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they absolutely should have aborted the baby the moment they learned about it and it's slightly deranged that the combined leadership of NASA, Roscosmos, and fictional SpaceX were willing to risk the lives of a dozen people over kelly's pregnancy like, just outstandingly weird that, in universe, no one on earth or mars even brought up the possibility of aborting a baby that should have never existed and represented a severe breakdown in protocol between both the american and russian crews. QuoProQuid fucked around with this message at 14:19 on Aug 15, 2022 |
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Aug 15, 2022 14:17
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QuoProQuid posted:i don't mean that in a derogatory way, just that that it operates under the same logic as something like "The West Wing" where every character is able to deliver inspiring speeches and how expertise and determination alone are able to transform the world. I groaned when Dev, tipped off that he's going to be voted out by the board, goes to the bullpen to poach away all the talent for a new space venture with blackjack and hookers (almost assuredly cause for civil action on multiple grounds, but whatever) with a Big Speech and they all are spellbound with his heady words, and Karen brings the oinking thoughtless slobs to their senses by calling down from the balcony reminding them that their Helios salaries and benefits are things that they require to meet their material needs. There are even ADRed in crowd lines like "I have a mortgage!" "My 401k!" "Dental plan! Lisa Needs Braces!" Owlbear Camus fucked around with this message at 14:27 on Aug 15, 2022 |
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Aug 15, 2022 14:25
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'Aren't you, like, rich?'
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Aug 15, 2022 14:26
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Owlbear Camus posted:I groaned when Dev, tipped off that he's going to be voted out by the board, goes to the bullpen to poach away all the talent for a new space venture with blackjack and hookers (almost assuredly cause for civil action on multiple grounds, but whatever) with a Big Speech and they all are spellbound with his heady words, and Karen brings the oinking thoughtless slobs to their senses by calling down from the balcony reminding them that their Helios salaries and benefits are things that they require to meet their material needs. this scene was a great way to endear me to karen like, kudos to for all mankind for taking a character that i reviled last season and making her the only sane person in the universe
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Aug 15, 2022 14:29
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Karen, from balcony: 🤌 "That fingers thing means money!"
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Aug 15, 2022 14:34
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jackhunter64 posted:'Aren't you, like, rich?' This single actor ruined every scene with Dev's big speech for me. They definitely felt like they were cast specifically to be annoying as gently caress.
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Aug 15, 2022 14:34
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Even if it got hosed up and re-writen and edited down to little more than a cheap gag, I'd love to know what the outline or bible had in mind with the North Korean guy and by extension their whole program. I follow the logic of "We launch several unacknowledged manned missions, every one that doesn't make contact because of a hard landing/we hosed up the radiation shielding/other that was retroactively an 'unmanned probe.' If we get a ping back from a successful landing, we win the race for a manned landing and announce. If we never hear back, we protect our reputation and never killed a bunch of guys in space." But it seems like even under optimum circumstances, it was a one-way suicide mission. There was no orbiter for recovery and the lander didn't seem to be a an orbital launch vehicle? So you're still announcing dead astronauts either way. IDK the whole thing seems to be a "Ha ha Koreans are Orcs throwing people away like lemmings because they're too Oriental to value life good" punchline, which seems lazy since you can do anything with NK without the fall of the USSR and the famine of the 90s turning them into a convenient US propaganda boogieman punching bag like it did here on Earth Prime Timeline. The one kind of cool thing was the surprise Ed being the one to break the language barrier when they got him back to base, but it being totally earned with the old man's backstory.
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Aug 15, 2022 14:52
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I assumed it was an Omon Ra situation except the kastronaut didn’t get the memo about how he was supposed to end the mission.
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Aug 15, 2022 15:19
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I don't really understand what the conspiracy theorists needed Jiimmy for if their plan was just to set off a big bomb in the parking lot. What was the point of the doohickey they had him install at NASA? Did I miss something?
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Aug 15, 2022 16:12
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SimonChris posted:I don't really understand what the conspiracy theorists needed Jiimmy for if their plan was just to set off a big bomb in the parking lot. What was the point of the doohickey they had him install at NASA? Did I miss something? I assumed that they planned to broadcast a manifesto of some kind first, but had to abandon that step of the plan when they got caught.
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Aug 15, 2022 16:13
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Wonder if there's a market for The Worst Wing but for this show. Seems liberalism erodes the plot writing lobe like the cancer it is.
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Aug 15, 2022 16:24
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tokin opposition posted:Wonder if there's a market for The Worst Wing but for this show. Seems liberalism erodes the plot writing lobe like the cancer it is. I mean, I'd listen. But I'm not sure For All Mankind is trying to say "this is super realistic politics" and it seems unlikely that a generation of pols is gonna cite it as inspiration. It'd need a different tack.
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Aug 15, 2022 16:57
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Also, they end up not even needing the docking card thing at all, because the msam never had enough fuel to get all the way to the Phoenix. If someone had done that fuel calculation a few days earlier, they never would have gone out there to find that guy. I hate to say it, but they really needed to see that video by the south Park guys where they say you can't have a story that is a bunch of "and then this happened".
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Aug 15, 2022 17:00
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On the 3.10 episode of the FAM podcast, one of the executive producers (either Matt Wolpert or Ben Nedivi) explained that since human-crewed spaceflight is so predominant in this timeline, North Korea would pour all of its resources into its space program rather than a ballistic missile program as a means of gaining international prestige. They didn't go any deeper than that, though.
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Aug 15, 2022 17:30
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I liked North Korea much better when it was a throwaway joke in the first episode. First man on Mars is just a lol.
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Aug 15, 2022 17:48
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Rental Sting posted:On the 3.10 episode of the FAM podcast, one of the executive producers (either Matt Wolpert or Ben Nedivi) explained that since human-crewed spaceflight is so predominant in this timeline, North Korea would pour all of its resources into its space program rather than a ballistic missile program as a means of gaining international prestige. They didn't go any deeper than that, though. This kind of Orientalism does not fill me with confidence the showeunners are being serious minded with their world building, but I guess the NCIS level "tied up next to the bomb in a van" or "Soviets suicidally gunning their engines because Moscow wants to win the Rainbow Road Cup" thing or any other of a number or plot beats weren't exactly subtle either. This just ain't gonna be the kind of thoughtful show one might like it to be.
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Aug 15, 2022 17:50
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i appreciate fam’s unwavering commitment to the belief that space magically makes everything better and any problem involving space can only be solved with more space like, sure, space definitely is going to address north korea’s fears for its own security and it’s definitely going to invest all its money in space programs instead of nukes. why not QuoProQuid fucked around with this message at 18:08 on Aug 15, 2022 |
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Aug 15, 2022 18:05
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QuoProQuid posted:i appreciate fam’s unwavering commitment to the belief that space magically makes everything better and any problem involving space can only be solved with more space It's silly, but they've also built up a geopolitical situation that's less violent and unstable, I think. The United States and the USSR didn't get involved in any destabilizing conflicts in the Middle East.
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Aug 15, 2022 20:17
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FAM is basically another Trek mirror universe where instead of being evil Terrans or our own prime universe, we likely avoid ww3 and will work our way to first contact not from a drunk genius repurposing an ICBM but by governments of the Earth competing against each other to figure out warp drive first. Like in Trek, everything can be solved by smart people being smart and the detail don't actually have to be rooted in any kind of reality. It's good.
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Aug 15, 2022 20:44
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Owlbear Camus posted:This just ain't gonna be the kind of thoughtful show one might like it to be. Which is unfortunate since I fundamentally agree with the show's premise anyway. It's definitely feels like some somewhat clueless but well meaning boomers' idea of a good timeline, I can see where comparisons to The West Wing come from although this show doesn't make me want to assault the monitor at least.
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Aug 15, 2022 20:48
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RacistsSuck posted:FAM is basically another Trek mirror universe where instead of being evil Terrans or our own prime universe, we likely avoid ww3 and will work our way to first contact not from a drunk genius repurposing an ICBM but by governments of the Earth competing against each other to figure out warp drive first. Like in Trek, everything can be solved by smart people being smart and the detail don't actually have to be rooted in any kind of reality.
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Aug 15, 2022 20:54
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Nichael posted:It's silly, but they've also built up a geopolitical situation that's less violent and unstable, I think. The United States and the USSR didn't get involved in any destabilizing conflicts in the Middle East.
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Aug 15, 2022 21:20
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I binged the last five episodes of this yesterday and, while I thought it was better than the first half, I would give it an 'okay' at best as a season. The first one was great and the following two haven't been as compelling. That said, they weren't too weak, and if the following seasons pick up steam, I still think that the idea of a 7 season sci-fi series where each envisions a new alternate decade would be a great achievement. Please let both failsons die next season and just let that family quietly disappear into NASA's history. Please stop the weird right wing tilt that the series seems to have. These two things would lift so much weight, I don't care if the series goes progressively softer and softer in its scifi as long as it makes the landing.
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Aug 15, 2022 21:40
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At least have the right-wing fringe groups have a response that makes sense. Those people were upset about a cooling loop and oil jobs. We have people right now who think Joe Biden is literal Hitler/Stalin/Mao who is destroying America and no one will let Trump wave his magic wand to save everyone, and they aren't building gasoline bombs in a van to blow up NASA or whatever. I thought their big thing was going to be to hijack the broadcast feed and then tell the world the "truth" about what really happened on the moon. Blowing up NASA makes absolutely zero sense considering it's Helios that is mining the Helium 3 and taking away oil jobs.
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Aug 15, 2022 22:35
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bawfuls posted:except Trek mostly has better writing and coherent politics First season of FAM is better than most first seasons of Trek. And the quality of writing is up there with a lot of DS9, which makes sense. It really feels like BSG all over again, where it starts out just incredibly strong and kinda loses the thread of what made it great as it goes along.
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Aug 15, 2022 22:43
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Part of the problem is they have like 20 different storylines when the show can only really delve into 10-15. So most of the stories get truncated and mean next to nothing. The domestic terrorist storyline is fine if they put more time into it. It probably should have been an arc that occurred over a couple of seasons (perhaps you see some anti-NASA grumbling at the end of Season 2). Instead, it was mostly a throwaway scene every episode that somehow culminated in a big event (in which the aftermath will be dealt with offscreen). Maybe that's just inevitable with the time jumps each season, but it sure seemed like the stories meant a lot more in season 1. Also just found out that the actruss who played Sunny is Bryan Cranston's daughter.
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Aug 15, 2022 23:11
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Regarding the NK lander, doesn't seem coincidence to me that it landed near the NASA and Helios landing sites. I assume that NK was planning to announce the successful landing but say some of their supplies hadn't made it, then hitch a ride back with either of the other crews.
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Aug 15, 2022 23:21
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Senor Tron posted:Regarding the NK lander, doesn't seem coincidence to me that it landed near the NASA and Helios landing sites.
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Aug 15, 2022 23:24
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Ok. Here’s how they should retcon the NK capsule in a way that makes it not stupid and actually advances the plot. NK was able to beg, steal, and borrow every piece space tech they could get their hands on. Since space travel is already so heavily commercialized in this timeline, and more countries with space programs to steal from, the NK has relatively few hurdles for actually making launch vehicles. The problem is, because of made politcal reasons, the NK cannot get ahold of plans for life support systems. That, they have to engineer from scratch and it turns out NK engineers are legitimately the best in the world when it comes to recycling air and water. Its even simple and cheap to manufacture. Eventually, Danny thinks to himself “why the gently caress have I not had to change a CO2 scrubber yet” and discoveres this next gen life support system while pulling up panels. He calls back to base to report his findings, thus allowing Happy Valley to stretch its life support long enough for pickup and is a character bridge for Danny’s return to society. So, science once again saves day and it turns out the North Koreans are a gently caress ton smarter than everybody thinks. I’m high at work and even I can fix this poo poo.
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Aug 15, 2022 23:42
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They could have just come across the lander and found 2 dead bodies in it. That makes some sense at least. NK sent a suicide mission to Mars in hopes of being first to the planet.
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Aug 15, 2022 23:52
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ending song should have been "American Idiot" by Greenday
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Aug 15, 2022 23:54
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Vegetable posted:I liked North Korea much better when it was a throwaway joke in the first episode. First man on Mars is just a lol. It could have worked if it had been written as some sort of joint Chinese/North Korean venture and the logistics of it were shown to the viewer in a way that was congruent with the show's "realistic" approach. It also would have been a way to introduce China as another player in the expanding list of powers, etc. Instead they went with the most tired and dumb "lol North Korea, am i rite?" approach. They are simultaneously secretly good enough to shoot two guys to mars before anyone else but also backwards enough to only provision them with hilarious space inefficient tins of cat food and a wooden box with a loaded gun. Also the writers gave them a magic bag of holding to hold all of the cat food and air they would need to be stranded for as long as the plot required. Niwrad posted:They could have just come across the lander and found 2 dead bodies in it. That makes some sense at least. NK sent a suicide mission to Mars in hopes of being first to the planet. That would have been way better.
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Aug 16, 2022 00:14
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Niwrad posted:They could have just come across the lander and found 2 dead bodies in it. That makes some sense at least. NK sent 20 suicide missions to Mars in hopes of being first to the planet.
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Aug 16, 2022 00:23
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Christ, you guys really hate babies and North Koreans.
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Aug 16, 2022 00:26
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What makes the writing annoying is that it feels like they are doing wildly unrealistic things for the sake of drama and story conflict, when reality would provide just as much opportunity for drama and conflict. The NK situation is one such example, but there are plenty more.
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Aug 16, 2022 00:33
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Why does everyone think North Korea sent 20 manned missions? All those other probes were sent by other countries. The north Korean one just happened to be closest.
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Aug 16, 2022 00:39
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Sorry, that was just me. Don't perpetuate my dumbness just because I find it funny to imagine
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Aug 16, 2022 00:41
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bawfuls posted:This doesn't track with the guy's actual behavior and statements. He didn't want to leave his crash site. Even after talking to Ed, he wanted to return to his post. "Don't worry Lee, this isn't a one way mission, we have also sent supplies to Mars for while you wait for our followup mission to bring you back!" They have to assume any communications back and forth with Mars would be intercepted, so no reason for him to know.
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Aug 16, 2022 00:48
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Data Graham posted:Sorry, that was just me. Don't perpetuate my dumbness just because I find it funny to imagine Take him to the shame capsule.
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Aug 16, 2022 00:50
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I was really expecting them to show that the North Koreans did a supply drop or something that the dude was surviving on, it definitely felt completely unbelievable that he had enough oxygen and food in that tiny capsule. It was really underlined when we got to see Danny carry a one month supply at the end. There really should have been some kind of explanation. It might have been funny if there was a runner throughout the season of food running down faster than expected and important supplies going missing. It could cause a bunch of arguments and mystery and then bam, they catch the North Korean dude raiding their supplies.
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