion of Iraq, and even that the 'victory' wasn't so clear cut.
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Mar 23, 2022 13:15
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FrozenVent posted:Yeah even if they push the Russians back to Moscow, they’ve still got a few destroyed cities and their infrastructure is in ruins. Which is tragic, but the silver lining is that the West is going to pour resources into rebuilding whereas Russia will be permanently crippled and depend on China to rebuild their military.
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Mar 23, 2022 13:15
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Boy did I piss a tankie off.  Best part is I suspect they don't realize I'm Jewish and the mod who probated me, didn't realize it, and even went to remove it, when I told him (and saying it was fine and funny, I just wanted to be on the record that I was Jewish lol).
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Mar 23, 2022 13:17
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Cimber posted:When was the last time in modern history that an aggressor actually won their war of aggression? It depends on how you define war and agressor. But, one important option is Putin in Crimea 2014 and before that Putin in Chechnya. Both were almost certainly a big part of what convinced Putin he can win and preserve international support.
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Mar 23, 2022 13:22
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VictualSquid posted:It depends on how you define war and agressor. But, one important option is Putin in Crimea 2014 and before that Putin in Chechnya. Both were almost certainly a big part of what convinced Putin he can win and preserve international support. Georgia is quietly shaking its head and wondering why nobody cares.
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Mar 23, 2022 13:24
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Stultus Maximus posted:Georgia is quietly shaking its head and wondering why nobody cares. Probably because they haven been giving flashy and newsworthy support to the current invasion. But, you are right they totally belong on the list.
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Mar 23, 2022 13:28
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Also because Georgia did not stand a shadow of chance in 2008. The real way to define victory is to define what victory looks like. Iraq and Afghanistan were losses. We lost. The US decided that ~nation-building~ was the next move, and it, uhhh, decidedly was not. Now Iraq is an Iranian-aligned dictatorship and Afghanistan ended in a complete Taliban victory. Whoops. But in Ukraine, what does victory even look like for the Russians? I'd say the capitulation of the central state and nothing less. Zelensky has already said he will not accept further territorial dismemberment of Ukraine. In which case they're not really doing that hot on that front.
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Mar 23, 2022 13:51
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:Andriy we love you Give em hell you glorious bastard
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Mar 23, 2022 14:10
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https://twitter.com/kyivindependent/status/1506623757447749640?s=21 So I guess Russia is finally going to motivate energy bans by Europe.
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Mar 23, 2022 14:29
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Alchenar posted:Contrary to what you've just seen, war is neither glamorous nor fun. There are no winners, only losers. There are no good wars, with the following exceptions: the American Revolution, World War II, and the Star Wars Trilogy. If they'd freed the slaves, maybe. As it stands, lol.
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Mar 23, 2022 14:30
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Xakura posted:If they'd freed the slaves, maybe. As it stands, lol. It’s a Simpsons quote.
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Mar 23, 2022 14:31
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