|
numptyboy posted:Same. The bike is cool and is probably really good, but imo i feel like the extra pulley ( especially on an ebduro style bike) is probably going to invite way more wear and maintenance than a more 'traditional' designs. Probably not much more than the other pivots in a multilink design. Many high pivots are single pivots, so that offsets the complexity somewhate. The pulley wheel probably won't see the same amount of grit that the ones in the RD would, but replacing it once in a blue moon wouldn't be a huge burden.
|
#
?
Sep 6, 2022 18:32
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 20, 2024 21:47 |
|
|
numptyboy posted:Ive never felt like pedal kick back adversely affects my riding to any great degree. I way more limited by skill level. The point of the whole design (high pivot + idler pulley) is not to reduce pedal kickback, it's to have that rearward axle path under compression that is meant to make the bike smoother, more stable, more forgiving when riding rough terrain. The idler pulley is there because without it, a high pivot design would have worse pedal kickback; so you not having any issues with pedal kickback on a non-high-pivot bike doesn't really have much bearing on whether the idler pulley is necessary or important for a high pivot bike.
|
|
#
?
Sep 6, 2022 19:50
|
|
|
Chain growth on a high pivot is way too much for the derailleur even if you didn't care about kickback. Idler also lets you tune the antisquat, which would otherwise be super dependent on the main pivot position. Linkage is a fun tool to play around with if you are interested in this stuff.
|
|
#
?
Sep 6, 2022 20:41
|
|
|
Mexican Radio posted:I commend this poster for understanding that a partner in need of an upgrade is, in fact, a great reason to buy a new bike for yourself. Finally someone besides me understands how true gift giving works  And yeah thats the bike. Its fuckin great for 1200, thats a drat good sale. The front axle is not boost spacing, I think its old school 100mm. I bought mine lightly used with some maxxis aggressors on it and it does a great job on the local trails. Hopefully she finds it more fun to shred than her old bike!
|
|
#
?
Sep 7, 2022 02:11
|
|
|
Aphex- posted:Good poo poo. The vast majority of modern enduro bikes are designed to be comfortable to pedal uphill so "too much bike" isn't really a thing anymore. I regularly do 40km, 1300m days on my 175mm travel 62.5 degree head angle beast that weighs like 17kgs and it's totally fine. Awesome. You guys (and various internet reviews of this bike) def assuaged my concerns with pedalling. Taking it out for a rip(mo, he) tomorrow, I will report back then.
|
|
#
?
Sep 7, 2022 02:15
|
|
|
Hello I bought a cloud with wheels. Man I missed full suspension. Polygon D7  
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2022 01:56
|
|
|
drat, Ryobi makes bikes now too (nice bike, grats)
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2022 02:04
|
|
|
ddiddles posted:Hello I bought a cloud with wheels. Man I missed full suspension. Nice bike!
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2022 02:04
|
|
|
The UP is still great. Rode a bunch of new to me trails up in Copper Harbor today. Had a blast. Thanks for playing tour guide Spime Wrangler and for not dropping me on the last climb!Suburban Dad posted:drat, Ryobi makes bikes now too Loled at this pretty good.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2022 03:56
|
|
|
spwrozek posted:The UP is still great. Rode a bunch of new to me trails up in Copper Harbor today. Had a blast. Thanks for playing tour guide Spime Wrangler and for not dropping me on the last climb! I cant wait to get up there and try Copper Harbor.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2022 05:22
|
|
|
I washed my bike, it's far too hot in socal right now. This is not where my bike lives, it has a nice cozy spot on the wall in the living room.
|
|
#
?
Sep 9, 2022 07:51
|
|
|
Not exactly what you want to see, shattered ceramic piston in my rear XT brake caliper... I think it's been that way for a while as my rear brake seemed to be losing fluid somewhere and the pad has worn unevenly. I only noticed when I went to bleed the brakes myself for the first time (have had it done at the shop before) and noticed one of the pistons was jammed. Unfortunately Shimano don't consider brake calipers serviceable and so they don't sell rebuild kits or replacement pistons, and there are no new or second-hand calipers in-stock anywhere in NZ that I could find. I bought a third-party rebuild kit off Amazon and replaced all the pistons and seals today, brake seems to work fine now but will have to see how it goes long-term I guess. It was amazing how many tiny chunks of ground up ceramic there were in the caliper, I can see why Shimano wouldn't sell a rebuild kit as it would be really easy to miss cleaning out all of the grit and have the new seals leak or pistons lock up.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 04:48
|
|
|
Why the gently caress would anyone make those out of ceramic? It's to save like 2 grams isn't it. Also lol at calipers not being officially rebuildable, what the hell
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 05:02
|
|
|
Slavvy posted:Why the gently caress would anyone make those out of ceramic? It's to save like 2 grams isn't it. I think in theory it's thermal? Like the ceramic can take a lot of heat and is an insulator to stop the fluid on the back of the piston from boiling. But uhhh, I'm pretty sure that I've never braked so hard and for so long that I'd come close to melting the piston or boiling the fluid in my rear brake caliper even if they were made out of something other than ceramic. The rebuild kit has the pistons made out of fibre reinforced phenolic and people seem happy with them so I'm sure they'll do the job for me too (and won't shatter).
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 05:12
|
|
|
Slavvy posted:Why the gently caress would anyone make those out of ceramic? It's to save like 2 grams isn't it. You can rebuild SRAM calipers.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 06:36
|
|
|
vikingstrike posted:You can rebuild SRAM calipers. In my experience you also have to bleed SRAM brakes almost monthly.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 08:57
|
|
|
Nohearum posted:In my experience you also have to bleed SRAM brakes almost monthly. This hasn’t been my experience over the last several years but that’s unfortunate if you’re doing it that much. I usually do a bleed a year when I overhaul things at the end of the season.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 14:31
|
|
|
vikingstrike posted:You can rebuild SRAM calipers. the easy rebuild process is to have your bike shop RMA them
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 15:05
|
|
|
Blackhawk posted:I think in theory it's thermal? Like the ceramic can take a lot of heat and is an insulator to stop the fluid on the back of the piston from boiling. But uhhh, I'm pretty sure that I've never braked so hard and for so long that I'd come close to melting the piston or boiling the fluid in my rear brake caliper even if they were made out of something other than ceramic. The rebuild kit has the pistons made out of fibre reinforced phenolic and people seem happy with them so I'm sure they'll do the job for me too (and won't shatter). Believe them or not but yeah lower end Shimano brakes don’t use ceramic but that also means they say you can only use resin pads with those since they don’t put back as much heat into the caliper as metal
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 16:19
|
|
|
Frozen Pizza Party posted:I washed my bike, it's far too hot in socal right now. This is not where my bike lives, it has a nice cozy spot on the wall in the living room. 
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 17:32
|
|
|
Levitate posted:Believe them or not but yeah lower end Shimano brakes don’t use ceramic but that also means they say you can only use resin pads with those since they don’t put back as much heat into the caliper as metal The 'resin only' is for the discs. You can run metallic pads on any Shimano calipers.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 18:00
|
|
|
Since we're all talking about it - just a reminder not to use anything metal (tire levers, screwdrivers, etc) when you are pushing your ceramic pistons back into the caliper - it's a very easy way to damage or destroy them.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 18:21
|
|
|
My not-bicycle-mechanic opinion is that if you're overheating the caliper before the disk, the caliper is chronically underbuilt, maybe to meet unreasonable weight expectations. Ceramic pistons are particularly dumb imo because they'd reduce the heat flowing into the liquid you have right there to act as a cooling medium and the caliper you have right there to act as a heat sink, steel or alloy just makes more sense to me. But I'm also a slow and lovely rider and have trouble imagining how you can brake for so long and so hard on an MTB that you'd overheat much of anything.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 19:46
|
|
|
Slavvy posted:My not-bicycle-mechanic opinion is that if you're overheating the caliper before the disk, the caliper is chronically underbuilt, maybe to meet unreasonable weight expectations. Ceramic pistons are particularly dumb imo because they'd reduce the heat flowing into the liquid you have right there to act as a cooling medium and the caliper you have right there to act as a heat sink, steel or alloy just makes more sense to me. I think the reasoning is you want to keep the heat out of the liquid so it doesn't affect the action of the brake. The heat has a comparatively easy time leaving the pad vs the fluid insulated in the hose and caliper/lever. The disc of course gets hotter at peak temps than the caliper, but you want to keep as much heat on the pad/rotor side of things since those are actively cooled by air.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 19:53
|
|
|
Idk all I know is in motorbikes, the heat travels through the fluid right up to the reservoir, which acts as a big old heat sink. Likewise the caliper itself acts as a heat sink. The disk on a bicycle is so small and flimsy and traveling relatively slowly that I don't think it has much heat dissipation capacity before it warps/the pad starts to fail, but maybe that's an intentional weakness, like a sort of thermal fuse? Again I return to the idea that the weight expectation is unreasonable in relation to the performance expectation. Is bicycle brake fluid hydroscopic?
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 20:04
|
|
|
Slavvy posted:Idk all I know is in motorbikes, the heat travels through the fluid right up to the reservoir, which acts as a big old heat sink. Likewise the caliper itself acts as a heat sink. The disk on a bicycle is so small and flimsy and traveling relatively slowly that I don't think it has much heat dissipation capacity before it warps, but maybe that's an intentional weakness, like a sort of thermal fuse? Again I return to the idea that the weight expectation is unreasonable in relation to the performance expectation. On mountain bikes, discs are so thin that they never warp, and the heat is so quickly distributed through it so you don't get the phenomenon of unequal cooling and warping. The action of the air travelling over the disc provides an immense degree of overall cooling relative to the mass of the disc (compared to the cooling of air over the disc of a moto disc). It's a completely different problem being solved - the caliper and fluid and everything else in the system is definitely a heat sink in the technical sense but heat is so quickly dissipated from the rotor and pad that it makes sense to do what you can to keep that heat in there. I want to say also that MTB hydraulic brake systems allow for less thermal expansion of the fluid relative to other applications. What I mean is if you were to linearly scale a MTB brake up to moto proportions you would find the reservoir is quite small in comparison. I don't have data that supports that. e: The two fluids used in MTB hydraulic brake systems are DOT fluids and mineral oil. Neither are hydroscopic and obviously the DOT stuff is the same as what you'd see in moto/automotive applications.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 20:17
|
|
|
DOT is definitely hydroscopic, that's part of the reason it's used in the first place. It has to be able to absorb moisture so you don't get discreet pockets of water turning to steam if you leave the thing parked for a few months then go for a ride/drive. I think you're right about mtb's having comparatively tiny reservoirs, to me that just reinforces the idea that things are underbuilt to save weight. Idk if a bicycle disc gets more cooling than a moto disc considering it's spinning much slower, has less surface area, doesn't have a big clunky wheel to dump heat into, but I'll defer to someone who knows more than me. There's a lot of BS in bicycle marketing though.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 20:23
|
|
|
I put an XT shifter on my Stanton and it is a thing of beauty. No mush, no pushing past the click to finish a shift. It just clicks and goes.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 20:36
|
|
|
When you cook your brakes on an extended downhill section the lever firms up as you keep it held (and you lose power / pads sound like they're dying). I assume this is because the system is only open to the reservoir when you release the lever. I guess this effect would be worse with a more conductive piston. If that is the reason it may be less of a problem for motos where you have more brake caliper/disc thermal mass to rider/bike weight (and less extended brake holding on downhills)? Edit: Here is the SRAM take on it. 
pinarello dogman fucked around with this message at 21:03 on Sep 11, 2022 |
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 20:53
|
|
|
Slavvy posted:DOT is definitely hydroscopic, that's part of the reason it's used in the first place. It has to be able to absorb moisture so you don't get discreet pockets of water turning to steam if you leave the thing parked for a few months then go for a ride/drive. I think you're right about mtb's having comparatively tiny reservoirs, to me that just reinforces the idea that things are underbuilt to save weight. Yeah sorry DOT (SRAM and others) is hydroscopic and mineral oil (shimano and others) isn't. Not going to repeat all the same stuff about discs but yeah the bikes are able to keep heat from being an issue. I don't think anything is underbuilt to save weight - it's engineered to be as much material as is needed and having more material for no reason is undesirable. Having said all this I do run slightly longer hoses and tell myself I'm getting an advantage by having more fluid mass to heat up and more housing surface area for cooling of it (the latter is almost certainly trivial).
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 20:57
|
|
|
pinarello dogman posted:When you cook your brakes on an extended downhill section the lever firms up as you keep it held (and you lose power / pads sound like they're dying). I assume this is because the system is only open to the reservoir when you release the lever. I guess this effect would be worse with a more conductive piston. Wait so on mtb's it's normal to just drag the brake for ages and ages? Cause yeah I've spent years training myself to use the brakes relatively briefly but hard to avoid chronic overheating on motorbikes. If that's the case then it is definitely a different problem and I'm also even worse at mtb riding than I realized, if that's possible. VelociBacon posted:Yeah sorry DOT (SRAM and others) is hydroscopic and mineral oil (shimano and others) isn't. It works on power steering lines, you just need an extra 3ft of hose
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 21:12
|
|
|
Slavvy posted:Wait so on mtb's it's normal to just drag the brake for ages and ages? Cause yeah I've spent years training myself to use the brakes relatively briefly but hard to avoid chronic overheating on motorbikes. If that's the case then it is definitely a different problem and I'm also even worse at mtb riding than I realized, if that's possible.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 21:20
|
|
|
HAIL eSATA-n posted:Dragging brakes is bad for multiple reasons, including not letting stuff cool down. Proper form is to brake in areas of high traction and release brakes going into areas of low traction or obstacles. Braking briefly and hard in areas of high traction, and feathering them if needed for control in areas of low traction, is the correct way Ok that makes me feel better!
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 21:29
|
|
|
Slavvy posted:Idk all I know is in motorbikes, the heat travels through the fluid right up to the reservoir, which acts as a big old heat sink. Likewise the caliper itself acts as a heat sink. The disk on a bicycle is so small and flimsy and traveling relatively slowly that I don't think it has much heat dissipation capacity before it warps/the pad starts to fail, but maybe that's an intentional weakness, like a sort of thermal fuse? Again I return to the idea that the weight expectation is unreasonable in relation to the performance expectation. I don’t think it really has anything to do with weight.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 22:29
|
|
|
HAIL eSATA-n posted:Dragging brakes is bad for multiple reasons, including not letting stuff cool down. Proper form is to brake in areas of high traction and release brakes going into areas of low traction or obstacles. Braking briefly and hard in areas of high traction, and feathering them if needed for control in areas of low traction, is the correct way While this is true, there are many, many riders (myself included) that aren’t the best at doing this. Especially when things get technical and steep, I’ll keep the brakes on a good bit to not get more speed than I feel comfortable with. And, yes, I know this isn’t ideal. No, I don’t need a lecture, it’s something I work on. And depending on where you live, downhills can be multiple miles long in the bigger mountains.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 22:34
|
|
|
vikingstrike posted:While this is true, there are many, many riders (myself included) that aren’t the best at doing this. Especially when things get technical and steep, I’ll keep the brakes on a good bit to not get more speed than I feel comfortable with. And, yes, I know this isn’t ideal. No, I don’t need a lecture, it’s something I work on. Oh I'm terrible and ride my brakes all the time 
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 22:57
|
|
|
HAIL eSATA-n posted:Oh I'm terrible and ride my brakes all the time It’s annoying because I actually think about it while riding and my brain can’t stop doing the same thing!
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 23:00
|
|
|
Slavvy posted:Wait so on mtb's it's normal to just drag the brake for ages and ages? Cause yeah I've spent years training myself to use the brakes relatively briefly but hard to avoid chronic overheating on motorbikes. If that's the case then it is definitely a different problem and I'm also even worse at mtb riding than I realized, if that's possible. You shouldn't be dragging your brakes if you can help it. Most trails are built so you have flatter sections where you can let up without getting out of control, but if its like 500+ m vert of 30% grade or something then it can be tough to get off the brakes long enough for them to cool down.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2022 23:22
|
|
|
I've only ridden one trail where I really felt like I was going too hard on my brakes and it was a ~300m vertical descent grade 4 tech trail at a down-hill bike park, which was about my skill limit at the time. Lots of super steep sections with diagonal roots etc.
|
|
#
?
Sep 12, 2022 00:48
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 20, 2024 21:47 |
|
|
Anybody watch Hardline? Here's the winning run, crazy fast. 18 year old from Squamish. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw9jXzIERsg&t=102s
|
|
#
?
Sep 12, 2022 02:31
|
|
