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Dik Hz posted:This is not normal and is highly unprofessional. Your manager is poo poo.
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Sep 27, 2022 12:53
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Morand posted:Thank you all for your kind replies. It means a lot. USA specific advice: This smells like a PIP. 100% have been there bud. Here's a checklist for today/tomorrow: - get with that doctor -  that resume on here- along with your resume, tell us in one sentence 2 or 3 specific options for what comes next. Same job, diff company? New career? School? - decide today if you wanna seek an ADA accommodation to secure some extra time. (IANAL, this is not guaranteed to work) - apply for 3 jobs - create a basic LinkedIn, don't have to do the whole thing just get it started if you haven't already For later depending on what you decide: - If you wanna go the do you'll want to do a free consult with an employment attorney. If you don't know one I'm happy to help via PM. IANAL but I work with and have hired several labor and employment attorneys. Interviewed ~100 of them. - minimum effort to not get fired, all other time on what comes next. Apply for poo poo while at work. Make sure to use your browsers form filling capabilities so you can apply to stuff much faster. - Make your Linkedin good, add lots of recruiters, take advantage of LinkedIn's and Indeed's easy apply features to get those application numbers up
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Sep 27, 2022 14:06
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I've been casually looking for new positions for around the past nine months on and off due to currently being underpaid based on market value. I don't think it is worth my time or effort to ask for a raise despite liking my department and promotions aren't going to happen because I had to move. They allow me to be remote, while most of the team is at least hybrid. Current problem is while I have no problem getting interviews, or second/final interviews, I can't seem to make it over the hump to getting an offer. I interview well enough I suppose but the thing I hear back frequently is they just had a candidate with more experience or more qualified. If that is the case, it is just simply that I am "good enough" for these roles but not the all star candidate? It is confusing to me since in my current role of 3.5 years I was the first employee for a recruitment department that my well known billion dollar company determined to create and I built our systems and processes that make the thing run, and it's been an overwhelming success for us. I also have interviewed a number of people for other roles and it is like management will take anyone they can get with a pulse. I realize I am trying to get into the upper echelon money (100k+) so in theory it should be tougher, but it is still discouraging since it keeps happening. What can I do to get over this final interview hump?
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Sep 27, 2022 14:44
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yeah for morand i'll reiterate that even if you somehow survive the process you really don't wanna be working there
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Sep 27, 2022 14:46
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UnleashedDad posted:Current problem is while I have no problem getting interviews, or second/final interviews, I can't seem to make it over the hump to getting an offer. I interview well enough I suppose but the thing I hear back frequently is they just had a candidate with more experience or more qualified. If that is the case, it is just simply that I am "good enough" for these roles but not the all star candidate? A sizable percentage of the time it's because they knew who they were hiring before they posted the position. Unfortunately and unfairly, if you're something other than straight white under-50 male you're extra liable to get plenty of interviews but few offers, it helps HR tick their boxes before hiring the director's crony. In any case there's nothing you can do about externalities. All you can do is improve yourself as much as possible. Every interview is another golden opportunity to sharpen your interviewing skills, so just keep at it. Re: Morand: CarForumPoster posted:This smells like a PIP. 100% have been there bud. A PIP isn't ambiguous. Either he was given a PIP and ordered to sign it, or not. Either way though it seems abundantly clear the company wants him gone to make room for Nicky Nepotism, and apparently they're raging assholes so they're also working on a case to deny him severance/unemployment if he refuses to quit. Tragicomically, in the U.S. there's nothing illegal about telling an employee "we're letting you go because we want to give your position to a nepotism hire" but you'd have to pay severance/unemployment to do it, and they're trying to avoid that. Because they're assholes. Eric the Mauve fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Sep 27, 2022 |
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Sep 27, 2022 15:51
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UnleashedDad posted:I've been casually looking for new positions for around the past nine months on and off due to currently being underpaid based on market value. I don't think it is worth my time or effort to ask for a raise despite liking my department and promotions aren't going to happen because I had to move. They allow me to be remote, while most of the team is at least hybrid. Most important to understand is an interview is not a graded test, it's a competition and you don't get to see the competitors. You might be going up against an internal hire, or a VP's nephew, or a legit superstar. You might be going against a bunch of morons. You don't know! The fact that your getting to the final interviews is a good sign, and if they are reaching out to let you know indicates its not like a failed background check or something (they usually ghost you), but maybe give some thought if that might be the problem and how you can address it. So you could do everything right and not get an offer because you came in 2nd place. If you'd like better advice, maybe post some of the job descriptions and your resume and we can maybe point out if there are any gaps that might need tightening. I'm guessing you just need to keep plugging away.
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Sep 27, 2022 15:52
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You can also come in first place and still not get the job. Maybe the company lost a series of funding but doesn’t want to let it’s current employees know by freezing hiring. Note: this actually happened to me on both ends.
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Sep 27, 2022 17:37
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One of the most insulting things that has ever happened to me is being told that I wasn't "technically strong enough" for a role only to find out that they were actually just waiting on government grants to actually get poo poo started. I've since been approached by recruiters for the company several times and each time told them why I won't work for them without a cash apology.
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Sep 27, 2022 17:47
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Dik Hz posted:You can also come in first place and still not get the job. Maybe the company lost a series of funding but doesn’t want to let it’s current employees know by freezing hiring. Note: this actually happened to me on both ends. Yeah, also a really good point. This is the weirdest the economy's been in at least a decade, maybe more. Companies are vacillating wildly between "We need to grow to take advantage of the hot market" and "We need to cut costs!". The role they are hiring for one week might not be available the next week.
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Sep 27, 2022 18:02
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I did speak to an employment lawyer. I was told that what is happening to me is “immoral” but not illegal and I did not have a case. I have an appointment with my therapist tonight and will work on redacting my resume for posting then.
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Sep 27, 2022 21:08
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My resume with details changed https://imgur.com/a/guFsIbp https://imgur.com/a/qo4RZXe
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Sep 28, 2022 01:15
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Get your ADA status sorted and start documenting stuff for a constructive dismissal. It might change what the lawyer thinks. Alternatively check with a better lawyer.
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Sep 28, 2022 01:15
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Morand posted:My resume with details changed I bet you could get this down to a 1 pager. You're repeating yourself a lot and using a lot of words when you could just rely on your bullet points. For example, you mention Ccure 800/9000 three times on the first page. I would try to get rid of your first two sections, then get rid of all the paragraph-style summaries under each job, and incorporate your keywords into the bullet points.
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Sep 28, 2022 01:45
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Morand posted:My resume with details changed If my colleagues disagree, I will defer to them, but I feel pretty strongly about some of these. Mostly in order.
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Sep 28, 2022 01:50
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Happiness Commando posted:If my colleagues disagree, I will defer to them, but I feel pretty strongly about some of these. Yep, I'm good with these. I'd actually suggest a start over, maybe a different format since you seem to be struggling using this format. Some quick hits: -Probably should be a 1 pager -You are mixing up your skills, experience and certifications. Those should all be clear and easily identifiable -You are including skills and experience that have nothing to do with (what I assume) is the job you want to get -Don't say "High End Support", it sounds like it's Level 3. Call it level 3. -I assume you want another DB Support role? Then that job should have a lot of real estate, the security system thing should have a much smaller footprint, and the IT support role should be much smaller (maybe touch on documentation, customer service, maybe training) It's pretty clear this resume has been in use for over a decade and you just keep adding stuff to it and I think that is probably hurting you overall.
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Sep 28, 2022 02:23
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Morand posted:My resume with details changed Happiness Commando has said basically everything I'd have said about Action Words and bullets, so I'd like to see a revision with it a lot more punchy. One thing I wanted to add is that typically in the US you put your graduation/completion date with your education and certificates. Also, either abbreviate BA and BS or don't. It's not a domain specific term; they will know what a BA is. You are correct to de-emphasize education generally by putting it at the end, but my impression that it is still a box that places want to tick so it has to be included. So, something like: My Resume posted:STAIRS UNIVERSITY – Hell, MO I have it side by side with an Additional Skills section with fluff like "fast learner" but that's because my degrees are pretty old so not super relevant, so that helps de-emphasize them amongst some other fluff.
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Sep 28, 2022 11:43
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Does anyone have any advice on getting inbound linkedin traffic? I followed some guides but nothing seems to have been made since 2019. It’s obvious that you get farther from people seeking you out, but I retooled, fixing stuff up, added keywords, and went from five weekly views to 20.
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Sep 28, 2022 18:55
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Golden Bee posted:Does anyone have any advice on getting inbound linkedin traffic? I followed some guides but nothing seems to have been made since 2019. It’s obvious that you get farther from people seeking you out, but I retooled, fixing stuff up, added keywords, and went from five weekly views to 20. Interacting with stuff on your feed will show up on others' feeds. Even just liking things. The best way is to write broetry, or just write about stuff you're working on or what you've learned.
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Sep 28, 2022 19:17
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I'm expecting to hear this week about a job I've had 5 interviews for(including with the CEO) over the past 7 weeks. We have not discussed salary yet, how much of a red flag is this? At this point I'm expecting to get rejected but also wondering why they would waste so much time interviewing me.
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Sep 28, 2022 19:56
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It's your responsibility to bring up salary. They're going to wait as long as possible to hook and then lowball you.
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Sep 28, 2022 20:04
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Happiness Commando posted:It's your responsibility to bring up salary. They're going to wait as long as possible to hook and then lowball you.
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Sep 28, 2022 20:07
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Yeah wow, that is the exact opposite of the right advice. There's a reason so many companies put the screws to applicants to name their desired (or even better, current) salary first.
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Sep 28, 2022 20:14
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If OP is potentially going to decline an offer based on salary, it's their responsibility to ask for compensation details like what is budgeted for the role. An employer not offering that information up front isn't a red flag as such because the vast majority of employers do that. If OP has happy to have five interviews over several weeks and then find out that the top of the range is 30k short of what they currently make, well, ok 
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Sep 28, 2022 20:21
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Happiness Commando posted:If OP is potentially going to decline an offer based on salary, it's their responsibility to ask for compensation details like what is budgeted for the role. An employer not offering that information up front isn't a red flag as such because the vast majority of employers do that. Go ask for what the budgeted salary for a position is early in an interview process and report back how often you actually get a useful answer. 99% of the time the person you’re talking to early in the process doesn’t even know or have the power to influence it. And even if they did, you’re going to get “what are you looking for?” Or “we have a range that depends on the qualifications of the candidate” and not a useful number. Doing multiple interviews only to get low-balled can happen, but it’s part of the job hunting process. Although companies that lowball are likely to show their whole rear end long before the fifth interview. Remember it is a two-way street and you should be screening them too
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Sep 28, 2022 20:46
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Dik Hz posted:Go ask for what the budgeted salary for a position is early in an interview process and report back how often you actually get a useful answer. 99% of the time the person you’re talking to early in the process doesn’t even know or have the power to influence it. And even if they did, you’re going to get “what are you looking for?” Or “we have a range that depends on the qualifications of the candidate” and not a useful number. That tactic has worked for almost every position I've interviewed for in the last several years. I'm done talking about this. Back to resume reviews. Happiness Commando fucked around with this message at 22:24 on Sep 28, 2022 |
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Sep 28, 2022 22:22
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if you intend to bring up comp first before an offer you better bring it up really early in the process and have a good understanding of market and your win conditions. at this point you should just wait for their offer.
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Sep 28, 2022 23:16
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I'm more concerned the company is not seriously considering filling the position rather than getting lowballed. I've been in this position too many times recently where I get to the final round and not receive an offer. The span of time along with the company not asking my salary requirements at any point during many interviews doesn't give me any confidence about my chances. I've been interviewing a lot and I've never gone thru this many rounds without discussing salary, with that being said I would rather wait for an offer rather than bring it up on my end.
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Sep 28, 2022 23:30
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His strategy is rational if you're optimizing for minimal time invested in procuring a job. Of course, most of us would rather optimize for money. Blowing off interviews saves a lot of time in the instances where the company doesn't want to pay what you're worth. But it makes it hard to practice your interviewing skills. Of course if you're already an interviewing god and in such high demand that it's pointless to even talk to a company until they prove they're willing to pay what you want, then that too is moot. Casual Yogurt posted:I'm more concerned the company is not seriously considering filling the position rather than getting lowballed. I've been in this position too many times recently where I get to the final round and not receive an offer. The span of time along with the company not asking my salary requirements at any point during many interviews doesn't give me any confidence about my chances. I've been interviewing a lot and I've never gone thru this many rounds without discussing salary, with that being said I would rather wait for an offer rather than bring it up on my end. A company not talking about salary until the offer stage could be indicative they already know they're giving the job to the director's brother-in-law, sure. But it also tends to be indicative of a good company. Good companies seek the right fit, determine which candidates are most desirable, and then negotiate salary with them. Weak companies that only care about finding the cheapest minimally qualified candidate are the ones that want to talk money before they talk about anything else. Eric the Mauve fucked around with this message at 23:39 on Sep 28, 2022 |
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Sep 28, 2022 23:36
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Eric the Mauve posted:A company not talking about salary until the offer stage could be indicative they already know they're giving the job to the director's brother-in-law, sure. But it also tends to be indicative of a good company. Good companies seek the right fit, determine which candidates are most desirable, and then negotiate salary with them. Weak companies that only care about finding the cheapest minimally qualified candidate are the ones that want to talk money before they talk about anything else. How does this square with the advice to get recruiters to tell you the range before continuing?
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Sep 28, 2022 23:50
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Magnetic North posted:How does this square with the advice to get recruiters to tell you the range before continuing? recruiters are different, they work through big outbound volumes so trying to make sure there's a fit at all is important. They are in sales and they are selling you and the job. the opportunity in this situation is an opportunity you have chosen to apply to, which is a different situation with different dynamics.
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Sep 29, 2022 00:06
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The same position that I applied for several months ago and came in the top 3 for has opened up again. With a very slightly different focus, under a different manager. I'm not sure if it's worth throwing my name in the pool again? I think I can interview well, but I haven't made any other real changes (combination of moving, generalized depression, and the fact that I also am considering wincing and staying in my current position, getting one more license for a couple of grand a year bump, and seeing what happens next year when they change my pay band).
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Sep 29, 2022 01:04
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blackmet posted:The same position that I applied for several months ago and came in the top 3 for has opened up again. With a very slightly different focus, under a different manager. Nobody reasonable is going to see the resume of a previous finalist and think “not this rear end in a top hat again”
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Sep 29, 2022 01:30
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Magnetic North posted:How does this square with the advice to get recruiters to tell you the range before continuing?
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Sep 29, 2022 17:04
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Happiness Commando posted:That tactic has worked for almost every position I've interviewed for in the last several years. I'm done talking about this. Back to resume reviews.
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Sep 29, 2022 17:17
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Mantle posted:
https://linkedin.com/in/hireadamgoldberg Golden Bee fucked around with this message at 21:15 on Sep 29, 2022 |
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Sep 29, 2022 21:13
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Just an fyi, companies spend way more money interviewing than you do getting interviewed. The longer the interview process goes, typically, the more the sunk cost fallacy weighs in your favor. Let them fall in love before talking money. If you have an ironclad salary you know is at our above market, by all means use salary as a filter, you can actually benefit from the anchoring. But most people interviewing don't have a salary market information advantage so it's best to let them go as long as they can before it comes up.
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Sep 30, 2022 01:24
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I had an interview yesterday that went well and I stand a decent chance of getting offered the job. Problem is I’ve been summoned to jury duty in a month. Am I obligated to tell my potential employer about this ahead of time, as in, before the offers go out? Or it it just a way to shoot myself in the foot and ensure they’ll hire somebody else who can start sooner? There are multiple good candidates from what I understand.
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Sep 30, 2022 13:13
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no you are not obligated to tell them, what the hell?
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Sep 30, 2022 13:23
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The wheels turn slowly in my field. It’s certainly possible I won’t get an offer at all; it’s also possible that I get an offer the day before I’m supposed to appear. Idk the timing is just stressing me out and making me feel guilty about withholding information. I’m definitely not trying to act like the position is mine, cause it’s not, I’d just really like to start off on the right foot if I do get lucky with them.
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Sep 30, 2022 13:36
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Tell them AFTER they make an offer and when you're negotiating the start date. "Just to let you know, I may have jury duty on X date." All but the most dysfunctional companies will work with you on that. If they make that a pain in the rear end, run! But don't go there until you get to that point.
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Sep 30, 2022 14:53
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