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I believe in Mushroom
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Oct 19, 2022 23:58
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PostNouveau posted:I dunno maybe I don't want that loving dork spreadsheet poo poo I want to ride a dragon Hey! Some of us are watching this show because it's a live action Crusader Kings mod lol
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Oct 20, 2022 00:00
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"an awful civil war happened because of criston cole and the history books will reflect that he is hitler, when in truth he was just a big stupid guy who didn't know his own strength" is a genius idea, but i dont think that's what they're doing.
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Oct 20, 2022 00:06
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I AM GRANDO posted:Isn’t the book supposed to be a collection of primary sources or an oral history or something? Maybe the show is supposed to be what “really” happens vs the book being the legend that grows up later or what is reconstructed by historians piecing together biased and partial accounts. I’m not going to read the thing to find out, though. yeah i guess so. i'm not gonna read it either because i hear it's just a kind of dry plot recap and the show is filling in way more psychological and plot details than it had anyway, and i'd rather be on the ride for the first time, but my point is the same - they're selecting/inventing the things that serve alicent being a victim/struggling against patriarchy rather than the things that make her an evil bitch. which is creating a bit of whiplash imo cos alicent in ep6/7 vs alicent in ep8/9 are two different human beings. it's kinda interesting we're getting like, one version of the event as filtered through the current media landscape. 30 years ago we would've gotten 'that slut rhaneyra, why does viserys care about her more than me!', in 30 years we'd hopefully get some weird insane version of ASOIAF where misogyny isn't the only negative force in social dynamics which must be preserved for historical accuracy roomtone fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Oct 20, 2022 |
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Oct 20, 2022 00:06
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CRISTON: dahhhh i did what you's asked boss i protected da food from da poor people and gave away da royal fleet ALICENT: [slaps self in face] CRISTONNNN~~!!!!!!!!!!!
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Oct 20, 2022 00:10
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A Buttery Pastry posted:People die instantly from blows to the head all the time, and he was slammed into a small rock. I’m not doubting that you can die instantly from a blow to the head, and I understood that the rock is what was holding him in place. It was specifically the part where Ser
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Oct 20, 2022 00:14
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1940's viserys as portrayed by jimmy stewart
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Oct 20, 2022 00:14
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roomtone posted:yeah i guess so. i'm not gonna read it either because i hear it's just a kind of dry plot recap and the show is filling in way more psychological and plot details than it had anyway, and i'd rather be on the ride for the first time, but my point is the same - they're selecting/inventing the things that serve alicent being a victim/struggling against patriarchy rather than the things that make her an evil bitch. which is creating a bit of whiplash imo cos alicent in ep6/7 vs alicent in ep8/9 are two different human beings. I’d love to see the 80s primetime soap version of this show where they slap each other while yelling bitch and whore.
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Oct 20, 2022 00:22
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I AM GRANDO posted:Isn’t the book supposed to be a collection of primary sources or an oral history or something? Maybe the show is supposed to be what “really” happens vs the book being the legend that grows up later or what is reconstructed by historians piecing together biased and partial accounts. I’m not going to read the thing to find out, though.
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Oct 20, 2022 00:23
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Criston and Alicent are gonna/have done sex stuff right? I'm assuming that's what that whole "If you ever loved me....as your queen" stuff meant. Or it's her way of manipulating him.
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Oct 20, 2022 00:30
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Robobot posted:Criston and Alicent are gonna/have done sex stuff right? I'm assuming that's what that whole "If you ever loved me....as your queen" stuff meant. Or it's her way of manipulating him. I haven't read the books but my read on their situation is that he is 100% devoted to her, and she knows that. I don't get any sex vibes from the two of them. Considering that she let him go free when he admitted to sleeping with the princess, and she stopped him from suicide, I can see how their relationship might have built up over the past 10+ years.
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Oct 20, 2022 00:35
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That was my take on it too until that line. I'm probably just reading too much into it though.
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Oct 20, 2022 00:37
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Robobot posted:Criston and Alicent are gonna/have done sex stuff right? I'm assuming that's what that whole "If you ever loved me....as your queen" stuff meant. Or it's her way of manipulating him. i think keeping him on the edge of bustin is really more to her advantage considering the sole track record we have for him. she was giving him the 'now cole, i know you are my biggest onlyfans subscriber, but there is a tier i don't tell people about for the most loyal' kinda deal. in his mind, there's no such thing as loyal enough. my prediction is this man is going to die having hosed exactly one time with hate in his heart, no self-reflection will ever occur roomtone fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Oct 20, 2022 |
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Oct 20, 2022 00:39
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I get the impression that the one time we saw is not the only time Rhaenyra and Cole got down. You don't give the "run away with me to Essos" speech to a one night stand, especially not however long after the fact they'd timejumped.
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Oct 20, 2022 00:46
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I mean I feel they needed to commit to Cole murdering beesbury. Toss him out the window. Episode 9 was okay but kinda dimmed by expectations from the brilliance of episode 8.
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Oct 20, 2022 00:46
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CapnAndy posted:I get the impression that the one time we saw is not the only time Rhaenyra and Cole got down. You don't give the "run away with me to Essos" speech to a one night stand, especially not however long after the fact they'd timejumped. well possibly but i think his attitude the next day when rhaneyra was saying 'come!' (as in come here to have sex) and he didn't said to me that after that first time, he was in his mind about oaths and duty and revering women and then eventually he got around to saying let's get married when it became clear his fantasyworld wasn't actually happening how he thought, and he got turned down on that, offered a secret boyfriend position. 2nd place, the absolute worst kind of place for a stallion like criston god damned cole. i don't think casual sex should be assumed with this kind of society unless it's explicitly said that yeah, that's what they were doing. i think it was once.
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Oct 20, 2022 00:53
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That DICK! posted:CRISTON: dahhhh i did what you's asked boss i protected da food from da poor people and gave away da royal fleet Listen. Lord Rosby was really loving old and boring, and Aurane Waters was a real panty dropper. Could have happened to anyone.
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Oct 20, 2022 01:16
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You guys didn’t see Criston peeking out of the closet in the background with Larys and Alicent’s feet?
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Oct 20, 2022 02:03
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CapnAndy posted:I get the impression that the one time we saw is not the only time Rhaenyra and Cole got down. You don't give the "run away with me to Essos" speech to a one night stand, especially not however long after the fact they'd timejumped. I originally thought this, but seeing Cole's later characterization has made me think he actually might. It wasn't so much the depth of their relationship per se, it was the salvaging of his own honor, which would be as tarnished after a one-night stand as if they were banging regularly.
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Oct 20, 2022 02:07
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Robobot posted:Criston and Alicent are gonna/have done sex stuff right? I'm assuming that's what that whole "If you ever loved me....as your queen" stuff meant. Or it's her way of manipulating him. I don't think they're loving, but there's a sexual valence to their relationship, yeah. Criston is definitely horny for her, he just sublimates it under chivalric duty. His comment about treating all women with the same reverence you'd treat your mum is probably quite telling; I wonder if he's had sex even once since he did it with Rhaenyra. Alicent knows this, IMO, and is perfectly happy to use it control him, but I think she's also got enough residual piety to refrain from making a more aggressive overture. (Plus it would be a dumb move to give up her power.) It's similar to the foot scene; she's practical enough to play on her supporter's fascination with her, but she'll never go the full Thomas Pynchon. Look, but don't touch. She won't gently caress Criston unless she can absolutely help it IMO.
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Oct 20, 2022 02:15
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I am the coke snoring HBO suit writing the showrunners a note mandating an Alicent/Cole/Lary threesome by the end of S2.
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Oct 20, 2022 02:22
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Open Source Idiom posted:I don't think they're loving, but there's a sexual valence to their relationship, yeah. i think this is a pretty ireffutable and obvious reading of alicent and cole's relationship although i would add that cole would never touch alicent either unless he was pushed to the absolute edge. the utter core of his self-identity relies on worshipping her, as an object and not a person. i could see him killing her when or if that's betrayed, because he is a hateful man, but i do not see a kiss or anything like that between these two. roomtone fucked around with this message at 02:51 on Oct 20, 2022 |
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Oct 20, 2022 02:48
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roomtone posted:i think this is a pretty ireffutable and obvious reading of alicent and cole's relationship I mean, if we're just acknowledging what would be in his character, the dude is basically a bunch of sexual assault red flags that can wear armor and murder septuagenarians. Which I mostly bring up to mention how much I don't want to see him do any of that ever, please god no.
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Oct 20, 2022 03:14
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Tender Bender posted:This is the point of the scene, Otto is trying to dress everything in the trappings of legitimacy but this ceremony isn't the real deal. They can wave around all the props they want and say "No really before he died Viserys definitely told us we were in charge", but then a literal dragon crashes the coronation and tells them to gently caress off before flying off to ally with the real dragon heir. It's a huge fire breathing metaphor. Which is why Otto should have had dragons there, because in his mind, having then there says the opposite. He even says how much they need Aegon to be seen as the next conqueror, and the defining trait of Aegon is showing up and conquering Westeros with dragons. I think they just liked the cuteness of the metaphor and the hero moment for Rhaenys too much. E: also I read the Beesbury scene as Criston trying to kill him.
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Oct 20, 2022 03:20
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roomtone posted:i think keeping him on the edge of bustin is really more to her advantage considering the sole track record we have for him. she was giving him the 'now cole, i know you are my biggest onlyfans subscriber, but there is a tier i don't tell people about for the most loyal' kinda deal. in his mind, there's no such thing as loyal enough. Yes, Larys Strong is in that tier.
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Oct 20, 2022 03:25
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parara posted:Yes, Larys Strong is in that tier. the feet poo poo with larys was a dumbass writing move because it makes what i assume will be a long running character way less interesting in the service of a thematic point which hey, already made obvious, but even with it i don't think we're quite at the point of 'all larys wanted was feet pics lmao', despite what the internet says because it is in love with feet. it could just be an aspect he's enjoying to exploit while he's really angling at something else. i mean, i loving hope it is because i want this show to be good not descend into the idiots.
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Oct 20, 2022 03:42
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It would be wildly off for Rhaenys to have actually killed the Green faction there: * Alicent has just been nice to her. She has genuine sympathy for Alicent right now despite everything. * She’s been through the pain of losing children and is not indifferent to how cruel it would be to kill Aegon. * Killing them is a huge escalation given that mass scale slaughter of nobles (the only actual people in the world, commoners are NPCs) hasn’t happened yet. It wouldn’t necessarily prevent a civil war, and might just as likely make the coming conflict worse. So it makes sense to me at least that she would remind them “hey, Dragon rider here” before noping out.
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Oct 20, 2022 03:46
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agreed so why did she burst through the floor
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Oct 20, 2022 03:52
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roomtone posted:agreed Escaping the dragon pit without having to go through any other dragons
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Oct 20, 2022 03:55
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ruddiger posted:You guys didn’t see Criston peeking out of the closet in the background with Larys and Alicent’s feet? The Superman outfit really ruined my immersion
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Oct 20, 2022 03:55
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roomtone posted:the feet poo poo with larys was a dumbass writing move because it makes what i assume will be a long running character way less interesting in the service of a thematic point which hey, already made obvious, but even with it i don't think we're quite at the point of 'all larys wanted was feet pics lmao', despite what the internet says because it is in love with feet. Larys is unironically my favourite character because of his potential (and his actor is fantastic) so I fully agree with you here. Please don’t do my boy dirty like this.
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Oct 20, 2022 03:57
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I think the feet thing doesn't lessen the character at all, in fact makes him even more of a creep. We aren't exactly suppose to like the guy that killed his father and brother with criminals he freed from person and cut out their tongue. He's suppose to be this series Ramsay Bolton I guess.
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Oct 20, 2022 04:04
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Jerkface posted:Escaping the dragon pit without having to go through any other dragons there is a huge entrance that was shown in ep 1 and i think 6 she could have left from or she can burst through at least some of the walls. if the doors don't suit she can wait until her best pal alicent leaves the dragonpit and bust on out then. what're you trying to say, some guard would say whoah now hold on, we talked about this. the front, back and side doors are banned. the only way you're getting out of here, my lady, is directly through the ceiling above us. she already snuck in, she can bust out in any direction she wants. roomtone fucked around with this message at 04:08 on Oct 20, 2022 |
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Oct 20, 2022 04:05
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ShowTime posted:I think the feet thing doesn't lessen the character at all, in fact makes him even more of a creep. We aren't exactly suppose to like the guy that killed his father and brother with criminals he freed from person and cut out their tongue. He's suppose to be this series Ramsay Bolton I guess. well that's only interesting if you're satisfied by characters you can sum up as 'a creep' and 'supposed to like' there's a bunch of camps of people watching this show with competing interests in what is going on. you're in the simple face value one, and that's fine you probably actually have a life. some of us don't and we think like hold on man...that poo poo doesn't help me sleep. i can't dwell on this! it's baby crap!
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Oct 20, 2022 04:10
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She needed to have a display of power, but doesn't want to kill them in case they end up winning. She showed them mercy and if she has to, she can use that to get mercy in return. She's doing a bit of playing both sides.
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Oct 20, 2022 04:10
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Beefeater1980 posted:* Killing them is a huge escalation given that mass scale slaughter of nobles (the only actual people in the world, commoners are NPCs) hasn’t happened yet. It wouldn’t necessarily prevent a civil war, and might just as likely make the coming conflict worse.
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Oct 20, 2022 04:17
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Lary already lost me when he offered to take an eye from the Strong boys voluntarily, such a small time way to get back on Rhaenyir camp.
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Oct 20, 2022 04:35
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Ravenfood posted:Yes I get the visual metaphor. I enjoyed that, and it did not escape me that a dragon showing up to protest Aegon's coronation is a huge omen/sign for everyone who wants to read it that way, especially in universe. I think Otto doesn't have the dragons there because Otto can't control the dragons. Dragons aren't props, they're obscenely powerful animals with wills of their own. Who on his side has control of dragons? Three unreliable teens/young adults: Aemond, who was just trying to undermine him with Alicent and seems extremely ambitious for his own ends; Aegon, a hungover mess who doesn't even want to be there; and Helaena, who seems chill enough, fair, but is also a kind of loopy teen. I can easily see Otto coming to the conclusion that they are too much of a wild card to have at this extremely important event, and at this current point I'm not sure he'd be able to arrange for them to be there even if he wanted to. Which is part of the metaphor: Otto isn't a Targaryen, he's a smug guy from Hightower who's playing at being the king of the dragons. (I didn't read the book so maybe I'm way off base but whoever wins here, I don't see Otto making it out on top) Tender Bender fucked around with this message at 04:41 on Oct 20, 2022 |
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Oct 20, 2022 04:37
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stephenthinkpad posted:Lary already lost me when he offered to take an eye from the Strong boys voluntarily, such a small time way to get back on Rhaenyir camp. well it isn't like anybody thought aheh! this larys is a cool guy, burning down his family hey sometimes you gotta do what you gotta the offer to take the kids eye, well look. that was a frank injustice and luke should be half blinded. that's just. but this feet situation well that makes our very smart man larys actually seem like quite a smelly and basic man. a man who is turned on by socks. what kind of person is that. what are his wealth redistriubution policies.
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Oct 20, 2022 04:59
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CapnAndy posted:This is the point I don't understand. There is a crown on Aegon's head. poo poo is escalated. Either you're on team Rhaenyra Abdicates or you're already at civil war, and that ain't Rhaenys' team. You can see that a situation is escalating and not immediately go to "and now I will kill a large chunk of my extended family and most of the state bureaucracy". And real people have feelings and don't necessarily just go straight to murder. Like, every time I read one of these things where someone has a problem with how a character acts because they disagree with it, I gotta ask : do you expect to agree with all characters? Because they're allowed, even encouraged, to make choices we disagree with. The show has told us now that Rhaenys isn't the kind of person who gets moderately inconvenienced by someone so they use that as an excuse to burn them and all their loved ones alive in public.
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Oct 20, 2022 04:59
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