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Sab669 posted:The actual art style is nice for the environments and such, IMO, but the pill-shaped characters look really out of place with the rest of it. Gives me a sort of Worms-meets-Minions vibe? And I strongly suspect it was a "these are easier (cheaper) to animate than full humanoid models" decision it's based on a newgrounds flash series that started in like 2003 and was animated in flash, i think that's exactly why they made that decision
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Apr 8, 2022 15:40
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Cowcaster posted:8000 internet randos giving a third person shooter a higher number on a website than undertale is not very good evidence that it is in fact, better than undertale, to me I wasn't convinced until I saw users saying "[ascii chad face]" and "henk"
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Apr 8, 2022 15:43
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Foul Fowl posted:it's based on a newgrounds flash series that started in like 2003 and was animated in flash, i think that's exactly why they made that decision ah, so 8000 people from a dead outdated website like it, it's just your average something awful indie title thread
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Apr 8, 2022 15:50
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Cowcaster posted:ah, so 8000 people from a dead outdated website like it, it's just your average something awful indie title thread yeah exactly, i'm guessing every one of those 8000 people has been a fan of that series for like 15 years
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Apr 8, 2022 15:54
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I think steam review percentage is genuinely the best aggregate metric out there, it's just a very specific measure - the percentage of people who spent money on the game on steam thinking they'd like it and then actually liked it (plus cared to enough to leave a review, which is going to skew negative). They're by design meaningless across genres and are always going to be lower for more hyped or genre-bending games. A game with no general hype clearly signalling from its store page that it's for a specific audience will have a review score from only said audience, which I think is great and very useful right up until people try comparing it to other, unrelated games.
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Apr 8, 2022 15:56
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Cowcaster posted:ah, so 8000 people from a dead outdated website like it, it's just your average something awful indie title thread And yet when Vampire Survivors was first posted here it had like 700 reviews and now it has *checks* sixty eight loving thousand reviews holy poo poo Clearly this dead outdated website is solely responsible for that 
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Apr 8, 2022 16:05
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what i keep coming back to is throwing it in the sack next to undertale. one's a self-described " third-person Run n' Gun / Beat'Em Up filled with arcade-style action and button-mashing brutality", the other's a jrpg about feelings, there's just no basis for comparison there. someone who's a huge fan of 4x strategy games isn't going to give two shits that elden ring, a 3rd person adventure rpg, has a 108% rating on metacritic. and conversely, a 4x strategy game getting a 109% on metacritic doesn't mean everyone who's loving elden ring is going to love that even more. just an utterly useless juxtaposition.
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Apr 8, 2022 16:29
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Cowcaster posted:what i keep coming back to is throwing it in the sack next to undertale. one's a self-described " third-person Run n' Gun / Beat'Em Up filled with arcade-style action and button-mashing brutality", the other's a jrpg about feelings, there's just no basis for comparison there. someone who's a huge fan of 4x strategy games isn't going to give two shits that elden ring, a 3rd person adventure rpg, has a 108% rating on metacritic. and conversely, a 4x strategy game getting a 109% on metacritic doesn't mean everyone who's loving elden ring is going to love that even more. just an utterly useless juxtaposition. I see you are not familiar with the writings of Mr. Tarason.
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Apr 8, 2022 16:34
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Was gonna say, Dominic doesn't even need to still post here to send the thread into a tizzy. 
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Apr 8, 2022 16:35
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What are you talking about? Undertale is a game about brutally murdering an entire species, then an entire world.
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Apr 8, 2022 16:35
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is the conceit that everyone loves all genres of videogame equally? and that they just need a big enough number next to one they don't like to enjoy it? and that the arbitrarily assigned metric of a score out of 100 can be used as an empirical way of comparing vastly different kinds of videogames? if someone rates a game four stars out of five, does that then directly map to an 80/100 in this system? i feel myself beginning a descent... into madness!
Cowcaster fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Apr 8, 2022 |
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Apr 8, 2022 16:37
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Mordja posted:I see you are not familiar with the writings of Mr. Tarason. and why would he make his account name dominic white. real first name fake last name. either commit or don't!
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Apr 8, 2022 16:37
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Undertale is a hybrid bullet hell / skeleton dating simulator
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Apr 8, 2022 16:38
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Undertale is a game where you advance the dialogue and the NPC digs their elbow into your ribs while waggling their eyebrows into the camera and going "Eeh? EEEEH? JOKES!"
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Apr 8, 2022 16:47
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Undertale is a game for people who answered "hell yeah" when Hotline Miami asked if they like hurting other people
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Apr 8, 2022 16:49
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ok but i have to admit that stating a game based entirely on a 2003 game series from newgrounds dot com "exists wholly in its own reality bubble" is absolutely 100% accurate, albeit unintentionally
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Apr 8, 2022 16:49
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Sab669 posted:And yet when Vampire Survivors was first posted here it had like 700 reviews and now it has *checks* sixty eight loving thousand reviews holy poo poo Vampire Survivors is also $3 while the Madness game is $25.
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Apr 8, 2022 16:51
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Dominic has weird opinions, but at face value the tweet is correct. It is strange that no one reviews a game that clearly has some kind of traction and appeal. The complaint isn't "why don't reviewers love this game" it's "why aren't reviewers even trying it". Maybe it is a niche 6.5/10 game, but regardless of whether you see reviewers as consumer guides or as judgers of artistry or as critics, they probably should be looking to examine a game that could be interesting, even if the conclusion is "this game has niche appeal to an existing audience but no more."
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Apr 8, 2022 17:00
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Furthermore, where are the serious literary opinions on zines?
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Apr 8, 2022 17:06
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I don't trust reviews when Shoneys still exists. If we had the standards of good taste we would only like good games and burn Shoneys down
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Apr 8, 2022 17:06
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Velocity Raptor posted:September 28 - NEO: The World Ends With You (PC) Wait wait wait wait wait hold up, this came out for PC? Is it region locked or something?? Not seeing it in my Steam
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Apr 8, 2022 17:18
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Artelier posted:Wait wait wait wait wait hold up, this came out for PC? Is it region locked or something?? Not seeing it in my Steam Its on Epic Games only.
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Apr 8, 2022 17:19
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Artelier posted:Wait wait wait wait wait hold up, this came out for PC? Is it region locked or something?? Not seeing it in my Steam I said come in! posted:Its on Epic Games only. To add to this, most if not all recent big AAA Square Enix games have been EGS exclusive. Possibly for just a year, but I have yet to see Kingdom Hearts 3 come to Steam as an example. Not that I miss it since it's awful, but it's a big one losing sales since no one knows there's a PC version.
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Apr 8, 2022 17:44
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i agree with dominic's point but the situation makes sense with how games journalism is structured nowadays. it's either big sites that won't touch anything with a marketing budget less than 100mil or the individual blogs of hobbyists that cover specific genres or personal interests. Madness definitely exists outside both those spaces, given that it's a comparatively small work and not in a popular genre friday night funkin would be in the exact same spot (devoted fanbase, no outside attention) if not for the legions of artists willing to crank out fanart for it on a daily basis to forcibly bring it into the public eye Venuz Patrol fucked around with this message at 17:47 on Apr 8, 2022 |
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Apr 8, 2022 17:44
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I said come in! posted:Its on Epic Games only. Saoshyant posted:To add to this, most if not all recent big AAA Square Enix games have been EGS exclusive. Possibly for just a year, but I have yet to see Kingdom Hearts 3 come to Steam as an example. Not that I miss it since it's awful, but it's a big one losing sales since no one knows there's a PC version. Oh, no wonder I didn't realise it was on PC! I got it day 1 on Switch and I loved it but the whole time I was thinking "I want to play this, again, but with a better framerate." Guess I'll hope it'll come to Steam, or maybe I'll nab it if it goes on sale + Epic coupons or whatnot. Thanks!
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Apr 8, 2022 17:51
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Austin Walker responded to that thread with a good point: games critics have no way of knowing it exists. The developers didn't send out any PR about it to anyone, so it's not like they were trying to get attention and failed. If they're happy just selling copies and not worrying about attention from critics, more power to 'em. Funnily enough, he also mentioned that seeking out those games was part of their strategy at waypoint when he worked there, and on waypoint radio on monday they spent half the episode talking about Abermore, the very definition of an interesting failure. Only 27 reviews, and they're Mostly Negative!
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Apr 8, 2022 17:54
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i doubt dominic was saying it was a cruel injustice, just that it's interesting to see a game perform decently with a lot of reviews/players and many reviews overwhelmingly positive, without any mainstream coverage. i've played a lot of games that barely crack 100 reviews so i'd say madness is performing decently vampire survivors didn't get any coverage either until it exploded in popularity and sites were like "OK i GUESS we'll look at it" too many people will just not play an indie game unless it's put right in front of their face e: also maybe it's fine that not every game is as popular as undertale, and doesn't have people brigading the Steam thread to insufferably evangelize about it (no shade to undertale, just something that seems to happen to a lot of well-liked indie games) The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 18:06 on Apr 8, 2022 |
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Apr 8, 2022 18:04
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Yea I hear Indies say all the time how hard exposure is, how crucial the first day/week on Steam is etc. etc. It doesn't really seem that unlikely to me that lots of no-name indie games could be received similarly and fly under the radar just by nature of how many games there are being released all the time. Some are just bound to fall through the cracks.
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Apr 8, 2022 18:16
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Artelier posted:Oh, no wonder I didn't realise it was on PC! I got it day 1 on Switch and I loved it but the whole time I was thinking "I want to play this, again, but with a better framerate." Yeah Square just kinda swept the game under the rug. Barely any marketing, and no community outreach / work with content creators to help promote the game. Then they did their usual "not enough people bought this game, guess no one cares  " They did this to Guardians of the Galaxy too, and I imagine it's going to happen to Stranger of Paradise too.
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Apr 8, 2022 18:24
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Sab669 posted:I wonder how many games out there have an Overwhelmingly Positive review score with <= 10K reviews that I've never heard of before. There's a website for it. https://steam250.com/hidden_gems
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Apr 8, 2022 18:26
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Also I tried that Madness game and it was still not as good as the Madness Interactive that came out in 2003.
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Apr 8, 2022 18:27
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Jack Trades posted:There's a website for it. oh my
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Apr 8, 2022 18:42
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even steam250's hidden gems page prioritizes games that have close-to or over 3 digit reviews/votes, and there are plenty of good games that never reach that number :/ I mean there's nothing to be done about that, unless steam250 makes a "even hiddener gems" list/algorithm. but stuff's always gonna go overlooked e: of stuff I've gotten recently, Rainbow Billy's done exceptionally poorly, only having 41 reviews (92% rating), which forced them to lower their price to $20 -- probably the right call. I got it through a Fanatical bundle and I suspect that's how most people will end up playing this game if they play it at all. Retro Machina has 103 reviews (88% rating). Prodigal has 101 reviews (96% rating). none are on that list The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 20:01 on Apr 8, 2022 |
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Apr 8, 2022 18:44
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Jack Trades posted:There's a website for it. touhou having multiple top slots in the ranking is extremely fitting
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Apr 8, 2022 18:56
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Venuz Patrol posted:touhou having multiple top slots in the ranking is extremely fitting I also wouldn't consider them really hidden. They're kind of staple of the bullet hell sub-genre. They're the only games in that list that I have.
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Apr 8, 2022 20:45
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Begemot posted:Austin Walker responded to that thread with a good point: games critics have no way of knowing it exists. The developers didn't send out any PR about it to anyone, so it's not like they were trying to get attention and failed. If they're happy just selling copies and not worrying about attention from critics, more power to 'em. They did a kickstarter in 2014. It's so old that it has a "We're on Steam Greenlight!" notice. Clearly a big passion project.
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Apr 8, 2022 21:09
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StrixNebulosa posted:It makes sense to me! Undertale is an indie game that literally everyone has heard of (I think), and here's something "better" rated but no one's heard of it. This *is* their marketing campaign isn’t it? Reading that Twitter thread I’ve never seen a person that presumably has no relation to the developers stump for it so hard.
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Apr 8, 2022 21:59
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Majin posted:This *is* their marketing campaign isn’t it? overwrought gushing is kind of his thing
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Apr 8, 2022 22:22
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Oxxidation posted:overwrought gushing is kind of his thing Ah, thought it was just the “PR” part of his bio but fair enough. Might be a fine game who knows, but a dozen or more posts of “this game should be a massive hit, why isn’t it? Ya know? Ya KnOw?!??!” kinda sets off some red flags.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:24
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Foul Fowl posted:it's based on a newgrounds flash series that started in like 2003 and was animated in flash, i think that's exactly why they made that decision
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