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The Silent Scourge posted:So I just gotta vent on this and its tangental to the learning chat, but we're looking for a house with a 1 year old. That alone is stressful as gently caress and while I am out of town for work my inlaws ambushed my wife about the schools in the area we are looking at. Aren't those based on standardized test scores? Our neighborhood school is rated 1/10 and has an out of area waiting list a mile long because it does English/Spanish immersion. It's the most diverse school in the city by a mile and like 30% are ESL students no poo poo they aren't going to set the curve. I can supplement my kid's testable skills just fine and I'm primarily interested in her not growing up to be a piece of poo poo and bilingual with a diverse peer group is a good place to start. Edit: my kids school (#195 in the state)   The school down the road (#3 in the state)   There is no question where I'd rather be. My kid is still in preschool but I'm already hooked up with the (very active) PTA and am looking forward to doing whatever I can to help the whole class. Chef Boyardeez Nuts has issued a correction as of 14:53 on Apr 27, 2022 |
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Apr 27, 2022 14:37
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my kid goes to school in a district that is majority POC, mostly free and reduced lunch(before Covid) and has all bad grades on all the niche/good schools lists and she’ll be fine because of 1.our socioeconomic status and 2. parent involvement. now, I live in the epicenter of DeVos influenced “school of choice” and my kid goes to a different school were zoned for because 1. no loving after school care and class lets out at like 3:30 and 2. there is an environmental public school that we liked even though my kids district is the biggest in the region it has no before /after school care district wide and other programs that I’m sure we all grew up with doesn’t support two working parents so my spouse and I have to take turns leaving work early to get her from bus stop I could move a mile in two directions and be in A+ schools and after/before child care but then im living in houses that cost 1-200,000k more.
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Apr 27, 2022 15:08
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The Silent Scourge posted:So I just gotta vent on this and its tangental to the learning chat, but we're looking for a house with a 1 year old. That alone is stressful as gently caress and while I am out of town for work my inlaws ambushed my wife about the schools in the area we are looking at. I wouldn't worry too much, because while there are definitely "good" schools and "bad" schools it doesn't 100% correlate with income and can even change on a dime. My wife teaches at one of the top private 10 high schools in our state, and when she started three years ago it was worthy of that recognition. Then two years ago (right around when our daughter was born!) they got a new head of school who believes "No child should fail, and if they do it's the teachers fault" at a school where a 75 is considered failing. Cue my wife returning from maternity leave to what is essentially a whole other school. Parents can and will get grades dropped from kids' records if they're not high enough (anything less than a B is fair game no matter how badly the child is doing in general). Kids have successfully petitioned the head of school, who should have no business setting curriculum, to pressure teachers into canceling tests they didn't feel like taking, multiple times in my wife's department alone. I lost count of how many times my wife or her colleagues have been told to doctor student's grades because it may affect their acceptance to a college where they're only being courted as an athlete. The parents are rich and conservative in general, so you bet your rear end critical race theory is being used as a cudgel against the liberal arts departments. It also looks like an Ivy League, but the actual equipment they have inside is older than what my mediocre early aughts high school used. They can get away with it because the kids are rich enough that they all have their own top-of-the-line laptops and whatever else they need, but the reason is presumably because any upgrades would eat into the administrators' bonuses, and boy howdy do they have administrators. It's gotten bad enough that my wife's students complain to her about it. It's even gotten bad enough that my wife's students want her to quit, straight up told her the other day "You deserve better." This all sounds lovely and negative, and it is because I'm venting, but the moral is you can't pay for a good school. This school's tests are off the charts because every kid has a private tutor and every class is designed to game the tests. I once covered a school on the education beat that had awful test scores because it was bussing in all the special needs kids the surrounding towns were kicking out of their programs. They were being punished for doing something good. tl;dr There are good private schools. There are good public schools. It's hard to control for either. All you can do is support your kids.
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Apr 27, 2022 15:24
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Bar Ran Dun posted:of course D&D shat up my thread on it. biggest thing I learned from the thread... I was put into a gifted program in Grade 4 and that Greg anecdote was way too familiar. Good read, though, and thank you, because I've never properly considered what that diagnosis might have meant for child-me and what my experience of the world was actually like at the time. I have a conspicuously bad memory; I didn't understand until recently, when I found old report cards in my parents' garage, how much of a stranger that me is to myself. I feel like my life before maybe Grade 11 was scrubbed out of my brain at some point. I see a lot of this in my son, too, and there are zilch supports in place here for students with that particular kind of need. We're putting him in an immersion program to sop up some of his excess processing power but we'll be doing a lot of skill building at home as well.
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Apr 27, 2022 15:44
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meanolmrcloud posted:I have one niece who attends a pricey stem (yes these exist) Montessori thing, and has from 2 through age 6, and another niece who was with a stay at home mom until recently attending kindergarten. That's not really a fair comparison though, and I say that as someone who sent his daughter to a Montessori until kindergarten. It could also just be the extra socialization, kids learn a ton through just playing and especially with other kids. Being in any school is going to give more opportunities for that given how unfortunately atomized and nuclear society and families are in modern america (and europe).
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Apr 27, 2022 15:48
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Bar Ran Dun posted:of course D&D shat up my thread on it. biggest thing I learned from the thread... i had to pay $250 for a GT test on my 4 year old because her birthday was 11 past the cutoff to go to kindergarten and it was the only way they'd let her in. there are some specific GT magnet schools here, and the kids met with this GT group of adults twice a year every year they were in the county to discuss their development and goals. the school taught them math and reading two grades above the norm. it was really pretty great and i hated it because obviously we can supplement her education as parents, and there were so so many more children out there who needed that sort of focus and help all the way through their education and they wouldn't get it because their mommies and daddies couldn't desperately scrounge up the money for the test. loving bullshit and really really upsetting.
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Apr 27, 2022 15:50
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my kids neuropsychologist recommended a Montessori due to her cognitive assessment but the only two programs in my district are 1.private with unreasonable commitments and 2.public that lets out at like 3pm. she does ok in normal school but she’s pretty bored and is probably adhd(inattentive type) but we have an appt in the fall(everybody is booked out for eternity) to see what’s going on
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Apr 27, 2022 15:52
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i am harry posted:mommies and daddies couldn't desperately scrounge up the money for the test. loving bullshit and really really upsetting. I know a local provider that approached teachers to offer this pro bono and there really was no movement for it. but also my district has no G&T program. all the whiter ones around me do!
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Apr 27, 2022 15:57
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The Silent Scourge posted:Does that poo poo really matter? Are we dooming our kid to lovely education becuase the elementary school is 4/10? How the gently caress do you deal with this poo poo, it feels like no matter what whatever you do its a crap shoot if the school is actually good or not. You're playing the odds -- Peer group is one of the most absolutely fundamental influencers in your child's development. Poverty* is what it is. There will be fewer pro-social, academics-oriented children in a school with an impoverished or transient population, and so it will be harder for your kid to make friends with them. This thread can have a giant derail about how there are shitheads in wealthier schools too, and that's right, but we all know which sorts of shithead behaviors are tolerated or rewarded and which sorts are punished and life-ruining in our actually-existing society. I left a job I loved because I knew firsthand how much of a dumpster fire the elementary school was in that town, and I knew that no matter what we did at home, he was going to be in that environment for the bulk of his waking hours, five days a week. * It's not just a poverty thing, obvs -- you see this in some rural schools too, for example, where the kids know they're guaranteed rig pig positions or whatever and so academics isn't really relevant to their lives.
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Apr 27, 2022 16:04
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i am harry posted:loving bullshit and really really upsetting. in WA they have an achievement component in addition to the intelligence testing. this filters out all the minorities and poor kids and kids with two diagnoses. it also allows the rich parents two tests they prep their kids for by paying tutors. basically all the ones that really need it get pushed out lol. this then creates reaction. here it was pretty public in Seattle and the push is to end the programs. when the actual thing that would help would be cut the achievement component and get all the minorities, poor, and double diagnosed into the programs. the ones that need help desperately. the other problem is that most of these programs are well let’s just teach them two years ahead. no that’s not right. asymmetrical development they aren’t ahead uniformly. in fact they might be below average or behind in some areas. that gap gets many of them frustrated and angry. a second grader might be able to read and comprehend like a high school senior verbally, but only write like a second grader. or they might have the moral development of a late high schooler with a regular eight year olds emotional regulation, and the volume turned up on all their emotions that one is real fun btw.
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Apr 27, 2022 16:20
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Bar Ran Dun posted:
yeah more work is not the answer. my kid is advanced in a lot of areas but emotionally is very much a 5 yr old so it throws people off, especially since her enunciation/articulation is advanced. we work a lot with the emotional regulation. it’s a common problem with kids who don’t have the emotional advancement with cognitive. i seriously don’t know how I would have done this alone since my spouse is an expert in kid brain development. it isn’t intuitive imo.
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Apr 27, 2022 16:27
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Well for some good news about these types of difficult decisions and how they may impact your child's future make sure you check the biosphere collapse thread
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Apr 27, 2022 16:37
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another thing to note, this conversion is statistically very, almost absurdly so, improbable. basis number of users here and number of standard deviations for this diagnosis. meaning people with this variety of brain fuckery (or similar spectrum conditions) tend self select to be on SA, especially in CSPAM and D&D. it’s also obvious once you know what it looks like so you also get to watch out for ideological predation, people will target your kids to want them to think in the manner they do!
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Apr 27, 2022 16:49
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sonatinas posted:we work a lot with the emotional regulation. it’s a common problem with kids who don’t have the emotional advancement with cognitive. i seriously don’t know how I would have done this alone since my spouse is an expert in kid brain development. it isn’t intuitive imo. pandemic hosed my family right up on this front, all the ways we used community to emotionally regulate got cut off abruptly. we are only just digging out of the hole. my wife’s family are all educators, and special Ed, and both of us went to basically the best public gifted school in the country. so we did know intuitively and intellectually... and it still hosed us up pretty bad.
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Apr 27, 2022 16:56
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IAMKOREA posted:Well for some good news about these types of difficult decisions and how they may impact your child's future make sure you check the biosphere collapse thread why? I have an eight year already very upset about that who independently reached that conclusion on his own because animals and ecosystems are a thing he hyper focuses on. early existential crises are another thing for kids like this so it’s kindof a  situation.
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Apr 27, 2022 17:11
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unlimited shrimp posted:You're playing the odds -- Peer group is one of the most absolutely fundamental influencers in your child's development. Poverty* is what it is. There will be fewer pro-social, academics-oriented children in a school with an impoverished or transient population, and so it will be harder for your kid to make friends with them. This thread can have a giant derail about how there are shitheads in wealthier schools too, and that's right, but we all know which sorts of shithead behaviors are tolerated or rewarded and which sorts are punished and life-ruining in our actually-existing society. Not calling you out or anything, but I have to point out that a major problem with private schools isn't shithead kids of shithead parents, it's that the same controls public schools have in place to keep the poor in their place exist there too. They have ways to ensure that the hardworking kids who earned scholarships and took on debt don't get access to the same opportunities as the wealthy kids both indirectly (since everyone is automatically considered preppy the social circles break down around wealth rather than academics, and if you're from the town with the lovely public schools your friendship prospects suffer accordingly) and directly (letting support structures put in place for the scholarship kids wither by underfunding them). Again, plenty of public schools are absolute trash fires that should be avoided if you have the opportunity, but just because you jumped social rank to a private school doesn't mean you're being let into the club. My wife had these and similar lessons beaten into her over two decades of attending a private school then teaching at other private schools. After all that she still considers going to one for high school one of the best choices she ever made! It has its benefits! But it's a deeply personal decision that's impacted by your personality, where you live, how you learn, etc. In summary please don't take advice from an internet stranger whose name is literally Huge Fuckin' Idiot. Do your own research and then do what you think is best without killing yourself over it. Thank you for listening.
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Apr 27, 2022 17:16
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I agree 100% and that part you highlighted was hastily written because I wanted to short circuit any accusations of classism or racism. I just find a lot of people are willing to discuss the ravages of poverty in the abstract but they're squeamish about talking about how that manifests socially because they don't want to responsibilize people or blame the victim. There are lots of good reasons to avoid schools in "bad neighborhoods" that have everything to do with systems and nothing to do with individuals.
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Apr 27, 2022 17:34
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Bar Ran Dun posted:why? I have an eight year already very upset about that who independently reached that conclusion on his own because animals and ecosystems are a thing he hyper focuses on. early existential crises are another thing for kids like this so it’s kindof a It was an "it don't matter, none of this matters" joke. Just a dumb joke.
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Apr 27, 2022 17:56
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Bar Ran Dun posted:why? I have an eight year already very upset about that who independently reached that conclusion on his own because animals and ecosystems are a thing he hyper focuses on. this is my future. my kid already has anxieties about this stuff and to add on top of that I’ve had to tell her numerous times the Sun is not going to go nova in our or anybody else lifetimes for a very long time. we will be gone or off this planet before that happens.
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Apr 27, 2022 18:19
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sonatinas posted:this is my future. my kid already has anxieties about this stuff and to add on top of that I’ve had to tell her numerous times the Sun is not going to go nova in our or anybody else lifetimes for a very long time. we will be gone or off this planet before that happens. "Don't worry honey, we'll be extinct as a species long before the red giant sun swallows the planet."
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Apr 27, 2022 18:58
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i dont trust school rankings. unless your in like the bottom 10% worst school districts in America, a few notches up or down on the ranking wont make a difference in your kids life. the best thing you can do if your in a lovely school district is spend an extra 15 minutes a day studying with your kid, or if possible hire a tutor once a week. (we found one who tutors in her spare time, she's a 3rd grade teacher and my son was soooo far behind because of the year of remote learning and she comes once a week just to help with homework and shore up some areas he's week in, mostly reading) also you should probably do that even if you're in a good school district cause rich suburban parents can't really throw their kids to the wolves and say "well we pay all these taxes for a great school i shouldn't have to do anything"....which some do anyway
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Apr 27, 2022 19:13
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sonatinas posted:this is my future. my kid already has anxieties about this stuff and to add on top of that I’ve had to tell her numerous times the Sun is not going to go nova in our or anybody else lifetimes for a very long time. we will be gone or off this planet before that happens. l have also had this conversation. this is very normal for a gifted kid. here’s another one: does she dislike movies with too much emotional tension or believable protagonist peril (Disney films are good example)?
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Apr 27, 2022 20:11
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The Nastier Nate posted:i dont trust school rankings. they mostly measure socio economic status of the parents. it’s a real poo poo show trying to answer if a school is actually good. especially now after the pandemic.
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Apr 27, 2022 20:21
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Bar Ran Dun posted:l have also had this conversation. this is very normal for a gifted kid. here’s another one: does she dislike movies with too much emotional tension or believable protagonist peril (Disney films are good example)? I can't stand them personally lol am i on the spectrum ???
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Apr 27, 2022 20:26
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Bar Ran Dun posted:l have also had this conversation. this is very normal for a gifted kid. here’s another one: does she dislike movies with too much emotional tension or believable protagonist peril (Disney films are good example)? My sister wanted to take my son to his first movie. He made it through almost all of Jungle Cruise like a champ but then completely lost it when he saw that the magic tree was dead. Kids rule.
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Apr 27, 2022 20:39
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Bar Ran Dun posted:l have also had this conversation. this is very normal for a gifted kid. here’s another one: does she dislike movies with too much emotional tension or believable protagonist peril (Disney films are good example)? yes. for awhile frozen 1&2 were too scary. we never made it through tangled or soul . she’s better now I think but I haven’t tried anything really scary or perilous. my neighbor Totoro and ponyo were the perfect kids movies for awhile. she now loves this Sherlock Holmes movie on HBO that was made in HK. I’ll watch Pokémon with her(I aged out of it when it came out) and I’m like this world rules since a 10 yr old can just go on a journey with no danger. my kid talks about what she’s going to do on her future journeys and I’m like this fuckin pandemic…
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Apr 27, 2022 22:11
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Thanks everyone, we talked it through and are moving forward since we knew about the school ratings poo poo before we started shopping, just got caught off guard by her parents suddenly trying to guilt her about it when im not around. The part about them being afraid that its mostly non-native speakers was more mask off then i ever expected them to be. At the end of the day how much we get involved and help our kiddo learn is the most important thing.
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Apr 27, 2022 23:11
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Bar Ran Dun posted:l have also had this conversation. this is very normal for a gifted kid. here’s another one: does she dislike movies with too much emotional tension or believable protagonist peril (Disney films are good example)? Hmm. Hmmmmmmm.
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Apr 27, 2022 23:12
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gauging my childs intelligence by having him watch artax drown in the swamp of sadness and then collecting his tears in a beaker
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Apr 27, 2022 23:21
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brugroffil posted:Hmm. Hmmmmmmm. man I’ve seen all the G&T things. the place I went to school for was the inspiration for a young adult fantasy novel series. all the various quirks was stuff I didn’t realize was abnormal until my thirties. they’re screamingly obvious now.
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Apr 27, 2022 23:32
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U-DO Burger posted:gauging my childs intelligence by having him watch artax drown in the swamp of sadness and then collecting his tears in a beaker think about an autistic kid covering their ears or not wanting to be touched. the social emotional behavior isn’t separate from the learning difference. it’s just assumed to be for learning differences perceived as negative. for the one that is perceived as positive people fail to understand the connection and don’t know it’s a thing.
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Apr 27, 2022 23:41
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I took my kid to see Guardians of the Galaxy when she was 3. It's still her favorite movie to this day.  Love to watch Marvel with my movie buddy.
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Apr 28, 2022 00:00
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The Nastier Nate posted:i dont trust school rankings. I work in a lot of school districts with people who have disabilities and people who are experiencing severe trauma at home. This seems to be the case. I met with the student council at a middle school in a district with a pretty bad reputation and I wouldn't have been able to tell them apart from the student council in a "better" school. Their parents are just more involved. Now, this is cspam so we probably all know why some parents aren't able to be involved. That's the way it is right now though. Edit: For parent content, we met a nice family at the library who is on the same page as us regarding covid. Yesterday we met at the park and had a great time and now my son has a friend. It's nice.
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Apr 28, 2022 00:02
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Unrelated but my kid is working her way through some "new math" grouping tv show on Netflix and holy poo poo is this stuff way more accessible than by rote boomer bullshit I was taught. My three year old is actively grasping concepts I struggled with in the second grade.
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Apr 28, 2022 00:40
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Chef Boyardeez Nuts posted:Unrelated but my kid is working her way through some "new math" grouping tv show on Netflix and holy poo poo is this stuff way more accessible than by rote boomer bullshit I was taught. My three year old is actively grasping concepts I struggled with in the second grade. What's it called? e. if it's "New Math" then it must not be on Canuck Netflix.
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Apr 28, 2022 00:59
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my kids love Number Blocks, which is an awesome basic math show on Netflix. i miss math shows, they were so fun https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q53GmMCqmAM
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Apr 28, 2022 01:22
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Yeah, it's Number Blocks
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Apr 28, 2022 01:23
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Can't wait till my kid is old enough to subject to Math Noir
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Apr 28, 2022 01:28
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Uhhh there really isn't any research that validates the idea of a "gifted" student existing compared to "normal" or "dumb" kids. Not to be a dick, but the whole g and t thing is a fairly inaccurate belief that isn't backed up in 99% of ed literature or even just my practical experience. The difference (barring developmental delays) between a gifted and a normal or poor student is 90% experiential, meaning "gifted" kids have typically received better instruction and opportunities over a longer period of time than their peers. There isn't really anything more than childhood experiences differentiating most students by ability or achievement. E: and the reason I bring it up instead of not is because that belief has also historically been used to deny a quality education to students from underprivileged backgrounds, or those with disabilities. Maybe some students are developmentally gifted, but the difference between them and a student with exactly the same background and instruction usually isn't meaningfully important. The idea that some students are "gifted" translates organically into the belief that some are not, which is also not accurate. Kids are as good or bad at school as the opportunities they've received (both in and outside school). NeatHeteroDude has issued a correction as of 01:49 on Apr 28, 2022 |
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Apr 28, 2022 01:46
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If i worked one on one with a student for 7 hours a day, 5 days a week, I could either turn them into a gifted kid or reduce them to rubble based on how i teach them and modify their behavior. G and t programs and teaching philosophies also tend to undervalue some of the most important skills they can learn in school (teamwork, cooperation with different peers, social skills, etc.) because many adults make the assumption that there HAS to be some kind of social tradeoff for being good at school.
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Apr 28, 2022 01:56
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