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Nobody other than George could have directed those films because he was creating a brand new production pipeline in real time as he was making them. His concerns were often directed to the technical challenges moreso than the acting because the films would not be able to exist without solving those challenges. Had he focused more on the acting, the scope and scale of the films would have been significantly less ambitious.
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May 16, 2022 12:44
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Folding lightsaber idea : give the protag lightsaber proof gloves , make the folding lightsaber connected by chains, and then copy all the 3 section staff choreography from 36th chamber of Shaolin
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May 16, 2022 14:17
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stev posted:I think if you'd had anyone other than George directing the actors a lot of problems with the prequels would've gone away. How come nerds never say the opposite, and get all hype about the "acting direction" in Irvin Kershner's Robocop 2 or whatever.
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May 16, 2022 14:27
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To be sure Robocop 2 clearly got futzed with by the studio at some point. Like the entire tone of the film is lacking the sleazy intensity of the first. One of the major differences in the PT is it’s about a more “civilized” age and Lucas shows this by adopting the formality and pageantry of old Hollywood costume epics (the kind they stopped making after Cleopatra more or less.) It is trickier to pull off, on a writing and acting level, and the Jedi are deliberately supposed to be stoic and passionless and that’s another layer of challenge. It doesn’t all work but Lucas is willing to err on the side of being a little cheesy.
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May 16, 2022 17:57
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I feel like "directing actors" as a concept really involves a whole bunch of different factors more so than like, a set of magic words you say to the actors that directs them towards a specific type of performance. So it's reductive to say that Lucas should've just focused more on directing the actors, as if that's a simple either/or choice that he made. So sure, maybe if the dialogue was written more naturalistically, and if the movie had less emphasis on special effects, and the actors spent more time on rehearsing their dialogue scenes than they did lightsaber fights, they would've been in a position to give better performances. But these are the movies Lucas wanted to make, he wanted the dialogue written that way. He wanted the groundbreaking special effects. So the reason the actors weren't given a completely different set of circumstances to give a completely different set of performances is because that would've been a different movie from what Lucas wanted to make.
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May 16, 2022 18:08
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Basebf555 posted:I feel like "directing actors" as a concept really involves a whole bunch of different factors more so than like, a set of magic words you say to the actors that directs them towards a specific type of performance. So it's reductive to say that Lucas should've just focused more on directing the actors, as if that's a simple either/or choice that he made. Yeah but we were talking about the stuff that was bad about the PT, and the quality of performance that George got out of a group of very talented actors is high up on that list. If you removed the racist accents that also would've been different from the movie he wanted to make, doesn't mean it shouldn't happen.
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May 16, 2022 18:25
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stev posted:Yeah but we were talking about the stuff that was bad about the PT, and the quality of performance that George got out of a group of very talented actors is high up on that list. If you removed the racist accents that also would've been different from the movie he wanted to make, doesn't mean it shouldn't happen. I get it but my point is that we're not talking about a switch you just flip, or a dial you turn up by a notch. There's a bunch of factors that led to the performances being what they are so if you're going to change all that stuff you'd have completely different movies. The accents are a simple thing you can drop in or take out easily, it doesn't change the foundation of what the prequels are to change something like that.
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May 16, 2022 18:29
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Ghost Leviathan posted:...suddenly realising that Raiden from Metal Gear is basically Anakin. Which is probably on purpose. (while Big Boss is Darth Vader. And of course there's deliberate similarities between Raiden and Big Boss's arcs) I made this comparison just up page and I want my internet points, dammit. The more I think about it, Attack of the Clones continues this idea. There's a thing that looks like a detective story, a thing that looks like a romance, but it's all part of the manipulation. It's recreating a hero's journey in a flawed way to create a very flawed hero. And the Jedi play their own part in this flawed journey, thinking they can avoid its inevitable end. Snowman_McK fucked around with this message at 01:36 on May 17, 2022 |
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May 16, 2022 23:28
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I've been reading about the Renaissance and specifically carnivals that would integrate ornate, cultural plays with tons of live special effects being performed, among other things, to enforce political dynasties. I love that phantom menace is not only in dialogue with the performances as a film, but also came with an attached carnival.
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May 17, 2022 02:42
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Darth TNT posted:I like the prequels. Though I seem to recall the second movie is a bit dull? Jar Jar didn't electrocute himself on purpose, he's just clumsy. Anakin being absurdly young yet so gifted is why the Jedi believe he's the chosen one, Quigon and Obiwan don't tell anyone else about his midiclorioan levels (unless I forgot). stev posted:I think if you'd had anyone other than George directing the actors a lot of problems with the prequels would've gone away. Except there's plenty of bad acting in Empire and Jedi and countless other nerd sacred cows like Indiana Jones, and no one really cares. It's only a problem when nerds want it to be. Same with "racist accents". Anyways, the Disney Wars have good acting top to bottom, but it can't rescue their bad scripts
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May 17, 2022 08:01
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Eh, I think kid Anakin works in context of a story that's basically about your escapist nostalgia coming back to bite you. Anakin's a special kid swept up in a grand adventure and told he's the chosen one, and then he comes back some years later as a hunky unstable child soldier reluctantly indoctrinated into the janissary cult too late to fully give himself over to it, an underappreciated war hero slash living weapon. My main problem with kid Anakin is that I never really bought the love story part of it.  And I think the special kid gets swept up could've worked better at an older age as well. Take Power Rangers, which was popular with the kids but all the leads are twice their age. Blood Boils posted:Jar Jar didn't electrocute himself on purpose, he's just clumsy. I know he's clumsy and I don't mind clumsy unless I feel it gets in the way. In that scene we have Qui Gon trying to explain poo poo while Anakin fiddles with an important piece of machinery while at the same time we have someone acting funny trying to draw attention to his predicament. I personally just don't like that, but humor is subjective.
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May 17, 2022 08:30
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Phantom Menace explicitly evokes a antediluvian paradise, back when the republic "worked" and wasn't yet corrupted by power and war. This is the same intent that backs up annie and jarjar's being in the film, as they are both very much characters for an innocent kid's movie. Aging up anakin into a teenager with attitude would be completely at odds with this. Also, if you want a movie with anakin as an edgy teen, you've already got it in Attack of the Clones!
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May 17, 2022 09:06
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Darth TNT posted:I know he's clumsy and I don't mind clumsy unless I feel it gets in the way. In that scene we have Qui Gon trying to explain poo poo while Anakin fiddles with an important piece of machinery while at the same time we have someone acting funny trying to draw attention to his predicament. I personally just don't like that, but humor is subjective. I agree with this. There have been many great points about how Jar Jar's behavior and the reactions of those around him serve as commentary of one kind or another. In the scene mentioned above, nobody even notices Jar Jar. If it's meant to lure us into thinking racistly about him like the characters do, there are more effective scenes. It's redundant.
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May 17, 2022 09:07
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The love story is tragic and uncomfortable, but it seems quite easy to believe. They're young, and hot, and lonely, and intense. Falling in love is exactly what you'd expect people to do under those conditions.
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May 17, 2022 10:14
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Snowman_McK posted:I made this comparison just up page and I want my internet points, dammit. Got the idea from that, sorry, thoughts just ran away with me. But yeah, MGS2 yet again manages to be prematurely meta given the whole actively trying to recreate the hero's journey in-universe to try to replicate the outcome. Which gets interesting because it kinda worked, but recreated the wrong hero! Bongo Bill posted:The love story is tragic and uncomfortable, but it seems quite easy to believe. They're young, and hot, and lonely, and intense. Falling in love is exactly what you'd expect people to do under those conditions. I've said before, the problem is that Hollywood audiences are so used to romantic subplots done terribly and gratituously they don't realise it's meant to be on purpose.
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May 17, 2022 10:50
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BiggestBatman posted:Phantom Menace explicitly evokes a antediluvian paradise, back when the republic "worked" and wasn't yet corrupted by power and war. This is the same intent that backs up annie and jarjar's being in the film, as they are both very much characters for an innocent kid's movie. Aging up anakin into a teenager with attitude would be completely at odds with this. I had to look up antediluvian.  I did not see the connection between young Anakin/innocent Jarjar vs Good Republic. You make a good point regarding that theme.
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May 17, 2022 12:01
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New Vanity Fair article just dropped with a few behind-the-scenes pictures of upcoming stuff. Haven't had the chance to actually read it yet, though.
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May 17, 2022 12:56
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Blood Boils posted:Anakin being absurdly young yet so gifted is why the Jedi believe he's the chosen one, Quigon and Obiwan don't tell anyone else about his midiclorioan levels (unless I forgot).
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May 17, 2022 14:28
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Doctor Spaceman posted:Qui-gon tells the entire council when he's trying to persuade the council to let him train Anakin. A big deal with Qui-Gon is that he's an iconoclast to the rest of the Order and considered a hippie weirdo for believing in old prophecies rather than embracing the eternal status quo. Anakin is taken in partly because of their implied guilt for his death at the hands of an enemy they considered an extinct legend lost to history.
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May 17, 2022 14:35
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feedmyleg posted:New Vanity Fair article just dropped with a few behind-the-scenes pictures of upcoming stuff. Haven't had the chance to actually read it yet, though. Relevant to the CD thread: - Taika movie is probably next, before Rogue Squadron - KK doesn't know what they're talking about when they mention Feige's project - Rian's trilogy is backburned due to him being all-in on Knives Out atm - No more recasts for OG characters like Han or Luke, we CG or nothing now boys
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May 17, 2022 14:37
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Ghost Leviathan posted:A big deal with Qui-Gon is that he's an iconoclast to the rest of the Order and considered a hippie weirdo for believing in old prophecies rather than embracing the eternal status quo. Anakin is taken in partly because of their implied guilt for his death at the hands of an enemy they considered an extinct legend lost to history. They are skeptical about Qui-gon's claims but Mace doesn't seem to dispute the existence of the prophecy and in the next two films they are all onboard with it. Even when Anakin falls they think they are the ones who misinterpreted the prophecy. Qui-gon's introductory line in the series is a clear statement that he's short-sighted and lacks foresight, setting up how much of a mistake it is to listen to him.
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May 17, 2022 15:10
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Cross-Section posted:Relevant to the CD thread: I'm not sure how I feel about that. I was okay with deep fake Luke, though the voice misses something somehow. Though that may also be because he wants to sound detached. On the other hand, it is okay to move on.
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May 17, 2022 16:12
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Even when they got deepfake Luke "right" it still looked like someone had dragged and dropped a gif of his face onto a different head. There's no dimension to it and there are shots where the light and shadow between the face and neck don't match. It's terrible. I much prefer the straight up CG characters in Rogue One. They don't look real but they're a drat sight less off-putting and creepy.
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May 17, 2022 16:15
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Insofar as qui gon invented, or was beloved by the force enough to be allowed by it to invent, or whatever, immortality, I still think it's likely he was supposed to have some kind of unprecedented wisdom or virtue. As far as kathleen kennedy's 10 trillion word essay, it doesn't look like anything to me
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May 17, 2022 16:17
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I like how they still have to pretend Rian's trilogy will ever be made.
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May 17, 2022 16:19
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I mean, I'm totally against all this deepfake poo poo, but we shouldn't act like the tech will be where it is now forever. It's going to become a lot more convincing and seamless the more they do it.Spermando posted:I like how they still have to pretend Rian's trilogy will ever be made. I mean, reading KK's words she doesn't really imply that at all, that perspective is VF's editorializing.
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May 17, 2022 16:25
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feedmyleg posted:I mean, reading KK's words she doesn't really imply that at all, that perspective is VF's editorializing. She specifically says he's been busy with Knives Out - so I assume it's still on the cards once that trilogy is done.
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May 17, 2022 16:54
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Doctor Spaceman posted:Qui-gon tells the entire council when he's trying to persuade the council to let him train Anakin. Fair enough, I only remembered him telling them he's the chosen one
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May 17, 2022 16:58
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If rian works on other stuff about 10-15 more years he can come back and do it in the bloom of the kids who grew up with TLJ aggressively posting phase. I don't mean that in a scoffing way, that's probably the best approach if it has to be done at all
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May 17, 2022 17:01
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stev posted:She specifically says he's been busy with Knives Out - so I assume it's still on the cards once that trilogy is done. My read is that she very specifically didn't say this.
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May 17, 2022 17:44
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I wonder if there's ever been discussions within Disney about the possibility of just doing a straight-up remake of the OT with an all new cast.
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May 17, 2022 17:47
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Half a decade of making actors say "real sets! wow" at gunpoint, and now all praise to the digital backdrop bubble
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May 17, 2022 17:47
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Basebf555 posted:I wonder if there's ever been discussions within Disney about the possibility of just doing a straight-up remake of the OT with an all new cast. I’m sure someone has brought it up in some meeting, but I see next to zero incentive for Disney to stick its dick in that hornet nest when you can always do what they just did and go a little bit in the future (or 1000 years in the past) and basically tell the same stories with the same iconography.
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May 17, 2022 17:50
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Ingmar terdman posted:Half a decade of making actors say "real sets! wow" at gunpoint, and now all praise to the digital backdrop bubble You can have both a real set and a digital backdrop at the same time.
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May 17, 2022 17:51
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General Dog posted:I’m sure someone has brought it up in some meeting, but I see next to zero incentive for Disney to stick its dick in that hornet nest when you can always do what they just did and go a little bit in the future (or 1000 years in the past) and basically tell the same stories with the same iconography. I'm not sure they would view it as a hornets nest. They already have evidence they can point to where they basically just did shot for shot remakes of their hit movies from the early 90s, and those remakes made big money. They might see it as an ace in the hole that they will only play if/when things get very dire for the franchise.
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May 17, 2022 17:55
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Basebf555 posted:I'm not sure they would view it as a hornets nest. They already have evidence they can point to where they basically just did shot for shot remakes of their hit movies from the early 90s, and those remakes made big money. They might see it as an ace in the hole that they will only play if/when things get very dire for the franchise. All of those remakes had a significant change in style and they've already found out once they can't treat Star Wars like their other big franchise.
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May 17, 2022 17:58
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Basebf555 posted:I wonder if there's ever been discussions within Disney about the possibility of just doing a straight-up remake of the OT with an all new cast. I can't imagine it. So....likely.
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May 17, 2022 18:00
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Basebf555 posted:I'm not sure they would view it as a hornets nest. They already have evidence they can point to where they basically just did shot for shot remakes of their hit movies from the early 90s, and those remakes made big money. They might see it as an ace in the hole that they will only play if/when things get very dire for the franchise. I’d never say never, but it’s unfathomable to me that it would happen in the next 25 years. I guess maybe after Lucas, Ford, and Hamill are all dead you can start about a 10 year clock until it’s plausible. General Dog fucked around with this message at 18:05 on May 17, 2022 |
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May 17, 2022 18:02
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Basebf555 posted:I wonder if there's ever been discussions within Disney about the possibility of just doing a straight-up remake of the OT with an all new cast. Probably seen as too sacrosanct. Besides, they don't need to. That's outmoded thinking, seeing cinema as the end-all-be-all. Instead what they'll likely do is continue to remake bits and pieces of them for new generations in a way that doesn't supplant the originals, like all those OT animated shorts they did recreating key moments but with way bigger action and fast-cuts.
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May 17, 2022 18:03
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feedmyleg posted:Probably seen as too sacrosanct. Besides, they don't need to. Agreed, but only for now. I'm envisioning a time like 8 to 10 years from now where it's possible the audience demand for Star Wars could be at an all time low(i.e. if the next round of movies fails), and the idea of the OT being sacrosanct may not be as important as their desperation to jump start the franchise again.
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May 17, 2022 18:09
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