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Dumpmaster General posted:what movie is this, I'm morbidly curious That's the new Lord Of The Rings show, I think?
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Sep 18, 2022 04:27
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Xealot posted:. Captain Marvel has a powerful lady smirking at the camera, but Alita was endorsed by the Terminator man and maybe liking it might hurt Disney who made the Holdo movie? Alita didn't do a press conference shortly before release saying she didn't want white men to review her movie, nor does the movie have a bit where a guy says you should smile more and then gets his property stolen. There are like three or four grifters on Youtube who gained tens of thousands of subscribers just off of those two things. The whole antagonize part of your audience to make another part extra loyal doesn't always pay off.
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Sep 18, 2022 08:05
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Spermando posted:Alita didn't do a press conference shortly before release saying she didn't want white men to review her movie, nor does the movie have a bit where a guy says you should smile more and then gets his property stolen. That's not what Brie Larson said so much as she wanted more diversity among reviewers.
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Sep 18, 2022 08:53
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Maxwell Lord posted:That's not what Brie Larson said so much as she wanted more diversity among reviewers. No, she specifically said she didn't want to listen to white men reviewing movies "not made for them". Regardless of real intent or what corollaries you want to tack onto that, I don't remember the press around Alita being so antagonizing and it is a big factor in the reception by those Youtubers. Contrast that with EEAAO, which the usual suspects liked even though it's a very female-centric movie. Film studios also learnt the wrong lesson from that whole fiasco and now the objective seems to be to speedrun the controversy cycle to attract viewers, as evidenced by Kenobi and ROP. Spermando fucked around with this message at 09:07 on Sep 18, 2022 |
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Sep 18, 2022 09:01
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The Munsters are at 1313 Mockingbird Lane.
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Sep 18, 2022 09:13
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Spermando posted:No, she specifically said she didn't want to listen to white men reviewing movies "not made for them". Regardless of real intent or what corollaries you want to tack onto that, I don't remember the press around Alita being so antagonizing and it is a big factor in the reception by those Youtubers. Contrast that with EEAAO, which the usual suspects liked even though it's a very female-centric movie. There's a pretty big loving difference between saying that she wants to hear what a movie meant to the ones it was actually made for and "white men can't review my movies".
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Sep 18, 2022 09:48
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Alita also gained points from that crowd because: -It was based on a manga property and so obviously apolitical, -The lead character was more classically feminine than Captain Marvel while still kicking rear end so could be held up as an example for "see, there's a right and a wrong way to do Strong Female Characters" type arguments, -There was already a more general MCU fatigue. The last point is illustrative of a more general tactic: reactionary nerds pick their battles so as to align themselves with other pop culture grievances. Once they see a particular work has been either well-received or ignored by the general public, they'll move on to something else, or sometimes declare it unwoke/the good kind of representation. It's when the work is badly received, or simply fail to make consensus and generate conversations around its quality, that they'll keep the woke accusations alive, because then they can stir every argument toward "western culture is getting worse because of diversity, everything bad happening currently can be traced back to that".
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Sep 18, 2022 13:20
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YaketySass posted:-It was based on a manga property and so obviously apolitical, A certain breed of nerd thinking Japanese things aren't political will always be funny.
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Sep 18, 2022 14:16
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Here's an article that I think helps contextualize Larson's comments, and yes, it is completely disingenuous to pretend they were antagonizing.Dawgstar posted:A certain breed of nerd thinking Japanese things aren't political will always be funny.
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Sep 18, 2022 14:52
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Dawgstar posted:A certain breed of nerd thinking Japanese things aren't political will always be funny. Obviously there also exists a contingent who understand this lack perfectly well, but still play into it because it serves their purposes, no matter what cause they're promoting or attacking.
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Sep 18, 2022 15:15
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Were the chuds that praised Alita mad that Ghost in the Shell cast a white woman to play the Major? Because that was a parallel controversy. People were mad at the casting but you could make the same argument we make about the Little Mermaid remake-why would a cyborg's race be relavent? What side of that culture war were they on? Because on one hand, "SJWs" were mad the character got whitewashed. So I could see them being contrarian just to avoid siding with their cultural enemies. On the other hand, criticizing the casting could be seen at consistent with their criticism of casting of other remakes. "This character looked like X, it detracts from the original story to change it to Y".
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Sep 18, 2022 19:44
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QuoProQuid posted:the first is just straight white men not liking films that try to center experiences outside of their own and being anxious about their status declining relative to other groups. these individuals see diverse casting as a threat to their own cultural hegemony. they also see changes in the industry (motivated by major studios becoming aware of unmet demand in the market) as an implicit critique of themselves and their interests. what does it say about them that they loved a movie later found to have massive failures in its portrayal of other groups? I am incredibly skeptical of cultural hegemony that isn't backed up by economic and political hegemony. Even with the best intentions it's inherently inauthentic.
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Sep 18, 2022 23:18
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Panfilo posted:Were the chuds that praised Alita mad that Ghost in the Shell cast a white woman to play the Major? Because that was a parallel controversy. People were mad at the casting but you could make the same argument we make about the Little Mermaid remake-why would a cyborg's race be relavent? What side of that culture war were they on? No, but horny MAGAs were annoyed that Scarlett Johansson wasn't nude throughout a lot of the film like Major Motoko had been in the 1995 release. Sometimes appearance comes before consistency e.g. Republican/conservative polling favored Tulsi Gabbard to be the D presidential nominee in 2020. Now some of it may've been her anti-Islamic statements. But some thought it was because she looked like an attractive Mortal Kombat video game character. Her religion took a back seat to her appearance nonetheless. Spermando posted:Film studios also learnt the wrong lesson from that whole fiasco and now the objective seems to be to speedrun the controversy cycle to attract viewers... 
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Sep 18, 2022 23:56
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Big surprise https://twitter.com/KianjRyan/status/1571490101162655745?t=_g0Hz3-3Jg8hnLRHGJheXQ&s=19
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Sep 19, 2022 02:17
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"ok but SCIENTIFICALLY mermaids—" I'm going to stop you right there, friend.
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Sep 19, 2022 03:24
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scientifically accurate Little Mermaid movie where a manatee gets strangely horny for a sailor
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Sep 19, 2022 16:40
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Mantis42 posted:Stuff like this annoys me because it's unartful and cringe. That's kind of a distortion, nobody says "Elves will not replace us". In fact that first image is from later in the episode. What happens is the guy on the right is riling up the crowd about elves in Numenor because one elf (Galadriel) ended up being taken there (long story). And yeah he does say they threaten their job as smiths because they don't sleep and live forever and so on. The crowd does chant "Elf lover!" briefly (in reference to the queen-regent who took her in, though she's not exactly being generous), but nothing like the Charlottesville slogan. Like yeah there's a racial intolerance thing briefly (though the real reason the queen-regent has been harsh on letting in elves is because of a prophecy from a palantir), but it's not as on the nose as the tweet makes it look. Maxwell Lord fucked around with this message at 06:59 on Sep 20, 2022 |
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Sep 20, 2022 06:55
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Maxwell Lord posted:That's kind of a distortion, nobody says "Elves will not replace us". In fact that first image is from later in the episode. Come on, you expect us to believe someone posted ragebait on Twitter?!
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Sep 22, 2022 06:46
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https://twitter.com/GPrime85/status/1572565125999267842?t=ftCYkwRxy5WDT-HJPAJhuQ&s=19
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Sep 22, 2022 09:20
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Panfilo posted:https://twitter.com/GPrime85/status/1572565125999267842?t=ftCYkwRxy5WDT-HJPAJhuQ&s=19 Who is this
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Sep 22, 2022 11:54
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It's a guy that makes really bad reactionary comics that are 99% variations on "You are shouting and angry and my self-insert is cool and collected".
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Sep 22, 2022 11:56
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Timeless Appeal posted:Here's an article that I think helps contextualize Larson's comments, and yes, it is completely disingenuous to pretend they were antagonizing. Yeah the fragility was off the charts. Also the "Brie Larson can't act" takes, which were absolutely hilarious.
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Sep 22, 2022 17:52
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Samovar posted:Who is this Far right homophobic rapist webcomic guy
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Sep 22, 2022 20:48
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Panfilo posted:https://twitter.com/GPrime85/status/1572565125999267842?t=ftCYkwRxy5WDT-HJPAJhuQ&s=19 Who wants to bet this dude prominently displays Dune and Starship Troopers and Wheel of Time on his book shelf as "fun escapist fantasies with absolutely no politics"? Oh, here he is replying positively to Kojima (whose games are painfully political), and in apparent praise of Dune, which is literally about the knock-on effects of imperialism in the middle east and spice is just straight up oil. https://twitter.com/GPrime85/status/1080795051582726144 ... but that's not political because when he says political he means "those loving [f-slur]s in muh video game" and "those loving [n-slur]s in muh video game".
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Sep 23, 2022 14:18
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Edit: was replying to archived version of the thread and didn't engage with current conversation.
MixMasterMalaria fucked around with this message at 17:18 on Sep 23, 2022 |
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Sep 23, 2022 16:46
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YaketySass posted:scientifically accurate Little Mermaid movie where a manatee gets strangely horny for a sailor A "scientifically-accurate" Little Mermaid is just The Shape of Water and it turns out it kicks rear end and is substantially more woke.
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Sep 23, 2022 22:34
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This is who George is  https://twitter.com/GPrime85/status...ingawful.com%2F Uncle Wemus fucked around with this message at 07:00 on Sep 24, 2022 |
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Sep 23, 2022 22:44
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you know i'll say one thing about that awful comic, both of them are in heaven
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Sep 23, 2022 22:47
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Maybe don’t post horribly transphobic images here without putting them behind spoilers or something
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Sep 24, 2022 04:36
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The idea that Disney needs to stir up controversy to attract their viewers is pretty weird.
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Sep 24, 2022 10:14
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Alhazred posted:The idea that Disney needs to stir up controversy to attract their viewers is pretty weird. It's not just about attracting viewers, but polarizing them. How many times have you seen people giving extremely mediocre shows and films free publicity just because it angers their political enemies?
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Sep 24, 2022 11:01
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Disney gets all the free publicity they need simply by being Disney.
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Sep 24, 2022 11:06
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I guess that's why Mulan was such a smash hit.
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Sep 24, 2022 11:07
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And I who was lead to believe that controvercy attracts wievers.
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Sep 24, 2022 12:12
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Consistent advertising is the single-most important element to a product's existence. See: Moxie soda, or more currently, the required output of influencers to stay relevant. Also why you can assume the stated budget of any big studio movie is actually double for advertising costs. Controversy is additional advertising and encourages people to make a cause out of a product, so yes, it generates additional revenue. Anger is a much more memorable emotion than no emotion at all. Remember, it doesn't mean anything that a company makes enough money. It always has to be making more money. Hence the infamous Eisner memo of "by making money, we will sometimes make art."
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Sep 24, 2022 13:32
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Alhazred posted:And I who was lead to believe that controvercy attracts wievers. Basically, there was so much poo poo going against it that no group was going to "defend" it against their "enemies". If there were two poles surrounding the movie, it was Disney vs. several different groups that would usually be at each other's throats. Had they filmed it in the US with more Asian-Americans involved (even if they weren't Chinese), then perhaps it would have been polarizing in the way Spermando is talking about, with a bunch of conservatives mad about the movie disrespecting men and liberals lining up to support the movie in turn.
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Sep 24, 2022 13:42
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That's what I was referring to. While there was some controversy regarding the shooting of Mulan, the discourse died out really quickly because it wasn't about a hot topic in the US. Nobody in the US or in Europe would go to bat for that movie because even people who liked it probably won't care to write essays about how unfairly it was criticised or how absurdly woke it was. When you invite comparisons to the original and change one single that everyone will get defensive about, you have magically created a loyal fanbase that will engage in witch hunts on your behalf. Some of these remakes/reboots are perfect for this because they're so slavish to the original in every other respect that they beg that you compare them to the iconic original--the Little Mermaid more than any of them. The fact that this is giving work and shines a spotlight on artists who usually get sidelined doesn't change the fact that there can be a very cynical motivation when a corporation does it.
Spermando fucked around with this message at 14:47 on Sep 24, 2022 |
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Sep 24, 2022 14:43
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Spermando posted:That's what I was referring to. While there was some controversy regarding the shooting of Mulan, the discourse died out really quickly because it wasn't about a hot topic in the US. Nobody in the US or in Europe would go to bat for that movie because even people who liked it probably won't care to write essays about how unfairly it was criticised or how absurdly woke it was. When you invite comparisons to the original and change one single that everyone will get defensive about, you have magically created a loyal fanbase that will engage in witch hunts on your behalf. Some of these remakes/reboots are perfect for this because they're so slavish to the original in every other respect that they beg that you compare them to the iconic original--the Little Mermaid more than any of them. The fact that this is giving work and shines a spotlight on artists who usually get sidelined doesn't change the fact that there can be a very cynical motivation when a corporation does it. Similarly, Lucasfilm and Disney were particularly lovely to Boyega and Tran--neither warning them or supporting them against racist trolls. So, when they cast Ingram they got in front of it and had her back when the obvious happened. Is that them cynically trying to look good for the press? Maybe, but it's better than the alternative and also once again, I don't think I've met anyone getting Obi-Wan tattoos out of solidarity. Are there people who liked Obi-Wan because there was a fun antihero character played by a Black lady, sure? And that's fine.
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Sep 24, 2022 16:17
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Timeless Appeal posted:I just don't think the notion of these magically created fanbases actually exist and are in themselves a cynical idea rooted in notions of virtue signaling. In The Northman thread in this subforum someone posted they were disappointed in the film and their main beef seemed to be there weren't any non-whites. People like that do exist. Spermando fucked around with this message at 16:59 on Sep 24, 2022 |
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Sep 24, 2022 16:46
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Spermando posted:In The Northman thread in this subforum someone posted they were disappointed in the film and their main beef seemed to be there weren't any non-whites. People like that do exist. The rest of your argument brings us back to the underlying issues that once you start seeing inclusion as a corporate conspiracy theory, it gives you permission to write off any inclusion you want. Even when the actual evidence is that what you're seeing is creatives fighting to get as much inclusion of queer affection as possible past corporate censorship, and literally the exact opposite of what you're suggesting is true.
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Sep 24, 2022 17:19
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