(Thread IKs:
dead gay comedy forums)
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Southpaugh posted:propagandas propaganda and we know the western working and middle classes benefit from their position within the global hierarchy. Making them hesitant to turn against it, despite their own labour and value being parasitised. (I might be a disenfranchised piece of poo poo but atleast I can watch netflix on my enormous TV that didn't even cost a weeks wages.) "capitalism / democracy may not be perfect but look what it's doing for us here, compared to other countries that don't do capitalism / democracy as good as us" I guess we'll get to find out how that mindset reacts when it encounters the dollar losing 90% of its value
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Jul 15, 2022 03:08
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Danann posted:https://twitter.com/bidetmarxman/status/1547237104593145856 growing up i always wondered why so little money in America could buy you so much cheap poo poo from foreign countries
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Jul 15, 2022 04:39
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Racketeers typically don't give up on the operation without causing some damage first
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Jul 15, 2022 04:47
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MSDOS KAPITAL posted:lmao marx and lenin were petite bourgeois intelligentsia, engels grand bourgeois intelligentsia. generational wealth and a solid liberal education did not miss these guys. lenin posted:This does not mean, of course, that the workers have no part in creating such an ideology. They take part, however, not as workers, but as socialist theoreticians, as Proudhons and Weitlings; in other words, they take part only when they are able, and to the extent that they are able, more or less, to acquire the knowledge of their age and develop that knowledge. But in order that working men may succeed in this more often, every effort must be made to raise the level of the consciousness of the workers in general; it is necessary that the workers do not confine themselves to the artificially restricted limits of “literature for workers” but that they learn to an increasing degree to master general literature. It would be even truer to say “are not confined”, instead of “do not confine themselves”, because the workers themselves wish to read and do read all that is written for the intelligentsia, and only a few (bad) intellectuals believe that it is enough “for workers” to be told a few things about factory conditions and to have repeated to them over and over again what has long been known you're not wrong about your disjunct, but don't be so dismissive about the other half. southpaugh's not wrong either. a poo poo education system is capable of handing out degrees to imbeciles who know and understand little about the world and actively refuse to learn more. in the long run though these are not the kind of people capable of figuring things out. there's a contradiction because maximizing production requires people capable of figuring things out
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Jul 15, 2022 07:35
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The Voice of Labor posted:marx and lenin were petite bourgeois intelligentsia, engels grand bourgeois intelligentsia. generational wealth and a solid liberal education did not miss these guys. this makes sense. if I were a high bourgeois class intellectual who dug too far and deep and turned class traitor, I would work to turn and organize petite bourgeois class traitors to push their buttons on behalf of the working class, to retard and disrupt the inner workings of Capital as much as possible and create space and breathing room for the workers; lower its defenses, incapacitate its offenses, and destabilize it to the greatest possible extent, but ultimately constrain myself to a supporting role for the only class that can carry the fight.
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Jul 15, 2022 07:58
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The Voice of Labor posted:you're not wrong about your disjunct, but don't be so dismissive about the other half. southpaugh's not wrong either. a poo poo education system is capable of handing out degrees to imbeciles who know and understand little about the world and actively refuse to learn more. in the long run though these are not the kind of people capable of figuring things out. there's a contradiction because maximizing production requires people capable of figuring things out I guess I just disagree that the education capital needs people to have, in order to keep this thing going, necessarily gives people some grounding in marxism etc. and, even if it does, I would expect capital to push not to give them those tools anyway, and then hope for the best. which is what seems to be happening. capitalists understand this poo poo, too, and in no universe are they going to suffer purposefully raising a generation of revolutionaries because it might also increase profits a bit in the short term in Lenin's time and so on it was probably a different story because the capitalists of the day didn't consciously approach this stuff from a materialist, class-based perspective. they pretty much do, now. or maybe the college grads I know are just unusually bad 
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Jul 15, 2022 10:57
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Zodium posted:this makes sense. if I were a high bourgeois class intellectual who dug too far and deep and turned class traitor, I would work to turn and organize petite bourgeois class traitors to push their buttons on behalf of the working class, to retard and disrupt the inner workings of Capital as much as possible and create space and breathing room for the workers; lower its defenses, incapacitate its offenses, and destabilize it to the greatest possible extent, but ultimately constrain myself to a supporting role for the only class that can carry the fight. most traitors to the capitalist class historically seem to be drawn from the former aristocracy i.e. people who were grandfathered in to the ruling class but were being steadily pushed out by the real bourgeoisie. the US is in a uniquely bad position in this regard since we never had an aristocracy
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Jul 15, 2022 11:03
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MSDOS KAPITAL posted:who's doing that, though. seriously who are the class traitors and how much success are they enjoying at the moment biosphere collapse and its attendant effects, limits to further expansion of the capitalist empire, the growth of China, and the declining rate of profit drive the ongoing collapse of Capital by increasing constraints on its maximization function, forcing it to cannibalize itself and shrink. this would exert pressure on the overall system and in turn on both the grand and petite bourgeoisie, effectively causing the emergence of a situation which would be self-similar but not identical to what you describe, in turn causing some of them to spin off and decay into class traitors. who they are and how much success any such people may currently be enjoying would be indistinguishable from the organic effects of the aforementioned dynamics, which would probably be good for their continued survival.
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Jul 15, 2022 11:47
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MSDOS KAPITAL posted:in no universe are they going to suffer purposefully raising a generation of revolutionaries because it might also increase profits a bit in the short term the bourgeoisie are just as trapped in the cycle of enclosure, exploitation, and accumulation as we are. the higher your short-term profits are, the more money you can get from lenders (also in full pursuit of short-term profits) and the better the terms. that money is used to accumulate more productive property, creating more profits. that is the raison d'etre of the bourgeoisie. as a class they 100% will accept any future consequences in exchange for short-term profits. short-term profits are the primary driver of their actions. in their minds, they're not the ones who have to deal with the subsequent unrest - that's the cops' problem, and they better deal with it if they wanna keep riding the gravy train. every consequence of their pursuit of maximum short-term profits is a market externality to be resolved or just forestalled by one or several of their subordinate organizations. and if their organizations can't handle it, they'll spin up a new one or reorganize. as a class, they do not plan ahead more than ten years at the most. usually closer to five in my experience.
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Jul 15, 2022 13:46
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MSDOS KAPITAL posted:most traitors to the capitalist class historically seem to be drawn from the former aristocracy i.e. people who were grandfathered in to the ruling class but were being steadily pushed out by the real bourgeoisie. the US is in a uniquely bad position in this regard since we never had an aristocracy    
BrutalistMcDonalds has issued a correction as of 18:51 on Jul 15, 2022 |
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Jul 15, 2022 18:44
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MSDOS KAPITAL posted:
the kind of education people are getting in the united states isn't adequate to keep things going. the well healed ivy league elites who staff the cia are now too dumb to effectively coup, bully and extort and the global south. that's the end of offshore colonial exploitation and the cheap goods and materials placating the residents of the metropole
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Jul 15, 2022 19:14
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https://twitter.com/mothfxg/status/1547639245883392002?cxt=HHwWhICqtbjsqPoqAAAA
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Jul 15, 2022 21:15
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AnimeIsTrash posted:https://twitter.com/mothfxg/status/1547639245883392002?cxt=HHwWhICqtbjsqPoqAAAA 
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Jul 15, 2022 22:41
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MSDOS KAPITAL posted:who's doing that, though. seriously who are the class traitors and how much success are they enjoying at the moment anarchist software developers starting communes? lol we don't really have any working class movements for capitalists to defect to anyway. Easier to switch sides between our bourgeois factions if you want some drama in your life. Get Canceled, go on a right-wing media tour, you know?
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Jul 16, 2022 06:07
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croup coughfield posted:as a class they 100% will accept any future consequences in exchange for short-term profits. I think my blind spot here is the same reason I can't wrap my head around how China owned the West with Dengism no matter how many times it's explained to me. I can only recognize that it happened
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Jul 16, 2022 06:17
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I can't tell if you're making a great point or if I've been owned or something else or both or what, but well played regardless, probably
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Jul 16, 2022 06:18
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MSDOS KAPITAL posted:I can't tell if you're making a great point or if I've been owned or something else or both or what, but well played regardless, probably yes
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Jul 16, 2022 17:59
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Danann posted:https://twitter.com/bidetmarxman/status/1547237104593145856  🔜 
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Jul 16, 2022 19:10
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nice to see that whoever did the art for that dust jacket has been to the oregon vortex
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Jul 16, 2022 20:18
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been readin the wages of destruction by adam tooze, which goes into incredible detail about nazi political economy from 1933-1945, from trade and monetary policy to profitability and manufacturing is there any similar book about the USSR after the NEP and before WW2?
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Jul 19, 2022 07:03
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Danann posted:https://twitter.com/bidetmarxman/status/1547237104593145856 Oh man this a great read This will 100% happen by 2030
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Jul 19, 2022 07:54
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its happening right now. thats what that thread is about.
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Jul 19, 2022 13:25
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it's very funny to me because euro was being considered by several countries that didn't like the dollar so much as a 2nd reserved currency, and that might have kept the western neoliberal hegemony working for a decade or more longer but then EU decided to kill itself over a stupid border dispute between two non-members, greatly accelerating the whole downfall lmao
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Jul 19, 2022 13:45
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mila kunis posted:been readin the wages of destruction by adam tooze, which goes into incredible detail about nazi political economy from 1933-1945, from trade and monetary policy to profitability and manufacturing Kotkin's Stalin biography covers this pretty well, and seems decently sourced to me although he's an anticommunist. I think there's finally going to be some more english work on this subject since the archives opened, but I'm not gonna buy a $200 print on demand academic book with no reviews lol. Hopefully a smart person will answer because I'm interested in this too.
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Jul 19, 2022 14:20
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croup coughfield posted:its happening right now. thats what that thread is about. I meant the dollar dropped as world reserve currency and end of petrodollar will happen by 2030 Then its mad max in america boys
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Jul 19, 2022 14:22
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mila kunis posted:been readin the wages of destruction by adam tooze, which goes into incredible detail about nazi political economy from 1933-1945, from trade and monetary policy to profitability and manufacturing it's not about the whole of the USSR, but the closest answer I can furnish is Kotkin's "Magnetic Mountain"
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Jul 19, 2022 14:24
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mila kunis posted:been readin the wages of destruction by adam tooze, which goes into incredible detail about nazi political economy from 1933-1945, from trade and monetary policy to profitability and manufacturing Alec Nove's Economic History of the USSR is pretty good for this, although it was published in the early '90s so could be out of date. There's a slight anti-Stalin tinge to the book so make of it what you will, but even though the book covers the entire history of the USSR more than half of it is dedicated to pre-WW2 economic data. It's out of print so it may be tough to find. You might also be interested in a collection of essays from RW Davies, JD Barber, SG Wheatcroft, etc. called The Economic Transformation of the Soviet Union, 1913-1945. This is still in print and very detailed but it might also be considered out of date because it was first published in the mid '90s. If there are more recent books on this topic whose authors have gotten fuller access to Soviet archives I'd be interested to know about them.
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Jul 19, 2022 15:09
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MLSM posted:Oh man this a great read Is it really? It just seems like a very convoluted way of saying that US dollar hegemony is dying.
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Jul 19, 2022 15:57
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As someone who has a very weak grasp on what "US dollar hegemony" actually means, I found it very helpful.
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Jul 19, 2022 16:51
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Cpt_Obvious posted:As someone who has a very weak grasp on what "US dollar hegemony" actually means, I found it very helpful. *spits* dem lover
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Jul 19, 2022 16:57
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tokin opposition posted:*spits* dem lover Indeed, we're all very disappointed in you, Captain Obvious...
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Jul 19, 2022 17:06
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You guys must be disappointed that my last avatar is gone.
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Jul 19, 2022 17:11
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evilpicard posted:Kotkin's Stalin biography covers this pretty well, and seems decently sourced to me although he's an anticommunist. I think there's finally going to be some more english work on this subject since the archives opened, but I'm not gonna buy a $200 print on demand academic book with no reviews lol. Hopefully a smart person will answer because I'm interested in this too. gradenko_2000 posted:it's not about the whole of the USSR, but the closest answer I can furnish is Kotkin's "Magnetic Mountain" MeatwadIsGod posted:Alec Nove's Economic History of the USSR is pretty good for this, although it was published in the early '90s so could be out of date. There's a slight anti-Stalin tinge to the book so make of it what you will, but even though the book covers the entire history of the USSR more than half of it is dedicated to pre-WW2 economic data. It's out of print so it may be tough to find. thx all
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Jul 19, 2022 19:12
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MLSM posted:I meant the dollar dropped as world reserve currency and end of petrodollar will happen by 2030 yes, that is happening right now thanks to our bullshit re: ukraine
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Jul 19, 2022 22:10
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I got distracted from "The ABC of Communism" for a long while but I'm back on it and it's still a banger
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Jul 21, 2022 09:16
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tl;dr
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Jul 21, 2022 16:43
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https://twitter.com/bucephalus424/status/1550947179602272264?s=20&t=n0kyMVhmqx30UDf6d9vnDg do western academics know the Communist Party of China exists. or that anything exists outside Europe and the US. edit: in less snarky news it looks like somebody decided to officially professionally translate the forbidden Losurdo https://twitter.com/plbmagazine/status/1551356808484179969?s=20&t=ib0x1McTANntEwPpTL-SAQ Atrocious Joe has issued a correction as of 01:42 on Jul 25, 2022 |
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Jul 25, 2022 01:32
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Atrocious Joe posted:https://twitter.com/bucephalus424/status/1550947179602272264?s=20&t=n0kyMVhmqx30UDf6d9vnDg no.
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Jul 25, 2022 01:42
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no one mentions China in that entire California communism thread afaict
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Jul 25, 2022 02:16
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Atrocious Joe posted:edit: in less snarky news it looks like somebody decided to officially professionally translate the forbidden Losurdo Cool. I wonder how much a difference it makes. The one off lulu is good but it's missing the concluding essay by luciano canfora
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Jul 25, 2022 02:49
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