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There’s “Don’t Get Poisoned” in Pathways into Darkness, where you are practically guaranteed to get poisoned as soon as you leave the first room
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Oct 23, 2022 15:35
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skasion posted:There’s “Don’t Get Poisoned” in Pathways into Darkness, where you are practically guaranteed to get poisoned as soon as you leave the first room Two Times Two Equals...
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Oct 23, 2022 15:38
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The Kins posted:Bungie were always pretty good for a level name, especially in the pre-Halo days. Yeah they’re on the whimsical/non-descriptive side for the most part, but to me that’s much more memorable than “Refueling Base” or “Computer Station” or whatever. Begging for Mercy Makes Me Angry!! The only Doom level name that always makes me laugh is in Going Down. “200 Mega Hurts”
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Oct 23, 2022 15:47
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Aye Mak Sicur
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Oct 23, 2022 16:22
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ive been having difficulty quantifying why i like cultic a little more than dusk or amid evil, and i think ive got at least one reason but i am having trouble like articulating it for some reason it seems easier to preserve a feeling of kinetic linkage (ie your gun emits some kinda physical force, the enemy responds in an equivalent and appropriate manner to that force) with sprite enemies than it is with 3D enemies. like i know at in my heart of heart in both cases you're shooting at an abstract thing until it triggers its hurt, death, or gib animations, but sprites seem to hide that artifice better and I don't know why. its not to say that every sprite based shooter is more satisfying than every 3d enemy based shooter, or that even all sprite based shooters feel good, but it seems to require a much larger budget to make 3d models respond as 'naturally' as sprites, perhaps in the same way old film grain hides the strings in practical SFX shots where HD digital footage exposes them but the way heads pop off in cultic feels a lot more natural than the way they pop off in say, wrath, which is a very high production value boomer shooter with some really great 3D dismemberment. but you headshot a zombie in wrath and the head pops off forward more than anything, and then the body explodes in a kinda canned way. but stuff in cultic is just as canned, only it feels better? the way the explosives in cultic and build games lift and throw stuff is also much more satisfying feeling, that force that persists for like a half second longer than other games do. perhaps someone with better behind the scenes knowledge can explain it to me, heres a list of 'recent' sprite based games i think feel markedly better than their 3D enemy equivalents, because maybe theres another connection between them i have missed: selaco project brutality viscerafest cultic (obv) nightmare reaper ion fury (dubious about including this one because i think its mostly coasting on being build engine) gamefeel has always been a major factor that's important to me, but one i've found hard to translate into words. Like i've been trying to do a post on why I like INCISION so much, even compared to games that are higher production value or more complete, but it just feels better.
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Oct 23, 2022 17:23
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juggalo baby coffin posted:ive been having difficulty quantifying why i like cultic a little more than dusk or amid evil, and i think ive got at least one reason but i am having trouble like articulating it The best way for you to test that theory is play Prodeus, as you can freely swap between 3d models and their sprites. I preferred the 3d models since I was already running with fake low res and I wanted the smoother animation and clearer visibility, but it'll be interesting to hear what ya think. edit: I've not tried it, but VoxelDoom? Serephina fucked around with this message at 17:35 on Oct 23, 2022 |
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Oct 23, 2022 17:33
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Voxel Doom works really well because at a distance the monsters look exactly like their sprites and they still have their animation frames and eight distinct rotations to them. It's only when you get close that the added depth becomes obvious.
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Oct 23, 2022 17:38
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Serephina posted:The best way for you to test that theory is play Prodeus, as you can freely swap between 3d models and their sprites. I preferred the 3d models since I was already running with fake low res and I wanted the smoother animation and clearer visibility, but it'll be interesting to hear what ya think. its interesting but prodeus feels kinda the same amount of meh in both modes
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Oct 23, 2022 17:42
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Cultic rocks - the first boss was scary. edit: can't stop playing this poo poo owns Groovelord Neato fucked around with this message at 19:31 on Oct 23, 2022 |
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Oct 23, 2022 17:53
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KozmoNaut posted:Voxel Doom works really well because at a distance the monsters look exactly like their sprites and they still have their animation frames and eight distinct rotations to them. It's only when you get close that the added depth becomes obvious. The fact that it came with exactly one frame for the Mancubus, the about to fire frame, hosed with me while playing it with Doom 2 because I couldn't tell if it was my imagination or not. I died the first time I noticed it because I just stared. I had to go into the files to see if my brain was dying. It looks so good
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Oct 23, 2022 17:59
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skasion posted:Yeah they’re on the whimsical/non-descriptive side for the most part, but to me that’s much more memorable than “Refueling Base” or “Computer Station” or whatever. Begging for Mercy Makes Me Angry!! If I Had A Rocket Launcher I’d Make Somebody Pay
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Oct 23, 2022 18:15
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haveblue posted:If I Had A Rocket Launcher I’d Make Somebody Pay Which gets a call-back in Halo as "If I had a superweapon..."
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Oct 23, 2022 18:35
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skasion posted:There’s “Don’t Get Poisoned” in Pathways into Darkness, where you are practically guaranteed to get poisoned as soon as you leave the first room Which is convenient, because you can't get past the guardians at the end unless you're poisoned. And yeah, Pathways/Marathon level names are the good stuff.
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Oct 23, 2022 18:49
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ToxicFrog posted:Which is convenient, because you can't get past the guardians at the end unless you're poisoned. More ironic than convenient since that challenge is on the level immediately before Don't Get Poisoned. Maybe it's also a reminder to cure yourself after?
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Oct 23, 2022 19:03
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haveblue posted:More ironic than convenient since that challenge is on the level immediately before Don't Get Poisoned. Maybe it's also a reminder to cure yourself after? Oh right, those are in Warning: Earthquake Zone, which in my head is more associated with having a shitload of Ghasts in it.
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Oct 23, 2022 20:01
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Groovelord Neato posted:Cultic rocks - the first boss was scary. A huge part of the reason why the game works is because it's actually got a good scare factor. It's creepy as poo poo in a bunch of places and if you weren't the angriest guy to ever refuse to die it'd probably be a lot scarier. There's places where the bait and switch are totally telegraphed and despite knowing what's coming it still manages to work
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Oct 23, 2022 23:59
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The slomo on some kills in cultic is really satisfying, risky because it's either when you kill a bunch of dudes all at once (probably with an explosive) and a bunch of gibs and blood fly out, or it's a wicked headshot and a bunch of blood flies out.
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Oct 24, 2022 01:24
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Gets kind of doofy though when you fling dynamite round a corner and get the slomo as you're standing around staring at a wall.
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Oct 24, 2022 01:45
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I like it, especially when you get a couple gibs flying over. It's like "well I guess that was pretty gnarly, I bet it's gonna look wild when I get around this corner." I used to play a lot of TF2 and you could set a damagesound, and set it to pitch relative to how much damage you did. It was real satisfying when you'd lob a rocket around a corner to check if anyone's there and it's a random crit and you hear that big BOOONNNNNNNG sound.
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Oct 24, 2022 02:07
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The shotgun shells ejecting in slow-mo ... 
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Oct 24, 2022 02:08
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UnknownMercenary posted:Civvie's FEAR video just dropped. I think it might be the first video of his where he doesn't die once in a play through, also lot of good gags in this one, in particular the part where he shoots the fat guy and a never ending flood of blood and cheese snacks comes erupting out of his computer eventually flooding the whole complex had me rolling Al Cu Ad Solte posted:I miss cool level/stage/mission names. Reminds me I need to get back to playing Dead Space 1, it's funny how that game often is janky on Windows but runs near perfectly on Steam Deck
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Oct 24, 2022 02:11
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I appreciate civvie alluding to the Fear 2 ending very politely
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Oct 24, 2022 02:19
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The slow-mo on big kills in CULTIC hit the same place in my brain as the good ol' Unreal Tournament "HOLY poo poo!" voice clip.
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Oct 24, 2022 02:20
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drrockso20 posted:I think it might be the first video of his where he doesn't die once in a play through, also lot of good gags in this one, in particular the part where he shoots the fat guy and a never ending flood of blood and cheese snacks comes erupting out of his computer eventually flooding the whole complex had me rolling That’s definitely a kinda character you don’t see in things anymore.
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Oct 24, 2022 03:01
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It wasn't until I was recently replaying F.E.A.R. that i even realized they gave Mapes a fat man tuba leitmotif from the get-go. I halfway thought i was imagining it until Civvie confirmed it being a thing.
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Oct 24, 2022 05:16
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I tried to play the F.E.A.R demo back when it was new, but the family computer at the time was very much not up to it. The game turned into a slide presentation the moment any shooting started. Not single digit FPS if that. Then LGR reviewed it a few years ago and I played all three games and had a pretty good time.
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Oct 24, 2022 05:20
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Here is more John Romero reminiscing about the old days, in case anyone is interested https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzqdZAYcwfY
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Oct 24, 2022 10:06
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juggalo baby coffin posted:ive been having difficulty quantifying why i like cultic a little more than dusk or amid evil, and i think ive got at least one reason but i am having trouble like articulating it It's a question of budget. For the limited budget these devs move around, sprites are a better choice because making good pain reactions and good blood effects and gibs that result convincing are much harder in 3d. Look at how satifying is the killing poo poo in Destiny 2, so it can be done, but of course indies don't have the manpower needed for that. Additionally, in 2d there is some layer of abstraction going on between what you see and the player that makes 2d sprites punch at a higher level of what they are at a more objective level.
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Oct 24, 2022 10:43
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Finished chapter 1 of Project Warlock 2, was overall pretty good, aside from what I mentioned previously about the sword beam upgrade being bad, only major nitpick I have is due to how long the cooldowns for them were I often would completely forget to use any of Palmer's spells, indeed dual wield was the only one that saw any regular use, think they need to be shorter to be encouraged to be used more Oh and also sometimes the hit detection is a bit weird
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Oct 24, 2022 10:52
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FEAR's combat is so good that that grey concrete unfinished room in Civvie's video where he uses the mine is burned into my brain forever while how absolutely dogshit the ghost sequences are exist as though a letter delivered from far away and rain soaked to unreadability.
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Oct 24, 2022 13:48
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The ghosts and almost all the environments being really samey are the two biggest flaws. Still a great game though.
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Oct 24, 2022 14:14
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The garage fight and its soundtrack are peak FEAR imo
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Oct 24, 2022 14:53
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Turin Turambar posted:It's a question of budget. For the limited budget these devs move around, sprites are a better choice because making good pain reactions and good blood effects and gibs that result convincing are much harder in 3d. Look at how satifying is the killing poo poo in Destiny 2, so it can be done, but of course indies don't have the manpower needed for that. yeah this lines up with some stuff ive been thinking, like how cheap practical effects in movies are still always better than cheap CGI. one can be made to look good (by which i mean more impactful, gross, scary etc rather than realistic) by three guys in a cabin (evil dead), one can have a team of 10,000 and still look unconvincing and weird (recent marvel movies). like you said destiny 2 has very good feedback on kills, and for all the games other sins it is very satisfying to coach gun a hole through the center of a gnarr in serious sam 4. then other enemies in that game (looking at you kleer) feel like absolute poo poo to fight because theres barely any feedback difference between a meatshot and grazing them with 2 pellets. i love skeletons man but i have hated the kleer so much in serious sam games. who decided the series' most prevalent enemy should be the one with the least gore and the most stupid looking attack (what the gently caress is that bola ball and chain thing? the kleer dont even have hands, they just do a mild animation and a ball and chain spawns out of them?). the fact im thinking at all about realism in a serious sam game is a problem, because its a very goofy setting, but the kleer come off like something from a bad player mod for UT99. where the creator didnt hvae access to animation facilities so just looped a few frames of the idle anim for the ranged attack animation idk i had more of a point i think but its been driven out of my head by a looping sound of hoofbeats. i think you are correct though, its easier to hide the seams at lower budget with sprite work. the expectation of ragdoll physics i think also made good feedback a lot harder for a while. like the lovely way in unreal engine games where you could only gib someone down to a set of jorts that the camera followed edit: regarding FEAR, the combat in that game was so good i had saves before every major battle just so i could go back and replay segments when i wanted. i would load the game after combats i had won because i felt like i could have done it in a cooler way. trepang and selaco are really carrying that tradition on, i guess doom eternal does a good job of having discrete, acrobatic setpiece battles, but it is very videogamey feeling compared to the cinematic feel of FEAR juggalo baby coffin fucked around with this message at 16:31 on Oct 24, 2022 |
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Oct 24, 2022 16:28
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I have always believed that the design of the Kleer was held back by the desire to use it in the handful of places where dozens or hundreds of them come at you at once. The simplicity of their animation and action must have been somehow imposed by the tech necessary to get those scenes to work on early 00s hardware, and it wouldn't have been possible if they had more detailed animations or complex behavior. The only real evidence I have for this is that there are almost no other enemies in the game that are used for scenes like that, except maybe the kamikazes who are even simpler
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Oct 24, 2022 16:35
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I remember when FEAR gameplay was first shown off during a E3 and the demo they showed seemed to have a much higher emphasis on the horror aspect. Like a near constant stream of paranormal crap happening between the shootouts. Contrast that with the final release where you get maybe a short spook every half dozen rooms or so.
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Oct 24, 2022 17:44
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I was giving Perseus Mandate another play through last week and actually jumped pretty hard at a Fettel scare.
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Oct 24, 2022 17:57
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juggalo baby coffin posted:
One of the things I really liked about the Xbox 360 port of FEAR was that it had a sort of instant-action mode where you would have arena fights in some of the better setpieces, so I could just infinitely replay those. Also it had a bonus mission where you played as Delta Force Sgt. Holliday fighting to the roof of the Armacham building to escort Bishop out. You don't have the slo-mo so it's a much more frantic battle against replica troops, pretty neat. Sadly those additions never made it to the PC version of FEAR
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Oct 24, 2022 18:04
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haveblue posted:I have always believed that the design of the Kleer was held back by the desire to use it in the handful of places where dozens or hundreds of them come at you at once. The simplicity of their animation and action must have been somehow imposed by the tech necessary to get those scenes to work on early 00s hardware, and it wouldn't have been possible if they had more detailed animations or complex behavior. The only real evidence I have for this is that there are almost no other enemies in the game that are used for scenes like that, except maybe the kamikazes who are even simpler Serious Sam 2 actually had a sizable budget, as demonstrated by it having more levels than the Burj Khalifa and about as many unique environment/monster sets.
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Oct 24, 2022 18:05
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Vakal posted:I remember when FEAR gameplay was first shown off during a E3 and the demo they showed seemed to have a much higher emphasis on the horror aspect. Like a near constant stream of paranormal crap happening between the shootouts. There's a great bit in the E3 demo where, I guess they hadn't quite finalized what characters were going to do what, and one guy walks into a room full of charred skeletons and blood. CO: What do you think, Holiday? Holiday: I think some nasty poo poo happened in here. CO: That's great. Got anything useful to add? Holiday: There's a lot of anger in this room. CO: Obviously. Holiday: Yo man, get off my dick. You asked what I thought. Wasn't in the final game iirc but that exchange has stuck with me 
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Oct 24, 2022 18:06
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Thanks to FPS boost the entire FEAR series is 60fps on the Series X - except for FEAR files. Are those any good?
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Oct 24, 2022 19:30
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