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dialhforhero posted:Special effects can suffer immensely without the blurring effect of 24fps. Your eyes CAN see at about 60fps and when films are done at higher frames you notice the details of motion more. This can be a big issue in special effects since you can easily create an uncanny valley of sorts if you aren’t really really good at animation. Similarly, I recommend not watching older scifi like Robocop on anything more HD than DVD - I watched it on Blu-ray and the effects looked awful (Amazingly, Alien and Aliens still look fantastic.) Platystemon posted:I don’t see the resemblance. It was right the first time, since it's Australia. 
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Sep 5, 2022 22:04
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Older media on digital, you just have to accept you can not perfectly re-create it, whatever medium you are watching something fundementally different than what people saw in theaters in it's initial release, so when it comes too DVD or blu or 4k a lot of it is just a case by case basis. Like, the best way to watch Live and Die in LA is probably on an old VHS tape where the reds start to bleed a lot, but the Criterion Blu-Ray of Kiss Me Deadly is pure sex.
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Sep 5, 2022 22:12
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Skwirl posted:Older media on digital, you just have to accept you can not perfectly re-create it, whatever medium you are watching something fundementally different than what people saw in theaters in it's initial release, so when it comes too DVD or blu or 4k a lot of it is just a case by case basis. 
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Sep 5, 2022 22:17
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As a slight aside to a subject that's already a derail, and at the risk of becoming the IOSM myself, a really can't stand retrogamers who insist that old games need to be played on CRTs or with godawful CRT filters. That stuff looked like dogshit back in the day and I did everything I could before I got an HD TV to minimize the "feel" of a CRT. Oh, what's that, that's how those games were  intended to look? They were intended to look like dogshit?Also, cf that one loon in the Final Fantasy thread who keeps posting Jorge Luis Borges copypasta in response to AI upscale mods Edit: my one exception to the "no CRT filters" are the scanlines in Caves of Qud. Agents are GO! has a new favorite as of 22:21 on Sep 5, 2022 |
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Sep 5, 2022 22:19
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The version of Ong Bak that had been on streaming a while back was definitely from a grungy 16mm print with over saturated colors and I gotta say it added something to the experience.
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Sep 5, 2022 22:19
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iwentdoodie posted:Guarantee that's a lie. If you have very narrow or very wide feet you can be left out because those sizes are not economically viable. I was born with club feet and after surgery and and braces I still have short, wide feet with almost no arch at all. The kids called me pidgin toed but honestly it's more like big flappy duck feet. Theoretically I wear a 6EEEE. Only specialty stores stock 6EEEE. I usually can't afford that, so if I'm shopping at like Walmart it's a 8 1/2 or 9W which leaves me enough room in the toe box to smuggle hamsters. I often buy men's shoes, because those tend to be a little wider at any given length, but obviously that's restricted to runners and loafers. Presumably a shop for trans men and drag performers would have pretty shoes that were wide enough, but they'd still be way too long. Of course I probably shouldn't wear heels anyway since that would compress the tendons they spent all that money stretching out. But if I lost my mind and wanted to do 1950s housewife cosplay the shoes would be a problem.
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Sep 5, 2022 22:34
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Hihohe posted:Which way western man C: 
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Sep 5, 2022 22:37
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Agents are GO! posted:As a slight aside to a subject that's already a derail, and at the risk of becoming the IOSM myself, a really can't stand retrogamers who insist that old games need to be played on CRTs or with godawful CRT filters. That stuff looked like dogshit back in the day and I did everything I could before I got an HD TV to minimize the "feel" of a CRT. Oh, what's that, that's how those games were Come on over to the Retrogames thread and let's duke it out. The only "wrong" way to play old games is stretching a 4:3 game to fill a 16:9 screen. Stay far away from those people. wash bucket has a new favorite as of 23:04 on Sep 5, 2022 |
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Sep 5, 2022 22:54
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Agents are GO! posted:Similarly, I recommend not watching older scifi like Robocop on anything more HD than DVD - I watched it on Blu-ray and the effects looked awful (Amazingly, Alien and Aliens still look fantastic.) So disagree. Robocop looks fantastic and the stop motion is always a treat
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Sep 5, 2022 23:13
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Sorry to continue the framerate/motion smoothing derail, but I got into a similar one with someone who schooled me on some things a few months back. Can't remember what thread it was, but they pointed out that high framerates are even more important with gaming, specifically VR, than movies. Someone upthread here already reasoned that 24fps is acceptable because film isn't exactly an interactive medium, which makes sense, but when you take into account wearing a VR headset and whipping your head left and right, you need something a lot faster to make the VR environment feel more believable. The other thing they brought up that now I can't unsee, is maybe film's worst kept secret: Panning shots look like garbage. Maybe this isn't necessarily a framerate thing, but there's a reason filmmakers these days tend to avoid long stationary pans, they have this almost nauseating drag feeling to them. The last thing they mentioned, that I still haven't gotten my head around, is that the whole idea of 'our eyes having a framerate' isn't really true. If anyone can elucidate on this that'd be fascinating, because I can't really visualize how else our eyes could work. It makes sense that 24fps was more borne out of economical and mechanical concerns at the time, though.
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Sep 5, 2022 23:15
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That dragging actually kicks rear end and helps with editing using whip pans
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Sep 5, 2022 23:18
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Agents are GO! posted:As a slight aside to a subject that's already a derail, and at the risk of becoming the IOSM myself, a really can't stand retrogamers who insist that old games need to be played on CRTs or with godawful CRT filters. That stuff looked like dogshit back in the day and I did everything I could before I got an HD TV to minimize the "feel" of a CRT. Oh, what's that, that's how those games were 
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Sep 5, 2022 23:21
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ynohtna posted:what the gently caress?! Meet Kristina and Galip Ozturk
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Sep 5, 2022 23:32
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Agents are GO! posted:As a slight aside to a subject that's already a derail, and at the risk of becoming the IOSM myself, a really can't stand retrogamers who insist that old games need to be played on CRTs or with godawful CRT filters. That stuff looked like dogshit back in the day and I did everything I could before I got an HD TV to minimize the "feel" of a CRT. Oh, what's that, that's how those games were The only good NTSC/CRT filters are the ones that get real crunchy with it, like a good lovely fuzz pedal for guitar. Horizontal bleed, image retention, way more edge curvature than you’d expect to be acceptable in a consumer product, color bleeding, mmm… Just make it take ten minutes for the circuits to warm up before it’ll recognize an RF signal on channel three and it’s like I’m back in my basement in 1995 again.
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Sep 5, 2022 23:35
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yeah it's not that they didn't look like poo poo, it's that they look even worse now they did a lot of genius stuff with the tech at the time
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Sep 5, 2022 23:36
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Dewgy posted:Just make it take ten minutes for the circuits to warm up before it’ll recognize an RF signal on channel three and it’s like I’m back in my basement in 1995 again. Tangentially related, but you might get a kick out of this conversation between a couple of producers thinking up useless and hilarious audio plugins. a limiter with a built-in comb filter you can't turn off gets me every time
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Sep 5, 2022 23:44
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Mister Speaker posted:Tangentially related, but you might get a kick out of this conversation between a couple of producers thinking up useless and hilarious audio plugins. Now that’s my kinda poo poo!  See also, The Turd. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87kB4iAtbJQ
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Sep 5, 2022 23:49
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What am I missing because I just watched a handful of SotN videos on youtube and none of them have red dot eyes like that
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Sep 5, 2022 23:55
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Emulators usually have filter modes you can use to try and simulate the blurriness of CRTs, but yeah if you just output the raw pixels in HD it often looks quite weird because a CRT is basically a filter in and of itself and graphics were designed to be put through it. Sort of like how modern games might be designed with the assumption you would be using some sort of ambient occlusion and they look rather flatly lit if you turn it off. This one seems to have been using close to original sprites and seems minimally compressed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIODe7RGo7k OwlFancier has a new favorite as of 00:02 on Sep 6, 2022 |
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Sep 5, 2022 23:56
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Len posted:What am I missing because I just watched a handful of SotN videos on youtube and none of them have red dot eyes like that YouTube compression strikes again.
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Sep 5, 2022 23:59
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Dewgy posted:Now that’s my kinda poo poo! Sounds like a pretty good fuzz pedal. Clever about the way it's packaged, too. Reminds me of this, a pedal that makes everything sound like cassette-tape black metal https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WcsV7hQ1V4 My buddy has a pedal that you can put fluids into to change its timbre. I think it works on capacitance or something, but you pop out this little capsule and fill it with whatever fluid you want and you get different tones out of it.
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Sep 6, 2022 00:03
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Found one, I just had to keep clicking If I wasn't looking for them I wouldn't have noticed because it doesn't matter
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Sep 6, 2022 00:03
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Mister Speaker posted:My buddy has a pedal that you can put fluids into to change its timbre. I think it works on capacitance or something, but you pop out this little capsule and fill it with whatever fluid you want and you get different tones out of it. Finally, the tri mode piss, poo poo, and cum pedal.
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Sep 6, 2022 00:04
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Len posted:What am I missing because I just watched a handful of SotN videos on youtube and none of them have red dot eyes like that Like yeah there are obviously cherry-picked extreme examples going on to magnify the difference but either way it's really clear that CRTs made a huge difference in the fidelity of pixel art back then, and pixel art prior to the early 00s was designed with CRTs in mind.
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Sep 6, 2022 00:05
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mind the walrus posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw2QfPREu-Q none of that is worth having to deal with a crt in 2022
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Sep 6, 2022 00:06
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To some people it would be, like no you don't have to have one to play the games and that's good, but if you want to actually see them as they would have been seen when they were made, you do probably want a CRT.
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Sep 6, 2022 00:16
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Len posted:If I wasn't looking for them I wouldn't have noticed because it doesn't matter Buddy, nothing matters.
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Sep 6, 2022 00:31
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Can we skip this argument this time? It happens every time someone brings up CRTs and the filters and all that poo poo, and it's always tedious and both sides just yell past each other.
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Sep 6, 2022 00:35
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Fine, I'll change the subject and talk about my vinyl record collection.
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Sep 6, 2022 00:37
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McCracAttack posted:Fine, I'll change the subject and talk about my vinyl record collection. at least vinyls are still taken by goodwill and trash collectors
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Sep 6, 2022 00:37
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McCracAttack posted:Fine, I'll change the subject and talk about my vinyl record collection. I generally collect vinyls of records that are important to me. I really want to get my hands on F# A# Infinity by Godspeed you Black Emperor, cus I want to experience the lock track at the end.
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Sep 6, 2022 00:39
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Did someone say vinyl? Is this the thread to talk about funko pops?
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Sep 6, 2022 00:42
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Real music fans listen to wax cylinders
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Sep 6, 2022 00:45
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I like the look of the left, the right looks like poo poo. Len posted:none of that is worth having to deal with a crt in 2022 
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Sep 6, 2022 00:48
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Tenebrais posted:Real music fans listen to wax cylinders https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fA9sJ3LBwg&t=40s
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Sep 6, 2022 00:49
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lol at consuming produced media. If I want to hear a song I'll just read the sheet music.
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Sep 6, 2022 01:00
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Agents are GO! posted:I like the look of the left, the right looks like poo poo. Neither is what you would see on a crt.
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Sep 6, 2022 01:03
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Exactly.
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Sep 6, 2022 01:07
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Mister Speaker posted:The last thing they mentioned, that I still haven't gotten my head around, is that the whole idea of 'our eyes having a framerate' isn't really true. If anyone can elucidate on this that'd be fascinating, because I can't really visualize how else our eyes could work. It makes sense that 24fps was more borne out of economical and mechanical concerns at the time, though. Frames are a convenient way for our technology to handle images that change over time, but they can also be treated as continuous phenomena, varying smoothly across time. Perhaps it’s easiest to conceive of this by analogy to audio. Digital audio uses discrete samples forty thousand times per second or so, but there is a long tradition of analog representations of sound, whether as grooves in vinyl or magnetic domains in tape or marks on a strip of film.  Do this for each pixel in an image and you’ve eliminated frames. Platystemon has a new favorite as of 01:38 on Sep 6, 2022 |
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Sep 6, 2022 01:07
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Skwirl posted:Neither is what you would see on a crt.
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