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Wasn’t there a mention in the book about Legolas walking on top of the snow when they were trying to go up Carhradras?
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Sep 7, 2022 21:59
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MrMojok posted:Wasn’t there a mention in the book about Legolas walking on top of the snow when they were trying to go up Carhradras? Wouldn't surprise me. In any case, has anyone ever complained about him walking on the snow?
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Sep 7, 2022 22:00
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zoux posted:Also he can walk on snow which is just not possible at all. That was directly out of the book.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:01
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lol if you "sink" when you walk on snow, looks like someone has never gazed upon the Light of Valinor yeah i know Legolas didn't!!
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Sep 7, 2022 22:03
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hot take: I was fine with the stupid Legolas bullshit because it made up for his lack of being interesting in any other way
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Sep 7, 2022 22:06
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Xibanya posted:hot take: I was fine with the stupid Legolas bullshit because it made up for his lack of being interesting in any other way How could you say something so brave, yet also so correct?
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Sep 7, 2022 22:08
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Randarkman posted:Wouldn't surprise me. In any case, has anyone ever complained about him walking on the snow? Not sure, but people are for sure complaining about Galadriel using the other dude's sword as a platform.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:16
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rkd_ posted:Not sure, but people are for sure complaining about Galadriel using the other dude's sword as a platform. Yes. Because that was bad.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:20
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rkd_ posted:Not sure, but people are for sure complaining about Galadriel using the other dude's sword as a platform. Galadriel and Elf were just running a Flip Six Three Hole play.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:20
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Presto posted:That was directly out of the book. Yeah I know. It's still ridiculous and impossible outside of some sort of elven magic, but you don't hear anyone complaining about that.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:22
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Mystery dude is definitely going to turn out to be Sauron.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:23
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Hollismason posted:Mystery dude is definitely going to turn out to be Sauron. He already said he is a different character named Anteater.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:23
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Mystery dude is so fuckin gangly I refuse to believe he's Gandalf or Sauron or Saruman or anybody whose identity is not tied to being a spaghettiman
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Sep 7, 2022 22:25
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zoux posted:Yeah I know. It's still ridiculous and impossible outside of some sort of elven magic, but you don't hear anyone complaining about that. You don't see a difference between that and the oliphant scene or sword ramp? Though I will say the problem with the sword ramp isn't that it's unrealistic or magic, it's just that it's so stupid. The oliphant falls in the same category I think, though it is also ludicrously over the top.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:26
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Legolas Fred Flinstoning down a trunk was the greatest scene in all of cinematic history 
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Sep 7, 2022 22:29
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Randarkman posted:You don't see a difference between that and the oliphant scene or sword ramp? Though I will say the problem with the sword ramp isn't that it's unrealistic or magic, it's just that it's so stupid. The oliphant falls in the same category I think, though it is also ludicrously over the top. I do not give a poo poo/think it's badass
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Sep 7, 2022 22:31
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Randarkman posted:You don't see a difference between that and the oliphant scene or sword ramp? Though I will say the problem with the sword ramp isn't that it's unrealistic or magic, it's just that it's so stupid. The oliphant falls in the same category I think, though it is also ludicrously over the top. At least a sword kinda makes sense for giving you a boost, since it'd bend a bit then spring back. Doesn't just break because it's a magic elf sword.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:31
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Randarkman posted:Yes. Because that was bad. Actually I checked and it turned out to be "cool as gently caress" just like the legolas poo poo. Sorry!
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Sep 7, 2022 22:32
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zoux posted:I do not give a poo poo/think it's badass Cool, well I do not. I think it's one of many things wrong with action scenes in alot of movies in say the past decade or two. The primary culprit is probably super hero movies, but I think the current trend probably started for real with the LotR movies. Which overall I do love, but they are not without their issues. appropriatemetaphor posted:At least a sword kinda makes sense for giving you a boost, since it'd bend a bit then spring back. The strict realism of it is not the issue.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:34
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Then what is the issue
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Sep 7, 2022 22:37
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zoux posted:Then what is the issue Randarkman posted:You don't see a difference between that and the oliphant scene or sword ramp? Though I will say the problem with the sword ramp isn't that it's unrealistic or magic, it's just that it's so stupid. The oliphant falls in the same category I think, though it is also ludicrously over the top. I'd say mostly because I think it looks stupid and that I know the reason for it being there is because of the dumb legolas stuff from the movie trilogy and Hobbit and seeing that rear its ugly head again is just filling me with embarassment and apprehension. It's also a general thing with movies having their characters in action scenes always doing these totally badass moves and at the very worst end of it just having characters turn into CGI and flip all over the place. At that very worst end of it basic phyiscs and whatever kind of just being ignored is part of it, but mostly becuase it just deflates any sense of tension or danger. I'd much rather have people just wail at each other and get bruised and sweaty.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:47
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So like, just how hard to read is The Silmarillion? This show (and this thread) has me watching YouTube videos of Tolkien lore, and I was wondering if I should finally give it a shot, after avoiding it for years. I've been told it's like reading the Bible. Super dense? Quick note if it helps for the recommendation, I dislike the singing portions of the LOTR books. Just tend to skip right over them. From what I'm seeing, that, uh, comes up. Randarkman posted:Someone posted this in another thread, interview with the guy who plays meteor man That is a really strangely written "article", because nothing in his quotes say he's Annatar, or that his purpose is to forge the rings. His quotes could apply to anyone, or any number of purposes. The unquoted parts extrapolate an awful lot, so I'd like to know the source.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:49
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A half elf and the eagles fought and killed Ancalagon the Black. Why can't Legolas and Galadriel do whatever they want? These aren't D&D elves. They're basically Kryptoninans. https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Ancalagon Seeing people complain about superhuman beings in a magical world - as in a world we don't even know abides the laws of physics or has them as we understand - is extremely confusing. Noam Chomsky fucked around with this message at 22:53 on Sep 7, 2022 |
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Sep 7, 2022 22:51
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Noam Chomsky posted:A half elf and the eagles fought and killed Ancalagon the Black. Why can't Legolas and Galadriel do whatever they want? Because that sucks and would be terrible.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:52
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thrawn527 posted:So like, just how hard to read is The Silmarillion? This show (and this thread) has me watching YouTube videos of Tolkien lore, and I was wondering if I should finally give it a shot, after avoiding it for years. I've been told it's like reading the Bible. Super dense? As someone who has read the Silmarillion twice, yes it's a slog. Facebook meme nails it pretty well:  But again, I like it enough I've read it more than once. If you're watching YouTube videos of Tolkien lore at least give it a whirl, you know whether you're gonna make it or not fairly quickly I'd say.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:52
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thrawn527 posted:So like, just how hard to read is The Silmarillion? This show (and this thread) has me watching YouTube videos of Tolkien lore, and I was wondering if I should finally give it a shot, after avoiding it for years. I've been told it's like reading the Bible. Super dense? Stick with the videos
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Sep 7, 2022 22:53
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Randarkman posted:Yes. Because that was bad. If an Elf can run on snow without so much as denting it I think they can also be launched off of a sword. Randarkman posted:I'd say mostly because I think it looks stupid and that I know the reason for it being there is because of the dumb legolas stuff from the movie trilogy and Hobbit and seeing that rear its ugly head again is just filling me with embarassment and apprehension. It's also a general thing with movies having their characters in action scenes always doing these totally badass moves and at the very worst end of it just having characters turn into CGI and flip all over the place. At that very worst end of it basic phyiscs and whatever kind of just being ignored is part of it, but mostly becuase it just deflates any sense of tension or danger. I'd much rather have people just wail at each other and get bruised and sweaty. I don't disagree with you, but it was one very quick scene to establish Galadriel as a powerful and skilled warrior, nothing more. We don't know how the actual important battles of the show will look, but I don't think this one is necessarily indicative.
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Sep 7, 2022 22:55
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Randarkman posted:Because that sucks and would be terrible. But elves in middle earth can clearly do what is shown given that they accomplish much more insanity in the books. Fingolfin fought Morgoth. Do you know how large and powerful Morgoth was? People complaining about this stuff don't even like Lord of the Ring let alone this show. https://the-lords-of-the-rings.fandom.com/wiki/Morgoth Too many seem to have come to this from D&D and don't understand elves in Arda aren't just "humans but longer lived with extra points in charisma." Noam Chomsky fucked around with this message at 23:01 on Sep 7, 2022 |
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Sep 7, 2022 22:56
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Noam Chomsky posted:But elves in middle earth can clearly do what is shown given that they accomplish much more insanity in the books. I hadn't really thought of this yet but you hit the nail on the head. With the release of this show I see so many people going "I love Lord of the Rings, but I just hate how *insert something that is typically Lord of the Rings*." It feels like they want to strip away everything and end up with Game of Thrones. It's the worst on social media where people not only pretend to love Lord of the Rings but also claim that they have deep and vast knowledge of the universe and that everything they don't like is not part of it.
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Sep 7, 2022 23:01
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thrawn527 posted:So like, just how hard to read is The Silmarillion? This show (and this thread) has me watching YouTube videos of Tolkien lore, and I was wondering if I should finally give it a shot, after avoiding it for years. I've been told it's like reading the Bible. Super dense? I can speak only for myself, and you’ll have others in the thread chime in too. For me, I fell in love with The Hobbit at the age of 7 or so, and then with LotR at about the age of 11. I tried to read the Sil at maybe 16 or so, and it was a real slog. I trudged through it and did finish it, but for me it was a very difficult read. It was the language, it was the format, it was very dense. It was a lot of things. I had my hard copy of the Sil for a long time and looked at parts of it when I was in my late 20s but never again read the whole thing. I read everything on Kindle now, and I do think it would be a good Kindle buy because with that you can highlight and make notes and whatnot, so I could highlight important sections and events. I need to buy it someday and do that, and try again to read it start to finish.
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Sep 7, 2022 23:02
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thrawn527 posted:So like, just how hard to read is The Silmarillion? This show (and this thread) has me watching YouTube videos of Tolkien lore, and I was wondering if I should finally give it a shot, after avoiding it for years. I've been told it's like reading the Bible. Super dense? Noam Chomsky posted:But elves in middle earth can clearly do what is shown given that they accomplish much more insanity in the books. If neither side can imagine why this aesthetic divide exists ("it looks cool vs it looks bad") then no amount explaining can bridge the gap. Llamadeus fucked around with this message at 23:11 on Sep 7, 2022 |
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Sep 7, 2022 23:03
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Noam Chomsky posted:People complaining about this stuff don't even like Lord of the Ring let alone this show. This is the worst argument. And no, I'm not blown away by the show and came in extremely cynical based on the whole unecessary nature of it and Amazon being behind. I did think the second episode was better than the first one and I clearly am interested enough in the source material to check it out, something I probably wouldn't have done for another show I was this cynical about. So you can gently caress off with saying I "don't like Lord of the Rings" because I happen to think that series (LotR mostly in RotK) and the Hobbit got way too indulgent in their action scenes, particularly when Legolas was around, as they went on in a way that I thought was detrimental to my enjoyment of them. People like different things for different reasons, but "just turn off your brain and watch the super heroes/transformers fly around for 30 minutes " was always the worst rationalization/justification for those types of scenes/movies. If the show avoids this kind of stuff going forwards it will be so much better for it. Randarkman fucked around with this message at 23:06 on Sep 7, 2022 |
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Sep 7, 2022 23:03
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The Silmarillion owns, imo, and i want to read it again after watching the show/reading the discussions about it, but do keep the wiki at hand because it's hard to remember every name.
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Sep 7, 2022 23:05
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i know its dumb but i love this
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Sep 7, 2022 23:11
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rkd_ posted:I hadn't really thought of this yet but you hit the nail on the head. With the release of this show I see so many people going "I love Lord of the Rings, but I just hate how *insert something that is typically Lord of the Rings*." It feels like they want to strip away everything and end up with Game of Thrones. Pretty much. I don't care if people don't like the show but many of the complaints show how ignorant they are of the source material. What they want is a big budget adaptation of the Critical Role campaign or something. Tolkein's works inspired the fantasy genre but most of the tropes people are familiar with are from Dungeons & Dragons - namely Forgotten Realms - and similar. I don't blame people for not knowing but at least do research before hating on something you think is implausible that just isn't. So much is tied up in the cosmology if the universe of LotR. You don't see Gandalf do a lot of actual magic because he isn't supposed to. He's supposed to help and meddle. That's why Eru doesn't just banish Sauron to the void. There's a decent reason for most of the things people are complaining about but they can't and won't use Google.
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Sep 7, 2022 23:12
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What? How are you getting any of that from anything in this thread?
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Sep 7, 2022 23:13
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Randarkman posted:This is the worst argument. And no, I'm not blown away by the show and came in extremely cynical based on the whole unecessary nature of it and Amazon being behind. I did think the second episode was better than the first one and I clearly am interested enough in the source material to check it out, something I probably wouldn't have done for another show I was this cynical about. So you can gently caress off with saying I "don't like Lord of the Rings" because I happen to think that series (LotR mostly in RotK) and the Hobbit got way too indulgent in their action scenes, particularly when Legolas was around, as they went on in a way that I thought was detrimental to my enjoyment of them. Clearly you don't like the source material because elves in the silmarilion may as well be DragonBall Z characters. You can dislike the show without inventing nonsensical reasons not to. It's ok!
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Sep 7, 2022 23:14
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Llamadeus posted:The distinction Randarkman isn't about power levels or whatever, it's fundamentally an aesthetic one: ie when you read you are free not to imagine anything as aesthetically awful as an elf holding up a sword as a little ramp for another elf to run up. This will probably improve as more episodes are released but it was literally a fight that lasted a couple of seconds and all Galadriel did was run on top of the sword and jumped. There were no crazy gravity-defying jumps, 360s or any other action move that would be too far out of the realm of possibility. I understand that it looked a little ridiculous, but I don't get the fixation on it or how it could seemingly spoil the rest of the episode. I especially hate the comparisons to the troll fight in LoTR as everything about that was way different.
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Sep 7, 2022 23:15
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I loved the Silmarillion. I couldn't tell you how many times I read it as a teenager. Once you've read it through once it's the sort of book where you can just go back and read specific chapters. It's all one narrative in chronological order but it's better to approach it as anthology of short stories.
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Sep 7, 2022 23:15
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It's funny but I've seen some people complain about how slow the first two episodes are and that's actually why I like it. I appreciate that they're taking their time rather than rushing from point A to point B like late season GOT did. My biggest complaint remains how they (and Peter Jackson) portray the Dwarves. They're a lot more serious and somber in tone in the books. Actually the way they portrayed Durin III is exactly my vision of the Dwarves. I wish they were all like that rather than the more comical portrayal they went for with Gimli (and, so far, Durin IV). As for the battle scenes, I prefer those to be mostly grounded but I don't mind a little flash here and there. Most of Tolkien's battle scenes involve heroes prevailing against bad (or even impossible) odds anyways. Boromir kills countless orcs before he's subdued. Theoden and company charge out of Helm's Deep and plow through an army before help arrives, etc.
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Sep 7, 2022 23:16
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