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Need Scotland to become independent and then EU again for that personally. I am now supportive of Scottish independence, hi guys.
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Jul 30, 2022 19:08
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look we already agreed you can only get mad about this if it's a briefcase full of cash
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Jul 30, 2022 19:45
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SixFigureSandwich posted:Very generally speaking it's only becoming more difficult to get citizenship or a passport for another country, so definitely get them if you qualify for any and can afford it. Especially if you can get an EU one and you don't already have one, if not for yourself then for any kids, partner or other family members who might be able to benefit from it in the future. Yeah I should have got one before my daughter was born, it's too late for her to get grandfathered in (or great-grandmothered in) now unfortunately. Wasn't expecting Brexit at the time though
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Jul 30, 2022 19:50
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SixFigureSandwich posted:Very generally speaking it's only becoming more difficult to get citizenship or a passport for another country, so definitely get them if you qualify for any and can afford it. Especially if you can get an EU one and you don't already have one, if not for yourself then for any kids, partner or other family members who might be able to benefit from it in the future. UK citizenship is quite easy in the grand scheme of things. Some countries will flat out not naturalize you unless you have the relevant ancestry no matter how much money you have.
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Jul 30, 2022 20:02
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Z the IVth posted:UK citizenship is quite easy in the grand scheme of things. Some countries will flat out not naturalize you unless you have the relevant ancestry no matter how much money you have. In the case of my American wife, the route to citizenship via marriage to me still costs ~£12,000 over five years. So, y'know, still quite a grand scheme of things. Talking of which, just got back from the shittiest 'holiday' of my life in America, for various reasons starting with the airline losing our luggage (which still has not been found), various sorority-related shenanigans noone is going to care about, and then capping it off with us both getting COVID immediately before she was supposed to see her family for the first time in 4 years. Cue several days in DC where we were supposed to be sight-seeing, instead holed up in the B&B ordering food in, and 2020-lockdown-style family meetings where everyone meets in a park, masked, 6' or more apart. I've never been so glad to get back home.
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Jul 30, 2022 20:26
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Should've taken ivermectin you'd have been fine it works over there.
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Jul 30, 2022 20:27
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feedmegin posted:In the case of my American wife, the route to citizenship via marriage to me still costs ~£12,000 over five years. So, y'know, still quite a grand scheme of things. Well yes, I didn't say it was cheap. Most Asian countries won't naturalize you even if you were Jeff Bezos.
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Jul 30, 2022 20:34
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Yeah they have a requirement of good moral character.
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Jul 30, 2022 20:35
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sebzilla posted:Yeah I should have got one before my daughter was born, it's too late for her to get grandfathered in (or great-grandmothered in) now unfortunately. She might still be entitled to a passport. Irish Citizen Information posted:you were born outside of Ireland and your parent (who was also born outside of Ireland) was an Irish citizen or entitled to be an Irish citizen at the time of your birth, then you are entitled to become an Irish citizen. Might be worth making inquiries.
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Jul 30, 2022 20:41
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If having an Irish great-grandad does turn out to work then let me know, I might have a go myself. :P
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Jul 30, 2022 20:57
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feedmegin posted:If having an Irish great-grandad does turn out to work then let me know, I might have a go myself. :P Time travel is extremely dangerous.
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Jul 30, 2022 20:59
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The Question IRL posted:She might still be entitled to a passport. Does the eligible parent have to have claimed citizenship themselves before their kids can or can it skip the generation?
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Jul 30, 2022 21:09
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Looks like the former, unfortunately. for great-grandchildren their relevant parent has to be in the registry before they were born: (A = irish citizen who was born in ireland, but subsequent generations of their family weren't; D = their grandchild, born outside ireland)
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Jul 30, 2022 21:19
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kecske posted:Does the eligible parent have to have claimed citizenship themselves before their kids can or can it skip the generation? If the parent never claimed it then the grandparent can be used. It only goes back 2 generations so great grandparents can never be used.
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Jul 30, 2022 21:19
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fatninja187 posted:Echoing what others have said, i usually just lurk cause i don't feel i'd be contributing much to the conversation. Yeah for the bolded part it was the same for me. It was the press and I think David Cameron and a load of other people talking about how "dangerous" Corbyn was that made my ears prick up and I distinctly remember thinking "If all those cunts are saying he's bad, he's probably alright". I think I'd already realised what a load of poo poo HIGNFY was at that point. Anyway yeah, Complaints on a Plate is a very good lefty youtuber. I linked one of their vids here before about Labour antisemitism, in about 2018-19ish, but I think most people passed over it. You should check it out. E: Funnily enough before I was "properly" left wing I had sort of figured out the labour theory of value on my own. In that I'd got to thinking "But what ultimately drives the cost of anything" and getting to "Well it's about providing for the workers, but then the resources for that also come from other workers" but I never followed through to get to the broader implications of that. WhatEvil fucked around with this message at 22:09 on Jul 30, 2022 |
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Jul 30, 2022 21:48
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feedmegin posted:If having an Irish great-grandad does turn out to work then let me know, I might have a go myself. :P From the looks of it, probably not. But it might be worth while going through the rest of your lineage (mother, father and both sets of grand parents) in case any of them had an Irish passport or other form of Irish citizenship. You never know what might turn up. kecske posted:Does the eligible parent have to have claimed citizenship themselves before their kids can or can it skip the generation? From my reading of it, no. Since it says "you were born an Irish citizen" (which implies you have claimed citizenship) or "you were entitled to it." Which reading the later after the former, would read that the citizenship hasn't been claimed (but could be claimed.) Putting that to one side, if Seb is now an Irish citizen, his daughter would be surely able to draw her own line of citizenship to him, as opposed to any Irish grandparent/great grandparent as Seb had previously been using. As I said, worth making inquiries about.
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Jul 30, 2022 22:27
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The Question IRL posted:From the looks of it, probably not. My understanding from what Seb said is they would be using a grandmother to get citizenship. If that's the link, then Seb's daughter would be not eligible as Seb's grandmother is her great grandmother and so not close enough. You can only skip one generation. If I'm wrong and anyone ever gets it through a great grandparent I'd love to know. My great grandparents were Irish. Granny and mum both born in England. They're eligible but I'm not.
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Jul 30, 2022 22:34
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You could always just get a job in Ireland, and claim citizenship after 8 years or so full employment. Worked with a lot of EU people who became dual irish citizens for working here for years.
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Jul 30, 2022 22:38
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Sad Panda posted:My understanding from what Seb said is they would be using a grandmother to get citizenship. If that's the link, then Seb's daughter would be not eligible as Seb's grandmother is her great grandmother and so not close enough. You can only skip one generation. Could you not persuade your mum to apply and then get one via the child-of-a-citizen rule?
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Jul 30, 2022 22:39
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just all accept your british
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Jul 30, 2022 22:44
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Tesseraction posted:Could you not persuade your mum to apply and then get one via the child-of-a-citizen rule? Oh she's going to get it at some point but she (or my granny) needed citizenship when I was born. Getting it later doesn't allow someone currently alive (me) to now become eligible to apply.
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Jul 30, 2022 22:45
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happyhippy posted:You could always just get a job in Ireland, and claim citizenship after 8 years or so full employment. 5 years
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Jul 30, 2022 22:46
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Tesseraction posted:Could you not persuade your mum to apply and then get one via the child-of-a-citizen rule?
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Jul 30, 2022 22:46
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NotJustANumber99 posted:just all accept your british My British what? Anyway no, I'm Scottish.
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Jul 30, 2022 23:15
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New identities just dropped, bugfix for Edinburgh.
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Jul 30, 2022 23:22
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Guavanaut posted:New identities just dropped, bugfix for Edinburgh. Checks out, Edinburgh is Anglish
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Jul 30, 2022 23:31
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forkboy84 posted:My British what? still British pal. sort yourself out though and help me get back to being european
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Jul 30, 2022 23:35
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Sad Panda posted:My understanding from what Seb said is they would be using a grandmother to get citizenship. If that's the link, then Seb's daughter would be not eligible as Seb's grandmother is her great grandmother and so not close enough. You can only skip one generation. If Seb uses a grandparent then their daughter would be eligible if they were born after Seb got citizenship but not if they were already alive when citizenship was granted.
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Jul 30, 2022 23:48
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Guavanaut posted:New identities just dropped, bugfix for Edinburgh. Southside of Glasgow being Britons absolutely checks out.
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Jul 31, 2022 01:10
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FWIW the British citizenship requirements were a headache for me and my dad until he emailed the consulate (I think - some rep of HM’s Government) who sorted it out with an email.
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Jul 31, 2022 01:55
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Surprise T Rex posted:My political stance on literally everything is borne of nothing but compassion and empathy and a desire for nobody in the world to ever struggle to survive and I literally cannot square that approach with right-wing political philosophy at all, and it rubs me right up the wrong way when people say it's just a difference of opinion. I still have family and some friends across the political spectrum (although decreasingly so as I get leftier and older family members die off). The right wingers I know tend to be empathetic, generous, kind and supportive to people they know, but anyone they don’t know personally is assumed to be lazy and grasping at best and actively malevolent at worst. Most of all, what they have in common is a strong reluctance to seeing things as systemic problems and a belief that leftists and liberals (whom they see as interchangeable - scratch a liberal and get a Stalin) want to take from people like them and give to strangers who won’t appreciate it and aren’t part of the same community. They believe we want to do this to fulfil our sense of self importance, because they can’t understand why else anyone would voluntarily help strangers over family and friends. I’ve found that if you can make a story out of it, they can come around to agreeing that one person or one family needs help and it’s right to eg pay more in taxes to help them. They don’t then extend that to “everyone in that position should get the same help” because they worry that this means there won’t be enough for them and the people they care about. I don’t think they can be reasoned out of this because it’s not a rational belief system; it’s an emotive one.
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Jul 31, 2022 02:05
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People you haven't met can be whatever you imagine them to be, and it takes a small amount of effort to imagine that they are people just like you, rather than mere objects to reinforce whatever other imaginary things you like to dwell on, like the endless horde of barbarians lurking outside the boundaries of your perception who want to destroy and steal everything you love.
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Jul 31, 2022 02:25
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OwlFancier posted:People you haven't met can be whatever you imagine them to be, and it takes a small amount of effort to imagine that they are people just like you, rather than mere objects to reinforce whatever other imaginary things you like to dwell on, like the endless horde of barbarians lurking outside the boundaries of your perception who want to destroy and steal everything you love. And yet every time people are asked to vote on the issue, the majority comes down on the side of “horde of faceless barbarians”. So how to change that? I mean I’d like to think our upcoming shared immiseration into poverty would help build solidarity but historically that’s mostly led people to close ranks even further. Maybe if we get a famine or a war as well?
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Jul 31, 2022 02:48
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There probably isn't much you can do about it, I think that attitude is heavily borne from people who do not have any proper attachment to other people living in the real world, and who instead get their perception of the wider world from media they consume. And legacy media obviously loves that view of the world where it's full of ravening hordes just outside the gates. Combine that with the collapse of traditional working class social settings (thanks neoliberalism) and you see a further and further retreat into fantasy. To a degree this is also true of new media, there are certainly plenty of outlets that cater to that and if you connect lots of people who already think that way they will generate their own reinforcement for that worldview as well, though I have a small amount of hope that the relatively lassiez faire approach of the internet at least allows for lefties to carve out a space and attract an audience in a fashion that I don't think was available in that window of time between the collapse of unions and anything resembling a "social" element in society combined with the dominance of legacy media outlets setting 100% of the conversation, and the current day. I don't know, increased focus on unions and avowedly left wing presence in the media I think certainly helps too. But whether any of the avenues available can reach the necessary critical mass, I have no idea.
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Jul 31, 2022 03:07
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Guavanaut posted:New identities just dropped, bugfix for Edinburgh. drat Scots! They ruined Scotland!
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Jul 31, 2022 07:36
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My wife's gran is Irish. If my wife was to get an Irish passport, and we've been married 10 years, could I get one? WhatEvil posted:E: Funnily enough before I was "properly" left wing I had sort of figured out the labour theory of value on my own. In that I'd got to thinking "But what ultimately drives the cost of anything" and getting to "Well it's about providing for the workers, but then the resources for that also come from other workers" but I never followed through to get to the broader implications of that. I know probably the only reason you have the idea is because you subconsciously pick up on cultural relics of their theory, but still. It's annoying.
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Jul 31, 2022 07:36
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Beefeater1980 posted:I still have family and some friends across the political spectrum (although decreasingly so as I get leftier and older family members die off). Really interesting to hear that, as I have the same experience. My aunt and uncle are so generous and gracious with me and the rest of our family, hold large dinner parties for all their friends, are strong voices of leadership in a couple of healthcare & animal rights groups that they're part of... But still say Brexit was a good thing, anyone who needs a foodbank hasn't prepared enough for rainy days, people just want to come to the UK to sponge off the state, etc. They aren't even that political, like we can spend a weekend with them and have great conversations, but during say one meal one of them will come out with something mindblowingly entitled/selfish/cruel, and then we'll go back to pleasantries. It would be so much easier if they were horrible across the board. Much harder when someone seems to have a lot of good in them, but then comes out with ridiculous rightwing talking points out of the blue. Their voices even sound different when they say this crap, it's clear they're parroting media talking points. So frustrating.
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Jul 31, 2022 08:00
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I found out a few months ago that my great grandfather was born in Dublin but apparently that's one step too far removedto get an Irish passport. Probably a little bad taste too given he was the son of a British soldier stationed there in the 1880s or so. It was quite a cool find on ancestry actually as I found an incredibly distant relative on there who had photos of the family. Quite eerie.
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Jul 31, 2022 08:17
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OwlFancier posted:There probably isn't much you can do about it, I think that attitude is heavily borne from people who do not have any proper attachment to other people living in the real world, and who instead get their perception of the wider world from media they consume. And legacy media obviously loves that view of the world where it's full of ravening hordes just outside the gates. Combine that with the collapse of traditional working class social settings (thanks neoliberalism) and you see a further and further retreat into fantasy. framing matters; it is normal for people to harbour contradictory political intuitions on individual desert and morality. Rhetorical innovations matter in a genuine sense of reshaping actually-existing dominant frames of thought - the Tories succeeded enormously on immigration by shifting the angle toward debates over quotas (where people systematically estimate unrealistically low figures) rather than standards (where people systematically estimate unrealistically accepting standards). We see this replayed over and over again, where one broadly popular intuition (e.g. "there should be a cap on the child tax credit") is fought with another (enforcing a "rape clause" to operationalize said cap seems abhorrent). this is not to say that framing is the only thing - politicians continually fling novel or revived ideas at the wall to see what sticks, and sometimes they strike gold where polling would have suggested none previously (cough brexit cough), but of course it would not be sensible to bet the farm on such a success. Happily in the riotous chaos of liberal democracies, a society can try many things all at the same time without tying its mast to any particular one...? what works elsewhere doesn't necessarily work in the UK. in the end, of all of the various Corbyn-period experiments, the one which paid off most for British audiences was to pitch "an NHS but for X". Other things which work well in e.g. France (where having a council of celebrity leftist intellectuals to underpin your programmatic seriousness seems to really work and gets extensive favourable media attention) were tried and fell flat blaming The Mass Media is a standard post-1960s riff, but we can readily observe that a concept that somewhere the Other is getting rich at your expense, in cahoots with the Powers that Be is popular even in countries with state-controlled media and rigid censorship
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Jul 31, 2022 08:42
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I find it helps to understand it as people doing things for people they know and like isn't really indicative of very much, because they are really doing it for themselves. It is easy to do things for people you know and like because that will likely pay rewards to you in turn and there is an emotional drive to do it, it is not a remarkable ability, it is very commonplace. To do things for people you don't know or to make the effort to humanise people is significantly more uncommon.
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Jul 31, 2022 08:52
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