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Full Collapse posted:This is a question that's been eating at me for a while. Sorry if it's a dumb one. Not a dumb question at all. I'm not 100% sure on this but I think a lot of people track these with the only oil system mod being a cooler. Need for fancy pans, baffles, or an accusump usually shows up when you put slicks on if it's going to be an issue. I haven't dug way into this though so it's that I haven't seen it pop up as a must do for a track car, not that I'm sure it doesn't.
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Apr 27, 2022 01:51
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Roman Rambo posted:Don't do it to yourself if you want to track it. Get a BRZ. But what if I have an irrational hatred of Subaru and Toyota? I literally do because weebs ruined them for me Edit: I wish I took a picture of the gaggle of group 1 and 2 supras that all found each other in the paddock and were all going way too slow and refusing to point people by. There had to be at least 8 of them. KillHour fucked around with this message at 02:51 on Apr 27, 2022 |
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Apr 27, 2022 02:43
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Look at my username and imagine how I feel. Just a sea of really loud morons. Still love Hondas. Be the change you want to see in the world.
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Apr 27, 2022 02:58
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I want to see a world with more turbo noises v v
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Apr 27, 2022 03:11
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I vote going full track rat and get a kswapped Fit. Easy on tires, can haul everything to the track, room for big guys, rips For that 35k you could have a fun car, and enough cash for hella track time
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Apr 27, 2022 05:01
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no lube so what posted:I vote going full track rat and get a kswapped Fit. Easy on tires, can haul everything to the track, room for big guys, rips This is wisdom.
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Apr 27, 2022 12:56
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I got some fresh vinyls for the shitbox. Gonna look sweet plodding slowly at the back now.
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Apr 27, 2022 15:41
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You people aren’t helping me not look at used GT86/BRZs Theres a nagging feeling I get that tracking a 30 year old turbocharged car isn’t the greatest idea, especially as the drat thing has started to appreciate in value. Just kinda annoying that the prices on GT86s hasn’t dropped as much as I’d like, kinda hoping when the GR86 comes out here they might drop a bit more.
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Apr 27, 2022 15:50
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That’s more of used car prices are dumb as hell. Unfortunately the GT86 is still kinda pricey, NC Miatas crashed a little bit. E46 330i’s in serviceable conditions can still be found reliably (reliable? lol) for around ~5k.
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Apr 27, 2022 20:17
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Roman Rambo posted:I got some fresh vinyls for the shitbox. Gonna look sweet plodding slowly at the back now. What’s the best way to get custom vinyls?
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Apr 27, 2022 20:25
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Phone posted:That’s more of used car prices are dumb as hell. Unfortunately the GT86 is still kinda pricey, NC Miatas crashed a little bit. That sounds about right, I sold my old 330i ZHP sedan for the guy that bought it from me a couple of months ago. It had a fair number of the normal track suspension/bushing mods, 250k miles, and had some paint issues. $5k
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Apr 27, 2022 20:33
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Phone posted:That’s more of used car prices are dumb as hell. Unfortunately the GT86 is still kinda pricey, NC Miatas crashed a little bit. I could pick up an nc for gently caress all here, but after replacing the entire suspension (front & rear subframes, all the arms hubs and brakes) on my friends nc I don't want one. I did drive it on track for a bit, it was fine. It's not stock it's been tuned for 200hp with cams and manifold. With the oe billstein shocks, mazdaspeed springs and some sort of combination of rx8 sway bars. Was on lovely toyo street tyres though. Main thing I don't like is the weight over the front. I'm so used to the pointyness of the mr2 with not much weight on the front wheels. I dunno he's got some avon track tyres now which are cast offs from the nc race series here so maybe that will help. E46 is too old, I could probably budget for a e92/90 m3 but those could get expensive fast. M135i would also be another option, but I can't stand em. Other options would be Cayman/boxster, but the ones i'd be looking at don't seem much faster on track than the mr2 is really. Plus I don't like Porsches that much. We also have the option of renaultsport stuff. If you come to a trackday here you will have multiple mx5's, caterhams and renaultsport clios/meganes. I would say the meganes are pretty much the French Integra Type R, especially some of the cup chassis models. But again it's another car I respect but I don't see myself spending money to own one. But what about a lotus elise? Well after doing a passenger ride in one, I was amazed by how effortless it was but also realised how poo poo it would be to use on the road. I was bumping shoulders with the owner the seats are so close together and neither of us were that large. Also the S1 cars are silly money now and the S2's are getting there in price also. DC5 Itr would be possible but they are getting on with age and not much cheaper than a GT86. S2000 is the same with AP2's costing as much as a GT86 but much less practical older car. Basically tldr I convince myself with lots of  that I want an 86/BRZ lol
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Apr 27, 2022 21:51
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I don't think you guys got the AP2 with the 2.2 so I see no reason to not just shop for an AP1. The rear subframe geometry change is a small thing and the 4 channel MK60 ABS in the DBW AP2 is a nice little upgrade, but other than that the AP1 is still pretty great. The things are pretty easy to put a K24 into if you want more power or you pop the F series, used motor prices just straight aren't worth it unless you're an absolute purist. I've driven two Exige track cars, one being a S260 and the other being a K24 swap. If you want a track only car, you're not tied to needing a bunch of power, and you're willing to spend the current buy in prices I think they are still kind of a deal if you find the right one. As far as the BRZ... the motor all around isn't there compared to the S2000, the ABS can be intrusive depending on your brake/tire setup, and the early cars (< 2017) can have EPS cut out issues with sticky tires. I like the car otherwise, especially the amount of space you've got in it compared to a Miata or S2000. Not having to deal with a soft top / hard top is a beautiful thing for a track car, the aftermarket part market is about as good as it gets for a Japanese car, and it is a pretty simple / reliable / cheap to run car all around. In short, I tracked a S2000 heavily for 3 years, a turbo NB Miata for a year, and I've got maybe a handful of days in the BRZ. Doing it over I'd have kept the S2000, caged it, and put a K24 into it. If I'd stuffed the S2000 into a wall after that then I'd have bought a BRZ anyway since I won't deal with another convertible track car or pay S2000 prices now. Anyway, I sold the supercharged motor setup out of my white BRZ and I'm putting a K24 into it as soon as the KPower kit I ordered in February shows up. If it isn't what I hoped then I'm buying an Exige. Re: E36 M3 - It is basically an old version of a BRZ and is more expensive at this point, I see no reason. BlackMK4 fucked around with this message at 22:19 on Apr 27, 2022 |
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Apr 27, 2022 22:10
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BlackMK4 posted:If you're power addicted there is always a Camaro SS 1LE but it won't be that affordable to run. You misspelled C5 Z06.
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Apr 27, 2022 22:24
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BlackMK4 posted:I don't think you guys got the AP2 with the 2.2 so I see no reason to not just shop for an AP1. The rear subframe geometry change is a small thing and the 4 channel MK60 ABS in the DBW AP2 is a nice little upgrade, but other than that the AP1 is still pretty great. The things are pretty easy to put a K24 into if you want more power or you pop the F series, used motor prices just straight aren't worth it unless you're an absolute purist. Yeah they both have the 2.0 engine, just having a quick look at the classifieds the cheapest AP1 is about 9 grand with closing on 170k miles. You’ve also got to remember I live in a wet country where we love to salt the roads so it’s probably going to be rusty underneath. For a nice one that hopefully isn’t full of rust you’re looking at 15 to 20 grand. For 10 grand I could buy a Megane 265 Cup which would be 10 years newer, has 100,000 less miles on the clock and would be much faster than most S2000’s out of the box. Realistically I missed the boat on S2000’s here when you could buy a lowish mileage AP2 for about 8 grand. I’ve heard stuff about ABS doing weird stuff in the 86/brz, what was it? Ice mode or something? I’m moving to a slightly more rural area soon hopefully, so maybe I can find a better lockup than the current one I keep my car in. Then I might have the option just to buy something like an MX-5 Supercup NC, or an MR2 challenge car for cheap and buy a low loader with the rest of the money. Then I’d have the option to get a racing licence and embarrass myself in actual motorsport. track day bro! fucked around with this message at 22:41 on Apr 27, 2022 |
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Apr 27, 2022 22:37
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IOwnCalculus posted:You misspelled C5 Z06. Probably not a bad idea, actually  track day bro! posted:Yeah they both have the 2.0 engine, just having a quick look at the classifieds the cheapest AP1 is about 9 grand with closing on 170k miles. Arizona privilege, never seen rust.My BRZ can be pretty easily coaxed into hard pedal 'ice mode' in braking zones with bumps, but I think it has to do with being outside the range of the factory ABS calibration via Stoptech front / rear, a lot more grip, etc. The car also doesn't have much rear bias so it is more difficult to rotate it on the brakes. Easily worked around, but it existing is kind of annoying coming from the BMW M3 MK60 ABS in the Miata that was absolutely fantastic. BlackMK4 fucked around with this message at 22:52 on Apr 27, 2022 |
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Apr 27, 2022 22:50
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track day bro! posted:You’ve also got to remember I live in a wet country where we love to salt the roads so it’s probably going to be rusty underneath. Move to the superior southern part of the country 
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Apr 27, 2022 22:57
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I swear I get jealous when I see the undersides of the cars where you are. Mine isn’t so bad because I had all the suspension arms and subframes powdercoated when I re-bushed everything. But even then thats started to look a little crusty in places, even after years where it gets put into storage before the salt goes on the roads. My pal bought the cheapest NC2 PHRT in the country and when I mean country it was pretty much one of the most northern parts of Scotland. Every time I’d help him with the drat thing I swear I ended up shearing multiple bolts it was so bad. The ice mode stuff sounds scary, I guess do you have the option of pulling the abs fuse? I mean this is coming from someone who’s car doesn’t have abs at all though. I’m surprised there are no aftermarket solutions for it? TheBacon posted:Move to the superior southern part of the country I live in the southern part of the country though….
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Apr 27, 2022 23:05
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The abs in my spyder is pretty bad with ice mode. Wtf Toyota, loving chumps
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Apr 27, 2022 23:10
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I've kind of started to correlate Bosch with weird abs behavior, whereas Continental makes some good stuff. I could be smoking crack with that observation though.track day bro! posted:The ice mode stuff sounds scary, I guess do you have the option of pulling the abs fuse? I mean this is coming from someone who’s car doesn’t have abs at all though. You can do that but I don't think it is worth it.
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Apr 27, 2022 23:19
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What is "ice mode"? I seem to remember it coming up before when BlackMK4 binned that miata , but what does it do or feel like?
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Apr 27, 2022 23:23
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You get a hard brake pedal and the car doesn't slow as expected. The way that I understand it is that you can easily end up outside of the range of normal braking rates of deceleration in a car with different tires / brakes / etc than stock. Some ABS software will determine that some large large wheel speed delta over time means you're on a low grip surface so it intervenes and starts blowing off braking. It can usually be worked around by recognizing when it'll likely occur and changing driving / braking habits. Some cars don't have the issue, some do. Porsches and Lotuses are kind of notorious for it on track, so people go to Continental MK60 (M3), Continental Race, or Bosch motorsports ABS units which either are significantly less prone to it or plain don't do it (along with the other bonuses of a real race abs unit). What happened to the Miata was my fault, I should have taken it a lot easier in a brand new to me car. I'd never experienced it before and reacted to it incorrectly in a bad spot, it is what it is. BlackMK4 fucked around with this message at 23:44 on Apr 27, 2022 |
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Apr 27, 2022 23:41
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track day bro! posted:
I went through a similar kinda thing. Wanted something rwd and was in an apartment so reliable too. S2000s got the boot for only being cheap when ragged out. Miatas were just to small. Both had soft top as a negative. 350z had the same pricing thing as s2ks but less so. 370s were just expensive + expensive staggered tire. If I'd known if would have a proper garage a few years later a c5 might have been a great choice. BRZ was basically my goldilocks Miata. Big enough to use as a daily and on road trips, hard top, cheap at the time, and simple (engine not counted). With swap kits for k24s if the engine proved an issue long term. If used car prices ever chill out I'd love an older one as a track car. If not mine will be an older one soon enough.
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Apr 27, 2022 23:58
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track day bro! posted:Scotland. Man for years I thought you lived in Italy. You need to get away from the fraudulent brits mi amico.
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Apr 28, 2022 01:01
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KillHour posted:Looking at my front tires, the reason the driver's side bubbled is clearly because I'm running on the sidewalls too much. Makes sense that it would be that one since the Glen is very right-turn heavy. I was running at pretty conservative pressures (~38 PSI hot) so I think what I really need to do is add some negative camber on the front. A quick Google says that the front camber can be adjusted to -1.5 deg on the factory setup, so I'm going to have a shop redo my alignment. Any recommendations on how far I should go with it? I was thinking of maybe having them go 1 degree out and see how that does? the rs is at -1.5 from the factory. it's very annoying. if you want to run a track set up -3~ is where you should start. also you have to cut out a lot of poo poo up front to get past -1.5 edit: also KillHour posted:thats it im going back to the bmw thread where they encourage my bad spending addiction!!! hi speed motorsports in CT will build, store, and transport your car. all you have to do is arrive and drive. no idea what that ends up costing but if you want to burn cash. KidDynamite fucked around with this message at 01:35 on Apr 28, 2022 |
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Apr 28, 2022 01:28
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no lube so what posted:What’s the best way to get custom vinyls? You have a bunch of options. There are a bunch of places like Firestormgraphix online that you can call/email and get something made, and they'll mail it to you and you slap it on there. You could do what I did which is design your decals and then contact a local vinyl place to have them printed, cut and installed. Ultimately, it came out well but I did have to do a bit of back and forth with them about the design. I think the best course of action though is to find a local vinyl shop and then have their designer create you the design you want. That way if there are any issues with the upscaling of logos/printing/cutting whatever because of the design, its on them. If you're having something custom made, definitely request a proof so that you can see how it is actually going to look. edit for my other vinyl stories: I had these removable vinyls made at izoomgraphics that I used for a while if you're into that. They eventually get dirty and you have to discard them, so it isn't super cost-effective in my opinion. https://i.imgur.com/Mf9Wp1E.jpg I also had these matte clear numbers made which were super cool but for obvious visibility reasons were not so popular with the stewards. oops. https://i.imgur.com/o1zgQPF.jpg track day bro! posted:
I'm in a BRZ now, and while it is really awesome, I sometimes think about either a Cayman or e46 m3. I've had a cayman in the past and an e46 non-m and liked them both very much. Personal comedy option I would get the new BRZ. I've driven many of them on track and think they are exceptional. But, for now I am very happy with the modified old gen BRZ that I have. Roman Rambo fucked around with this message at 14:34 on Apr 28, 2022 |
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Apr 28, 2022 14:21
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Unfortunately I haven't done a track day in a full size car all year. I've come to terms with the fact that the Miata will never be where I want it to be without installing a drop pan, and if I'm going to do that I may as well just buy a spec Miata that's already caged with a floor drop. So at some point the Miata is going up for sale and all of that money will go towards getting my E46 M3 ready for the track. In the meantime though I bought a Ka100 powered kart and wholly recommend it. I've never been so physically exhausted from driving something before. It's loving awesome. 
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Apr 29, 2022 15:49
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Karting looks like so much fun. If you don't mind me asking how much did it end up costing to actually start racing?
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Apr 29, 2022 18:01
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The floating carts look genuinely photoshopped in and are messing with my head.
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Apr 29, 2022 18:06
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I've need to see if a kart will fit in the back of my transit connect 🤔
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Apr 29, 2022 19:57
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QaijSWOmwkE No comment.
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Apr 30, 2022 04:48
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Donny is a big boy track, it's also where I managed to crash. The down hill chicane part (called crainers) is no joke. I put one wheel on the grass there with the rear wheels unloaded with a bit of lock. The car switched ends instantly and I went into the tyre wall on the other side of the track backwards.
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Apr 30, 2022 15:05
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"At this point in the day I thought that the track was completely dry, but the shadow at 0:20 hid a tiny strip of damp track that I hadn't seen. I braked hard as usual, just touched the damp patch and the result is this video." Ahh, the joys of racing
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Apr 30, 2022 17:38
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track day bro! posted:The down hill chicane part (called crainers) is no joke. The number of times I've liftoff oversteered there in iRacing can attest to this.
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Apr 30, 2022 17:57
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If you're on slicks and there is any wet or damp spot on track you will find it fast and it will be a pucker moment. Last time I ran NCM there was a patch of moisture on pit in, hitting it at anything more than walking pace would have the car out of line quickly. Tiny bit of grooving and it's completely different. We did out comp school in spec racer fords running these and it poured the entire weekend, cars were just fine. 
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May 1, 2022 22:22
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I've been tracking and upgrading my Subaru Legacy GT wagon over the past few years after building the engine and realizing that driving it fast on the road is stupid and driving it slow on the road is boring. I am aware that this is a stupid decision and a bad choice for a track vehicle but I'm having fun. I have a few questions about brakes and suspension setup. This winter I installed Fortune 500 coilovers with Swift springs, with a roll center correction kit and 2015 STI steering rack. I also added a Cusco type RS rear 1.5 way plated LSD (the front diff is a Quaife ATB Torsen style). It has Whiteline front and rear sways, the front is 22mm and the rear is 20mm (stock is 20mm and 16mm). They are both two step adjustable and both set to soft. I am running Pilot Sport 4S tires. It's about 1" lower than stock. On stock suspension the car was killing the outside of tires pretty quickly as could be predicted. Adding the sways helped with this, but made it easier to upset with bumps and curbs. The coilovers made it so much more composed and predictable, as could be expected. And the diffs have made it not spin the inside tires when coming out of corners. On my last track day, I kept increasing the damper stiffness until it didn't wallow around after bumps and elevation changes, and wound up at 15/24 clicks in the front and 17/24 clicks in the rear, with 0 being full soft and 24 being full stiff. However it seems to understeer more since adding the rear diff and coilovers, especially with throttle on. I was thinking of one or more of the following to address this: - Go to the firmer setting on the rear bar - Go back to the stock front bar (though the car still has moderate body roll with the current setup, so I'm wary of making it too soft in roll) - Get some adjustable toe links so I can easily toe the rear out a bit (I am running -2 degrees front camber, 1/8" front toe out, and -1.5 degrees rear camber, 0 rear toe). I currently adjust back and forth between street and track alignments so doing the rear for track days isn't a big deal when I'm under there anyway. - Take some preload out of the rear diff (currently at 66% preload). This is a huge pain in the rear end of course since it involves dropping the rear end and disassembling the diff. It also turns fine when not under load, and doesn't skid or make any noise at all when turning slowly in a parking lot. Any thoughts on which way to go? The swaybars seem like the easiest thing to try by far, but it's basically reducing rear traction, which I'm not sure is ideal. Brake questions: I fought for a while to keep the stock brakes working well, eventually running Hawk DTC-70 pads after destroying some HPS's (which were crazy dusty on the street and didn't last on the track). These were crazy overkill and covered the side of the car with bits of my rotors. In hindsight, running them was stupid (but they did stop well). It didn't keep the rotors from getting very warped though so I went to some larger STI Brembos from a track car, which came with a set of track pads. The pads have an NRS backplate but I don't know what they are and neither did the seller. They work well from cold, have worked well at high temperatures, and are fairly clean. They are fairly loud, and they have less bite than the DTC-70's but are quite adequate. Does this sound familiar to anybody? I am thinking EBC Blue Stuff maybe? I'd like to get another set.
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May 7, 2022 03:47
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Id start with stiffer rear bar. Very quick and easy to do between sessions so you can get a 1:1 test. Keep going till it's to much. If full stiff isn't enough disconnect the front, rear back to soft, and through the range again. Less sway bar but more spring is ideal in a world where you have all the springs and time for track specific setups. And or a world where you're ok with really high spring rates. Other options. Raise the rear a bit. Up the rear spring rate. Or add chassis stiffeners to the rear. Stut bars and the like. At a certain point your chassis will become the spring. Depends on tires, cage?, chassis stiffness etc. EDIT: re-read your post. Maybe just toss more front camber at it to start? On a car with front struts you'll probably want 3-4 deg at the track. honda whisperer fucked around with this message at 04:25 on May 7, 2022 |
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May 7, 2022 04:21
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I would wonder if the diff is set up too tight for the power you're making. I know it was night and day when I sent my OSGiken in to be re-tuned. I'd also second raising the rear, if it isn't already up, and adding rear spring BlackMK4 fucked around with this message at 04:56 on May 7, 2022 |
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May 7, 2022 04:53
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I don’t have any advice or input but man you can’t post all that and not include a pic of a track wagon, I applaud you goon
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May 7, 2022 05:26
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How about more front camber, maybe stiffer rear springs. Do you have stiffer bushings in the front LCAs?
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May 7, 2022 05:53
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