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So I've been slogging away at this. I'm up to Chapter X. I gotta say this is a rough game to play to this point if you're in a certain frame of mind. I've started playing and just stopped a few times when I decided I just couldn't deal with the game world. Everybody except for the protagonists is either lovely, useless, dead or a combination of. You are completely hosed. It feels like if this game has a happy ending it won't even be cathartic because at this point I can not believe House Wolffort could possibly claw their way out of this hole save a layer cake of contrived plot bullshit. Ok I'm at Chapter XI now Holy poo poo this game is a loving misery lasagna ChrisBTY fucked around with this message at 04:34 on Apr 21, 2022 |
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Apr 20, 2022 23:52
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This game doesn't pull too many punches, which I appreciate. Really, war games are going to hit you like that--they're supposed to be tragedy-filled affairs. Tactics Ogre's opening chapter has you either murder a bunch of innocent people, or be on the run and called the Butcher of Golyat by people convinced you did the murder, and Final Fantasy Tactics walks you through Delita's tragic backstory, complete with his sister getting murdered by an rear end in a top hat in the opening chapter.
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Apr 21, 2022 15:08
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Everything about the introduction to Hyzante was just an escalating series of  one after another"Oh, these guys seem okay. They're definitely nicer than those fuckers from Aesfrost. And they talk a big game about equality. Let's go visit! Oh, huh, they sure do love that Goddess. And religious fundamentalism. And they are very selective about who gets to be 'equal,' huh? Oh, and they enslaved a whole ethnic group, to the point that they demand the return of Rosellans abroad so they can have more enslaved laborers for their salt harvesting. And they kill them just for asking for water. Hm. Maybe I should've visited Aesfrost."
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Apr 21, 2022 16:11
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Harrow posted:Everything about the introduction to Hyzante was just an escalating series of That was actually one of my favorite bits of storytelling in the whole game. "Oh sweet they're kinda commies! Oh but wait it's religious communism? That's a little sus. And what's this I'm hearing about the Ministry of Medicine? Hmmm. Oh and they have a very clear hierarchy despite claims of equality? And I can't go see where the salt is produced? I wonder w.....oh. Well then."
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Apr 21, 2022 16:17
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Elephant Ambush posted:That was actually one of my favorite bits of storytelling in the whole game. Also Religous martyrdom in my theocratic egalitarian society? We don't that here because we don't want the Roselle getting ideas, make them toil as hard as possible without making death their endgoal and damned if you try to convince the ministry that dying for goddess as a goal is a good idea. Cue Hyzantian zealots charging at you with Aelfric amulets.
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Apr 21, 2022 17:11
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I felt like Tactics Ogre and FFT would let you up for air and Triangle Strategy does not. Just drown in the bullshit of war, the evil of mankind and the hopelessness inherit to all political structures.
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Apr 21, 2022 18:56
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It has a happier ending at least.
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Apr 21, 2022 19:15
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ChrisBTY posted:I felt like Tactics Ogre and FFT would let you up for air and Triangle Strategy does not. Just drown in the bullshit of war, the evil of mankind and the hopelessness inherit to all political structures. I would agree with this if they'd gone a bit harder on the idea that Glenbrook wasn't actually that great of a place. Same with Wolffort; everyone's just happy to toil away under the protection of Serenoa and company. You hear people thanking you for supplies, and having worries about the war but generally everyone's content with how things are run. I guess in terms of plot beats you could say it doesn't let you up, but I think once you go on the offensive it's pretty optimistic if you're on the golden route. FFT the big problem is that Ramza's plot line is sort of orbiting the event happening in the world a bit too often. It's easier to disconnect from what's actually happening to the greater populace because you're dealing with literal demons that everyone is unaware of. It's definitely a strength of Triangle Strategy that even the poo poo that's more tapped into magic, is very grounded and doesn't feel like divine intervention but rather just another of mankind's sins.
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Apr 21, 2022 19:19
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Just drown your sorrows in "mock battles".
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Apr 21, 2022 19:22
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I guess I'm just not up to that point yet. And I'm also not on the Golden Route. I couldn't get anybody to go along with my 'let's traffic the illegal salt' plan. Everybody acted like it's this big moral conundrum but...gently caress Hyzante. What do I care if Soresley is skimming some off the top of their bullshit salt trade? Good for him. The whole thing is bullshit anyway. And what's my reward for exposing his corruption? A demand to give them back their precious slave labor. Great. Wonderful. Fangz posted:Just drown your sorrows in "mock battles". Honestly that worked pretty well for me yesterday.
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Apr 21, 2022 19:36
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I haven't finished a playthrough yet and don't know anything about what route I'm on or anything like that, but I do sorta wish there wasn't a golden route. I feel like the existence of a route where everything turns out the best, even if it's difficult to achieve, sorta by default implies that other routes are "wrong" or "bad" by comparison. One of the things I really liked about Fire Emblem Three Houses was that there was no perfect route. Maybe I'll feel differently once I actually see the full story and see the golden route presumably in NG+.
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Apr 21, 2022 19:55
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Harrow posted:I haven't finished a playthrough yet and don't know anything about what route I'm on or anything like that, but I do sorta wish there wasn't a golden route. I feel like the existence of a route where everything turns out the best, even if it's difficult to achieve, sorta by default implies that other routes are "wrong" or "bad" by comparison. One of the things I really liked about Fire Emblem Three Houses was that there was no perfect route. What bugs me knowing there's a golden route is that I can kinda see where it is, I missed one step (because nobody could be convinced to go my way), but all the other choices I want to make are lining up with what I think the Route wants. So now I either do what I want and probably do it all again later, or deliberately pick options I like less.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:00
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I think the characters' in-game arguments are reasonable enough the end goal for either salt scheme is to expose Sorsley and earn Hyzante's cooperation, and however one feels about Hyzante, they're literally the only force left that can oppose Aesfrost. Their reservations to the smuggling plan are a mix of not wanting to do actual crimes or fearing that doing crimes may get you on Hyzante's shitlist, and the ones for the smuggling plan are thinking that you can't just waltz into Hyzante without proof, or that making contact with the other end of the smuggling scheme is worth the risk. All that is entirely reasonable in-universe I think. Honestly I wouldn't think too hard about the Fourth Route; the game is very much designed for the first playthrough to push you in one direction over which you have limited control, but which is nevertheless marked by your choices. If you're only going to see one ending, it's a disservice to make it the Fourth Route one. (also Three Houses totally did have a perfect route i will fight you on this)
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Apr 21, 2022 20:15
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I would kinda suggest that players don't go for it on the first playthrough. FWIW, there's still some variability in what you can pick and still get the Golden route.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:16
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The game is very, very clear about evoking the idea that you are a significant but small player caught in a war between larger powers. I think it actually does a great job with that. That has its disadvantages and the game really plays into that through the midgame as it feels like you're being ground to dust. But it also has its strengths which absolutely will show up later.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:30
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I finally made it to the golden path but uh I didn’t realize it would require me to use literally every character so I guess I’m gonna reload an earlier save and grind up my 6 or 7 characters who aren’t lv 50… On Hard you get a little crown next to the mock battles you win so I am gonna do all of them like a weirdo!!!!
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Apr 22, 2022 01:43
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About to give this a start. Anything I should know or be warned about before I begin?
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Apr 22, 2022 16:48
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Vandar posted:About to give this a start. I would recommend not looking anything up and just playing it blind and living with your decisions. There are 4 endings and a New Game+ so don't worry about getting everything the first time. You can't. There is no permadeath so don't worry about losing units in a fight. If you lose a fight you keep all your XP and get back all the items you used so don't worry about losing. You don't get anything special for never losing units or never losing a fight. You will not get enough resources in your first playthrough to max everyone out so just power up the units you use the most. Try using every character you recruit even if you think they suck. They all have useful abilities. Ezana is the best character.
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Apr 22, 2022 16:59
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You actually DO get a reward for never losing a unit, but it apparently isn't worth it.
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Apr 22, 2022 17:18
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When you get the opportunity to unlock upgrades for your units, focus on ability unlocks and passive effects first, the stat bonuses have a comparatively minor impact. Look for glimmering spots in the exploration phases, those are secret items.
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Apr 22, 2022 18:26
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Chapter 12 spoilers: Haha, I fuckin knew it. Dragan found salt, probably the same salt repository Frederica's mother knew about. I absolutely love that this entire conflict came about because someone found something to disrupt Hyzante's salt monopoly and not over any kind of demons or dragons or divine entities like so many tactical RPGs end up dropping the political elements to focus on.
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Apr 22, 2022 19:40
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Harrow posted:Chapter 12 spoilers: Haha, I fuckin knew it. Dragan found salt, probably the same salt repository Frederica's mother knew about. I was grinning at the same reveal. Not what I expected, but in hindsight I'm surprised I didn't.
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Apr 22, 2022 20:02
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Harrow posted:Chapter 12 spoilers: Haha, I fuckin knew it. Dragan found salt, probably the same salt repository Frederica's mother knew about. Yeah it owns. I called it way in advance but confirming I was right was pretty satisfying and yeah I love that all this conflict is over that discovery.
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Apr 22, 2022 20:14
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Fangz posted:When you get the opportunity to unlock upgrades for your units, focus on ability unlocks and passive effects first, the stat bonuses have a comparatively minor impact. Stat gains are actually pretty great. I also want to point this out about class promotions: you get higher stat bonuses as they get closer to reaching max level. So promoting to Elite between 20-30 doesn’t seem amazing but the total stat gains by lv 50 are massive: https://twitter.com/kotexfitts/status/1517654081489149952?s=21&t=y6Mleh2BOeSs5RC9LHbfNA
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Apr 23, 2022 01:00
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Er.. to clarify that doesn't mean you should hold onto promotions until you are max level, it means that they also boost your stat growths significantly.
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Apr 23, 2022 01:33
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The thing I have a hard time figuring out is when it's worth getting a weapon damage upgrade versus another passive. I'm not really sure how much of a difference the weapon damage upgrades make on their own.
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Apr 23, 2022 01:35
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Clarste posted:Er.. to clarify that doesn't mean you should hold onto promotions until you are max level, it means that they also boost your stat growths significantly. Stat growths are also retroactive, so don't worry about "missing out" on anything if you don't promote at the right time or whatever.
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Apr 23, 2022 01:47
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I tried to word that in a way that made it clear that you don’t get bonuses for holding off on promoting. But you get new characters at lv 50 once your main characters are lv 50, and the promotions look crazy. People earlier in the thread were saying that promotions don’t have a big effect on stats and boy were they wrong! And I’m pretty sure even small stat boosts have a big effect. The best accessories only give +3 or +5 in a stat but apparently that makes a huge difference. Edit: I don’t really understand Quahaug’s moveset. What makes his haste different from Geela’s? He also can’t really deal much damage and most of his moves are weird. Blackbelt Bobman fucked around with this message at 02:08 on Apr 23, 2022 |
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Apr 23, 2022 02:01
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Blackbelt Bobman posted:I tried to word that in a way that made it clear that you don’t get bonuses for holding off on promoting. But you get new characters at lv 50 once your main characters are lv 50, and the promotions look crazy. People earlier in the thread were saying that promotions don’t have a big effect on stats and boy were they wrong! And I’m pretty sure even small stat boosts have a big effect. The best accessories only give +3 or +5 in a stat but apparently that makes a huge difference. Quahaug is a support unit, and I've made a few posts about him already. He's actually amazing, but you need a bit of thought in how you use him. -He's super fast. I think he's the fastest unit in the game? -His haste is the same as Geela's. It doesn't need an upgrade like hers. -His delayed damage attack hits for 25% health, has range, and follows the victim like targeting a spell does in FFT. Proportional damage that cannot miss is always great. -His single unit "revert turn" ability can be insanely powerful. Did Erador just lose 400 HP in one turn AND his buffs expire? -Oh, the boss character way back there and you want to surround him with your powerful units without moving? Swap places with them, then move to safety. -And finally, his stop time ability allows you to cheese nearly every battle where the boss doesn't have some big fuckoff move at max TP: bonuses from not moving, status ailments, status buffs, damage from fire, delayed damage, etc. all tick when you're stopped. If Quahaug has max TP when he does this move, he can unfreeze another unit by reverting their turn. Stop Time is pretty broken, all things considered, since all of your units benefit from high TP more than the enemy team (e.g. weapon skills).
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Apr 23, 2022 02:42
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Prowler posted:I think it's important to mention that, in all of this, you are NEVER locked out of a path, regardless of conviction score. The only way you can screw yourself is by responding incorrectly, or flipping the (usually lone) undecided incorrectly. There's always a person you can convince, and you only ever need one. that's not true. i suppose grinding mock battles could've done the trick eventually but on my first run i was apparently so wishy washy that i couldn't persuade anyone against giving up roland in chapter 7 no matter which combination of dialogue options i picked. and i tried every one!
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Apr 23, 2022 02:43
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Looper posted:that's not true. i suppose grinding mock battles could've done the trick eventually but on my first run i was apparently so wishy washy that i couldn't persuade anyone against giving up roland in chapter 7 no matter which combination of dialogue options i picked. and i tried every one! Were you trying to convince everyone or something? I think for that vote, your only undecided is Anna, yes? There is a combination of answers you can use with her and she will vote your way. Full stop. I never had an issue with that vote, both in the demo and in my first time through playing the game. Edit: If you can't convince her, you can convince Roland. You tell him don't let Sir Maxwell's death be in vain, and that option that basically calls him worthless as a bargaining chip and he will go along with you. I watched two different streamers use this method and didn't run into any issues on their first try. Either you're extremely unlucky, or maybe you weren't paying attention as closely as you thought? Did anyone else get "conviction" blocked on this early decision? Haven't seen any complaints. Prowler fucked around with this message at 03:30 on Apr 23, 2022 |
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Apr 23, 2022 03:19
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Looper posted:that's not true. i suppose grinding mock battles could've done the trick eventually but on my first run i was apparently so wishy washy that i couldn't persuade anyone against giving up roland in chapter 7 no matter which combination of dialogue options i picked. and i tried every one! Did you not go out into town? Some of the votes have exploration sections attached that can unlock dialogue options.
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Apr 23, 2022 04:17
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I reached chapter 14 (specifically the battle with Avlora in the fountain) and I think I've reached a point where my brain clearly isn't understanding this game's combat the way it does other tactical RPGs. I just don't see a way to keep up with everything it's throwing at me with the resources I have. Thunder damage in the fountain does chip damage at best and never seems to paralyze enemies. Plus Ezana only has so much TP and so many turns, and Thunderstones are even weaker. I haven't found another item to upgrade Jens's hammer so he keeps running out of TP to throw Spring Traps with. I'm also really annoyed that Milo and Roland are force deployed because I have a couple of units I'd really love to be able to fit in and I haven't found another Silver to upgrade Roland's lance with yet so he's kinda dead weight (and I'll fail the battle if he dies). I can't seem to play aggressively and just try to rush down the healers and Avlora because I just get overwhelmed and destroyed. This is very frustrating.
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Apr 23, 2022 04:31
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Harrow posted:I reached chapter 14 (specifically the battle with Avlora in the fountain) and I think I've reached a point where my brain clearly isn't understanding this game's combat the way it does other tactical RPGs. I just don't see a way to keep up with everything it's throwing at me with the resources I have. Thunder damage in the fountain does chip damage at best and never seems to paralyze enemies. Plus Ezana only has so much TP and so many turns, and Thunderstones are even weaker. I haven't found another item to upgrade Jens's hammer so he keeps running out of TP to throw Spring Traps with. I'm also really annoyed that Milo and Roland are force deployed because I have a couple of units I'd really love to be able to fit in and I haven't found another Silver to upgrade Roland's lance with yet so he's kinda dead weight (and I'll fail the battle if he dies). I can't seem to play aggressively and just try to rush down the healers and Avlora because I just get overwhelmed and destroyed. That one took me two tries but I got it by lumping everyone together instead of splitting my forces. I also made it rain and then both Ezana and Narve stayed in the far back and spammed lightning into the fountain. Use Julio as a TP battery. The point is not to kill Avlora but to lure as many mooks into the fountain as you can and just keep spamming lightning. The chip damage adds up and you get twice as many chances to stun. Then bring archers and Frederica and stay to one of the back corners and just abuse ranged attacks. It's not super hard to turtle on that map and then once Avlora gets close just ignore everyone else and dogpile her. Abuse fury on the mages and healers when they get close.
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Apr 23, 2022 04:45
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Harrow posted:I reached chapter 14 (specifically the battle with Avlora in the fountain) and I think I've reached a point where my brain clearly isn't understanding this game's combat the way it does other tactical RPGs. I just don't see a way to keep up with everything it's throwing at me with the resources I have. Thunder damage in the fountain does chip damage at best and never seems to paralyze enemies. Plus Ezana only has so much TP and so many turns, and Thunderstones are even weaker. I haven't found another item to upgrade Jens's hammer so he keeps running out of TP to throw Spring Traps with. I'm also really annoyed that Milo and Roland are force deployed because I have a couple of units I'd really love to be able to fit in and I haven't found another Silver to upgrade Roland's lance with yet so he's kinda dead weight (and I'll fail the battle if he dies). I can't seem to play aggressively and just try to rush down the healers and Avlora because I just get overwhelmed and destroyed. For what it's worth I had more trouble with that fight than any other in my playthrough (haven't started ng+ yet though).
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Apr 23, 2022 04:50
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Harrow posted:I reached chapter 14 (specifically the battle with Avlora in the fountain) and I think I've reached a point where my brain clearly isn't understanding this game's combat the way it does other tactical RPGs. I just don't see a way to keep up with everything it's throwing at me with the resources I have. Thunder damage in the fountain does chip damage at best and never seems to paralyze enemies. Plus Ezana only has so much TP and so many turns, and Thunderstones are even weaker. I haven't found another item to upgrade Jens's hammer so he keeps running out of TP to throw Spring Traps with. I'm also really annoyed that Milo and Roland are force deployed because I have a couple of units I'd really love to be able to fit in and I haven't found another Silver to upgrade Roland's lance with yet so he's kinda dead weight (and I'll fail the battle if he dies). I can't seem to play aggressively and just try to rush down the healers and Avlora because I just get overwhelmed and destroyed. For some reason I did that fight on the first try. Julio as TP Battery, and I had just upgraded Serenoa to Lvl3 and got his House Bannor ult which gives +TP to all units in like 4 squares. I also had Piccoleta and Benedict. Milo/Roland went along the right side and eventually killed the master healer behind Avalora, while Anna and Hugette ran interference along the left. Everyone else was in the middle, not in the lake, baiting people into the lake with Piccoletta. Avalora can't get up on the ledges on either side of the map except from the very back. An (intentional?) call back to Chapter 7?
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Apr 23, 2022 05:04
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Harrow posted:I reached chapter 14 (specifically the battle with Avlora in the fountain) and I think I've reached a point where my brain clearly isn't understanding this game's combat the way it does other tactical RPGs. I just don't see a way to keep up with everything it's throwing at me with the resources I have. Thunder damage in the fountain does chip damage at best and never seems to paralyze enemies. Plus Ezana only has so much TP and so many turns, and Thunderstones are even weaker. I haven't found another item to upgrade Jens's hammer so he keeps running out of TP to throw Spring Traps with. I'm also really annoyed that Milo and Roland are force deployed because I have a couple of units I'd really love to be able to fit in and I haven't found another Silver to upgrade Roland's lance with yet so he's kinda dead weight (and I'll fail the battle if he dies). I can't seem to play aggressively and just try to rush down the healers and Avlora because I just get overwhelmed and destroyed. This was also the hardest battle for me as well, partially because I didn't level any thunder mages. Without the spring trap upgrade, I'm not sure how viable this is, but if you can predict the boss's movements you can launch them towards your own forces and dogpile them before the mess of enemies in the back can catch up. Anna or a flier can also provide a distraction to help separate out the boss from the minions.
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Apr 23, 2022 05:05
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Prowler posted:Were you trying to convince everyone or something? i spoke to everyone in favor of the choice i didn't want (roland, benedict, geela) and the neutral party (anna), and reloaded my save quite a number of times to attempt every combination of options. i didn't have any trouble in the demo or on a second fresh run of the game, so yes i'm quite sure i just had a particular set of conviction values that locked me out of the moral choice at that time Cattail Prophet posted:Did you not go out into town? Some of the votes have exploration sections attached that can unlock dialogue options. yes i'm aware, i literally made a list of every combination and ticked them off as i tried them to be totally sure
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Apr 23, 2022 05:16
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The ol' complaining about it on the internet trick worked again! Jesus god that's a shitload of kudos from all those multi-hits
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Apr 23, 2022 05:30
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Harrow posted:The ol' complaining about it on the internet trick worked again! Congrats! What was your strat?
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Apr 23, 2022 06:16
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