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BabyFur Denny
Mar 18, 2003

Atlas Hugged posted:

There was a woman complaining on the new Traveling in Thailand Twitter community about being grilled at immigration and having to provide documentation proving her intent, so just play it safe for now.

I mean after reading this thread it sounds like immigration very much has a good reason to grill people on this.

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Atlas Hugged
Mar 12, 2007


Put your arms around me,
fiddly digits, itchy britches
I love you all

BabyFur Denny posted:

I mean after reading this thread it sounds like immigration very much has a good reason to grill people on this.

This is 100% what the comments on Twitter were as well.

"My home country has no issue letting people in!"
"There is no way in hell that that is true under any circumstance, you entitled, privileged rear end."

webmeister
Jan 31, 2007

The answer is, mate, because I want to do you slowly. There has to be a bit of sport in this for all of us. In the psychological battle stakes, we are stripped down and ready to go. I want to see those ashen-faced performances; I want more of them. I want to be encouraged. I want to see you squirm.
Yeah I think most people from rich westernised countries would be astonished at how difficult it can be for folks from less developed countries to get visas. Especially in the Anglosphere where there’s so much bullshit narrative about “immigrants stealing jobs” or whatever

A travel blogger friend of mine travels on an Indian passport, and getting visas for a lot of countries is incredibly difficult for her. Bank statements, sworn declarations, embassy visits, expensive fees etc

Electric Wrigglies
Feb 6, 2015

webmeister posted:

Yeah I think most people from rich westernised countries would be astonished at how difficult it can be for folks from less developed countries to get visas. Especially in the Anglosphere where there’s so much bullshit narrative about “immigrants stealing jobs” or whatever

A travel blogger friend of mine travels on an Indian passport, and getting visas for a lot of countries is incredibly difficult for her. Bank statements, sworn declarations, embassy visits, expensive fees etc

Totally agree and this can manifest in the sad way where people will take a liking to some local or other and of course they say something along the lines of "you should come visit Australia, of course you can come in because I will vouch for you".

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat
My wife's sister has been living with us in the States for a couple of years and her boyfriend has been working his rear end off to get a visa to come visit from Thailand, and has failed multiple times. I feel really bad for him, he seemed put together the one time I met him. It's not like he's a dirtbag like my wife's brother, who seems to have had no problems with getting a visa to fly over next week!

Yossarian-22
Oct 26, 2014

Hi all, not sure if any of you have experience relocating to SE Asia (specifically Thailand) with pets. My girlfriend and I are going to do so in one month via Qatar Airways. I'm having trouble filling out the import permit so I attached pictures of my permit with questions relating to the particular parts that concern me (the rest I've figured out for myself). Thank you!



FortMan
Jan 10, 2012

Viva Romanesco!

There are actually 2 questions in there. The first two choices are (live) animal and animal carcass. The three choices after those are bringing it () into () out of, and () through.

Edit: a translation on that part

FortMan fucked around with this message at 17:34 on May 21, 2022

Yossarian-22
Oct 26, 2014

FortMan posted:

There are actually 2 questions in there. The first two choices are (live) animal and animal carcass. The three choices after those are bringing it () into () out of, and () through.

Edit: a translation on that part


Thanks!

I guess I'm also wondering if I have to acknowledge that I'm going through Doha airport from the U.S. anywhere on the permit? Hence the "pass Thailand through" part?

FortMan
Jan 10, 2012

Viva Romanesco!

The Thai text is better translated to "pass Thailand to (another country)", so I think you only need to fill the "pass Thailand through" if your pet is just passing through Thailand, and the final destination is somewhere else.

goodness
Jan 3, 2012

When the light turns green, you go. When the light turns red, you stop. But what do you do when the light turns blue with orange and lavender spots?
New to the thread, looking in regards to medical tourism for dental. Family member needs a tooth implant and I heard it can be cheaper to go overseas from the US to get one. For reference, current quote is north of $3000 USD here in the US.

Boola
Dec 7, 2005
I have little personal experience or knowledge on that front, but I do know there's many places in Mexico that specialize in medical tourism with dentists that studied in America and have top credentials, equipment, reviews. If your family member isnt looking to travel 24 hours and spend ~1000+ on flights, that's probably an overall cheaper and easier option.

If they just want to vacation in Thailand or SE Asia with the procedure as an extra incentive for coming, sure. Maybe others here have some input for you.

the heat goes wrong
Dec 31, 2005
I´m watching you...

goodness posted:

New to the thread, looking in regards to medical tourism for dental. Family member needs a tooth implant and I heard it can be cheaper to go overseas from the US to get one. For reference, current quote is north of $3000 USD here in the US.

Don’t you have to visit the dentist at least twice to attach the implantation? First time to attach the root, the some months later, the crown?
Will it still be worth it if you have to fly out twice?

goodness
Jan 3, 2012

When the light turns green, you go. When the light turns red, you stop. But what do you do when the light turns blue with orange and lavender spots?

the heat goes wrong posted:

Don’t you have to visit the dentist at least twice to attach the implantation? First time to attach the root, the some months later, the crown?
Will it still be worth it if you have to fly out twice?

Yes but they already have the root done.

Boola posted:

I have little personal experience or knowledge on that front, but I do know there's many places in Mexico that specialize in medical tourism with dentists that studied in America and have top credentials, equipment, reviews. If your family member isnt looking to travel 24 hours and spend ~1000+ on flights, that's probably an overall cheaper and easier option.

If they just want to vacation in Thailand or SE Asia with the procedure as an extra incentive for coming, sure. Maybe others here have some input for you.

That is a good point thanks, Mexico would be much more convenient.

Yossarian-22
Oct 26, 2014

The gf and I made it to Chiang Mai, Thailand. I'm hoping to get an international teaching job and she already has the NGO job. Our dog made it too! :) She got bit by red ants today though. :(

What cool stuff should we do here other than the obvious Flight of the Gibbon/Doi Suthep/three main Buddhist temples?

Atlas Hugged
Mar 12, 2007


Put your arms around me,
fiddly digits, itchy britches
I love you all

Yossarian-22 posted:

The gf and I made it to Chiang Mai, Thailand. I'm hoping to get an international teaching job and she already has the NGO job. Our dog made it too! :) She got bit by red ants today though. :(

What cool stuff should we do here other than the obvious Flight of the Gibbon/Doi Suthep/three main Buddhist temples?

It's Chiang Mai, so there's not all that much. Check out Butter is Better if you're homesick for American grub.

Boola
Dec 7, 2005
The best thing about Chiang Mai is there are a lot cool things within a 1-2 hour drive and even more within 3-4. I like the city but it is pretty sleepy compared to other places in Thailand.

Another restaurant recommendation is Dinky's BBQ. The owner is from Austin Texas and does the only BBQ I've found outside of America that does Texas style any justice. I

Ang Kaew Reservoir in town is a nice spot. Good for walking or running or just sitting and chilling in both the morning and evening. Go to the Chiang Mai University night market or walk along Sutthep road to the south for a lot of cheap eating options. The night market at the north gate of the old city is my favorite overall.

The north gate jazz club is a chill time for live jazz. Archers is a bar that use to have some crazy specials different nights of the week (not sure currently) like large strong cocktails for 100 baht on Fridays. Renegade is a decent bar if you're missing craft beer. Pricey stuff compared to your standard Leo but that's what Thai import taxes gets you.

Huay Tung Tao Reservoir is just outside of the city and worth a visit. There's restaurants set up on the lake there and it's a good place to go for a run in the morning or have a meal with a view of the lake

Don't just stop at the Doi Sutthep temple - keep driving further past it and explore for some great viewpoints and cool weather. The Hmong Village up there in Doi Pui is a good place for walking around and has good coffee shops. Khao Soi Loong Surin there is the best Khao Soi I've had. Made several trips up there just to eat there. I like doing the monks trail up Sutthep. There's also camping up in Doi Pui where you can rent a tent that's already set up for cheap.

Mon Jam is maybe 60-90 minutes away and is incredibly beautiful. Mountain views and flowers everywhere. There's a bunch of little Homestay and glamping places up there. Go stay overnight sometime and eat moo kata.

The road loop around the base of Doi Sutthep is an easy and fun day trip drive. Some good coffee shops along the way, curvy roads, have lunch at one of the little restaurants on the side of the road by the river near Mae Sa waterfall

Chiang Dao to the north is a cool little town. Drive into the national park to see views of the mountain - it's beautiful. Both Nest 1 and Nest 2 are cool hotels in the town there. There's also places to stay in the national park with views of the mountain. If you're really adventurous, you can hike up Chiang Dao.

Doi Inthanon is worth a trip. Some impressive waterfalls there. The "peak" isn't too much to write home about but the pagodas up there are pretty at least and it's cool to visit the highest point in Thailand.

Pai, Mae Hong Son, and the entire Mae Hong Son loop are awesome. That's more of a several day trip though.

Mae Kampong is a quaint mountain town and easy drive. Can go there as a day trip or stay the night. Lots of good views there and cafes.

Phayao lake is a beautiful place that I never see people recommend for some reason.

Lampang has a good night market and is worth a drive to sometime.

Wat Chaloem Phra Kiat Phrachomklao Rachanusorn (that's a mouthful) is a drive to the north of Lampang but really cool. It's hundreds of steps up to the top of a mountain with viewpoints and a small temple on top of the mountain

Chiang Rai I think is the most boring city in Thailand that a lot of people I've talked to love for some reason. Go see the white, blue, black temples sometime though for the hell of it. Areas outside of the city are pretty enough at least. There's a famous tea farm just outside of the city that's kind of cool to visit.

That list should keep you busy for awhile if you have weekends off and feel like getting out of the city.

Gucci Loafers
May 20, 2006

Ask yourself, do you really want to talk to pair of really nice gaudy shoes?


Has anyone here re-located or temporarily re-located to Thailand? If so, how was it overall? I'm kind of at the point of my life where I want a big change and would like to see the rest of the world before I'm too old but would eventually end back up in the United States.

And there are... way too many Visa types. What would be the best one for 6 months or a year? The Special Tourist Visa? I'd be either going back to school remotely or maybe a few remote contract jobs. And I don't like the idea of having the visit the embassy every month to renew my Visa.

Gucci Loafers fucked around with this message at 23:33 on Jun 26, 2022

Finch!
Sep 11, 2001

Spatial Awareness?

[ ] Whaleshark

404 Not Found

Crosby B. Alfred posted:

Has anyone here re-located or temporarily re-located to Thailand? If so, how was it overall? I'm kind of at the point of my life where I want a big change and would like to see the rest of the world before I'm too old but would eventually end back up in the United States.

And there are... way too many Visa types. What would be the best one for 6 months or a year? The Special Tourist Visa? I'd be either going back to school remotely or maybe a few remote contract jobs. And I don't like the idea of having the visit the embassy every month to renew my Visa.

I spent increasingly longer periods of time there from 2008 to 2012, with each trip centred around a few weeks or months diving and relaxing on Koh Tao. I went back in 2012 and stayed, with brief trips home, for a couple of years.

I was lucky enough to get an ED visa to study scuba diving. There were other options available which I discovered when I was there - investment visas, Thai Elite, work permits, and so on. My visa was a 12 month + 12 month multiple entry visa - I had to leave Thailand every 90 days, but that usually coincided with a week at home anyway. If it didn't, I just went to Penang or KL or Hong Kong or Taiwan or whatever.

There were loads of temporary or permanent expats over there. The lifestyle was great - diving, gym, working remotely, exploring Thailand, etc. I imagine that the pandemic has had a negative impact upon all of those things. I know that my favourite people and places are no longer there, which is a shame, but that doesn't mean that there isn't (or won't be) a comparable lifestyle.

Koh Tao was the perfect place for me at the right time of my life. I don't know if I would have enjoyed living anywhere else in the world as much as I did. I loved the island life, enjoyed exploring Thailand and other nearby countries, made some friends for life, etc., etc., etc.

Of course the disclaimer is that this was 10 years ago and things have changed a lot since then.

But what worked for me might not work for you - it's worth spending a bit of time trying to find the right place for you. Go exploring for a few months first, then decide where to settle for a bit longer.

Gucci Loafers
May 20, 2006

Ask yourself, do you really want to talk to pair of really nice gaudy shoes?


I loved Bangkok. The city is so cool, housing affordable and furnished or partially furnished housing is super convenient.

Finch!
Sep 11, 2001

Spatial Awareness?

[ ] Whaleshark

404 Not Found

Crosby B. Alfred posted:

I loved Bangkok. The city is so cool, housing affordable and furnished or partially furnished housing is super convenient.

I like Bangkok a lot now, too. I didn't at first and it took a few visits before I figured the place out. I used to avoid it but now I go out of my way to spend time there.

Unfortunately, my wife has been to Thailand twice (!) and has no interest in ever going back. It's nowhere in the realms of divorce material, but it does kind of suck to know that I won't get to share places like Koh Tao, Mae Hong Son, Khao Sok, etc., with her.

Atlas Hugged
Mar 12, 2007


Put your arms around me,
fiddly digits, itchy britches
I love you all
Oh man I remember being on Koh Tao in 2011(?) and going into a random internet cafe and finding that a goon had left themselves logged in. I did the right thing and just logged out rather than posting the goat man, but 25 year old me was strongly tempted.

In any case I've been living in Thailand full-time since 2014. I can't believe how long it's been. I've been in the Bangkok area the whole time and am quite settled. I've been on both non-Bs and non-Os. I'm currently finishing my fifth year at my school and just signed a new two year contract, so yeah I'm enjoying it.

There's a goon here on the Thai elite visa and he likes it well enough, but you only get your money's worth if you're staying for multiple years.

For six months I'd just do the old standard of a 60 day multiple entry. You can extend it to 90 days while you're here and you just leave and come back in for an additional 60 days which can be extended again.

goodness
Jan 3, 2012

When the light turns green, you go. When the light turns red, you stop. But what do you do when the light turns blue with orange and lavender spots?
Has anyone brought cats over for a long term stay? I imagine its a huge pain in the rear end and only worth it if staying multiple years.

Atlas Hugged
Mar 12, 2007


Put your arms around me,
fiddly digits, itchy britches
I love you all

goodness posted:

Has anyone brought cats over for a long term stay? I imagine its a huge pain in the rear end and only worth it if staying multiple years.

My coworker brought her cat in from Malaysia and yes it was a huge pain in the rear end. She would recommend you use a pet service to handle all the paperwork.

Yossarian-22
Oct 26, 2014

goodness posted:

Has anyone brought cats over for a long term stay? I imagine its a huge pain in the rear end and only worth it if staying multiple years.

Can't speak for cats, but the gf and I took our dog over after arduous months of getting her the required vaccinations, an import permit filled out/sent/approved, and a health certificate signed by a USDA-approved vet. The last part literally had to be within 10 days of travel (literally has to be done last minute) and I only realized at the last minute that I needed to pay up the rear end for a shipping label for the certificate to get approved by the USDA. The shots had to be done >21 days before travel, so make sure to get those done early.

The dog also needed an appropriate travel crate so she could be in the cargo hold. I bought a hamster-like drinking nozzle for her and trained her to drink out of it for the flight. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00S02SRI2?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details I also bought an attachable food bowl so that she could be fed on the layover with the kibbles that I had put in a plastic bag and taped to the top of her crate. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0012GS73S?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

Ignore as much of this as needed if it doesn't apply for your cat. I'm guessing it's next to impossible to crate train a cat and we're really lucky that our dog loves her crate. She uses her travel crate every day now and we bought hers several months ahead of schedule to acclimate her. We didn't use any kind of pet service but we also had a lot of time to do proper research and planning. A service will cost extra money in addition to import fees etc. but it might be worth it in your case.

Yossarian-22
Oct 26, 2014

Boola posted:

Don't just stop at the Doi Sutthep temple - keep driving

Any tours for this or alternatives? I don't have a motorbike yet and I'm too much of a chickenshit to get one as of yet. Trying to survive by walking and Grab/InDriver

Crosby B. Alfred posted:

Has anyone here re-located or temporarily re-located to Thailand? If so, how was it overall? I'm kind of at the point of my life where I want a big change and would like to see the rest of the world before I'm too old but would eventually end back up in the United States.

I've been in Chiang Mai for a week and I loving love it. Everything is cheap and you can rent out a multiple bedroom house for 19k baht ($530 or so USD equivalent). You can go even cheaper than that really, but the gf and I needed a place that allowed pets. People are still wearing masks and as a COVID paranoiac it makes me feel great. You can still get away with being a maskless farang though because Thailand wants your money. Weed was just decriminalized so that's something else to consider (do NOT transport weed to/from Thailand though). Bangkok is by all accounts more exciting but I like the fact that Chiang Mai is actually a (relatively) walkable city with clean air

Atlas Hugged
Mar 12, 2007


Put your arms around me,
fiddly digits, itchy britches
I love you all
The clean air is very dependent on the season FYI. Chiang Mai is ranked as one of the most polluted cities in the world during burning season (December to April).

quote:

Average PM2.5 pollution levels in Chiang Mai during agricultural burning can climb as high as 400 μg/m3.

Yossarian-22
Oct 26, 2014

Yeah that's the exception sadly. It's one of the cleaner major cities in SE Asia otherwise. I'm leaning towards getting a remote/more flexible job here so that I can vacate during the burning season

FortMan
Jan 10, 2012

Viva Romanesco!

The actual bad time is Jan-April, November should still be fine. Nice and (relatively) cool

socketwrencher
Apr 10, 2012

Be still and know.
In places like Phuket, are there storage lockers or services where you can securely leave your wallet, sunglasses etc while you go for a swim?

Gucci Loafers
May 20, 2006

Ask yourself, do you really want to talk to pair of really nice gaudy shoes?


Yossarian-22 posted:

Any tours for this or alternatives? I don't have a motorbike yet and I'm too much of a chickenshit to get one as of yet. Trying to survive by walking and Grab/InDriver

I've been in Chiang Mai for a week and I loving love it. Everything is cheap and you can rent out a multiple bedroom house for 19k baht ($530 or so USD equivalent). You can go even cheaper than that really, but the gf and I needed a place that allowed pets. People are still wearing masks and as a COVID paranoiac it makes me feel great. You can still get away with being a maskless farang though because Thailand wants your money. Weed was just decriminalized so that's something else to consider (do NOT transport weed to/from Thailand though). Bangkok is by all accounts more exciting but I like the fact that Chiang Mai is actually a (relatively) walkable city with clean air

I thought it was only for medical use?

My last two questions,

1. What's the best way to find an apartment? How good are those pre-furnished apartments?

2. Which VISA should I pick if I want to stay in the Country for at least six months with the possibility of an extension and potentially working afterwards? Ideally, I am going skip out on a North American winter and go back to school remotely from Bangkok while possibly picking up a side gig for the hell of it. Ideally, I'd pick that Thai Elite Visa but I'm not staying for five years and it's extremely expensive.

Astoundingly Ugly Baby
Mar 22, 2006

"...crying bitch cave bitch boy."
- Anonymous Facebook user
I was thinking about heading to Thailand for 2 weeks sometime in November, possibly. Is the quarantine period still 14 days? Would be kind of pointless to go somewhere and be cooped up the whole time.

Gucci Loafers
May 20, 2006

Ask yourself, do you really want to talk to pair of really nice gaudy shoes?


Quarantine is over but people are still wearing masks and not everything is completely back to normal. But closer.

Atlas Hugged
Mar 12, 2007


Put your arms around me,
fiddly digits, itchy britches
I love you all
Yeah it's full on "endemic" here. Everyone at my school who had avoided covid since 2020 all seemed to get it this last week, but most of us were only mildly ill because we have 3-4 vaccines each.

You'll have to do whatever ATK/PCR requirement your airline has and then you'll need proof of vaccination upon entering Thailand. After that, you're home free.

Yossarian-22
Oct 26, 2014

What should I do if I want a scooter (in Chiang Mai) but have never driven one in my life/don't have a license? I'm thinking of taking lessons or at least just getting help riding one from one of my co-workers. I figure I'll buy one and just drive around my non-busy neighborhood at first.

Any recommendations for scooters for a nooblet like me who would rather be ultra safe than go top speed?

Boola
Dec 7, 2005
You won't be driving legally without a motorcycle license. So just know if you ever do get stopped by the police you'll get fined. When I was in CM for a few months last year, I never got stopped by the police once but I know during normal times in the past they'd have checkpoints set up and flag every white person they saw regardless of if you were wearing a helmet or not to check if you had the proper licenses (you also either need a thai license or international license to be legal).

Scooter rental places don't care - they'll rent to anyone with the money generally. Your insurance will care. If you get in an accident driving without the proper license, no insurance is going to cover your expenses.

Always wear a helmet. Don't be dumb.

Lessons would be advised. I took a 3 day motorcycle class in America to get fully legal years after I had been driving scooters in countries and I felt it improved my awareness and abilities. I started like you did initially though - drove in quiet areas and at 6am when I was learning before I got confident enough to drive in traffic. Starting with lessons would be the smarter route to go.

Any of the 110cc motorbike models will be fine for you starting out and if you don't plan to do much driving in the mountains. They're all pretty much the same. The most important thing when checking out a bike is that the tires still have good tread on them and that the brakes are responsive / have good stopping power.

Centusin
Aug 5, 2009
I don't know anything about riding in Thailand because I've never ridden there but my number 1 scooter tip is that trucks are your enemy and if there is a truck, you should aim to not be near it

Boola
Dec 7, 2005
Yeah. Everything is your enemy while on two wheels. Trucks, cars, dogs, other motorbikes, big potholes, loose rocks or sand on curves. But especially trucks. They can make you go splat.

the heat goes wrong
Dec 31, 2005
I´m watching you...

Yossarian-22 posted:

What should I do if I want a scooter (in Chiang Mai) but have never driven one in my life/don't have a license? I'm thinking of taking lessons or at least just getting help riding one from one of my co-workers. I figure I'll buy one and just drive around my non-busy neighborhood at first.

Any recommendations for scooters for a nooblet like me who would rather be ultra safe than go top speed?

Do you already have a driving licence? Car, not a motorcycle one. There is a big difference between having some experience with driving around in traffic and zero.

In Chiang Mai, the best and quickest way to learn would be the two day course Honda Safety Driving Center offers. Costs 2000 baht and you spend two days, 6 hours per day riding and practicing on your bike in their closed training field.
By the end of it, you will feel completely confident riding your scooter/motorcycle.
Teachers and training contents are good, I even went back there and took several other courses.
I did it the course this February and in the next few months rode around 5-6k in the mountains there. Now I own a motorcycle and ride daily 🙂

Honda​driving​school doesn't cover riding in traffic or local driving laws. They do offer the driving licence course, but you have to ask for it. I think it is 2 or 3 days. The actual driving licence test is ridiculously easy(written part my take some tries though)



Standard fine for driving without a licence is 500 baht for farangs, 200 baht for locals. Sometimes there are police checkpoints on the road when driving.

If you have a travel medical insurance, they probably won't cover you when you get into a accident and don't have a legal way to drive (which is either Thai driving licence or driving licence for motorcycles/scooters from your home AND an international drivers permit).
Some bike rental places have their own insurance, so when you get into a accident on their bike, some costs are covered.


If you want an actual driving school, then
Changphuak Driving School was really-really good. Can totally reccommend them.
Changphuak Driving School Chiang Mai - Driving Training Center White Elephant Gate
https://maps.app.goo.gl/ttYjeYHpt94CjQrw5

webmeister
Jan 31, 2007

The answer is, mate, because I want to do you slowly. There has to be a bit of sport in this for all of us. In the psychological battle stakes, we are stripped down and ready to go. I want to see those ashen-faced performances; I want more of them. I want to be encouraged. I want to see you squirm.

the heat goes wrong posted:

If you have a travel medical insurance, they probably won't cover you when you get into a accident and don't have a legal way to drive (which is either Thai driving licence or driving licence for motorcycles/scooters from your home AND an international drivers permit).

Just to be 100% clear on this point: I've rented dozens of cars across the world, including in some pretty unusual places (I literally just rented a car in rural Brazil today). And any travel insurance I've ever had explicitly states that they won't cover you driving/riding anything that you aren't licensed to do back home. In their eyes, riding a bike/scooter without a relevant license from home is basically no different to renting a car without a driving license at all. You can't do it at home, so it kinda follows that you can't do it elsewhere either.

So if you crash/get injured or whatever, your travel insurance will deny all your claims. If that's an acceptable risk to you - go nuts!

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Hecuba
Jul 20, 2005

What we do is invent our images. And we build them.
So apparently I'm going to Indonesia in a couple of weeks?

My husband and I got a simultaneous free chunk of time in August, procrastinated on figuring out where to go, and remembered we have a friend in Jakarta. Touched base with him and he promised to set some stuff up for us, so we booked the tickets. Turns out said friend has a buddy who's a travel guide and he presented us with an itinerary that seems... very much not our style. Marriot reservations in Depensar, all guided/packaged tours, the whole Western tourist playground thing.

I figured since we'd be with a local we'd find some cool low-key non-touristy poo poo, but I've been doing some research and am realizing with dawning horror that might not be an option.

Itinerary is roughly 3 days in Yogyakarta, a day at Sukuh, Bali for 3 days, then Jakarta for 3 days. It's too late to back out (and this is 100% on us for blindly handing the itinerary to our buddy), but we'd like to make the best of it. Nothing's set in stone yet except our tickets to Jogja but we've got to make final arrangements pretty soon. Anyone have recommendations or essential tips?

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