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It's one of the landing challenges in MSFS
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Apr 6, 2022 20:42
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| # ? May 25, 2024 08:42 |
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Ah, St Barts. Back when I got my first multi-engine job flying C402's and Aztec's, the boss was a boomer prick like most Part 135 owners. One day he came back to TJSJ late and without his Aztec. With a heroic tale about how the airplane malfunctioned while on final for TFFJ RWY10 and he saved the day but had to leave the airplane there for minor repairs. This was around 2009 so the beginning of smartphone cameras, YouTube, and viral videos. A few days later a video popped up of him completely loving up his approach, refusing to go-around, and finally touching down way down the runway and crashing at the end. We showed him the video during one of his weekly meetings where he would lecture us about safety. He became livid and told us to delete it and not share it with anyone. We had to explain to him how YouTube worked. Anyways here's the video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-z2o0acIlm4
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Apr 6, 2022 20:58
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What's the minimum runway length for an Aztec? I'm guessing more than 860 feet. 
Cojawfee fucked around with this message at 21:15 on Apr 6, 2022 |
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Apr 6, 2022 21:12
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Where most landing challenges in FS are difficult but not super hard with a few retries, St. Barts is one that I have never once been able to hit even close to good. I’ve definitely gotten it down but any passengers would be making GBS threads their pants either from the smack or the relative lack of runway in front of us.
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Apr 6, 2022 21:16
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The one where you land a King Air on a glorified helipad in the middle of the ocean is pretty nuts as well
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Apr 6, 2022 21:20
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Animal posted:Ah, St Barts. Back when I got my first multi-engine job flying C402's and Aztec's, the boss was a boomer prick like most Part 135 owners. One day he came back to TJSJ late and without his Aztec. With a heroic tale about how the airplane malfunctioned while on final for TFFJ RWY10 and he saved the day but had to leave the airplane there for minor repairs. This was around 2009 so the beginning of smartphone cameras, YouTube, and viral videos. A few days later a video popped up of him completely loving up his approach, refusing to go-around, and finally touching down way down the runway and crashing at the end. We showed him the video during one of his weekly meetings where he would lecture us about safety. He became livid and told us to delete it and not share it with anyone. We had to explain to him how YouTube worked. lmao this is loving wonderful.
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Apr 6, 2022 22:01
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Ah, the good old days, where videos didn't just cut out two frames after the main action.
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Apr 6, 2022 22:24
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Combat Pretzel posted:Ah, the good old days, where videos didn't just cut out two frames after the main action. WATCH UNTIL THE END... U WONT BELIEVE WHAT HAPPENS!!!
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Apr 6, 2022 22:31
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Animal posted:Ah, St Barts. Back when I got my first multi-engine job flying C402's and Aztec's, the boss was a boomer prick like most Part 135 owners. One day he came back to TJSJ late and without his Aztec. With a heroic tale about how the airplane malfunctioned while on final for TFFJ RWY10 and he saved the day but had to leave the airplane there for minor repairs. This was around 2009 so the beginning of smartphone cameras, YouTube, and viral videos. A few days later a video popped up of him completely loving up his approach, refusing to go-around, and finally touching down way down the runway and crashing at the end. We showed him the video during one of his weekly meetings where he would lecture us about safety. He became livid and told us to delete it and not share it with anyone. We had to explain to him how YouTube worked. Wow, the video of your boss loving up is one I show almost all of my students when we start discussing short-field landings and/or the importance of go-arounds. I love that video so much.
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Apr 6, 2022 22:38
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If you have not touched down by midfield at ANY runway, you should probably go around. When you manage to get the nose down on the wrong set of touchdown area markers, you have hosed UP.
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Apr 6, 2022 22:42
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MrYenko posted:If you have not touched down by midfield at ANY runway, you should probably go around. When you manage to get the nose down on the wrong set of touchdown area markers, you have hosed UP. Midfield on a very long runway in a suitable plane is acceptable in my opinion, provided you intended to do it and planned for it, just like intersection takeoffs are fine given enough runway. I think it's more accurate to say: you should always be landing within a situationally appropriate distance from your intended touchdown point, probably never more than 500 feet or so but occasionally less.
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Apr 6, 2022 22:56
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Sapozhnik posted:The one where you land a King Air on a glorified helipad in the middle of the ocean is pretty nuts as well From that description I’m gonna guess it’s probably Saba TNCS? Speaking of lovely airports in the middle of nowhere, is St. Helena FHSH in the game?
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Apr 6, 2022 23:00
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Mokotow posted:From that description I’m gonna guess it’s probably Saba TNCS? Can confirm: it is. I'm not sure if the sim accurately models the hosed windshear around it.
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Apr 6, 2022 23:09
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I love it when modders put in their own little local airports. The best ones also include a little guy in the little tower, a snack truck for visitors and some regulars' cars in the lot
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Apr 6, 2022 23:56
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PT6A posted:Can confirm: it is. I'm not sure if the sim accurately models the hosed windshear around it. Maybe not super accurately, but MSFS does model how air moves around cliffs and mountains and whatnot.
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Apr 7, 2022 00:13
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Animal posted:Ah, St Barts. Back when I got my first multi-engine job flying C402's and Aztec's, the boss was a boomer prick like most Part 135 owners. One day he came back to TJSJ late and without his Aztec. With a heroic tale about how the airplane malfunctioned while on final for TFFJ RWY10 and he saved the day but had to leave the airplane there for minor repairs. This was around 2009 so the beginning of smartphone cameras, YouTube, and viral videos. A few days later a video popped up of him completely loving up his approach, refusing to go-around, and finally touching down way down the runway and crashing at the end. We showed him the video during one of his weekly meetings where he would lecture us about safety. He became livid and told us to delete it and not share it with anyone. We had to explain to him how YouTube worked. lol, i was wondering why ppl wouldn't just approach from over the water until i saw this
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Apr 7, 2022 05:21
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MrYenko posted:If you have not touched down by midfield at ANY runway, you should probably go around. airplane: cessna 150 runway: merced-castle rwy 31
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Apr 7, 2022 06:49
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Maybe the bay/other hill is deceiving in its closeness, but a question for pilots: why doesn’t St Barts run opposite and have a sweeping turn near the hill into a very short final? My sim-knowledge-only guess is that it potentially sets you up to be totally hosed if anything goes wrong and it doesn’t give you a lot of time to figure out if you’ve hosed up? Once you turn for the runway you’re basically boxed, so you wouldn’t have any room to go around, especially if your go-around is anywhere near the threshold of the runway. On top of that the turn wouldn’t give you much time to stabilize an approach, so you’d put yourself in an even worse “go/no-go” decision spot since there’s more to manage closer to that ultimate decision point. Am I close? I ask because while I haven’t attempted it in the sim, naively I think it feels a whole lot easier to make a sweeping turn into a landing with slope to help me instead of a terrifying steep descent where I feel like I have to drop the fucker if I want to slow down on the slope.
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Apr 7, 2022 07:02
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Yeah, it's a very short runway and the hill means there's no possibility of a go-around if you gently caress up and land long. The wacky steep approach over the road is the better of two bad options.
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Apr 7, 2022 07:13
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Most airplanes can descend at a greater angle than they're capable of climbing at, so having a runway with an obstacle at the approach end but nothing on the departure end is significantly safer than one where the obstacle is on the departure end of the runway, especially at an airport that sees mostly smaller piston or turboprop airplanes that don't have a ton of excess power.
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Apr 7, 2022 10:29
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Anime Store Adventure posted:Maybe the bay/other hill is deceiving in its closeness, but a question for pilots: why doesn’t St Barts run opposite and have a sweeping turn near the hill into a very short final? Both directions are available for landing. Only takeoffs on runway 28 are prohibited. Winds decide which direction is in use. There are challenges with landing on 28 too: the go-around point is on the base leg before you turn final. There is no going around once you have turned. For 10 you can still go around on final. A steep approach isnt very difficult. That's not the concern. The pilot in that video could and should have gone around and would have been fine. But if they were landing 28 they couldn't have gone around safely because of the hills. Not being able to go around because you floated too long and crashing into the hill is the biggest risk. Zero One fucked around with this message at 13:06 on Apr 7, 2022 |
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Apr 7, 2022 12:58
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MrYenko posted:If you have not touched down by midfield at ANY runway, you should probably go around. When you manage to get the nose down on the wrong set of touchdown area markers, you have hosed UP. i dunno what if you just really want the flight to be over tho?
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Apr 7, 2022 13:19
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Nose down harder
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Apr 7, 2022 14:04
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azflyboy posted:Most airplanes can descend at a greater angle than they're capable of climbing at,. Technically all airplanes can descend at a greater angle than they can climb. -90deg is an angle.
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Apr 7, 2022 17:32
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Bloody Hedgehog posted:Technically all airplanes can descend at a greater angle than they can climb. -90deg is an angle. *F-15 joins the chat*
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Apr 7, 2022 17:47
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I know the MSFS F-18 fidelity is not the best, but hey it's accessible and fun, going vertical in the F-18 is a total blast. Unfortunately they haven't fixed the super stark line where scenery turns extremely green bug and probably never will, but whatever.
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Apr 7, 2022 18:05
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There's a Cessna 414 coming to MSFS and it looks  Still in early access so not on the in-sim marketplace yet but hopefully it will be at some point.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKtrwVpWghA
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Apr 7, 2022 18:14
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Oh man, I want that. The flat engines alone make it better for sightseeing than the Pipers.
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Apr 7, 2022 18:38
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Sapozhnik posted:There's a Cessna 414 coming to MSFS and it looks jerry simulator 2022! the title card of the video is even in the bay area lol
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Apr 8, 2022 01:48
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winwing hardware is generally considered to be good, right? I've got a VKB stick and pedals and mostly fly MSFS, but have started getting into DCS a bit as well and want to pick up a throttle, so I was looking at their F18 throttle. I live in Korea and from what I've seen the only standalone throttles that are relatively easily sourced here are the winwing stuff or the TM TWCS. (Buying a cm3 direct from virpil would also be an option but after shipping/import costs that's a pretty substantial price jump over the winwing for me, and I'm not sure it'd be worth the cost?)
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Apr 8, 2022 03:11
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astr0man posted:winwing hardware is generally considered to be good, right? I've got a VKB stick and pedals and mostly fly MSFS, but have started getting into DCS a bit as well and want to pick up a throttle, so I was looking at their F18 throttle. I live in Korea and from what I've seen the only standalone throttles that are relatively easily sourced here are the winwing stuff or the TM TWCS. (Buying a cm3 direct from virpil would also be an option but after shipping/import costs that's a pretty substantial price jump over the winwing for me, and I'm not sure it'd be worth the cost?) I have their throttle and it’s great. I just converted it into the F-16 handle, and while absolutely amazing for that airplane, I kind of miss the F-18 handle.
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Apr 8, 2022 03:19
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Sagebrush posted:Yeah, it's a very short runway and the hill means there's no possibility of a go-around if you gently caress up and land long. The wacky steep approach over the road is the better of two bad options. Yeah, and by Canadian standards... this is something you're required to train for: namely, how to clear an obstacle on approach to a short runway. The larger issue for most planes is: it's an exceptionally short runway, in addition to having a difficult approach. 2,100ft isn't a lot of room for your bog-standard piston twin. It's totally doable, but you have to nail your speed and glideslope on approach, and be ready to go around when you know you've hosed it up. We've replaced tires on our Seneca because someone (an instructor, I should point out) got a bit nervous on a 3,300ft. runway, forgot to raise flaps, and locked the brakes real bad. There's "what the POH says you can do" and "what your average pilot can do in practice" and they often don't bear much similarity to one another. PT6A fucked around with this message at 04:25 on Apr 8, 2022 |
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Apr 8, 2022 04:22
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Animal posted:I have their throttle and it’s great. Went ahead and ordered the winwing, thanks!
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Apr 8, 2022 11:21
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PT6A posted:There's "what the POH says you can do" and "what your average pilot can do in practice" and they often don't bear much similarity to one another. That was definitely hammered into me in flight training, yep. The POH performance table says that in so-and-so situation you can bring the plane to a stop in 1385 feet. Can you land in 1385 feet? The figure in the book was achieved with a brand new plane in perfect shape, on an ideal day, with precisely measured weather conditions, on a carefully swept runway, with a professional test pilot at the controls, and 1385' was the best number he got after dozens of attempts. Do you feel lucky?
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Apr 8, 2022 17:58
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That is so funny.
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Apr 8, 2022 18:29
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Animal posted:Ah, St Barts. Back when I got my first multi-engine job flying C402's and Aztec's, the boss was a boomer prick like most Part 135 owners. One day he came back to TJSJ late and without his Aztec. With a heroic tale about how the airplane malfunctioned while on final for TFFJ RWY10 and he saved the day but had to leave the airplane there for minor repairs. This was around 2009 so the beginning of smartphone cameras, YouTube, and viral videos. A few days later a video popped up of him completely loving up his approach, refusing to go-around, and finally touching down way down the runway and crashing at the end. We showed him the video during one of his weekly meetings where he would lecture us about safety. He became livid and told us to delete it and not share it with anyone. We had to explain to him how YouTube worked. It appears he also failed to mention in his heroic tale that he poo poo himself when the plane crashed. Because he absolutely did.
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Apr 9, 2022 07:24
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PT6A posted:Wow, the video of your boss loving up is one I show almost all of my students when we start discussing short-field landings and/or the importance of go-arounds. I love that video so much. That warms my heart. Tell them his name is Freddy.
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Apr 9, 2022 16:18
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Oh by the way I’m a big fan of that YouTube channel AIRBOYD (peep its most viewed videos), I’ve seen this video many times before I started getting my PPL. It’s a classic in plane nerd YouTube
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Apr 9, 2022 16:28
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Inner Light posted:Oh by the way I’m a big fan of that YouTube channel AIRBOYD (peep its most viewed videos), I’ve seen this video many times before I started getting my PPL. It’s a classic in plane nerd YouTube I wasn’t aware that it had become so popular since then, I love that. I hope it’s haunted him.
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Apr 9, 2022 16:37
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Mokotow posted:From that description I’m gonna guess it’s probably Saba TNCS? The takeoff is actually the fun part, but the trick is don't forget the props as soon as you touch down. If you just go to idle and stand on the brakes, chances are you're not going to have a good day.
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Apr 9, 2022 16:41
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