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DrunkenGarbageCan
Nov 4, 2009

grah posted:

I don't know if 105% accuracy is still recommended, i know you definitely don't go 110% like you would in pve.

110% was always recommended in 6.0 because you had such a wealth of tertiary stats you could hit the 1.4 alacrity threshold and hard diminishing returns on critical rating and still hit 110% accuracy.

With 7.0 the tertiary stat pool has been diminished to the point where you're not going to be able to hit all three. In PvP you sacrifice accuracy, in PvE you sacrifice crit.

At endgame you're Bolstered up to a minimum gear rating and Bolstered down for any gear with an ilevel greater than 326...if you're getting rolled your gear is not the problem.

Optimized gearing for PvE DPS for all specs except Lightning and Arsenal at 326 would be:

4 Enhancements + 3 Augments + Stim for Accuracy

4 Enhancements for Alacrity

Everything else (including Crystals) is Crit.

For PvP you would swap two of the Accuracy Enhancements for Crit.

Heals (all 3 specs) would replace all the Accuracy Enhancements with Crit, all Augments to Mastery, and switch to a Mastery stim.

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cams
Mar 28, 2003


DrunkenGarbageCan posted:

At endgame you're Bolstered up to a minimum gear rating and Bolstered down for any gear with an ilevel greater than 326...if you're getting rolled your gear is not the problem.
thanks everybody for all the info, this does answer the biggest part of my question regarding pvp. i did a couple months in wow last year and once you hit max level, pvp immediately became unplayable until you'd gone through weeks of the whole endgame circuit, especially if you started late in a season.

i'll keep in mind the specifics of gearing but i'm so far away from any of that, was mostly just wondering if i'd find a brick wall at the end if i stuck with it.

grah
Jul 26, 2007
brainsss

DrunkenGarbageCan posted:

110% was always recommended in 6.0 because you had such a wealth of tertiary stats you could hit the 1.4 alacrity threshold and hard diminishing returns on critical rating and still hit 110% accuracy.

With 7.0 the tertiary stat pool has been diminished to the point where you're not going to be able to hit all three. In PvP you sacrifice accuracy, in PvE you sacrifice crit.

At endgame you're Bolstered up to a minimum gear rating and Bolstered down for any gear with an ilevel greater than 326...if you're getting rolled your gear is not the problem.

Optimized gearing for PvE DPS for all specs except Lightning and Arsenal at 326 would be:

4 Enhancements + 3 Augments + Stim for Accuracy

4 Enhancements for Alacrity

Everything else (including Crystals) is Crit.

For PvP you would swap two of the Accuracy Enhancements for Crit.

Heals (all 3 specs) would replace all the Accuracy Enhancements with Crit, all Augments to Mastery, and switch to a Mastery stim.

Mastery augments? What a time to be alive. Last I recall crit pools were still low enough that Crit augs and often even Crit Relics were the best option once you hit a comfortable Alacrity for channel time and energy regen. Or at least were close enough that going Mastery Crit vs Mastery Power on your relics was a negligible difference. I think I was running about 3800 alac in pve for my heals and coming in around 3400 crit like that in full 330/augs.

CLAM DOWN
Feb 13, 2007




help my speeder is broken

kirbysuperstar
Nov 11, 2012

Let the fools who stand before us be destroyed by the power you and I possess.
Please tell me that's a reproducible bug because you did something like "turned anti-aliasing to something other than Low"

Dick Trauma
Nov 30, 2007

God damn it, you've got to be kind.

CLAM DOWN posted:

help my speeder is broken



CLAM DOWN
Feb 13, 2007




kirbysuperstar posted:

Please tell me that's a reproducible bug because you did something like "turned anti-aliasing to something other than Low"

I've made it happen a few times! If I'm in fullscreen mode, summon the mount, but tab out of the game right away forcing it to minimize before the casting of the mount is done, then tab back in, it seems to reload some textures or something to some degree? It's quite funny. Apparently it's only visible to me like that, another player couldn't see the weird invisible speeder.

cams
Mar 28, 2003


first thing i wanted to do coming back to the game was finish up my legendary player status. had 5 already done with a trooper already at the last planet. finished that, then did my light side inquisitor run which was fun as heck. i saved agent for last because so many people said it was the best. just starting chapter 2, my thoughts below.

|i'm bored this is boring. i'm having a hard time finding my character's perspective and i am hoping the actual story picks up a bit.

additionally, a question. when i finished my trooper's story, i immediately got everything off the character then deleted it. what i realized after was that i hadn't done the last conversations with my companions after finishing chapter 3, so i don't get the +10 useless stat for each. i know this doesn't matter for the legendary status, but if i really wanted to make sure i had them for completionism, could i get them via a boosted character? or would i fully need to play through the (insanely boring) trooper main story again to max them out?

Medullah
Aug 14, 2003

FEAR MY SHARK ROCKET IT REALLY SUCKS AND BLOWS
Nope, boosting won't give you any achievements.

Most conversations end during Act 3 though so technically you could likely just get to it.

The nice thing is you can now play Trooper story as whatever Tech class you like. You can be a Republic Sniper if you want.

Arquinsiel
Jun 1, 2006

"There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady

cams posted:

first thing i wanted to do coming back to the game was finish up my legendary player status. had 5 already done with a trooper already at the last planet. finished that, then did my light side inquisitor run which was fun as heck. i saved agent for last because so many people said it was the best. just starting chapter 2, my thoughts below.

|i'm bored this is boring. i'm having a hard time finding my character's perspective and i am hoping the actual story picks up a bit.

additionally, a question. when i finished my trooper's story, i immediately got everything off the character then deleted it. what i realized after was that i hadn't done the last conversations with my companions after finishing chapter 3, so i don't get the +10 useless stat for each. i know this doesn't matter for the legendary status, but if i really wanted to make sure i had them for completionism, could i get them via a boosted character? or would i fully need to play through the (insanely boring) trooper main story again to max them out?
I felt similar to you about the Agent at that point, but then it gets worse..

The character stat boosts are one per type per account, so as long as you have one ranged DPS character unlocked you've got that stat done. If you really feel like ticking all the boxes the best thing to do is probably just going to be setting up a stealthing Trooper and skip most of the story that way.

Eimi
Nov 23, 2013

I will never log offshut up.


I think the reason people like agent is that it's the most reactive to your choices. It can go a whole lot of directions based on what you pick. When I played through it I largely had the same reaction. It was neat, but it didn't emotionally grab me and make me care about it compared to Sith Warrior.

cams
Mar 28, 2003


Arquinsiel posted:

I felt similar to you about the Agent at that point, but then it gets worse..

The character stat boosts are one per type per account, so as long as you have one ranged DPS character unlocked you've got that stat done. If you really feel like ticking all the boxes the best thing to do is probably just going to be setting up a stealthing Trooper and skip most of the story that way.
to be honest, if i can't just skip it by boosting, i'll just wait until i'm ready and do another story run. the stats i'm talking about are actually the +10 presence you get for maxing out each companion. it only matters for the part of my brain that cares about seeing those filled in on my legacy screen. the good thing is is that i did the first 90% of the story at least 5 years ago so i barely remember the details.

Eimi posted:

I think the reason people like agent is that it's the most reactive to your choices. It can go a whole lot of directions based on what you pick. When I played through it I largely had the same reaction. It was neat, but it didn't emotionally grab me and make me care about it compared to Sith Warrior.
not being able to shoot kaliyo immediately really broke my role playing immersion. really though, the core problem is that the only thing in the star wars universe that comes close to being as interesting as jedi are fighter pilots, and you can't have a story origin for that.

Sombrerotron
Aug 1, 2004

Release my children! My hat is truly great and mighty.

cams posted:

really though, the core problem is that the only thing in the star wars universe that comes close to being as interesting as jedi are fighter pilots, and you can't have a story origin for that.
Kind of funny to read this after I don't know how many people - on these forums, at least - complaining for years about Star Wars always being about those boring Jedi.

Medullah
Aug 14, 2003

FEAR MY SHARK ROCKET IT REALLY SUCKS AND BLOWS

cams posted:

to be honest, if i can't just skip it by boosting, i'll just wait until i'm ready and do another story run. the stats i'm talking about are actually the +10 presence you get for maxing out each companion. it only matters for the part of my brain that cares about seeing those filled in on my legacy screen. the good thing is is that i did the first 90% of the story at least 5 years ago so i barely remember the details.

not being able to shoot kaliyo immediately really broke my role playing immersion. really though, the core problem is that the only thing in the star wars universe that comes close to being as interesting as jedi are fighter pilots, and you can't have a story origin for that.

I'd worry about it even less than pre 7.0, Presence is now a capped stat so that +10 presence is literally useless.

Ironslave
Aug 8, 2006

Corpse runner
I really came to like Kaliyo when I realized that she's doing to you what you do to everyone else.

Not being able to abandon or kill companions in the 1-50 story is something many of the stories suffer from in one way or another. I suspect they'd do it differently today, but a lot of it is tied up in the original design having companions be specialized to a role and not wanting to leave you without one, as I understood it.

cams
Mar 28, 2003


Medullah posted:

I'd worry about it even less than pre 7.0, Presence is now a capped stat so that +10 presence is literally useless.
could you live with this?



cause i can't!

Medullah
Aug 14, 2003

FEAR MY SHARK ROCKET IT REALLY SUCKS AND BLOWS

cams posted:

could you live with this?



cause i can't!

Well no, of course not, mines been full since 2013 heh.

FrostyPox
Feb 8, 2012

Still mad I couldn't immediately execute Skadge at the conclusion of our first encounter

CLAM DOWN
Feb 13, 2007




Skadge is the loving worst

KittyEmpress
Dec 30, 2012

Jam Buddies

Every story has at least one character I'd love to be able to say 'get the hell off my ship' to earlier.

Doc, Theron, Kaliyo, Scorpio, Corso, Akaavi, Skadge, Tanno Vik.

I can't remember a single Inquisitor companion besides Khem. I think most of the Warrior ones are fine though I loathe Dark Jaesa for being too edgy. But she is actually optional.

KittyEmpress fucked around with this message at 00:10 on May 25, 2022

Ainsley McTree
Feb 19, 2004


Quinn is famously someone that gamers would like to murder. But I’m one of his few defenders, every darth Vader type needs a sniveling officer to choke now and then, and if you’re surprised by him trying to assassinate you then you obviously haven’t read the sith constitution

KittyEmpress
Dec 30, 2012

Jam Buddies

Oh wow I forgot Quinn existed, so my bad. Definitely should have been killable post betrayal.

Medullah
Aug 14, 2003

FEAR MY SHARK ROCKET IT REALLY SUCKS AND BLOWS
Good news then when you hit Iokath (5.0)

KittyEmpress
Dec 30, 2012

Jam Buddies

Oh yeah I know he's killable now. I just meant more that every companion had ones to be killed during the original stories. That you couldn't.



I still have yet to recruit skadge to any alliance.

FrostyPox
Feb 8, 2012

I liked Kaliyo, at least for the entire agent storyline. Don't remember her post-vanilla SWtOR but I remember she plays an important role in one of the Zakuul bits IIRC

dmboogie
Oct 4, 2013

kaliyo on zakuul is good because it lets the agent sheepishly tell theon 'that's... my wife' as shes doing insane crime poo poo

Promethium
Dec 31, 2009
Dinosaur Gum
Kaliyo was Keeper's challenge for you to make good use of a difficult and volatile asset, and if you can't find a way to do that then you're basically admitting failure.

Eimi
Nov 23, 2013

I will never log offshut up.


Brumark is one of those weird companions if you're playing LS. I entirely forget why you even recruit the psycho in the first place, but he's like begrudgingly work with and then leave. Though I don't regret picking to kill him when he shows up again.

FrostyPox
Feb 8, 2012

dmboogie posted:

kaliyo on zakuul is good because it lets the agent sheepishly tell theon 'that's... my wife' as shes doing insane crime poo poo

I should play again just to do Zakuul with an Agent. I did a BH on my first play through a thousand years ago and Inquisitor most recently (which was still like three years ago)

Mind over Matter
Jun 1, 2007
Four to a dollar.



dmboogie posted:

kaliyo on zakuul is good because it lets the agent sheepishly tell theon 'that's... my wife' as shes doing insane crime poo poo

I've never played a male Agent that far, but that sounds amazing.

Arquinsiel
Jun 1, 2006

"There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady

Ironslave posted:

I really came to like Kaliyo when I realized that she's doing to you what you do to everyone else.
You mean she's being mildly snarky and maybe going off-script around the edges but still essentially doing exactly what she's told?

cams posted:

could you live with this?



cause i can't!
Have you done all the Imperial classes? I have a vague memory of being confused by that having already unlocked some stuff for one faction when I had done the other faction's equivalent class.

cams
Mar 28, 2003


Arquinsiel posted:

You mean she's being mildly snarky and maybe going off-script around the edges but still essentially doing exactly what she's told?

Have you done all the Imperial classes? I have a vague memory of being confused by that having already unlocked some stuff for one faction when I had done the other faction's equivalent class.
i've done all but agent, what that image is showing is that i finished the trooper story but did not max out the companions for it.

Arquinsiel
Jun 1, 2006

"There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady
That's weird. I had mine unlock without completing stories.

Ironslave
Aug 8, 2006

Corpse runner

Arquinsiel posted:

You mean she's being mildly snarky and maybe going off-script around the edges but still essentially doing exactly what she's told?

Kaliyo is a habitual liar who regularly creates new identities and fabricates new stories about who she is and her history as is convenient for her goals. She uses the people around her, playing every angle and refusing to commit to any one until the chips are down. She has no fidelity either to the causes she joins or to the people she partners with, up until she finally sees the Agent is worth a drat.

The Agent does all these things. Maybe a specific playthrough doesn't do all of them (maybe your agent isn't sleeping with every character they come across like a space James Bond), and maybe a specific player feels that their loyalties are more solid, but most of them are stuff all players engage in--the cover identities, feigning investment in a faction, playing both sides up until you're forced to make a choice. Kaliyo does to them what they are doing to everyone else, and she's suddenly the worst person ever. She is a mirror that many players refuse to look into.


Honestly there's also a lot that can be said about several of the Imperial Agent's companions. It's a storyline that grasps the kind of story it's trying to tell--a spy story--and does a lot of thematic reinforcement of that via its elements, with identity and loyalty the two it explores the most.

Medullah
Aug 14, 2003

FEAR MY SHARK ROCKET IT REALLY SUCKS AND BLOWS

Arquinsiel posted:

That's weird. I had mine unlock without completing stories.

You get the BUFF if you only complete one mirror,but the converstations are tied to each origin story. There's an Imperial and Republic tab.

Arquinsiel
Jun 1, 2006

"There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady
I remember being really confused at the Agent characters being unlocked but without me ever having played as one. I'm guessing "expansion bugs" did it at some point even though I never unlocked Doctor Loken on my Smuggler until way after finishing the Agent storyline :shrug:

Ironslave posted:

Kaliyo is a habitual liar who regularly creates new identities and fabricates new stories about who she is and her history as is convenient for her goals. She uses the people around her, playing every angle and refusing to commit to any one until the chips are down. She has no fidelity either to the causes she joins or to the people she partners with, up until she finally sees the Agent is worth a drat.

The Agent does all these things. Maybe a specific playthrough doesn't do all of them (maybe your agent isn't sleeping with every character they come across like a space James Bond), and maybe a specific player feels that their loyalties are more solid, but most of them are stuff all players engage in--the cover identities, feigning investment in a faction, playing both sides up until you're forced to make a choice. Kaliyo does to them what they are doing to everyone else, and she's suddenly the worst person ever. She is a mirror that many players refuse to look into.


Honestly there's also a lot that can be said about several of the Imperial Agent's companions. It's a storyline that grasps the kind of story it's trying to tell--a spy story--and does a lot of thematic reinforcement of that via its elements, with identity and loyalty the two it explores the most.
I think your read is solid for what they were aiming for, but in the end the structure of the medium means you are never really playing both sides. You never really make a choice. You always work for the Empire and can't change that. I think the core problem for me is my loyalties were *not* solid, so to use your mirror metaphor I looked in as the Agent, didn't like what I saw, and was powerless to change that beyond quitting. It'd work better in a game that let things actually be different at the end rather than finding a reason to bring you back into the fold to go to Makeb, in the same way the SpecOps: The Line devs were saying "You can just put the controller down anytime" and considering that a valid ending to the game.

Ironslave
Aug 8, 2006

Corpse runner
I can only speak for the 1-50 story, not for Makeb or anything past that. I've not played any of the origins beyond Chapter 3, primarily because I've been told they all become the same story with a few different lines of dialogue and that doesn't interest me as much and also seems like it'd make a few of the more character-driven stories get weird. The way I've had is described is needing to consider the post 1-50 story as the TOR story while the 1-50 is the class story, but I can't yet say how accurate that is.

Medullah
Aug 14, 2003

FEAR MY SHARK ROCKET IT REALLY SUCKS AND BLOWS

Ironslave posted:

I can only speak for the 1-50 story, not for Makeb or anything past that. I've not played any of the origins beyond Chapter 3, primarily because I've been told they all become the same story with a few different lines of dialogue and that doesn't interest me as much and also seems like it'd make a few of the more character-driven stories get weird. The way I've had is described is needing to consider the post 1-50 story as the TOR story while the 1-50 is the class story, but I can't yet say how accurate that is.

Pretty close.

1.0 - Class stories, all separate
2.0 - Rise of the Hutt Cartel, two faction based main storylines.
3.0 - Shadow of Revan, planetary storylines are identical, the factions have some different cut scenes 4.0-5.0 - Knights of the Fallen Empire and Eternal Throne, identical storylines for all classes
6.0-7.0 - Onslaught and Legacy of the Sith, back to two storylines that are faction based

Sombrerotron
Aug 1, 2004

Release my children! My hat is truly great and mighty.

Arquinsiel posted:

I think your read is solid for what they were aiming for, but in the end the structure of the medium means you are never really playing both sides. You never really make a choice. You always work for the Empire and can't change that. I think the core problem for me is my loyalties were *not* solid, so to use your mirror metaphor I looked in as the Agent, didn't like what I saw, and was powerless to change that beyond quitting. It'd work better in a game that let things actually be different at the end rather than finding a reason to bring you back into the fold to go to Makeb, in the same way the SpecOps: The Line devs were saying "You can just put the controller down anytime" and considering that a valid ending to the game.
This strikes me as an issue with basically every class/origin story: nobody ever actually gets to go "hang on I'm not happy with this arrangement and I want out or tear it down", even though there may be plenty of reasons to do so. The Trooper barely gets to complain about being ordered to commit warcrimes and certainly doesn't get to radically change the way the Republic treats its soldiers. The Smuggler can never say "you know what, never mind, I'll take a pass on this one". You'd think a Dark Side Jedi would at least have an opportunity to defect to the Sith Empire, but that never happens either. Even the Sith Warrior that decides the Sith Empire and its traditions are a dead end and something has to be done about it is limited to some sort of extremely low-key civil disobedience approach to instigating reform. The least offensive of the bunch is arguably the Bounty Hunter, but that's more to do with the fact that it's a character essentially without morals, allegiance, or a storyline of any actual substance and anything else to do than to take whatever next hit job is offered.

I mean, I do understand your point to some extent; I will always maintain that Planescape: Torment very much failed to live up to its promise by forcing you to end your existence one way or another, rather than permit any bargain with TTO, which I think is a similar gripe to the one you have with the Agent's story. But Torment is a single-player game with a fixed ending, and as you say the structure of the MMO medium does not allow for the same freedoms. If the player cannot accept the restrictions on agency imposed on the Agent, I don't really see how the restrictions on any other class/origin would be any less objectionable.

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Johnny Five-Jaces
Jan 21, 2009


i hate that idiot failed jedi mon cala guy

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