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happyhippy posted:A co-worker had a good argument for this situation. It's worse than that I think: If four people are working 25% harder and getting a crappy 10% bonus, the company has an effective fulltime employee at only 40% of the cost. So it's a) witholding a fulltime job from someone, driving up unemployment and giving employers leverage, b) shoving that lost 60% wages out of the hands of the masses, further dividing rich and poor. And therefore c) pulling money out of circulation and harming the economy. I'm not an economyologist so feel free to tell me I'm an idiot.
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Jul 30, 2022 17:59
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Takes No Damage posted:
That movie doesn’t even make sense in TYOOL 2022 because Peter could comfortably afford a one-bedroom apartment and had benefits at his job. Things have gotten so much worse since then, a huge chunk of working Americans would kill for a job like his.
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Jul 30, 2022 18:23
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Yorkshire Pudding posted:That movie doesn’t even make sense in TYOOL 2022 because Peter could comfortably afford a one-bedroom apartment and had benefits at his job. Things have gotten so much worse since then, a huge chunk of working Americans would kill for a job like his. Absolutely every last bit of that makes perfect sense both when it was made and today: Peter is a computer toucher.
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Jul 30, 2022 18:28
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Invalid Validation posted:My philosophy is do the bare minimum for about 3 days a week and then next to nothing for 2 days. gently caress working it’s a bad thing to do with your time. Funny enough, at least where I work if you know your poo poo you can do that and still be considered a commiserate worker cause there’s so many more stupid as poo poo people. Man it was nice to be able to do that. And then one of our several "single points of failure" left, I got pulled back in, and now it's either constant working or constantly faking working. Not sure how y'all manage "let me just walk away and play video games for a couple hours" but enjoy it.
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Jul 30, 2022 18:34
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SkyeAuroline posted:Not sure how y'all manage "let me just walk away and play video games for a couple hours" but enjoy it. for me, anyway, it's because i've always been like that twitter guy: i do an 8 hour day of work in the first two hours of the day. then 'im available for meetings and questions' right now i'm redoing our company's website, the bid they got from an outside firm was like double my salary and months long, i'm redoing it in 3 months and not spending a dime. why would they question my minute to minute as long as i deliver in the end
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Jul 30, 2022 18:42
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SkyeAuroline posted:Man it was nice to be able to do that. My last job was 80% sat with my thumb up my rear end and then 20% reacting to the poo poo hitting the fan, so I could spend 28 hours a week getting paid to have one eye on my work laptop and sending the occasional “everything’s still ok” message while I did whatever I wanted otherwise. That 20% was real white knuckle poo poo but I’d take it back in an instant over this job right now.
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Jul 30, 2022 18:50
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Yorkshire Pudding posted:That movie doesn’t even make sense in TYOOL 2022 because Peter could comfortably afford a one-bedroom apartment and had benefits at his job. Things have gotten so much worse since then, a huge chunk of working Americans would kill for a job like his. I think this entire thread would kill for the kind of relaxation Peter experiences after his hypnosis.
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Jul 30, 2022 19:03
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Sywert of Thieves posted:I think this entire thread would kill for the kind of relaxation Peter experiences after his hypnosis. I feel like that every day after leaving academia for literally anything else, especially pointless computer touching.
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Jul 30, 2022 19:13
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I'm interviewing for a full-time job on the other side of the state. I have two part-time jobs, and my bosses at both don't want to lose me, but they also don't have the power to offer me full-time. The downside of being a local government employee, I guess.
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Jul 30, 2022 19:39
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Sywert of Thieves posted:I think this entire thread would kill for the kind of relaxation Peter experiences after his hypnosis. QFT In addition to universal healthcare there should be universal mental healthcare. Hellworld would turn that into a nightmare of personal invasion too so maybe it's good this isn't an option.
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Jul 30, 2022 21:16
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satanic splash-back posted:I feel like that every day after leaving academia god loving drat i can't wait
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Jul 31, 2022 01:07
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Takes No Damage posted:Let me ask you a question: What do you think of a person who only does the bare minimum? It's fine as long as they're consistently doing the bare minimum? When they do stuff like go all out one or two days a week and then vanish the other days, that gets irritating quickly. But this is a highly metricized processing and customer service job, so people who do that are generally caught pretty quickly.
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Jul 31, 2022 06:21
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Johnny Truant posted:god loving drat i can't wait I gotta agree that once I left uni, losing the feeling of having constantly looming deadlines 24/7 is the greatest. Not that corporate life doesn't have deadlines, but usually 1) you're not solely responsible for those and 2) they're a lot more negotiable and 3) they won't put you even further into debt if you fail to meet them.
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Jul 31, 2022 08:36
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Sywert of Thieves posted:I gotta agree that once I left uni, losing the feeling of having constantly looming deadlines 24/7 is the greatest. Not that corporate life doesn't have deadlines, but usually 1) you're not solely responsible for those and 2) they're a lot more negotiable and 3) they won't put you even further into debt if you fail to meet them. I *still* have vaguely-remembered nightmares of not getting a project in on time, so I failed a critical course, so I won't be graduating this year. It's been decades now. I didn't even fail that course to begin with. :-S
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Jul 31, 2022 10:03
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Motronic posted:Absolutely every last bit of that makes perfect sense both when it was made and today: Peter is a computer toucher. Yeah, his problem wasn't that he was poor, it was that his job was monotonous and meaningless and mired in pointless redundant bureaucracy and his soul was getting squished. If anything it's more relatable now than in the retroactively idyllic 90s... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AfZpEe7KIJ8 Sywert of Thieves posted:I think this entire thread would kill for the kind of relaxation Peter experiences after his hypnosis. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wqQXu13tLA
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Jul 31, 2022 10:09
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That’s the kinda job I wanted because it seemed piss easy even if was soul draining. I’ve known a lot of construction people in my life and it’s not the blissful escape the movie makes it out to be.
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Jul 31, 2022 18:31
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Well yeah it's played for a joke there, but the overall sentiment that there is some legit personal satisfaction to be had from manual labor still holds true. If you're a ditch digger you can look back at the end of your shift and see that ditch you just dug that wasn't there when you started. An office drone may be moving around millions of dollars within their company or industry but at the end of the day they've been sitting in a chair for 8 hours and their cube looks exactly the same.
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Jul 31, 2022 23:31
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Takes No Damage posted:Well yeah it's played for a joke there, but the overall sentiment that there is some legit personal satisfaction to be had from manual labor still holds true. If you're a ditch digger you can look back at the end of your shift and see that ditch you just dug that wasn't there when you started. An office drone may be moving around millions of dollars within their company or industry but at the end of the day they've been sitting in a chair for 8 hours and their cube looks exactly the same. Sure. You are much more likely to have work end at the end of your working day. At most, the boss might text you in the evening about where to start tomorrow. poo poo, as a DSD delivery driver, I had great success telling store personnel that calling me past 6pm was useless, as I'd be asleep (that was a lie, but still). Get in early, do it correctly, go home early, enjoy the rest of your day while thinking about anything but work. Don't pick up the phone. Work will be there tomorrow, and so will you.
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Aug 1, 2022 00:03
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I wasn't a ditch digger but I got really good at a semi-skilled trade before I graduated college. Was managing it and doing quotes by around age 25. I am told I have a "different style" now that I'm on the management team of an entirely different venture, far and away from anything manual labor. I have this idea of a "working manager" I developed when I had days split between figuring out to how get a job done and get my quotes/calls out. I do not micromanage but I'm always trying to read between the lines to set up the handful of subordinates I have for success, idk.
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Aug 1, 2022 00:04
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I like to look after the people I manage because having to work for a living absolutely sucks. That’s something else making my new job hell, the company just does not give a gently caress about the well-being of anyone they employ and it’s small enough that I can’t get away with just using my own discretion to let things slide past any particularly stupid policies. I had a guy a couple of weeks ago who was having an incredibly lovely time outside of work ask me to let him take it easy on new work for a day so he could get on top of his existing stack and I said sure, it’s one day, who gives a gently caress. Like half an hour later I had some dickhead trying to rip me a new one because if someone is in the office getting paid then they need to be giving 110% and what I actually should have done in their opinion was send the guy home unpaid if he wasn’t going to go full throttle all day.
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Aug 1, 2022 00:16
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Yorkshire Pudding posted:That movie doesn’t even make sense in TYOOL 2022 because Peter could comfortably afford a one-bedroom apartment and had benefits at his job. Things have gotten so much worse since then, a huge chunk of working Americans would kill for a job like his. Samir does explain this to Peter in the movie right before Peter tells him he's getting fired.
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Aug 1, 2022 00:32
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satanic splash-back posted:I feel like that every day after leaving academia for literally anything else, especially pointless computer touching. Can someone tell me how to get out Most of my skills would only transfer to private education
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Aug 1, 2022 00:35
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Atopian posted:I *still* have vaguely-remembered nightmares of not getting a project in on time, so I failed a critical course, so I won't be graduating this year. It's been decades now. On occasion I have dreams about being late for high school. My heart sinks so low as I find out I have 20+ years of homework and projects to catch up on. It's a feeling so intense, a feeling I haven't had since high school but I have them in the dream.
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Aug 1, 2022 00:41
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So my plague rat coworker is still coughing! And still refusing to wear a mask! One of the managers very politely chewed her out over it, making the point that it negates the whole point of everyone else wearing a mask if she's coughing and not wearing a mask, and that if she wants to keep not wearing one, she'll have to get a medical exemption. She gave him a half-hearted "oh, I'll try as long as it doesn't make it too hard to breathe" and put a mask on, and didn't even make it a full half hour before the mask was just dangling off of one ear. She's claiming that her cough isn't contagious - it’s 'only' a bacterial infection, after all! I suspect that our primary manager is losing patience with Plague Rat, and the only thing keeping Plague Rat in a job right now is that firing her would take us down to only 2 cleaners and that's just not feasible. We'll see how long she stays, once we've got more cleaners hired.
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Aug 1, 2022 03:23
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Fitzy Fitz posted:Can someone tell me how to get out As someone who moved from academia and who regularly hires people from academia, I can tell you that most academics pigeonhole themselves, and that you probably have a ton of transferable skills that any employer is looking for. I don’t know what field you’re in, but we hire a lot of lab scientists: they have creative problem solving, public speaking, data analysis, working contentiously and carefully, independence and huge amounts of resilience (because experiments mostly don’t work), among other things. When I speak at alternative careers in science things, all the scientists think they can only continue as academics or be science teachers, and there’s nothing else available.
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Aug 1, 2022 06:43
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History Comes Inside! posted:I like to look after the people I manage because having to work for a living absolutely sucks. gently caress the dickhead. If he wants 110% productivity, he needs to give 110% pay.
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Aug 1, 2022 11:45
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Scientastic posted:As someone who moved from academia and who regularly hires people from academia, I can tell you that most academics pigeonhole themselves, and that you probably have a ton of transferable skills that any employer is looking for.  i think this is done purposefully by the culture at large, kind of like a crab bucket mentality. see the "joke" in academia that switching to industry is selling your soul, selling out, etc etc. i think the biggest hurdle is overcoming the "you're too overqualified for this position" hurdle, cause that's what i was banging my head against CONSTANTLY. i'm about to move(god this background check can't move quick enough  ) from a lab manager position, the plateau of where i could be in my career in academia without getting a phd, to an entry level scientist position and will be just immediately getting paid more, more PTO, better work hours, no on-call, doing actual  , gently caress i can't wait 
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Aug 1, 2022 12:05
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Scientastic posted:As someone who moved from academia and who regularly hires people from academia, I can tell you that most academics pigeonhole themselves, and that you probably have a ton of transferable skills that any employer is looking for. Being able to apply scientific method to any given problem is a huge boon, especially since everyone and their dog wants to be data driven instead of relying on the gut feeling of your shitbag boss
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Aug 1, 2022 12:09
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The hardest part of getting out of academia is realizing that 2+ years out means you're effectively locked out of teaching as your certificates and direct contacts lapse unless you go back to school, which is a scary idea if all you've done is teach.
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Aug 1, 2022 12:37
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Johnny Truant posted:see the "joke" in academia that switching to industry is selling your soul, selling out, etc etc. This was the biggest barrier to me leaving academia, I refused to even countenance the idea of “selling out” and it was when I got a good talking to by someone who knew that was foolishness that I even started applying for jobs in sales
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Aug 1, 2022 12:58
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Scientastic posted:jobs in sales 
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Aug 1, 2022 13:10
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Scientastic posted:This was the biggest barrier to me leaving academia, I refused to even countenance the idea of “selling out” and it was when I got a good talking to by someone who knew that was foolishness that I even started applying for jobs in sales yeah it's a pretty good litmus test for who to trust in academia, imo. if you mention industry, pharma, or basically any other non-academic job and they immediately, and absolutely seriously, describe it as selling out or whatever, you should just toss their opinions straight in the trash
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Aug 1, 2022 13:17
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Johnny Truant posted:yeah it's a pretty good litmus test for who to trust in academia, imo. if you mention industry, pharma, or basically any other non-academic job and they immediately, and absolutely seriously, describe it as selling out or whatever, you should just toss their opinions straight in the trash that's dr crab bucket mentality to you
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Aug 1, 2022 13:24
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I know, I did literally sell my soul for work/life balance and a decent salary
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Aug 1, 2022 14:34
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Scientastic posted:I know, I did literally sell my soul for work/life balance and a decent salary Someone obviously doesn’t give a poo poo about the search for truth and meaning!
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Aug 1, 2022 15:00
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Yorkshire Pudding posted:That movie doesn’t even make sense in TYOOL 2022 because Peter could comfortably afford a one-bedroom apartment and had benefits at his job. Things have gotten so much worse since then, a huge chunk of working Americans would kill for a job like his. Perks Peter has that I don't: -His own cubicle with walls high enough everyone can't see him all the time -While he doesn't park next to the building Initech does have enough spots for all employees. No mention of off-site parking and shuttles. -Peter's boss does little productive work, but his employee file shows he has a physics degree from MIT. If he needed to do Peter's work or to explain what Peter does, he could do so. -The consultants work hard and finish a project and are willing to confront management about wasteful policies. Peter does not sit with them for most of a day teaching them how to make a PowerPoint, then have them leave forever. Invalid Validation posted:That’s the kinda job I wanted because it seemed piss easy even if was soul draining. I’ve known a lot of construction people in my life and it’s not the blissful escape the movie makes it out to be. That story arc was from Judge's own experience: quote:When he was growing up in Albuquerque, everyone told him that if he wanted a lucrative and satisfying career, all he had to do was get a technical degree. “Guidance counselors just pound it into us: science, college, science,” he says. But he had a technical degree and could barely afford his rent. His next-door neighbor worked as an auto mechanic, and not only did he make more money than Judge, but he kept flexible hours and seemed to be substantially happier. (He would serve as inspiration for Lawrence, the construction-worker neighbor in “Office Space”; Judge’s neighbor in the other direction helped inspire Butt-Head.) “For so long,” Judge told me, “I was wondering how I was going to make a living that wasn’t going to make me miserable. That was my main concern in life.” Great article about Judge's background: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/13/...&smid=url-share
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Aug 1, 2022 15:02
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Scientastic posted:As someone who moved from academia and who regularly hires people from academia, I can tell you that most academics pigeonhole themselves, and that you probably have a ton of transferable skills that any employer is looking for. Yeah I'm a liberal arts academic. Plenty of soft skills. All soft skills, actually. Most of the possible careers I look at pay worse than what I'm making now or are even more tenuous, and I think I'd get really depressed in a field like sales or insurance because I'd hate what I was doing.
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Aug 1, 2022 15:12
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Sywert of Thieves posted:I think this entire thread would kill for the kind of relaxation Peter experiences after his hypnosis. It's why I have a weed vape pen on my desk and started doing yoga (well, DDPY, but that counts IMO).
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Aug 1, 2022 16:38
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Fitzy Fitz posted:Yeah I'm a liberal arts academic. Plenty of soft skills. All soft skills, actually. Most of the possible careers I look at pay worse than what I'm making now or are even more tenuous, and I think I'd get really depressed in a field like sales or insurance because I'd hate what I was doing. So many companies have departments that exist to create training materials. Lots of different names for it, my company calls it Learning and Performance. As a department they create training courses, e-learnings, and certification exams. Now I know you're thinking that your not a subject matter expert in industry, so thus you can't do this. Except you can because the department has SMEs for the software. The curriculum writers work with the SMEs to produce the material. Starting pay for our department is ~$100k. Then there are trainer positions. Those positions tend to have a bit more travel but you'd still be teaching.
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Aug 1, 2022 16:57
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Fitzy Fitz posted:Yeah I'm a liberal arts academic. Plenty of soft skills. All soft skills, actually. Most of the possible careers I look at pay worse than what I'm making now or are even more tenuous, and I think I'd get really depressed in a field like sales or insurance because I'd hate what I was doing. hey friend, liberal arts but with some math and physics that I have never used in a professional capability except when i worked for a laser company and was one of the few to understand how do laser do thing i currently supervise a bunch of IT departments for a large international conglomerate and id say i run a 70/30 split on dealing with people with soft skills and being an SME the other 30% of the time. dont go into sales for your own mental health.
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Aug 1, 2022 18:06
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