Paradox Grand Strategy: Tim Cook? How many divisions has he got?

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Radia: Jul 14, 2021; And someday, together.. We'll shine.

deeply glad I gave up on that project then :v:

# ? Apr 3, 2022 07:01

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# ? May 9, 2024 12:56

Yaoi Gagarin: Feb 20, 2014

Lady Radia posted:

in fairness you also had Darkest Hour and Arsenal of Democracy, as well as For the Glory which was.. a commercial failure, but honestly the perfect version of what those folks wanted.

Nah Paradox game mods are mostly around.. fake, pseudo-JSON? I think it's syntactically consistent (i got really far building out a Discord bot, for example, that processed save files to keep track of MP stats over time), but it's also come a long way in the last.. five years or so? Like we're still a way, way long way from anything like Civ 4's modding, but it's "pretty good". And in fairness always been good for what a lot of mods want to accomplish (and, frankly, MEIOU is a fuckin work of art in the EU4 engine).

does EU1 use the paradox scripting language? if so it would predate JSON

# ? Apr 3, 2022 09:48

Ardryn: Oct 27, 2007; Rolling around at the speed of sound.

VostokProgram posted:

does EU1 use the paradox scripting language? if so it would predate JSON

EU1 didn't have modding, or at the very least it wasn't modder friendly.

# ? Apr 3, 2022 10:00

ilitarist: Apr 26, 2016; illiterate and militarist

Randallteal posted:

Edit: like their pitch from the first dev diary is

Who played EU4 and thought the thing it was missing was more than a million extra provinces?

Yeah, that pitch makes me not interested in the game at all. Not you grandma's GSG, yeah yeah. Mods often come from the idea more is good. And that "no mana" remark, bleah. I see true game designers that would only use real resources like gold that you can store for 700 years and teleport around the world to turn into buildings or something.

# ? Apr 3, 2022 12:47

pdxjohan: Sep 9, 2011; Paradox dev dude.

VostokProgram posted:

does EU1 use the paradox scripting language? if so it would predate JSON

Yes.

We used it for scenariosetup then.

It started as simple object read/write system, where objects could hold other objects inside it.

Think i wrote it early 1998 or so

# ? Apr 3, 2022 13:34

Communist Zombie: Nov 1, 2011

A Buttery Pastry posted:

Well, it would support poo poo like visually expanding farmlands into former forests, land reclamation, or desertification, though I doubt the developers of the game have put much thought into terrain and climate. What with the 1356 world terrain map being literally just modern satellite imagery.

Considering its still in pre alpha hopefully theyll use a more accurate map, but deforestation and desertification are confirmed features, and on the reddit they said they are working on stuff like land reclamation/loss.

# ? Apr 3, 2022 14:48

RabidWeasel: Aug 4, 2007; Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Good luck to those guys but "tons of provinces and a huge timescale" are both huge red flags to me

The actually spherical Earth is good though

RabidWeasel fucked around with this message at 15:15 on Apr 3, 2022

# ? Apr 3, 2022 15:12

idhrendur: Aug 20, 2016

Lady Radia posted:

deeply glad I gave up on that project then

I've found recursive descent with each component handling its own parsing of the incoming data and letting sub-components do their thing works well. A handful of helpers handle 99% of cases. And I believe others have done more efficient parsers than mine, in a plethora of languages. So if you ever wanted to do so for kicks, you're in good company. Or if you wanted that as a stepping-stone towards a bigger project, others have handled that step for you.

# ? Apr 3, 2022 17:46

ilitarist: Apr 26, 2016; illiterate and militarist

I haven't written anything serious on Unity, but doesn't it use .NET platform? You can just write the same code people write in enterprise application development and it will not interact with Unity internal objects till it needs to render something.

In any case, I doubt performance is what you should worry about in this project.

# ? Apr 3, 2022 18:39

Radia: Jul 14, 2021; And someday, together.. We'll shine.

idhrendur posted:

I've found recursive descent with each component handling its own parsing of the incoming data and letting sub-components do their thing works well. A handful of helpers handle 99% of cases. And I believe others have done more efficient parsers than mine, in a plethora of languages. So if you ever wanted to do so for kicks, you're in good company. Or if you wanted that as a stepping-stone towards a bigger project, others have handled that step for you.

might follow up in some PM's, thanks friend

# ? Apr 3, 2022 19:23

Yaoi Gagarin: Feb 20, 2014

idhrendur posted:

I've found recursive descent with each component handling its own parsing of the incoming data and letting sub-components do their thing works well. A handful of helpers handle 99% of cases. And I believe others have done more efficient parsers than mine, in a plethora of languages. So if you ever wanted to do so for kicks, you're in good company. Or if you wanted that as a stepping-stone towards a bigger project, others have handled that step for you.

Recursive descent is really the best for anything with a tricky grammar. Afaik every production C and C++ compiler uses it

# ? Apr 3, 2022 20:48

idhrendur: Aug 20, 2016

VostokProgram posted:

Recursive descent is really the best for anything with a tricky grammar. Afaik every production C and C++ compiler uses it

Huh, that would mean my compilers class lied to me so many years ago. The instructor indicated it was all about lexx and yacc. Though we do better than the other session that was hand-writing tokenizers. Theirs would take tens of minutes to do that step alone whereas were sub-second.

# ? Apr 3, 2022 21:31

Guildencrantz: May 1, 2012; Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known.

Man, that project is not going to end well. Just by common sense, if you're a team of successful modders branching out into standalone games, your first project should be something smallish and tightly designed. Not "like those games we like but an order of magnitude bigger".

# ? Apr 3, 2022 21:54

Gaius Marius: Oct 9, 2012

No, never let fear keep you from attaining your dreams. Imagine if Arnold Einstein had been too scared to invent physics. Or if Micheal Jackson had listened to all his naysayers instead of doing basketball really well. Shoot for the stars, even if you miss you'll still be adjacent to the stars probably

# ? Apr 3, 2022 21:58

Vizuyos: Jun 17, 2020; Thank U for reading

If you hated it...
FUCK U and never come back

Guildencrantz posted:

Man, that project is not going to end well. Just by common sense, if you're a team of successful modders branching out into standalone games, your first project should be something smallish and tightly designed. Not "like those games we like but an order of magnitude bigger".

Are you saying it's not tightly designed to take EU4, increase the number of provinces by two orders of magnitude, and then slap Vicky's POP system on???

# ? Apr 3, 2022 22:14

hobbesmaster: Jan 28, 2008

Vizuyos posted:

Are you saying it's not tightly designed to take EU4, increase the number of provinces by two orders of magnitude, and then slap Vicky's POP system on???

Ah, the worse than late game stellaris slow down challenge.

# ? Apr 3, 2022 22:16

Farecoal: Oct 15, 2011; There he go

Guildencrantz posted:

Man, that project is not going to end well. Just by common sense, if you're a team of successful modders branching out into standalone games, your first project should be something smallish and tightly designed. Not "like those games we like but an order of magnitude bigger".

March of the Eagles but good would be a nice project. Maybe a slightly bigger timeframe, going from like 1760 to 1820.

# ? Apr 3, 2022 22:31

Subjunctive: Sep 12, 2006; ✨sparkle and shine✨

idhrendur posted:

Huh, that would mean my compilers class lied to me so many years ago. The instructor indicated it was all about lexx and yacc. Though we do better than the other session that was hand-writing tokenizers. Theirs would take tens of minutes to do that step alone whereas were sub-second.

I think the hotness these days are GLR parsers, and there are some production C++ compilers that use them. Bison can generate them. lex/yacc are fine if your grammar is amenable to LALR parsing, but doing that with C++�s grammar requires a lot of hacking around to keep extra state and so forth.

# ? Apr 3, 2022 22:42

IncredibleIgloo: Feb 17, 2011

I think their biggest flaw, amongst many, is their attitude towards abstraction. The entire conceit of video games is abstraction. It is funny that they mention they dislike board games because by definition boardgames are tightly scoped and often revolve around a limited number of mechanics and ways to interact with those mechanics. Content has to be engaging. 1 billion boring provinces is much worse than 1000 interesting ones.

# ? Apr 4, 2022 00:22

Farecoal: Oct 15, 2011; There he go

IncredibleIgloo posted:

It is funny that they mention they dislike board games

Okay I like them now

# ? Apr 4, 2022 00:36

IncredibleIgloo: Feb 17, 2011

I am still waiting on my kickstarter for the Board game of Europa Universalis, based on the computer game Europa Universalis, based on the prior board game Europa Universalis.

# ? Apr 4, 2022 01:46

Orv: May 4, 2011

Guildencrantz posted:

Man, that project is not going to end well. Just by common sense, if you're a team of successful modders branching out into standalone games, your first project should be something smallish and tightly designed. Not "like those games we like but an order of magnitude bigger".

I am super excited to see the absolute nightmare that the XCOM Long War mod people have made of their hyper ambitious strategy game.

# ? Apr 4, 2022 03:00

Jabor: Jul 16, 2010; #1 Loser at SpaceChem

Orv posted:

I am super excited to see the absolute nightmare that the XCOM Long War mod people have made of their hyper ambitious strategy game.

they already did it's called long war 2

# ? Apr 4, 2022 04:00

Red Bones: Aug 9, 2012; "I think he's a bad enough person to stay ghost through his sheer love of child-killing."

hobbesmaster posted:

Ah, the worse than late game stellaris slow down challenge.

Rework the game so you can only play as the Mongols, and the goal is to depopulate the earth before the ever-increasing pop count of the simulation destroys your CPU.

# ? Apr 4, 2022 07:01

Groogy: Jun 12, 2014; Tanks are kinda wasted on invading the USSR

Lady Radia posted:

Nah Paradox game mods are mostly around.. fake, pseudo-JSON?

I've never seen it as pseudo json. But yeah it's more like a markup language to call functions and manipulate data. But it is incredibly fast for what it is since it is like a 1-1 mapping almost to machine code. Faster than Lua I believe when we tested that some years ago.

VostokProgram posted:

does EU1 use the paradox scripting language? if so it would predate JSON

EU1 was on the Europa Engine and not the Clausewitz Engine. The script language of today was based of something from the Europa Engine I believe though. Someone like Johan would know better.
e: Ah I see Johan has already answered.

Groogy fucked around with this message at 10:18 on Apr 10, 2022

# ? Apr 10, 2022 10:16

idhrendur: Aug 20, 2016

Groogy posted:

I've never seen it as pseudo json. But yeah it's more like a markup language to call functions and manipulate data. But it is incredibly fast for what it is since it is like a 1-1 mapping almost to machine code. Faster than Lua I believe when we tested that some years ago.

I used to see so many projects where people try to write a tool to translate PdxScript to JSON and back. And then they discovered it doesn't really map.

# ? Apr 10, 2022 19:56

Pyromancer: Apr 29, 2011; This man must look upon the fire, smell of it, warm his hands by it, stare into its heart

Pdx script is better than JSON - it allows comments, for one

# ? Apr 11, 2022 14:33

Edgar Allen Ho: Apr 3, 2017; by sebmojo

IncredibleIgloo posted:

I am still waiting on my kickstarter for the Board game of Europa Universalis, based on the computer game Europa Universalis, based on the prior board game Europa Universalis.

https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/254127/europa-universalis-price-power

I have good news for you

# ? Apr 11, 2022 22:02

TTBF: Sep 14, 2005

Does anyone have that meltdown post from after Sunset Invasion got announced where the guy went on about losing the ability to feel human?

# ? Apr 14, 2022 01:37

trapped mouse: May 25, 2008; by Azathoth

TTBF posted:

Does anyone have that meltdown post from after Sunset Invasion got announced where the guy went on about losing the ability to feel human?

some bozo posted:

October 31st, 2012 is a day I will always remember. It was the day I became cynical, bitter, and distraught. You may call it an overreaction for me to feel this way simply because of the business practices of a single video game company, but let me explain what all of this means to me.

My life was thrown off balance and I never regained my footing after that day, because I lost my ability to respect. An essential part of being human is to feel respect for those who may or may not be deserving of it. But it is equally human to feel painful disillusionment when someone or something you respected turns out to be much less than you thought. But the level of betrayal I felt when Paradox announced their new DLC tore something from me that I'll never be able to recover. They tore away my ability to respect anything, and they tore away my ability to feel human.

Paradox Interactive was a company I respected, and their employees were people I looked up to. Crusader Kings, Europa Universalis, Victoria, and Hearts of Iron were all quality game series that combined historical accuracy with sandbox game worlds. These games may have been cartoony and humorous at times, but deep down they were always realistic and crafted with a level of detail and skill that won appreciation from gamers all across the internet. CK2 was their newest release, and the internet was in unanimous agreement that it was of unparallelled quality. Following it's long awaited release, Paradox began releasing quality DLC that raised the bar ever higher for Grand Strategy Games.

Then Sunset Invasion was announced. This was not just an announcement of DLC, it was announcement of Paradox Interactive's suicide. It was an expansion intended to completely disregard any historical accuracy, and instead shock the entire world with its lunacy. Paradox Interactive had gone off the deep end and raised the middle finger to everybody who stayed loyal to them. They had announced that they didn't care anymore, that they didn't care for their community, and they were going to go out of their way to sabotage everything they had spent years creating.

The pain I felt from this betrayal has destroyed me on an emotional level, and has deprived me of my primary source of entertainment. No longer can I play Grand Strategy games without remembering the day I ceased mattering to people I devoted myself to. Paradox had not just destroyed me or their company, they had destroyed the one force of stability in the world: Trust.