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SMEGMA_MAIL posted:It’s really amazing that despite all the horrible poo poo or general incompetence the US did post 9-11 the only general that has been meaningfully punished is him and it had nothing whatsoever to do with like covering up war crimes and he’s arguably the most competent general in GWOT McChrystal? He had overall command in Afghanistan before getting booted due to that Rolling Stone article
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Apr 8, 2022 20:51
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Suicide Watch posted:McChrystal? He had overall command in Afghanistan before getting booted due to that Rolling Stone article He got a movie starring Brad Pitt as himself.
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Apr 8, 2022 20:52
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Suicide Watch posted:McChrystal? He had overall command in Afghanistan before getting booted due to that Rolling Stone article Oh yeah good point. He got shitcanned about has hard as some with stars can for reasons that had nothing to do with performance.
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Apr 8, 2022 20:54
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PCjr sidecar posted:Has this ever worked? Ask the people of Japan where we never put a single boot on the ground of their home island but killed millions. Arguably the firebombings were worse than the nuclear bombings, and arguably you could say pushing Japan back to Japan and blockading them would have achieved the same ends, but you’d be wrong. Strategic bombing has saved countless Americans. It’s absolutely brutal, and it’s absolutely a war crime. Curtis LeMay knew that if they didn’t win in both theaters of war that he and his people would all be tried as war criminals at the end of the war and be executed.
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Apr 8, 2022 21:50
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I just read this on Der Spiegel. It's bad, so spoilers, and be warned, but it shows the kind of determination the Ukrainian people have. Some residents joined in the fighting as well. One of them was Ruslan, whose name has been changed for this story. A 50-year-old former police officer, Ruslan has a poorly stitched scar running up from his left ear across his head. Like other men in his part of town, he was furious about the Russian attack and exhilarated at the Ukrainian army’s victory. "Some men ran over to see what had happened and to kill Russians," he says. "Those who didn’t belong to the army or to the Territorial Defense Forces wanted to get their hands on a Kalashnikov or hand grenades." Ruslan claims that he also killed a Russian whose armored vehicle had been hit. Since he didn’t have a weapon, he strangled him. "It just happened. I guess it had to be that way," he says. When he jumped down from the armored vehicle, Russian soldiers fired on him and a bullet grazed his head, slicing open his scalp. https://www.spiegel.de/internationa...17-d90e0ef9b119
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Apr 8, 2022 21:56
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LtCol J. Krusinski posted:Ask the people of Japan where we never put a single boot on the ground of their home island but killed millions. The original statement in the post I was replying to: quote:Make the civilian populace turn on it's leadership and end the war. Is not at all what ended the war in Japan.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:09
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Arrath posted:They were, demonstrably, pretty capable circa 1945. The question is, when did they degrade to the poo poo show we see today? There's one huge difference between the Red Army of 1945 and the Red Army of, say 1947.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:17
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A.o.D. posted:There's one huge difference between the Red Army of 1945 and the Red Army of, say 1947. I'm honestly curious to learn more, as I've never much looked in to post-war demobilization on the Soviet side.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:21
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Radical 90s Wizard posted:Yea I just assumed they never had a plate to begin with, just a convenient pocket. IPCRESS posted:Packed with leaflets on the importance of reporting misappropriation of military stores. Every body armor comes packed with five shares in M&M Enterprises.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:21
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Nick Soapdish posted:Becoming a reef is the only military mission LCS can perform 100% Actually, not even that. Aluminum makes terrible reefs.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:23
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ChaseSP posted:Dismissing your opponents abilities is infamously a part of what dictatorships do and get the poo poo kicked out of them for it. The most hilarious example was the Italian Campaign in WW1. I assume you mean WW2, Italy was not a dictatorship in WW1.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:23
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LtCol J. Krusinski posted:Ask the people of Japan where we never put a single boot on the ground of their home island but killed millions. Neither the Japanese nor the German people rose up and deposed their governments. So, no attacking civilians did not cause the war to end early. Strategic bombing of manufacturing and strategic resources probably did impact the end of the war but that’s not really on the table in Ukraine as long as EU and NATO are willing to supply Ukraine.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:30
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Arrath posted:I'm honestly curious to learn more, as I've never much looked in to post-war demobilization on the Soviet side. In all seriousness, the Red Army of 1945 marched on American boots, and had all of their weapons, food, ammunition, and every other single thing moved on American trains, and those trains rolled on tracks that were repaired with American rails. (15 million pairs of boots, ~95% of all of the Trains and Railcars) Their new factories had electricity running on American wiring. Their vehicles (400,000 trucks and jeeps) were heavily American, and were fueled in part with American gas, and lubricated largely with American oil. 4.5 million tons of the food they ate had the crescent moon stamped on the packaging. This is just to set up the fact that the Red Army marched into Berlin on American boots. Part of the reason why the Soviet Union had more tanks and artillery than the rest of the Allies combined is because they didn't produce a lot of the Other Stuff that you need to fight a war. After the war, they didn't have that logistical support. That's not to say their might or ability to project force just vanished in a couple of years, but from that point on, they had to sustain themselves. Obviously they could still roll tanks mostly unopposed into the 50s and 60s, and until the M1 Abrams came out, the US was convinced that we could not win a tank battle in Germany. I cannot attest to whether or not that notion is accurate. As far as demobilization goes, the Soviet Union didn't demobilize as much or as rapidly as the rest of the Allies did. They had a lot of new, hostile territory to administer, and Stalin was immediately preparing for another war against the US and Britain, either defensive or offensive, depending on what opportunities arose. Also, the factories of East Germany and Eastern Europe weren't going to dismantle and relocate themselves back to Russia. It took a large conscript army to loot the 1/3rd of Europe under Stalin's control.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:44
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SMEGMA_MAIL posted:It’s really amazing that despite all the horrible poo poo or general incompetence the US did post 9-11 the only general that has been meaningfully punished is him and it had nothing whatsoever to do with like covering up war crimes and he’s arguably the most competent general in GWOT Stan the man McChrystal would disagree about these two points. Hell of a general, summarily fired for shooting his mouth off in front of an embedded Rolling Stones journalist.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:45
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EasilyConfused posted:I assume you mean WW2, Italy was not a dictatorship in WW1. I don't recall the italian campaign being great in ww2 either which is what I was referencing originally.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:46
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ChaseSP posted:I don't recall the italian campaign being great in ww2 either which is what I was referencing originally. It also featured a popular uprising that strategic bombing had nothing to do with!
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Apr 8, 2022 22:49
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https://twitter.com/MENAConflicted/status/1512546110153404419?s=20&t=z88wY595Zj4KSUnPJGD1ZQ
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Apr 8, 2022 22:49
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On a more hopeful note, there was a wedding in Kyiv yesterday.
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Apr 8, 2022 22:51
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Arrath posted:I'm honestly curious to learn more, as I've never much looked in to post-war demobilization on the Soviet side. It's not about the Soviets but is in the same ballpark, Embracing Defeat is a fascinating look at post-war Japan and how they demobilized (they couldn't account for hundreds of thousands of active overseas troops), the occupation, rationing (including how it was required for many people to buy food on the black market as rations were starvation), and how they transitioned to a democracy. The part about writing their constitution is especially interesting as it had oddly progressive guarantees of equality between men and women as Beate Sirota, an Austrian born woman was on the American side and was able to get that in.
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Apr 8, 2022 23:36
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LtCol J. Krusinski posted:Stan the man McChrystal would disagree about these two points. Hell of a general, summarily fired for shooting his mouth off in front of an embedded Rolling Stones journalist. Plus unlike Flynn, Stan’s brain never broke.
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Apr 8, 2022 23:49
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Kesper North posted:I swear to god I'm not a tankie, but what if... just what if... the entire threat of Russia was exaggerated just a teeny tiny bit for political and economic reasons to the benefit of Raytheon et al., and we didn't have to be this poo poo-scared of them the whole time because they were always this hollow I hate to say it but in hindsight these Team B guys apparently had the wrong idea. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Team_B (Mentioned in the six part Behind the Bastards/Dollop crossover on Kissinger that just aired)
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Apr 9, 2022 00:00
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shame on an IGA posted:On a more hopeful note, there was a wedding in Kyiv yesterday. Good luck to the couple and i hope it turns out to be more than just an enjoy what we can while we can marriage
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Apr 9, 2022 00:51
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Tyro posted:I hate to say it but in hindsight these Team B guys apparently had the wrong idea. Oh, interesting, I didn't know about this. I do have to wonder to what degree the outside experts were influenced by industry, to their detriment. It kinda seems like an opportunity for "regulatory capture" of analysis if the right shills got on the team. Stravag posted:Good luck to the couple and i hope it turns out to be more than just an enjoy what we can while we can marriage I hope so too, but I feel like it's pretty much exactly that for all of us these days. CommieGIR posted:https://twitter.com/MENAConflicted/status/1512546110153404419?s=20&t=z88wY595Zj4KSUnPJGD1ZQ Bangin'. At first I thought this was about the fact that the AK is pointed straight at the person in the seat in front of the cameraman. Kesper North fucked around with this message at 01:10 on Apr 9, 2022 |
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Apr 9, 2022 01:08
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Tyro posted:I hate to say it but in hindsight these Team B guys apparently had the wrong idea. Thanks. That was an interesting, if not very conclusive, read.
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Apr 9, 2022 01:22
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Tyro posted:I hate to say it but in hindsight these Team B guys apparently had the wrong idea. Hey it got us Soviet Military Power and that was awesome to read and look at the art….even if wildly optimistic about the Soviets. https://youtu.be/m7R6fupOgG4 https://youtu.be/wWcCirs0GEA There was also great art and diagrams. https://youtu.be/mkUcUtksVxs Marshal Prolapse fucked around with this message at 01:28 on Apr 9, 2022 |
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Apr 9, 2022 01:25
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CommieGIR posted:https://twitter.com/MENAConflicted/status/1512546110153404419?s=20&t=z88wY595Zj4KSUnPJGD1ZQ I highly recommend the app Radio Garden. I was smashing it to a Black Metal station out of Kyiv last night. As for the Russians. Some here recommended One Soldier's War about a conscript's war in Chechnya. It's... depressing and amazing because if you cut and paste Chechnya for Ukraine the whole thing is still the same. I've been reading the recent article on the dembel situation and I have known about this since the 1980s. Yes, I was a stupid war nerd in junior high. Shoot me. No wonder we are seeing war crimes on this scale. One Soldier's War does a wonderful job on who runs the conscripts and it sure as poo poo is not the officers. At one point the author is reduced to stealing car stereos to satisfy his "grandfathers" and to accumulate enough money to go home. My professional research area is Military Advising and I am not at all surprised that the UA has successfully transitioned to NATO standard. Hell, look at their dress uniforms: a conscious decision to move away from the former Soviet uniforms to a more western style. The NATO advisors I have read and interviewed all see the Ukrainians as enthusiastic and willing to learn. Most of the pushback I have listened to are people not realizing that the Ukrainian Army in 2014 and the Ukrainian Army in 2022 are very different beasts.
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Apr 9, 2022 02:08
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One Soldier's War is a hell of a read and I highly recommend it.
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Apr 9, 2022 02:28
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Humbug Scoolbus posted:I enlisted in the Reagan 80s and we trained expecting to get squashed by the Soviets (I was in the 82nd). Now this...I have almost no words. Seeing this story repeated a few times. Just want to say: It's better to train and equip your forces on the assumption that they're fighting a motivated enemy with infinite morale and cutting-edge tech and then find out your opponent is a paper tiger. If you want to know how doing the opposite plays out, it's happening in Ukraine right now.
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Apr 9, 2022 03:15
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shame on an IGA posted:Slovakia sent ALL of their S-300 assets, they definitely have a guarantee of getting backfilled with Patriot for that to have happened. all the reporting/talk/official communications about equipment transfers have basically been https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CYE6H3uDFo for a few weeks now
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Apr 9, 2022 03:35
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Marshal Prolapse posted:Hey it got us Soviet Military Power and that was awesome to read and look at the art….even if wildly optimistic about the Soviets. I have a few of those (with the original sign-off checklist stamped into it - no idea if they were meant to review it or just post it but it requires initials from most of the commander’s staff) and they’re a great teaching tool for the propaganda we produce for ourselves.
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Apr 9, 2022 03:48
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DekeThornton posted:I doubt it. It was a corrupt dictatorship back then as well, with all the same flaws. Just with a different ideological coat of paint. Yes, but there are levels of majorly corrupt. Ukraine also has major corruption issues, but not anywhere near that level. It's like how everyone plays dirty to win the Olympics, but Russian doping is on whole nother level. The late USSR was corrupt, but what happened in the 90s pushed the corruption to a level even further beyond what it was previously.
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Apr 9, 2022 04:12
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golden bubble posted:Yes, but there are levels of majorly corrupt. Ukraine also has major corruption issues, but not anywhere near that level. It's like how everyone plays dirty to win the Olympics, but Russian doping is on whole nother level. The late USSR was corrupt, but what happened in the 90s pushed the corruption to a level even further beyond what it was previously. So what you're saying is that the Russians went SSJ3 in corruption?
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Apr 9, 2022 04:24
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golden bubble posted:It's like how everyone plays dirty to win the Olympics, Wait, what?
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Apr 9, 2022 04:44
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Stravag posted:Good luck to the couple and i hope it turns out to be more than just an enjoy what we can while we can marriage plz don't slander the noble situationship
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Apr 9, 2022 04:45
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More coverage about Russia’s behavior at Chernobyl Russian Blunders in Chernobyl: ‘They Came and Did Whatever They Wanted.’ Tanks treads ripped up the toxic soil, bulldozers carved trenches and bunkers, and soldiers spent a month camped in — and dug into — a radioactive forest. quote:CHERNOBYL, Ukraine — As the staging ground for an assault on the Ukrainian capital of Kyiv, the Chernobyl Exclusion Zone, one of the most toxic places on earth, was probably not the best choice. But that did not seem to bother the Russian generals who took over the site in the early stages of the war. quote:Mr. Simyonov said that the Russian military had deployed officers from a nuclear, biological and chemical unit, as well as experts from Rosatom, Russia’s state nuclear power company, who consulted with the Ukrainian scientists. quote:In a particularly ill-advised action, a Russian soldier from a chemical, biological and nuclear protection unit picked up a source of cobalt-60 at one waste storage site with his bare hands, exposing himself to so much radiation in a few seconds that it went off the scales of a Geiger counter, Mr. Simyonov said. It was not clear what happened to the man, he said. Even Fantastic from Fallout NV wasn’t that reckless. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/08/world/europe/ukraine-chernobyl.html
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Apr 9, 2022 04:58
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Quackles posted:Wait, what? What I means is that other countries might have individuals get caught for doping, and have feeder programs that don't care enough about children's welfare to produce Olympians. But only Russia got banned from the Olympics because only Russia has a government sponsored and organized program to slam kids with performance enhancers to maximize their chance of getting one Olympic medal with no regards to their welfare. Other countries have doping scandals every now and then. Russia has state-sanctioned full-time doping program 24/7 365 days a year. It's like how the USSR's new AFVs suffered from corruption, political infighting, and manufacturing issues. But the USSR still managed to produce hundreds of their new design in a few years, and the new design was definitely better than the last design. Meanwhile the T-14 has been shown off for half a decade, and I don't think there are more than a handful of working (maybe) copies. The USSR was corrupt, but the Russian Federation is Super Corrupt Super Corrupt God 3. golden bubble fucked around with this message at 05:13 on Apr 9, 2022 |
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Apr 9, 2022 05:04
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golden bubble posted:What I means is that other countries might have individuals get caught for doping, and have feeder programs that don't care enough about children's welfare to produce Olympians. But only Russia got banned from the Olympics because only Russia has a government sponsored and organized program to slam kids with performance enhancers to maximize their chance of getting one Olympic medal with no regards to their welfare. Other countries have doping scandals every now and then. Russia has state-sanctioned full-time doping program 24/7 365 days a year. For those who haven't seen it, the documentary Icarus is an incredible watch. Russia literally built a building with secret doors so they could swap urine samples at night during the Olympics.
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Apr 9, 2022 05:19
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sounds like putin is trying to ascend to take his place in the pantheon with Khorne and Papa Nurgle
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Apr 9, 2022 05:20
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LtCol J. Krusinski posted:Ask the people of Japan where we never put a single boot on the ground of their home island but killed millions. *Without literal multiple nuclear weapon deployment* terror bombing has never ever worked. Okay, we can make that asterisk. Every case of air bombardment being tried as the primary strategy rather than supporting ground forces has failed utterly. Battle of Britain, rolling thunder, all that poo poo only serves to just make people hate you and rally around the flag. Without nuclear weapons nobody has ever accomplished any objectives without also putting boots on the ground. It’s the same loving thing every nationalist/fascist leader believes the enemy is weak willed and will give up. Bin Laden actually believed the same thing about the US. He seriously expected the US to just quit. We actually expected the Taliban to just give up when we bombed them a bunch. It never works without nukes and that ship sailed for any country on earth doing it again the moment the Soviets built their bomb. E: anyway this all circles around to that the Russian strategy to my surprise wasn’t just “ruthless” or inconsiderate of civilian deaths but it was so counterproductively vicious and so profoundly stupid, it’s almost like they engineered the best way to inspire not just intense Ukrainian nationalism but solidify Ukrainian as an identity explicitly hostile and incompatible with being Russian. Butter Activities fucked around with this message at 05:38 on Apr 9, 2022 |
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Apr 9, 2022 05:25
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Putins Russia is built on corruption and a cult of loyalty to one man, with a vision towards (in his mind) the glory and respect the Soviet Union generated. Competence is almost in direct opposition to corruption, and a competent war hero would create a center of gravity that could oppose Putin, making such a thing anathema to him. That's basically it. He values subservience over everything, the rest is irrelevant. The system allows the possibilities leading to the current situation.
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Apr 9, 2022 05:35
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