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real hedgehogs are really cute and I've always wanted one. EDIT: no I will not add context to this post, eat my butt
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Mar 24, 2022 05:23
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Dabir posted:Depends if you stick a rocket flower up his rear end. Those bits of Odyssey control a lot like Sonic probably should. I like those sections but Sonic levels are much better than them.
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Mar 24, 2022 05:45
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Simply Simon posted:Yeah, that's pretty much it. Some parts are 50% there, some 70%, some 90% (the fun parts), and some don't work at all, of course. Iirc "lots of people worked very hard on it" isn't actually true, only a few people did - Sega cut down the dev team to make another game, and then a bunch of them got headhunted when yuji naka left the company. and Sega never replaced the 3/4ths of the team that left, nor did they adjust any of the project's goals, expectations, or dev timeline Those few people probably pulled off a miracle getting the game to boot and be possible to play to completion though, definitely worth playing just to honor their sacrifice Looper posted:my friend, check out the little known gem sonic unleashed I've played sonic unleashed and it has between 1 and 3 good levels. But also mach speed generally has much wider areas, damage taken demand colliding with objects/the environment, and also no air control. These are all design fundamentals, not bugs, so "fixed up mach speed" would be reasonably different from boost sonic
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Mar 24, 2022 22:17
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nmzc8L8zTBk This is really cute and also randomly establishes exactly how the animal vs human cities work.
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Mar 25, 2022 00:00
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I can't believe Two Worlds theory was retconned out of existence by the magic of Vtubers.
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Mar 25, 2022 01:11
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ninjewtsu posted:I've played sonic unleashed and it has between 1 and 3 good levels. But also mach speed generally has much wider areas, damage taken demand colliding with objects/the environment, and also no air control. These are all design fundamentals, not bugs, so "fixed up mach speed" would be reasonably different from boost sonic They're design fundamentals that sucked, that's why they got rid of them in Unleashed. Except for the wider areas, I suppose, I'd like to see those come back.
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Mar 25, 2022 01:27
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Right, so that's why Unleashed isn't "mach speed but fixed".
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Mar 25, 2022 01:32
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There's parts of Unleashed that are a bit like mach speed, it's the level segments that are more open, where you run and drift around big turns and have to cut corners and barely jump. It's where you are asked to be good at the very basic movement (with the added challenge of the drift), something you rarely had to do in a Sonic game before. It's not a 1:1 and obviously Unleashed does it more deftly, and those segments seamlessly flow into more standard platforming parts, but I see where the comparison comes from. Probably the best analogy are Unleashed Acts like the one in Mazuri where you have to drift around big bends with no rails in the beetle boss arena, and you can't take it slow because of a time limit. Or isolated missions like where you have to boost over the water part of dragon road without breaking pots.
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Mar 25, 2022 08:46
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ninjewtsu posted:Iirc "lots of people worked very hard on it" isn't actually true, only a few people did - Sega cut down the dev team to make another game, and then a bunch of them got headhunted when yuji naka left the company. and Sega never replaced the 3/4ths of the team that left, nor did they adjust any of the project's goals, expectations, or dev timeline loving lol @ this still The problem's always been Sega. They don't treat any other franchises like this do they? I'm not sure how many Sonic games have gotten to actually have a normal dev cycle.
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Mar 25, 2022 09:04
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Ghost Leviathan posted:loving lol @ this still [looks at pso2ngs as well as pso2ep5] well,
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Mar 25, 2022 10:06
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Mar 25, 2022 10:14
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The Bee posted:I can't believe Two Worlds theory was retconned out of existence by the magic of Vtubers. I never got more than a few episodes into Sonic X but I liked its explanation of the split worlds, where the main characters and the floating island all got transported to Earth for the Sonic Adventure games. I like to think that Eggman and Gerald are from Earth but both found their way to Sonic's world* by experimenting with chaos energy or something. I guess the chaos emeralds are native to Sonic's world as well. It's strange they even tried to explain the split worlds since in Japan it's been Earth all along. It's easier to think of it being just like the world in Dragon Ball, where there's humans and modern/futuristic technology, but also talking animals, magical gemstones and lots of weird stuff. *I want to say Mobius but I know someone's gonna go um  Did they give a name to it in the 2020 Sonic movie? I know in the OVA it's called Planet Freedom.
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Mar 25, 2022 11:17
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I don't think the story focused on it long enough for it to matter.
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Mar 25, 2022 12:40
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I like that as an official explanation, although it doesn't exactly hold up well given that Unleashed and Forces were globe spanning adventures and solely featured humans and animals respectively. Whatever though, they can jump between using humans and animals whenever they feel like it and it doesn't really matter beyond that.
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Mar 25, 2022 12:53
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When I was a child, I was always fascinated with the idea of who built the Marble Zone or who lived in the Starlight Zone. Now, as a man, I know I was a dumb child.
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Mar 25, 2022 13:06
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You can tell that the movie wasn't under Sega's control because they actually gave Sonic an origin story of sorts, and context for where he lives. I've heard the various worlds compared to Norse mythology, oddly enough, with Sonic fleeing from Alfheim to Midgard.
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Mar 25, 2022 13:10
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they should call it mobius its a good name
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Mar 25, 2022 13:31
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The Bee posted:I can't believe Two Worlds theory was retconned out of existence by the magic of Vtubers. I don't see what that weird guy from chicago has to do with this
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Mar 25, 2022 14:00
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Disco Pope posted:When I was a child, I was always fascinated with the idea of who built the Marble Zone or who lived in the Starlight Zone. Now, as a man, I know I was a dumb child. i don't get it
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Mar 25, 2022 14:46
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Doctor_Fruitbat posted:I like that as an official explanation, although it doesn't exactly hold up well given that Unleashed and Forces were globe spanning adventures and solely featured humans and animals respectively. Whatever though, they can jump between using humans and animals whenever they feel like it and it doesn't really matter beyond that. Forces is really kind of the big fly in the single world ointment since it explicitly involves Eggman having taken over the whole world. In the games that focus more on animal-folk like Sonic and friends, it's been all but explicitly established that non-humans on Sonic's world don't really have much in the way of largescale infrastructure and organization so in games that focus more on the human side of Sonic's World it's easy to justify that the manimal population is around just offscreen since they don't really have any more agency on world events than the humans. Then you get a game like Sonic Forces, where it's stated Eggman has taken over the whole world but we only focus on the Sonic recolor population and it just raises the question of "Where's GUN during all of this? Why aren't any of the human governments doing something to stop this?". Honestly, I think either the Two Worlds or One World model could work for the games, but Sega refuses to actually commit to one or the other which leaves us in this weird state of limbo where neither model seems particularly accurate to what we've seen in the games. Disco Pope posted:When I was a child, I was always fascinated with the idea of who built the Marble Zone or who lived in the Starlight Zone. Now, as a man, I know I was a dumb child. I'm going to be honest, I've been kind of fascinated by the type of worldbuilding that could be extrapolated from the original games. Just this weird, nonsense adventure world full of ancient ruins, abstract super-cities and giant expanses of wilderness where you fight robots with magic rocks...
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Mar 25, 2022 15:22
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gun deployed their best operative, what more could they do?
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Mar 25, 2022 15:26
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As far as Japan goes, the games have always been set on an alternate Earth (South Island, Westside Island, and Angel Island are all based on real world locations). I think the Mobius angle comes from a misunderstanding of an interview with Yuji Naka where he referred to the Sonic 2 levels as “Mobius Worlds” (likely in reference to the fact there’s a lot of corkscrews present in the zones especially early on) and Sega of America just ran with it for a while. Larryb fucked around with this message at 15:54 on Mar 25, 2022 |
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Mar 25, 2022 15:31
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KingKalamari posted:I'm going to be honest, I've been kind of fascinated by the type of worldbuilding that could be extrapolated from the original games. Just this weird, nonsense adventure world full of ancient ruins, abstract super-cities and giant expanses of wilderness where you fight robots with magic rocks... I think in the early company "bibles" for Sonic, they had something about it being set 2,000 years after some kind of nukes destroyed everything. Which is where anthropomorphic animals like Sonic came from, while Flickies still existed. Radiation just made some animals different. So alot of the settings were just implied to be leftover stuff from when humans were the big population. And that definitely has way more of a charm to it. But I guess the current story makes more sense than Eggman being basically the only human left.
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Mar 25, 2022 15:48
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Can't believe a Vtuber video has done more for Sonic lore than any game from the past decade. The Two Worlds was a dumb concept so its good they retconned it. The planet should be called Mobius.
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Mar 25, 2022 15:53
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Larryb posted:As far as Japan goes, the games have always been set on an alternate Earth (South Island, Westside Island, and Angel Island are all based on real world locations). To expand on this: Hill Top Zone - Appalachian Mountains Mushroom Hill Zone - Redwood National City Escape - Scottsdale
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Mar 25, 2022 15:57
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Looper posted:i don't get it I'm in the camp that I liked Sonic a lot more when he was mute and kind of cute, but as a poster said above, his world was pretty interesting with its ancient ruins and lava based energy plants and city sized casinos and abstract tropical paradises.
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Mar 25, 2022 15:58
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Of course it's two worlds, Lost Hex is clearly another planet. Comedy option - a third timeline where Eggman captures and tortures Sonic for like a year and maybe kills all the humans off-screen but it's not important.
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Mar 25, 2022 17:03
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eggman built everything
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Mar 25, 2022 17:17
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For what it's worth, I can imagine Humanity went into a complete panic by the time Shadow went MIA so they probably surrendered and in turn the "mobians" (for want a better term) didn't give a care about what was going on with them during the (Comic's) Metal Virus incident and left them to it.
ConanThe3rd fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Mar 25, 2022 |
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Mar 25, 2022 17:28
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Hrist posted:I think in the early company "bibles" for Sonic, they had something about it being set 2,000 years after some kind of nukes destroyed everything. Which is where anthropomorphic animals like Sonic came from, while Flickies still existed. Radiation just made some animals different. So alot of the settings were just implied to be leftover stuff from when humans were the big population. And that definitely has way more of a charm to it. But I guess the current story makes more sense than Eggman being basically the only human left. No that's Archie, and it's nowhere near early. I think the lore dump for this was by aliens, but it might have been the ancient solid gold E-102 Gamma recolor built by Dr. Ivan Kintobor, Robotnik's ancestor who was born on 6/6/2006 and started the alien invasion by disecting their emissary after First Contact. I had to look up some of those details but man Archie Sonic was WILD Pre-Flynn.
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Mar 25, 2022 18:07
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actually aliens nuked the planet because robotniks ancestor dissected their ambassador and because of that humans turned into overlands who only have four fingers instead of five
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Mar 25, 2022 18:09
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Also to be clear this is Prime Robotnik's ancestor. Presumably Robo-Robotnik/Robotnik Mark II/Eggman, an alternate universe Robotnik to roboticized himself, then killed his Sonic and the Freedom Fighters, then got bored and nuked his Mobius to oblivion before moving to Mobius Prime to fight a different Sonic, had his own Ivan Robotnik in the past but this was never confirmed. Also it is called Mobius Prime because it is at the center of the multiverse and is the single most important and real Sonic universe there is out of all Sonic universes. Zonic The Zone Cop, a multiverse cop version of Sonic who always stands on the sides of panels because he's from a perpendicular universe, said so. Captain France fucked around with this message at 18:20 on Mar 25, 2022 |
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Mar 25, 2022 18:18
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robo-robotnik has the same backstory up until he robotocized himself actually
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Mar 25, 2022 18:40
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archie sonic owns
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Mar 25, 2022 18:40
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwDGReApaB0
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Mar 25, 2022 18:48
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Hrist posted:I think in the early company "bibles" for Sonic, they had something about it being set 2,000 years after some kind of nukes destroyed everything. Which is where anthropomorphic animals like Sonic came from, while Flickies still existed. Radiation just made some animals different. So alot of the settings were just implied to be leftover stuff from when humans were the big population. And that definitely has way more of a charm to it. But I guess the current story makes more sense than Eggman being basically the only human left. No, that's just Archie's story. The western backstory for sonic that was used was that it was a different planet called Mobius inhabited by animals with no humans. Dr Ovi Kintobor, a human scientist who came to the planet somehow, was turned into Dr Ivo Robotnik when an accident during an experiment with the Chaos Emeralds turned him evil. There's other stuff in there, like Sonic being his lab assistant and another lab accident turned him blue (he was a brown hedgehog who was fast before that), but that's pretty much it. This was in the manuals and on the Sonic website or something until it was eventually abandoned. Only UK tie-in media ever actually used the backstory, Sonic the Comic and some books. For whatever reason all the American stuff just did it's own thing, so there were three different cartoons that all had different backstories and basically nothing to do with the games other than having Sonic and Tails and a completely different looking Robotnik. For Japan there was barely any backstory I think, just there are some islands with talking animals and no humans I guess. Eggman wasn't the only human on the planet, just some dickhead taking over those islands. Veotax fucked around with this message at 19:09 on Mar 25, 2022 |
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Mar 25, 2022 19:01
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video game stories werent considered important back then and companies like sega would let their international branches make up whatever they wanted for instruction manuals or cartoons because they didnt think it would really matter. then it started mattering lol
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Mar 25, 2022 19:05
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16-bit Butt-Head posted:video game stories werent considered important back then and companies like sega would let their international branches make up whatever they wanted for instruction manuals or cartoons because they didnt think it would really matter. then it started mattering lol It still doesn't matter.
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Mar 25, 2022 19:07
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elf help book posted:It still doesn't matter. actually they matter if its a role playing or sonic game
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Mar 25, 2022 19:07
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Veotax posted:No, that's just Archie's story. The western backstory for sonic that was used was that it was a different planet called Mobius inhabited by animals with no humans. Dr Ovi Kintobor, a human scientist who came to the planet somehow, was turned into Dr Ivo Robotnik when an accident during an experiment with the Chaos Emeralds turned him evil. There's other stuff in there, like Sonic being his lab assistant and another lab accident turned him blue (he was a brown hedgehog who was fast before that), but that's pretty much it. I believe the only backstory given in the Japanese Sonic 1 manual is that Sonic was born on Christmas Island (another real world location) and that the first game was apparently not his first meeting with Eggman
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Mar 25, 2022 19:11
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