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MikeC posted:Chinese people are like people anywhere else. People are tribal by nature and it is easy to stir these kinds of feelings up provided you give them the right material. There will always be losers in any society who have accomplished nothing that they can feel good about so the only thing they have left to fall back on is their skin colour or culture. Racism in China is nothing new. Nor does moving into the West reduce racism among the diaspora. My parents and family still use racial slurs for different ethnic groups. That only toned down when my sister married a white guy and I am pretty sure my father came close to a meltdown but he mellowed out. Chinese people look down on other Chinese people too and discriminate against those from different regions just like how Canadians have stereotypes of people in Newfoundland or how Americans have the inbred white trash stereotypes of people in Kentucky or W. Virginia. This. All the various nationalities hate each other too, and have lots of stereotypes about each other. Think the UK vs France vs Germany.
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Apr 22, 2022 05:17
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I'm asking this honestly and don't mean to offend at all please give me clarity: I've heard as a slightly racist phrase that Chinese people are far more virulently racist than most people. Is this true in any reality or is it just a "whites aren't the only racists" downplay that actual frothing racists like to proclaim when challenged
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Apr 22, 2022 05:37
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:I'm asking this honestly and don't mean to offend at all please give me clarity: Little of this a little of that.
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Apr 22, 2022 05:45
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:I'm asking this honestly and don't mean to offend at all please give me clarity: Just to provide anecdata, I've dated two Chinese girls. One was insanely racist, like way above and beyond most things we find here in the US. Like "China needs to enslave the lesser Asian races" type stuff. The other was also quite racist, but had enough common sense to mostly keep it to herself (probably because we lived in a blue city and she realized her viewpoints would be frowned upon). I didn't realize it until she casually used the phrase "jungle Asian" in passing to refer to some non-Chinese Asians, I forget which.
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Apr 22, 2022 05:49
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:I've heard as a slightly racist phrase that Chinese people are far more virulently racist than most people. Slow News Day posted:I didn't realize it until she casually used the phrase "jungle Asian" in passing to refer to some non-Chinese Asians, I forget which.
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Apr 22, 2022 14:13
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Slow News Day posted:Just to provide anecdata, I've dated two Chinese girls. One was insanely racist, like way above and beyond most things we find here in the US. Like "China needs to enslave the lesser Asian races" type stuff. You dated Peven Stan?
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Apr 22, 2022 14:24
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:I'm asking this honestly and don't mean to offend at all please give me clarity: My reflexive wisecrack is that China has been calling itself the Middle Kingdom for centuries, and that tends to reflect a certain level of heightened racism. That being said, I have come across multiple people I knew questioned why we required police to read "Miranda rights" to people under arrest since "those people (i.e., racial minorities) don't matter." They were all from Mainland China. I'm sure a big part of that comes from being browbeaten with authoritarian propaganda since birth, but I've found that there's quite a strong strain of racial supremacy under all that too. As MikeC and Oracle said, people are all rotten. I don't think any of the racist Chinese people I know are that much worse than the racist white people or racist black people I've come across since they all end up at the same stupid end behavioral endpoint.
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Apr 22, 2022 14:30
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Eric Cantonese posted:As MikeC and Oracle said, people are all rotten. I don't think any of the racist Chinese people I know are that much worse than the racist white people or racist black people I've come across since they all end up at the same stupid end behavioral endpoint. At the risk of a derail could you tell us more about racist black people you’ve encountered?
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Apr 22, 2022 16:36
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Discendo Vox posted:It's that as far as I can tell neither government has a structural apparatus that would provide or create an expectation of such communication. I'm familiar enough with Chinese regulatory rollouts that I know their systems are genuinely opaque and have systemic gaps in ways that, e.g., regulations.gov or federalregister.gov don't. And this is very much by design. The last thing you want to do is create rules that actually limit what you can prohibit.
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Apr 22, 2022 16:56
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Eric Cantonese posted:My reflexive wisecrack is that China has been calling itself the Middle Kingdom for centuries, and that tends to reflect a certain level of heightened racism. I think part of it is that they're so drat open about their racism, like there is no brain to mouth filter. But a lot of Chinese Asians (not just mainland but like, Chinese minorities in a lot of the diaspora countries) are like that with lots of topics we'd consider impolite/socially taboo in the West (e.g. income, size). I can't tell you how many times I've heard people say poo poo like 'wow, long time no see. Man, you got fat!' or 'why would you date that guy, he's poor!' or 'drat, your girlfriend has a huge nose, how does that even happen?' Just like, completely eye-popping wtf poo poo.
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Apr 22, 2022 18:28
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:I'm asking this honestly and don't mean to offend at all please give me clarity: Watch this  video. Ask yourself how much worse it couldn have been outside just lynching the guy. Everyone in this video using the slur knows exactly what it means.WARNING https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1c-SZt17vvU
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Apr 22, 2022 18:52
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MikeC posted:Watch this This isn't even the worst case of this kind of heckling in China I've seen in person, at least it's just a (comparatively) small group yelling slurs and they're not visibly angry. Brings back some real bad memories.
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Apr 22, 2022 19:09
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Oracle posted:This. All the various nationalities hate each other too, and have lots of stereotypes about each other. Think the UK vs France vs Germany. There is a level of government encouragement for their ethnic-nationalism in china that isnt there in Europe.
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Apr 22, 2022 20:37
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Despera posted:There is a level of government encouragement for their ethnic-nationalism in china that isnt there in Europe. Buddy, your optimism is heavily misplaced
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Apr 22, 2022 20:46
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A big flaming stink posted:Buddy, your optimism is heavily misplaced Yeah, right now in Europe we've got a country invading another country on the stated grounds of the other country's ethnicity not being real/needing to be led by their own. It's not a problem unique to China.
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Apr 22, 2022 20:53
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Warbadger posted:Yeah, right now in Europe we've got a country invading another country on the stated grounds of the other country's ethnicity not being real/needing to be led by their own. It's not a problem unique to China. Maybe I should have said western Europe. Well Russia claims Ukrainians are Russian. Dont think China thinks Uighers are Han. They both are authoritiarian states that control social media and boost anything that makes their race look good.
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Apr 22, 2022 21:00
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Also I dont think "well russia" is quite the burn you think it is seeing how the chinese goverment and social media are busy boosting russia
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Apr 22, 2022 21:25
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Despera posted:Also I dont think "well russia" is quite the burn you think it is seeing how the chinese goverment and social media are busy boosting russia Eh, it wasn't meant as a burn. Just pointing out the obvious current example of ethno-nationalism in Europe. Not even trying to say China is better in that regard, just not unique.
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Apr 22, 2022 21:37
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mawarannahr posted:At the risk of a derail could you tell us more about racist black people you’ve encountered? I can’t tell if this is a serious question or not.
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Apr 22, 2022 21:44
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mawarannahr posted:At the risk of a derail could you tell us more about racist black people you’ve encountered? "Penny-pinching, evil Chinese/Koreans/Jews/Whites who can never be trusted..." And I've come across some black people who will say horrific stuff about other black people and proudly talk about how they don't "fit in." I don't think my experience is that weird, but you're welcome to disagree.
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Apr 22, 2022 22:01
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Despera posted:Maybe I should have said western Europe. Well Russia claims Ukrainians are Russian. Dont think China thinks Uighers are Han. They both are authoritiarian states that control social media and boost anything that makes their race look good. So is the west just more virtuous than the rest of the world or what makes them more anti racist?
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Apr 22, 2022 22:03
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I'm not sure that holding a Racism Olympics about whether China or Western nations are more racist is very productive. "Black people are racist like this" is also going down a bad path and hardly relevant to China.
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Apr 22, 2022 22:08
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Fritz the Horse posted:I'm not sure that holding a Racism Olympics about whether China or Western nations are more racist is very productive. I actually think the "Chinese are uniquely racist" is very illuminating just not for the stated reasons.
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Apr 22, 2022 22:14
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Terminal autist posted:So is the west just more virtuous than the rest of the world or what makes them more anti racist? I mean if you live in europe its harder to believe "x does y" when you can travel to whatever country in an hour without a passport. I dont think its crazy to assume that an authoritarian state would use its by far largest ethnic group as a source of unity and legitimacy European governments unlike say china dont force women to marry people of its largest ethnic group for instance You cant even leave the chinese internet without something illegal and its social media his heavily controlled to promote nationalism which as we know quite often leads to racism
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Apr 22, 2022 22:32
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Despera posted:I mean if you live in europe its harder to believe "x does y" when you can travel to whatever country in an hour without a passport. No more broad, unsourced claims or anecdotes on racism in China. I don't think it's a very productive topic for discussion but if posters are going to continue they need to provide actual official government policy, statements, statistics and not just hand-waving and anecdotal stories.
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Apr 22, 2022 22:38
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Fritz the Horse posted:No more broad, unsourced claims or anecdotes on racism in China. I don't think it's a very productive topic for discussion but if posters are going to continue they need to provide actual official government policy, statements, statistics and not just hand-waving and anecdotal stories. https://www.indiablooms.com/world-details/SA/25341/chinese-govt-sponsors-rape-of-uyghur-women-through-forced-marriage-allege-activists.html I could do 10 of these if you want
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Apr 22, 2022 22:40
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Fritz the Horse posted:No more broad, unsourced claims or anecdotes on racism in China. I don't think it's a very productive topic for discussion but if posters are going to continue they need to provide actual official government policy, statements, statistics and not just hand-waving and anecdotal stories. Official Government policy on racism?
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Apr 22, 2022 22:46
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Like seriously I dont see why you are making me have to sea lion everything that can be googled in 10 seconds
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Apr 22, 2022 22:47
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Despera posted:https://www.indiablooms.com/world-details/SA/25341/chinese-govt-sponsors-rape-of-uyghur-women-through-forced-marriage-allege-activists.html I'm not your target audience here, I'm not engaging in the discussion, just moderating. A basic D&D rule is to provide evidence for claims. Anecdotes and broad generalizations are not good evidence. MarcusSA posted:Official Government policy on racism? Despera has made several posts about Chinese gov't policies and racism/ethnonationalism, yes.
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Apr 22, 2022 22:49
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Fritz the Horse posted:I'm not your target audience here, I'm not engaging in the discussion, just moderating. A basic D&D rule is to provide evidence for claims. Anecdotes and broad generalizations are not good evidence. I just loving did and I could do it again. But its pointless because anyone with basic knowledge of china should probably know these things. If they dont here they go https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_China#Modern_China (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Apr 22, 2022 22:50
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Fritz the Horse posted:No more broad, unsourced claims or anecdotes on racism in China. I don't think it's a very productive topic for discussion but if posters are going to continue they need to provide actual official government policy, statements, statistics and not just hand-waving and anecdotal stories. deal with the couple people who posted stupid poo poo and let people talk about their own experiences, unless talking about first hand experiences of racism is suddenly verboten in dnd, but that would be loving stupid if we tried to apply it to the forum/country threads as a whole
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Apr 22, 2022 23:13
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Herstory Begins Now posted:deal with the couple people who posted stupid poo poo and let people talk about their own experiences, unless talking about first hand experiences of racism is suddenly verboten in dnd, but that would be loving stupid if we tried to apply it to the forum/country threads as a whole despera was making broad claims about china and chinese people being particularly racist as a whole, rather than posting an experience they have had with racist individuals in china. and i believe fritz was objecting to the unsupported assertions about chinese people as an ethnic group/nation e: for content, Shanghai came out with specific plan of action for dealing with covid https://twitter.com/AndyBxxx/status/1517315929704570880 https://twitter.com/AndyBxxx/status/1517316059014959105 https://twitter.com/AndyBxxx/status/1517316164950450176 https://twitter.com/AndyBxxx/status/1517316326116577280 obviously not an unbiased source, but i think it's heartening to see them finally forming official policy and plans specific to the outbreak rather than hacked together jerry-rigged plans. A big flaming stink fucked around with this message at 01:03 on Apr 23, 2022 |
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Apr 23, 2022 00:54
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Here’s a research paper about racism online in China, mainly focusing on Zhihu, a discussion forum something like Quora, focused on asking and answering questions that is very popular among educated Chinese people. It analyzes the trend of how the language of right-wing populism in the west has been co-opted into discourse about race, politics and identity in China. My own experience is that social media and popularly consumed news in China is overwhelmingly right wing and full of unchallenged racism and this article supports that. The interesting questions are how and why does this kind of language become so popular. https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/pdf/10.1177/1354066119850253 It’s not very useful to argue about who is more racist. Human beings are apes that tend to be lovely and horrible to other apes that are deemed to be the out group. It’s possible to do a better job at combating that, and some places probably do so, but the discussion usually ends up devolving into team sports anyway. That said, I do think it’s fairly telling that western right wing populism can be shared and promoted online and is often boosted on social media, but things like Me Too are censored and shut down.
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Apr 23, 2022 01:15
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Also holy poo poo my WeChat moments is nuts right now. People in Shanghai are Pissed.
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Apr 23, 2022 01:24
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A big flaming stink posted:https://twitter.com/AndyBxxx/status/1517316326116577280 This plan does not sound sustainable in the least 
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Apr 23, 2022 03:28
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Herstory Begins Now posted:This plan does not sound sustainable in the least i mean, it doesnt have to be sustainable since it is to specifically deal with the outbreak also the tweet you quoted doesn't seem that difficult given the massive testing capacity china possesses
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Apr 23, 2022 03:38
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ive done 39 pcr tests myself since february 24, which is as far back as my records go. this is in shenzhen. im doing another one tonight
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Apr 23, 2022 04:05
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fart simpson posted:ive done 39 pcr tests myself since february 24, which is as far back as my records go. this is in shenzhen. im doing another one tonight Seems normal
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Apr 23, 2022 08:01
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TheBuilder posted:Seems normal it’s not really a big deal, i don’t mind at all
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Apr 23, 2022 08:55
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What's the process like? Is it at home or do you have to go somewhere for it?A big flaming stink posted:i mean, it doesnt have to be sustainable since it is to specifically deal with the outbreak The testing capacity is the only part that I don't think they'll have any problems at all sustaining.
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Apr 23, 2022 10:25
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