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Is that placeholder default shadows that never got adjusted in each frame?
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Aug 19, 2022 23:41
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drat was really hoping for a Castlevania quality show in the Tekken Universe
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Aug 20, 2022 03:52
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At the very least, the show better have somebody thrown into a volcano.
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Aug 20, 2022 03:58
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Aug 20, 2022 11:46
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There should be a clause added to copywrite/trademark law, where if you do go this route of "it's dead, we're writing off the loss for tax purposes, and we're no longer selling it/streaming it/etc" then it's counted as abandoned and immediately enters public domain. And probably combine a system where masters are included in the Library of Congress in order to get any tax whatever for it in the first place so they can't try and hide. Don't wanna gently caress with Infinity Train anymore? Cool, anyone and everyone can use it as they like. We really need to tackle the walled garden of culture that Disney et al have cultivated.
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Aug 20, 2022 14:57
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Seeing creators ask to release DVDs/blurays of their shows (with commentary) and being told there wasn't interest is so sad, especially now.
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Aug 20, 2022 16:58
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It's definitely a misuse from the law as intended to take a property that was reasonably successful for a while and suddenly declare it as having no value to get some quick tax boosts. It's not fully clear that's what's happening here though. Not just from the lack of any real communication from the company itself, but from the fact that they're also burying Sesame Street, which they had a contract to stream, but they certainly didn't own it. Can you write something off when all you have is short term broadcast rights?
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Aug 20, 2022 19:00
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SlothfulCobra posted:It's definitely a misuse from the law as intended to take a property that was reasonably successful for a while and suddenly declare it as having no value to get some quick tax boosts. It's a weird thing where some stuff is definitely a tax write off and some things are just about cutting residuals, like Sesame Street. Supposedly they did make a decision to just bail out of animation and kids shows entirely because HBO Max wasn't capturing the market which could mean that some of this will be sold off eventually (to who though?). But then you have things like Cartoon Network erasing shows from memory on social media and it's not clear what's getting which treatment.
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Aug 20, 2022 19:25
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SlothfulCobra posted:
The new CEO is gaming tax law to ensure his year over year for his first term is neutral or positive in order to balance out the fact that whatever he does will take a couple of years to get into the green naturally. The fact that he hates scripted content is tangential to the situation. Even someone who hates one kind of content, as CEO, would be bound by fiduciary law to let it ride if it makes money. But if he makes a claim that it's not profitable (or profitable enough, or whatever) then he can flip that fiduciary duty to killing it for tax write offs. That he would have wanted to do that regardless is just a bonus for him.
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Aug 21, 2022 00:29
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https://owendennis.substack.com/p/so-uh-whats-going-on-with-infinity Owen Dennis, creator of Infinity Train, shared what he knows about the situation with his show. Basically, this is 100% on Discovery as Cartoon Network warned them that doing this would ruin their reputation with creators and fans. Discovery didn't care. This was all supposed to happen next week to give creators and probably fans time to prepare but Discovery did it early and didn't tell anyone; Owen found out while he was driving home and his phone started going off. As far as he knows, Infinity Train will be on iTunes, Google Play, Amazon Prime, Vudu, and YouTube to buy. He doesn't know how long it will stay but does believe that, if you buy something off of iTunes and Apple loses the rights to sell it, they won't take it away from you. He doesn't know about the other services. Owen also doesn't know if he's being lied to so that he'll be quiet and stop bothering people. Apparently there have been phone calls and emails for the past 3 days with zero answers because of the merger. Everyone who would know what's going on has either moved, been fired, or quit. He also implies that anyone who claims to know what's going on probably doesn't.
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Aug 21, 2022 00:39
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I've also heard rumors and seen more than a few videos from the big animation YouTube channels saying that Cartoon Network itself is on the chopping block.
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Aug 21, 2022 01:18
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ThermoPhysical posted:https://owendennis.substack.com/p/so-uh-whats-going-on-with-infinity I'm willing to believe that Cartoon Network was against this happening, mainly because like they said it's a huge blow against the creators and fans will lead to serious long term problems. Like, Cartoon Network has never done anything like this before and then suddenly Discovery comes a long and takes them over and a lovely thing is done that's very similar to a lot of other lovely things it's done while under control of David Zaslav and it's pretty easy to put two and two together and figure out what's going on and why. much like hospitals, the educational system, and most other businesses in America Cartoon Network is now in a position where the people who actually do things and understand how to run stuff efficiently no longer get a say in what happens. Instead a CEO will maximize short term profits in a way that creates a worse product and worse working conditions for everyone under them and a ton of people will lose their jobs and if the company goes under the CEO gets a ton of money and gets to go on to destroy another business in the exact same way because this is where unchecked capitalism inevitably leads. Space Cadet Omoly fucked around with this message at 01:42 on Aug 21, 2022 |
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Aug 21, 2022 01:38
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Crain posted:I've also heard rumors and seen more than a few videos from the big animation YouTube channels saying that Cartoon Network itself is on the chopping block. Cartoon Network has been (no exaggeration) 95% Teen Titans syndication for like 6-7 years, it would be just putting it out to pasture long past it’s prime. Adult Swim (and Rick & Morty) are the real question, those are the shows people are actually tuning in to watch.
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Aug 21, 2022 01:59
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Yeah, Cartoon Network has been mismanaged for a long time. It'd occasionally do a cool thing, but even then it had a good chance of loving things up with a horrible release schedule. Also, management screwing things up isn't unique to capitalism. The people who want to be in charge of things tend to be the worst people for that job. They spend more time on politics than the actual job they are supposed to be doing. As long as humanity exists, there will be incompetent idiots in charge of things that everybody pays the price for.
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Aug 21, 2022 02:27
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Gotta be real and say I liked Cartoon Network most when it was a bunch of old cancelled cartoons that normally ran in syndication and then Space Ghost.
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Aug 21, 2022 02:40
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Regardless, losing Cartoon Network like this would be a pretty big blow
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Aug 21, 2022 02:47
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I know there are much bigger concerns with this than the video game I like, but I really wonder how big of a blow to the Multiversus devs losing Cartoon Network would be. Would they also lose Adult Swim stuff too? Would they still have access to those characters?
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Aug 21, 2022 02:49
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Macaluso posted:I know there are much bigger concerns with this than the video game I like, but I really wonder how big of a blow to the Multiversus devs losing Cartoon Network would be. Would they also lose Adult Swim stuff too? Would they still have access to those characters? Idk why they wouldn't have access to those characters. Cutting Cartoon Network doesn't mean that they're memory holing it like a bunch of the other stuff, just that the channel might get axed and the branding dissolved into the greater corporate whole
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Aug 21, 2022 03:02
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Bust Rodd posted:Cartoon Network has been (no exaggeration) 95% Teen Titans syndication for like 6-7 years, it would be just putting it out to pasture long past it’s prime. Adult Swim (and Rick & Morty) are the real question, those are the shows people are actually tuning in to watch. CN still makes really good kid's shows when they want to. Losing them would be a real loss for the industry. I mean who's even left to make cartoons if they're gone? Nickelodeon? gently caress that poo poo.
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Aug 21, 2022 03:09
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readingatwork posted:CN still makes really good kid's shows when they want to. Losing them would be a real loss for the industry. Nick, Disney (lol), streaming platforms like Netflix maybe...not a lot I can think of.
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Aug 21, 2022 03:20
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Xelkelvos posted:just that the channel might get axed and the branding dissolved into the greater corporate whole Yeah, a lot of their stuff has been going direct to HBO Max (like the aforementioned Infinity Train) and while it never airs on the network, at the end its still credited as being made by Cartoon Network Studios. That'll be the most likely end result. Cable is dying so that's probably what was always gonna happen eventually, this huge clusterfuck might just be speeding up the process (if indeed they do axe the network). Then again, now that Discovery's nuking HBO Max, combined with people in general complaining about there being too many streaming services to watch, and the growing rejection of binge TV... maybe it's time for cable to come back!  readingatwork posted:I mean who's even left to make cartoons if they're gone? Nickelodeon? gently caress that poo poo. Exec: "yes that was a good pitch, but when does Spongebob come in?" Writer: "Sir my pitch was for a new show, nothing Spongebob related" Exec: 
TwoPair fucked around with this message at 04:16 on Aug 21, 2022 |
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Aug 21, 2022 04:09
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TwoPair posted:Exec: "yes that was a good pitch, but when does Spongebob come in?" Exec: But it will do Spongebob numbers right?
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Aug 21, 2022 04:21
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Speaking of, I caught a newer episode of SpongeBob and man. I need to go pull up one of those earlier episodes and see if it holds up this many years later because the new stuff wasn’t in the same continent from what I remember. That said, rose colored glasses and my old rear end isn’t exactly the target demo.
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Aug 21, 2022 04:48
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there’s a really sharp divide between the episodes before and after the movie came out
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Aug 21, 2022 04:50
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Craptacular! posted:Gotta be real and say I liked Cartoon Network most when it was a bunch of old cancelled cartoons that normally ran in syndication and then Space Ghost. Cartoon Network from ‘96-‘04 was the pinnacle of ‘toonin’. Dexter’s Lab, PPG, Samurai Jack, Courage the Cowardly Dog, Sheep in the Big City, Toonami in the afternoons, Midnight Run, the original Adult Swim line up with Mission Hill and the Oblongs, classic Bugs Bunny and Scooby Doo poo poo on Saturday mornings, classic and obscure animated movies on Friday nights, and enough money flowing into each studio that you got to see hour long specials and Holiday episodes too! I mean Nickelodeon and Disney afternoon provided some semblance of competition but for the most part Cartoon Network absolutely delivered the very best animation you could find anywhere when I was a lad and I loved it dearly.
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Aug 21, 2022 05:03
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TwoPair posted:Cable is dying so that's probably what was always gonna happen eventually, this huge clusterfuck might just be speeding up the process (if indeed they do axe the network). Then again, now that Discovery's nuking HBO Max, combined with people in general complaining about there being too many streaming services to watch, and the growing rejection of binge TV... maybe it's time for cable to come back! From my memory of how this stuff has been playing out for a few years, yeah, it's a really weird 180 from what seemed to be happening. Basically, Cartoon Network has been in a transitional state for a few years since traditional TV is dying off and kids sitting around watching reruns just isn't as much of a thing. So they were pushing kids to their ad-supported streaming app. Shows would get binge-dropped on there and they'd eventually play on TV at some point in the next month or so. This was also when they switched to the binge format of running 5 or 10 episodes in a week and then having months of silence. It was rough on serial shows and made it hard for some new shows to build an audience. And yeah, for awhile they were just the Teen Titans Go! channel. If kids wanted something else they could go to the app. It seems like it's gotten a little better over the last year or so and they still make some decent kids shows even if I'm not really going to watch them as an adult. It'd be a bummer to lose them and be down to just Nick and Disney. Netflix also slashed its animation department so unless they reverse course it's going to be rough. And all this was seemingly true for Adult Swim and even TBS' attempt at a cartoon block. For a while it seemed like there was a push/pull over new content. Teens and adults staying up late to watch weird cartoons just isn't as much of a thing anymore either and there was a sense that Adult Swim would exist to funnel stuff into HBO Max. Which they've been doing well enough for now. But now they're getting gutted too and there's this weird question of what's even going to be left. So the whole thing is just really strange since for years the old plan was to move animation to HBO Max to unify the library...and now new merger so gently caress a years long strategy, apparently. Hopefully they just sell it off rather than kill it. I'd have to assume someone would be willing to pay for that catalog. I thought the latest rumors was the Cartoon Network and Adult Swim had managed to survive the little Discovery civil war and stay on top, but who knows now.
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Aug 21, 2022 05:34
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This is all bad, but just wait until they start using AI to make cartoons so they don't have to pay creatives or worry about them wanting to add LGBT+ representation. I don't know when this will first happen, but given advancements in AI image generators and the lack of value for art the general public has I'm sure it'll happen eventually.
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Aug 21, 2022 14:24
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Hexmage-SA posted:This is all bad, but just wait until they start using AI to make cartoons so they don't have to pay creatives or worry about them wanting to add LGBT+ representation. I don't know when this will first happen, but given advancements in AI image generators and the lack of value for art the general public has I'm sure it'll happen eventually. It won't just be cartoons, it'll be all art. Separate art from the artist, separate the worker from the work.
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Aug 21, 2022 15:38
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Personally, I see AI being a really positive for art. It will allow people to be independent creators, and not rely on massive teams of artists, which is really impractical for most people. Modders, for instance, have already been using AI to add voice acting to their mods. If AI gets good enough, people will get a massive variety of choices for media. Artists need to work for corporations because its really difficult to accumulate all the resources they need on their own.
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Aug 21, 2022 16:10
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Yeah I mean ultimately it’s up to us to seek out human generated content, it’s not like the advent of AI art means humans can’t do it anymore, and the greatest human artists will continue to expand what we think is possible artistically, the same way they always have.
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Aug 21, 2022 16:27
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Bust Rodd posted:Yeah I mean ultimately it’s up to us to seek out human generated content, it’s not like the advent of AI art means humans can’t do it anymore, and the greatest human artists will continue to expand what we think is possible artistically, the same way they always have. We had this exact discussion in the Tech Nightmare thread. With the way things seem to be progressing, the general consensus is that AI art will probably fall somewhere between advanced "Clip Art" for corporate use and being just another tool to use by artists to accelerate development time. Like RiseAgain said, it'll be an amazing tool (once refined) for indie creators to be able to make stuff on their own. It will also probably take over a lot of corporate art needs for simple design work, but that will still rely on someone knowing the principals of "what looks good" to pick it. A good example was it being used to do concept art. Instead of spending a lot of time coming up with how to interpret some vague instruction from a producer you can just plug in keywords (or their whole request) and then show them a bunch of options for a quick starting point.
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Aug 21, 2022 16:35
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I see it as about the same as those AI-generated essays people were all about posting everywhere for a while that are basically entirely unreadable because you look at it for five minutes trying to parse through the words and there's actually no meaning so there's nothing there to actually read and people are just going WOW ISN'T IT FUNNY THAT NOTHING MAKES SENSE. funny funny At best AI generated poo poo is just worthless trash, at worst it'll shrink the amount of jobs for people to make a living on art just a bit more to make it all the more unviable as a career. The technology also relies on stealing other people's work en masse, so what happens when people start using it to edit images just slightly to get around having to credit artists for their work.
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Aug 21, 2022 17:14
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SlothfulCobra posted:I see it as about the same as those AI-generated essays people were all about posting everywhere for a while that are basically entirely unreadable because you look at it for five minutes trying to parse through the words and there's actually no meaning so there's nothing there to actually read and people are just going WOW ISN'T IT FUNNY THAT NOTHING MAKES SENSE. I know some artists claim that AI generated art is just stealing other people's art, but that is basically what all artists do. They take a bunch of other people's art and transform and combine it in novel ways. AI doesn't work the way you think it does. It doesn't search for a specific image and then slightly modifies it to match user needs. AI needs a massive amount of training data to work properly, and it uses all that data to generate images. Also, AI generated stuff needs to be curated, and prompts need to be carefully crafted to get what you want.
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Aug 21, 2022 18:10
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IShallRiseAgain posted:I know some artists claim that AI generated art is just stealing other people's art, but that is basically what all artists do. They take a bunch of other people's art and transform and combine it in novel ways. taking someone's work wholesale and then claiming as your own after running it through a glorified filter isn't what i would call novel
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Aug 21, 2022 18:17
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Oxxidation posted:taking someone's work wholesale and then claiming as your own after running it through a glorified filter isn't what i would call novel Well, that's what actual artists do too.
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Aug 21, 2022 18:19
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Oxxidation posted:taking someone's work wholesale and then claiming as your own after running it through a glorified filter isn't what i would call novel Art Historian standing in front of entire museum stuffed with "Mona Lisa" Master Copies and studies: "Ummm well, you see......ah hem.....ummmm" Edit: Museum Curator standing in front of Marcel Duchamp's LHOOQ: "It's about, ummm, you see......Art is......*sweats*" Crain fucked around with this message at 18:35 on Aug 21, 2022 |
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Aug 21, 2022 18:24
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Bust Rodd posted:Cartoon Network from ‘96-‘04 was the pinnacle of ‘toonin’. Dexter’s Lab, PPG, Samurai Jack, Courage the Cowardly Dog, Sheep in the Big City, Toonami in the afternoons, Midnight Run, the original Adult Swim line up with Mission Hill and the Oblongs, classic Bugs Bunny and Scooby Doo poo poo on Saturday mornings, classic and obscure animated movies on Friday nights, and enough money flowing into each studio that you got to see hour long specials and Holiday episodes too! I mean Nickelodeon and Disney afternoon provided some semblance of competition but for the most part Cartoon Network absolutely delivered the very best animation you could find anywhere when I was a lad and I loved it dearly. And before they split off Boomerang into its own thing they had all those blocks of classic WB and Turner stuff, including Popeye back to the earliest days. Creator-focused features like the Chuck Jones show and Tex Avery show. Groovies. It was glorious
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Aug 21, 2022 18:33
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IShallRiseAgain posted:I know some artists claim that AI generated art is just stealing other people's art, but that is basically what all artists do. They take a bunch of other people's art and transform and combine it in novel ways. With human artists though it results in a unique style based in the things that they personally thought looked neat and informed by their personal experiences that can be seen through their body of work, eventually becoming their brand that they become known for. One artist can't perfectly copy any style imaginable trivially.
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Aug 21, 2022 18:43
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IShallRiseAgain posted:Well, that's what actual artists do too. Actual artists think.
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Aug 21, 2022 19:30
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Hexmage-SA posted:This is all bad, but just wait until they start using AI to make cartoons so they don't have to pay creatives or worry about them wanting to add LGBT+ representation. I don't know when this will first happen, but given advancements in AI image generators and the lack of value for art the general public has I'm sure it'll happen eventually. Yeah this isn't going to happen. AI works by mixing a bunch of preexisting stuff together based on patterns it finds. It's not actually understanding the work that gets fed into it or communicating anything meaningful. AI generated cartoons would basically be like one of those joke scripts people make for comedy purposes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyK2jbm3mg8 And even if you can get something with an actual comprehensible plot there would be no themes or sincere exploration of ideas (you know, the stuff that makes art interesting). You need a human for that. That said... IShallRiseAgain posted:Personally, I see AI being a really positive for art. It will allow people to be independent creators, and not rely on massive teams of artists, which is really impractical for most people. Modders, for instance, have already been using AI to add voice acting to their mods. If AI gets good enough, people will get a massive variety of choices for media. Absolutely not. The shift from in-house studio employment to what is essentially a gig art economy has been devastating and AI will only exacerbate this. It may not replace human artists but what it can do is replace a bunch of existing jobs (for example the Atlantic is already using it for filler illustrations) and in doing so shrink the pool or corporate money many artists need to live. It may enable artists to make more impressive things on their own, sure, but I'm not sure that this will result in better pay due to the increased competition. You may just end up with bigger (and often worse looking) projects done for the same pay.
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Aug 21, 2022 19:32
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