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crabrock
Aug 2, 2002

I

AM

MAGNIFICENT






Johnny Truant posted:

I made the jump from academia to industry recently and jfc. This is so much better. Like infinitely better. :coolslime:

seconded

i hosed up a sequencing run and my boss was so understanding of it and we went over the thing i did wrong and then immediately planned our next one. there was no weird punishment or fretting over how much i'd just cost them or suggesting that it was because i'm stupid. just "well now you know for next time, which will be thursday"

such a weird change from all the stress of messing up new assays in my previous labs

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Snack Bitch
May 15, 2008

Goodness no, now that wouldn't do at all!
Finally got to experience a lab move. Took us three days to pack everything into crates. We had three mass specs to move and, of course, the boxes they came in couldn’t be found. Thermo was fine with strapping them down on pallets which is wild since they want 3k for the special crates to move them in. Is is standard to have to label every single box, chair, and piece of equipment with a form saying it has been cleaned/decontaminated?

No idea when or if I will get to unpack stuff. The new lab is still under construction and there’s a massive layoff tomorrow lol.

Lyon
Apr 17, 2003

Velius posted:

We’re doing an ELN evaluation at my workplace right now, including demos from LabVantage, Biovia, IDBS, LabArchives, etc. My impression right now is that IDBS seems to be focused more as a pure record keeping/notebook replacement, while LIMS/ELN integration seems to be the major focus of LabVantage and LabArchives. But practical details are pretty scant in the demos we’re getting.

It sounds like some folks here have a ton of experience with these products, anyone have strong opinions to share? Our use case is a hybrid of lab and field work, and both experimental science and routine analysis so we need both notebook customization and templates for routine work.

I worked at LabVantage for 12 years so I can give you the skinny on them if you want. In my opinion IDBS is the best ELN for R&D/experiments/notebook replacement and LIMS is going to be the best for QA/QC structured laboratory processes. LabVantage's ELN is pretty solid now so you can sort of get the best of both worlds depending on your use cases.

LabVantage has it's core LIMS capabilities for batch, request, sample, test/spec, inventory (reagents/standards/etc.), and equipment management and then fully integrated into the LIMS are a few other large modules. Those modules are: ELN (true free form experiment/logbook replacement), Laboratory Execution System (LES, same look and feel as ELN but locked down/structured), Scientific Data Management System (SDMS, repository for all your instrument run files as well as the ability to extract the data from them), CAPA, Stability, Environmental Monitoring, Formulations, and there's a powerful Workflow/Scheduler/Event management engine that can be utilized as well to build your own processes without needing to code.

I say this as a former employee, so I'm obviously biased, but LabVantage is the best general laboratory software package on the market today.

BRAKE FOR MOOSE
Jun 6, 2001

Does anyone have tips for first-step interviewing for discovery biology scientist positions? Basically, I'm a CRISPR and NGS guy mostly interviewing at early-stage companies and every interview goes through the same thing where they're kinda trying to figure out my experience and I can't figure out what the gently caress they really do but it involves RNA.

Mustached Demon
Nov 12, 2016

BRAKE FOR MOOSE posted:

Does anyone have tips for first-step interviewing for discovery biology scientist positions? Basically, I'm a CRISPR and NGS guy mostly interviewing at early-stage companies and every interview goes through the same thing where they're kinda trying to figure out my experience and I can't figure out what the gently caress they really do but it involves RNA.

Talk about projects you took to completion and your accomplishments. That'll cover your experiences in a frame of getting stuff done. As for what they really do, they probably don't even know. Really they're probably pretty close-lipped about it until they need to sell the job to you. They need to like you first and an accomplishment-based approach usually does better than skills based.

Oh and the best job hunting trick you can find: nepotism.

Sundae
Dec 1, 2005
A friend of mine is moving from Alabama to San Diego because the lab head for his PhD got a new role out there and is leaving. He could either start over with someone new (assuming anyone else would pick him up in the existing program), or come with his current lab head/chair to San Diego. They are so under-funded that they couldn't hire movers for the lab. He sent me photos of lab equipment in boxes using his personal clothes as bubble-wrap, etc etc. He's in San Diego now, after literally driving a uHaul with his goods plus the lab's stuff across the country.


Academia: Not even once.

Mr Newsman
Nov 8, 2006
Did somebody say news?

BRAKE FOR MOOSE posted:

Does anyone have tips for first-step interviewing for discovery biology scientist positions? Basically, I'm a CRISPR and NGS guy mostly interviewing at early-stage companies and every interview goes through the same thing where they're kinda trying to figure out my experience and I can't figure out what the gently caress they really do but it involves RNA.

I work for a flagship backed company that came out of stealth last year. I joined before they launched and they were very tight lipped about everything science related.

I had even signed an NDA prior to interviewing and nobody was really giving up the goods at that point. Once I verbally said I was interested in an offer, I sat down with a VP and the CSO and went through their (essentially) pitch deck.

As already mentioned, talk about a project you've taken from start to finish. I'd ask questions to get an idea about how well they're doing science which would dovetail into you demonstrating knowledge about the QC for NGS preps you do, or setting up controls, or whatever.

Snack Bitch
May 15, 2008

Goodness no, now that wouldn't do at all!

Sundae posted:

A friend of mine is moving from Alabama to San Diego because the lab head for his PhD got a new role out there and is leaving. He could either start over with someone new (assuming anyone else would pick him up in the existing program), or come with his current lab head/chair to San Diego. They are so under-funded that they couldn't hire movers for the lab. He sent me photos of lab equipment in boxes using his personal clothes as bubble-wrap, etc etc. He's in San Diego now, after literally driving a uHaul with his goods plus the lab's stuff across the country.


Academia: Not even once.

God drat, that’s terrible.

Development
Jun 2, 2016

Sundae posted:

They are so under-funded that they couldn't hire movers for the lab. He sent me photos of lab equipment in boxes using his personal clothes as bubble-wrap, etc etc. He's in San Diego now, after literally driving a uHaul with his goods plus the lab's stuff across the country.


Academia: Not even once.

academia does suck, but this sounds like poo poo negotiation by the lab head. they should have negotiated for either moving fees or to promise to buy all their poo poo new. a few years ago, my PI had received an offer to become a chair at duke and they offered to buy everything we needed new.

Mr Newsman
Nov 8, 2006
Did somebody say news?

Snack Bitch posted:

Is it standard to have to label every single box, chair, and piece of equipment with a form saying it has been cleaned/decontaminated?



Probably depends on what you work with and what company you're using to move tbh.
Definitely part of the process for the smaller moves I've done (BSL 1& 2). Usually just surface decon though.

Johnny Truant
Jul 22, 2008




Mr Newsman posted:

Welcome to the 'get paid' club :cheers:

Making nearly 10% more in an entry level scientist position than I was as a lab manager with no potential for career growth :zoid:

Also, I have a week more PTO because the mandatory federal holidays aren't taken out of my personal PTO! gently caress youuuuuuuuu academia!!

Snack Bitch
May 15, 2008

Goodness no, now that wouldn't do at all!

Mr Newsman posted:

Probably depends on what you work with and what company you're using to move tbh.
Definitely part of the process for the smaller moves I've done (BSL 1& 2). Usually just surface decon though.

We are a analytical chemistry lab so just a surface decon, but it’s the filling out a of a full sheet with details and signature that seemed a bit overkill. For example, we had over thirty chairs that each had to have a form attached too. I think we had to print 200+ of these forms to cover everything.

Dik Hz
Feb 22, 2004

Fun with Science

Development posted:

academia does suck, but this sounds like poo poo negotiation by the lab head. they should have negotiated for either moving fees or to promise to buy all their poo poo new. a few years ago, my PI had received an offer to become a chair at duke and they offered to buy everything we needed new.
Are you sure they weren’t moving because the PI wasn’t going to get tenure? That’s the number one reason junior PIs move.

Dobbs_Head
May 8, 2008

nano nano nano

Our company has decided that buying a LIMS looks too hard, we’re just going to build our own. :magemage:

The Aardvark
Aug 19, 2013


Good luck!

Johnny Truant
Jul 22, 2008




Dobbs_Head posted:

Our company has decided that buying a LIMS looks too hard, we’re just going to build our own. :magemage:

Make sure it's on a computer that has to have no network access. Oh, and that it only runs on Windows Vista :doit:

Mustached Demon
Nov 12, 2016

Johnny Truant posted:

Make sure it's on a computer that has to have no network access. Oh, and that it only runs on Windows Vista :doit:

Don't doxx some of my more obscure instrumentation.

Mr Newsman
Nov 8, 2006
Did somebody say news?

Dobbs_Head posted:

Our company has decided that buying a LIMS looks too hard, we’re just going to build our own. :magemage:

Enjoy your 1/4 finished LIMS that's going to be killed off in a year and a half when the dev in charge of it finds a new job :allears:

Dik Hz
Feb 22, 2004

Fun with Science

Hope you like forked spreadsheets.

Copy of copy of copy of copy of Lims_new_2_new_use-this2_2.xlsx

Epitope
Nov 27, 2006

Grimey Drawer
When is the line between a LIMS and a database plus ELN?

Johnny Truant
Jul 22, 2008




Mustached Demon posted:

Don't doxx some of my more obscure instrumentation.

:hmmyes:

This was half of the equipment in my first lab, lol

Zudgemud
Mar 1, 2009
Grimey Drawer

Johnny Truant posted:

:hmmyes:

This was half of the equipment in my first lab, lol

Did you also have to save your instrument data to floppy disks and move it to a slightly younger intermediary computer that was compatible with both floppy drives and USB sticka?

Cardiac
Aug 28, 2012

Dobbs_Head posted:

Our company has decided that buying a LIMS looks too hard, we’re just going to build our own. :magemage:

Oh, someone decided to spend the rest of their career maintaining it and essentially become unfireable.

Dik Hz
Feb 22, 2004

Fun with Science

Johnny Truant posted:

Make sure it's on a computer that has to have no network access. Oh, and that it only runs on Windows Vista :doit:

This but unironically. If IT can’t remote in they can’t brick your mass spec.

Lyon
Apr 17, 2003

Epitope posted:

When is the line between a LIMS and a database plus ELN?

Lines are blurring everywhere but LIMS are usually much more structured and ELN is more unstructured. ELN vendors are adding structured data capabilities and LIMS vendors are adding unstructured data capabilities so it’s sort of a toss up at this point. LIMS typically enforces processes/workflows and are going to be geared towards compliance with regulatory standards; ELN typically has less of a focus on this though that’s not to say you can’t deploy and validate an ELN in a GMP environment (for example). I’d say if you’re on the R&D side of the business you’re going to be partial to ELN and if you’re on the QA/QC side you’re going to be partial to LIMS.

Typically in LIMS you’re going to build out your tried and true processes/methods/products that don’t change frequently and in ELN you’re going to be doing experiments and process/method development.

Realistically though both systems tend to be catered towards the business/management rather than the lab staff. Paper (or somehow possibly worse, Excel) is still probably the easiest solution in many ways as a bench level scientist. Trying to improve the scientist experience is a major area of focus at my former company but also one of the biggest struggles.

Edit: I think ELN is closer to how scientists think and work so usually there’s a preference in that direction at the bench level whereas a lot of LIMS is more like after the fact data entry that the business needs for reporting, audits, and analytics. My old company has built a pretty decent ELN and Laboratory Execution System (LES, think QC ELN/traveller worksheet that’s tied to an assay/method or process like instrument calibration/reagent prep/stability pulls) to try and improve the bench level experience.

Lyon fucked around with this message at 17:24 on Aug 27, 2022

Cardiac
Aug 28, 2012

Last week I finished a python script that collected and formatted all of our X-ray data collection protocols amassed over 15 years with the purpose of depositing them in a database.
Everything in excel of course.
85 different column names, for where 8-10 are enough, which is rather interesting given how some coworkers live by their “SOP”s.

Dobbs_Head
May 8, 2008

nano nano nano

Job posting alert!

My company (a very well funded startup) in the Boston area is hiring laboratory scientists. We’re a battery R&D company focused on long duration energy storage to enable the renewable revolution. We have open roles for:

1) an analytical chemist with specialty in ICP-OES. We’re really looking for someone who can set the standard for analytical and quality methods since we are building that capability.

2) a more junior chemist (bachelors to bachelors + few years experience or a master) to do R&D (we train people here, so I’m looking for someone with good lab skills who wants to learn E-chem, but it’s a plus if you’ve touched a potentiostat)

3) a senior scientist to drive additive development work. This is a fresh PhD or masters + experience role. Here e-chem knowledge is a strong plus, but I’d take strong fundamentals in physical chemistry or spectroscopy of inorganic materials.

If you have those qualifications and want to work on solving climate issues, please PM me. The company is great to work for, management cares and there is a lot of opportunity for growth. We’re committed to diversity and inclusion and have the metrics to prove it.

Johnny Truant
Jul 22, 2008




1.5 months into new job and I've officially reached the "gently caress Empower" state of mind

RadioPassive
Feb 26, 2012

Empower is the worst chromatography control software, except all the others.

Johnny Truant
Jul 22, 2008




I poked at it for half an hour trying to overlay multiple electropherograms before my colleague showed me that unless you change it to Summary By All results, it will only ever show you your first result.

Why does it give me the option to overlay chromatographs if I can only summarize one result?! Whyyyyyyyyyy

RadioPassive
Feb 26, 2012

Select Sample Sets, Right click, View As -> Channels, select channels, right click, Compare?

Johnny Truant
Jul 22, 2008




I'm creating a report method from scratch and have never done so before, so I'm just finding all the little things I gotta set up before I can even generate my report, haha

Dik Hz
Feb 22, 2004

Fun with Science

The analytical lab I inherited a decade ago was using old waters hplcs to run gpc. They were using empower to run the instruments but the proprietary gpc triple detector software to collect and manage the data.

Holy hell was that a pain in the rear end. The triple detector never worked and all anyone cared about was the RI output so it was stupid on several levels.

But the consultant who sold them the system made over $100k according to the invoices I found.

RadioPassive
Feb 26, 2012

Johnny Truant posted:

I'm creating a report method

Oh that sucks

Johnny Truant
Jul 22, 2008




RadioPassive posted:

Oh that sucks

And how!

It's like kind of cool and kind of awful, at the same time.

crabrock
Aug 2, 2002

I

AM

MAGNIFICENT






i'm having some issues with an assay. about half the time it works, and the other half the time it doesn't. nobody else on my team has this issue. today another member watched me do every single step of the two day process, while doing it alongside of me. when we finished hers worked and mine didn't.

we didn't figure out what i'm doing wrong, but i've successfully vexed another person who is now confused as hell :)

mllaneza
Apr 28, 2007

Veteran, Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force, 1993-1952




Dik Hz posted:

The analytical lab I inherited a decade ago was using old waters hplcs

Your poor bastard. Waters software isn't good now, let alone the appalling older stuff.

There really isn't a lot of overlap between people who are well-versed in Windows software development best practices and people who know what an HPLC even is.

RadioPassive
Feb 26, 2012

crabrock posted:

i'm having some issues with an assay. about half the time it works, and the other half the time it doesn't. nobody else on my team has this issue. today another member watched me do every single step of the two day process, while doing it alongside of me. when we finished hers worked and mine didn't.

we didn't figure out what i'm doing wrong, but i've successfully vexed another person who is now confused as hell :)

I’m a team lead in a QC lab and this is my poo poo tell me more

AfricanBootyShine
Jan 9, 2006

Snake wins.

crabrock posted:

i'm having some issues with an assay. about half the time it works, and the other half the time it doesn't. nobody else on my team has this issue. today another member watched me do every single step of the two day process, while doing it alongside of me. when we finished hers worked and mine didn't.

were you using the exact same tools (i.e. pipettes or whatever) or were you using your own set?

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Dik Hz
Feb 22, 2004

Fun with Science

mllaneza posted:

Your poor bastard. Waters software isn't good now, let alone the appalling older stuff.

There really isn't a lot of overlap between people who are well-versed in Windows software development best practices and people who know what an HPLC even is.
I dumpstered them and replaced with a Thermo instrument that was marginally better. I wish Agilent wasn’t terrible these days. I bought a used HP branded Agilent 1100 to run normal and reversed phase and that thing just runs. It’s the same instrument I used in grad school: an old varian 600.

I don’t know why hplcs are so terrible. They’re literally just a pump. All the chemistry happens on the column and the science happens at the detector. Back when I was doing biochem I’d just hook my columns up to a peristaltic pump because it was so much easier.

Dik Hz fucked around with this message at 15:21 on Oct 1, 2022

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