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Elephant Ambush posted:This is from my first post in the thread from last week: Do you care too much how big the case is? Because modern videocards are ridiculously huge, as are CPU coolers, so being able to use a larger case can make life much easier.
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Nov 6, 2022 22:38
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you did get feedback from dr video games on your original post, even with two suggested builds:Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:The only GPU that has limited availability right now is the brand new RTX 4090. Everything else is in stock and are at least near their launch MSRPs. As usual, for 4K gaming, my baseline recommendation is an RTX 3080. It's faster than the consoles and will be at least reasonable at 4K for a little while. The RTX 3070 or the RX 6800 XT are also acceptable lower-cost alternatives, though you're going to be making more sacrifices to visual fidelity to get them to run smoothly at 4K, especially the 3070. The 6800 XT's performance will be closer to the 3080 except for when you turn on ray tracing, at which point it falls pretty far behind. Here's an example "budget" 4K gaming system with a 3080. It's based off of a list I made earlier where the goal was to essentially maximize 4K gaming performance while spending as little as possible on anything else. You can leave the RGB unplugged on the RGB fans that come with the selected case. That build list also uses a fast NVMe storage drive, which should minimize game load times. lih fucked around with this message at 22:40 on Nov 6, 2022 |
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Nov 6, 2022 22:38
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CaptainSarcastic posted:Do you care too much how big the case is? Because modern videocards are ridiculously huge, as are CPU coolers, so being able to use a larger case can make life much easier. Size and space are not a problem. If I need a huge case I'll get a huge case Phlegmish posted:I hadn't seen that 4 GB RAM - yeah, you'll definitely want more than that, most modern PCs would barely be able to function on just 4 GB. Right now I'm using almost 8 GB just browsing and having a bunch of stuff running. Would recommend at least 16 GB, I personally went for 32 GB in my new build, just to future-proof a little. Thanks for this. Looks like I'll be maxing out my budget but that's OK because like you I want as much future proofing as I can afford up front
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Nov 6, 2022 22:40
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Some other suggestions, there's not much difference between the 3080Ti and regular 3080 12gb, so if you wanted you could quite easily buy this MSI 3080 from Newegg and save another $200. Or if you're not bothered about ray tracing and aren't doing any work on this PC you could also look at AMD's GPUs which are equal to Nvidia's in most gaming tests where ray tracing isn't a factor. Here's a 6800XT for $670 after an offer code which cuts even more off your total cost. More CPU options on the AMD side too, their last gen CPUs are still massively capable and getting huge discounts all over the place so you could have the 5800X3D which is one of the best gaming CPUs available right now for only $90 more than a last gen Intel CPU. Or even the 5600X for $160, and both of those will go with my current favourite motherboard, the MSI PRO-A B550. And here's that complete list with AMD stuff instead, $500 less than what you had before for no significant performance drop (aside from ray tracing). And you could then afford to go bigger on more RAM or a nicer case like the Fractal Meshify C or Torrent. If you want ray tracing stuff all you need to do is swap out the GPU for a 3080. https://pcpartpicker.com/list/tBLwFg njsykora fucked around with this message at 22:49 on Nov 6, 2022 |
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Nov 6, 2022 22:45
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Elephant Ambush posted:Thanks for this. Looks like I'll be maxing out my budget but that's OK because like you I want as much future proofing as I can afford up front I think you can still easily get away with 16 GB, if cost is an issue. But definitely no less than that.
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Nov 6, 2022 22:46
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Elephant Ambush posted:Size and space are not a problem. If I need a huge case I'll get a huge case See the post by doc video games quoted above. Start with that, decide on what he told you to decide between, then tell us what you don’t like about what he picked (however nitpicky/seemingly small), and we’ll tell you how to change it/if it’s a feasible change to make. IMO you didn’t get more feedback after that because it was a perfect, solid post based on info you provided.
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Nov 6, 2022 22:55
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Thanks again for the help. What difference does ray tracing make? I'm not familiar with how important that is for modern games
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Nov 6, 2022 23:07
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Elephant Ambush posted:Thanks again for the help. What difference does ray tracing make? I'm not familiar with how important that is for modern games You should watch some YouTube videos to see, but the short of it is ray tracing is significantly more accurate light and reflection paths.
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Nov 6, 2022 23:12
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Elephant Ambush posted:Thanks again for the help. What difference does ray tracing make? I'm not familiar with how important that is for modern games That's debatable, and has in fact been debated a lot recently in the GPU thread, but I would personally suggest your safest bet is to prefer Nvidia so you not only have better capacity for raytracing but also get access to DLSS, which in games which support it can do a lot to increase framerates while maintaining better graphics quality. As has been mentioned, a 3080 12GB is probably a good card to target. The importance of raytracing is a pretty individual thing, but getting MOAR FRAMES is a more objective benefit.
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Nov 6, 2022 23:18
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DLSS is less important now that FSR is good and being added to nearly everything new, but if you want to future-proof at all you should definitely go with Nvidia because raytracing is going to become increasingly more important (just it's still unclear how quickly that's going to happen) instead of just being the high-end bell & whistle that it is now https://pcpartpicker.com/list/DpgHsL start with this build that Dr. Video Games put together for you, it's very solid. you could probably even save a little bit more with the MSI B550-A Pro over the motherboard listed there. then if you have room left in your budget for anything more, we can suggest what to improve njsykora posted:Or even the 5600X for $160, and both of those will go with my current favourite motherboard, the MSI PRO-A B550.
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Nov 6, 2022 23:23
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lih posted:the 5600X just doesn't make any sense as an option when the 5600 is $20 cheaper and not even noticeably worse Fair, I always forget about the non-X 5600.
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Nov 6, 2022 23:30
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Bouchehog posted:I'm not sure what an SFF case means but I'm pretty set on a 4090 and suspect that any future GPUs will retain the current trend of ridiculous size and power draw; at least this way I'm set for another GPU in a few years. The 4090 is extreme overkill for 1440p. You will be unable to make full use of the card because something else will be bottlenecking you in nearly every game (the CPU, your display's refresh rate, or even game engine limitations). It will last a while, more than "a few years," but so would something half the price. I would consider waiting a few months on the GPU purchase to see if Nvidia will lower the price of the 4080 in response to AMD, or even consider getting the 7900 XTX maybe. Elephant Ambush posted:Thanks again for the help. What difference does ray tracing make? I'm not familiar with how important that is for modern games This is a hotly contested topic, believe it or not. Some believe it's the future of graphics rendering, others believe it's just a gimmick today and is many years off from being mainstream. From my point of view it's already in a lot of titles as an optional toggle, but in most of those games the visual upgrade is minor at best, and the performance hit when enabling it can be severe. But it's being used in more robust ways recently, and we have more games on the horizon where it seems like you may not be able to turn it off. Many Unreal Engine 5 games will be like this, including the announced Silent Hill 2 remake and possibly CD Projekt Red's UE5 stuff. UE5's stock lighting system is a "hybrid" system that's designed to run well on GPUs that don't do RT well (such as the console GPUs), but it will still be faster/look better on GPUs that do do RT well. tl;dr: it's something you can turn off for now and not miss much in most games that use it, though it's debatable how long this status quo will last for. I recommended a 3080 for 4K because it's a great all-around card that does everything well, and I dunno if it's worth saving $100 by going AMD if what you're after is a solid 4K gaming system that will last you a while. edit: also now that I've read the rest of the recent posts in the thread, please do consider basing your build off of the builds I provided you earlier (someone quoted my post with them). If you have any questions about the contents of my build lists, I'd be happy to answer them. You can make a good 4K gaming PC without breaking the bank. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 04:05 on Nov 7, 2022 |
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Nov 6, 2022 23:48
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:The 4090 is extreme overkill for 1440p. You will be unable to make full use of the card because something else will be bottlenecking you in nearly every game (the CPU, your display's refresh rate, or even game engine limitations). It will last a while, more than "a few years," but so would something half the price. I would consider waiting a few months on the GPU purchase to see if Nvidia will lower the price of the 4080 in response to AMD, or even consider getting the 7900 XTX maybe. To put this in a different perspective if you buy a 3080/4080 now at $1000, then in 3 to 4 years by the similar class card for $1000 you will have spent the same amount of money as you would buying a 4090, but you would have a card that was significantly better than the 4090 and will last longer. additionally, you will have no loss in performance between now, and three years from now. Pilfered Pallbearers fucked around with this message at 00:20 on Nov 7, 2022 |
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Nov 7, 2022 00:18
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How difficult is it to get a new GPU on release day. I've never followed new gen releases before. Should I take the day off and make the trip to microcenter? or is it like buying a concert ticket online and getting lucky on newegg. and 3rd party cards, I'm assuming we'll hear more in the upcoming month, they will also release on the same day?
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Nov 7, 2022 01:21
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Tipme posted:How difficult is it to get a new GPU on release day. I've never followed new gen releases before. Should I take the day off and make the trip to microcenter? or is it like buying a concert ticket online and getting lucky on newegg. and 3rd party cards, I'm assuming we'll hear more in the upcoming month, they will also release on the same day? Basically impossible unless you're there immediately. Get lucky or wait a few weeks for stock to replenish.
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Nov 7, 2022 01:27
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Tipme posted:How difficult is it to get a new GPU on release day. I've never followed new gen releases before. Should I take the day off and make the trip to microcenter? or is it like buying a concert ticket online and getting lucky on newegg. and 3rd party cards, I'm assuming we'll hear more in the upcoming month, they will also release on the same day? The 4090 was available on Newegg for like 45 minutes on release day, and you've had to follow stock trackers and poo poo to have a chance of buying one ever since.
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Nov 7, 2022 01:27
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What's a good price point for a 3080 or 3080Ti? That's the sweet spot for 1440p, right? I have my 2060 Super and a 1080p monitor for now, but I'd like to be able to go to an ultrawide or curved early next year. Would it be worth keeping a 3090/Ti in mind with that in mind?
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Nov 7, 2022 02:14
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I would say that the sweet spot for 1440p is still the 3070, and the 3080 is the "max out every ray-tracing feature" overkill card. Right now, the 3080 is still hovering around $700 and the 3070 is $500 at retail, but you can get 3080s for $500 - $550 if you buy second-hand, and 3070s are $400 or less sometimes.
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Nov 7, 2022 02:17
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You could also hold onto your 2060S a little longer, I was able to play FF7R and Horizon Zero Dawn at 1440p60 just fine with mine. So it might be worth waiting for the full 40 series to come out and see if 30 series cards get bigger discounts to shift stock even if you do upgrade your monitor.
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Nov 7, 2022 02:40
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Echophonic posted:What's a good price point for a 3080 or 3080Ti? That's the sweet spot for 1440p, right? I have my 2060 Super and a 1080p monitor for now, but I'd like to be able to go to an ultrawide or curved early next year. Would it be worth keeping a 3090/Ti in mind with that in mind? I bought my 3080 FE for $550 used FWIW
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Nov 7, 2022 02:48
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Echophonic posted:What's a good price point for a 3080 or 3080Ti? That's the sweet spot for 1440p, right? I have my 2060 Super and a 1080p monitor for now, but I'd like to be able to go to an ultrawide or curved early next year. Would it be worth keeping a 3090/Ti in mind with that in mind? I would hold that card, especially if the monitor isn’t a specific timeframe purchase. Rule of computer components is the longer you can wait, the better components will be, but don’t wait if you need it now.
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Nov 7, 2022 03:30
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Phlegmish posted:I think you can still easily get away with 16 GB, if cost is an issue. But definitely no less than that. Was this post grammatically correct, what do you guys think? I feel like I should have said 'no fewer than that', since gigabyte is a countable noun.
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Nov 7, 2022 03:50
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Thanks for the insight. I'm not rushing to buy a new card, I just figured I'd keep an eye out for a deal over the holidays, is all. Plus my wallet could use a loving break after I "it's only another 20 bucks"-ed my way into a 2000 dollar build sans GPU. My uncle is going to inherit my card whenever I do upgrade, he's currently got my old 1060. Probably going to hunt him down a 5800X3D to replace his 3600X, too, once stock returns, since he's got an AM4 board. And RAM is treated as an aggregate the same way money and time are, so I'd say it's less unless you're talking about literal gigabytes, not gigabytes of RAM. Echophonic fucked around with this message at 06:43 on Nov 7, 2022 |
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Nov 7, 2022 05:18
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Phlegmish posted:Was this post grammatically correct, what do you guys think? I feel like I should have said 'no fewer than that', since gigabyte is a countable noun. I guess we're having a grammar tangent. I think it's fine because the implied noun there is RAM, and gigabytes are a modifier of that. For my own question, would the AK400 be enough cooling for a 13600k or 7600x? If sales prices come down into my budget, I'm looking at one of either of those for a build, and would prefer a ~$40* cooler than, say, the $80* AK620. * CAD 
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Nov 7, 2022 05:55
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Phlegmish posted:Was this post grammatically correct, what do you guys think? I feel like I should have said 'no fewer than that', since gigabyte is a countable noun. No, memory is a lump amount. 8GB of RAM is less than 16GB of RAM, not fewer.
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Nov 7, 2022 06:47
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unpronounceable posted:For my own question, would the AK400 be enough cooling for a 13600k or 7600x? If sales prices come down into my budget, I'm looking at one of either of those for a build, and would prefer a ~$40* cooler than, say, the $80* AK620. Yes, but just barely. The 7600X is gonna run up to 95C because that's generally what it does unless you have overkill cooling, and the 13600K can pull something like 185W during a very heavy multi-threaded load, which is on the edge of what the AK400 can do (maybe a little beyond, even). Both chips can be undervolted and/or power limited with little to no loss in performance, making single-tower coolers more viable. I personally find it incredibly stupid that Intel is letting an i5 pull so much power at stock and think everyone should limit that sucker down to 140W or less. The 12600K pulled only 126W in TechPowerUp's blender test, for reference.
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Nov 7, 2022 06:57
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idk what availability is like in canada (it seems to be kinda weird in general) but you might be able to find the thermalright peerless assassin 120 for a good price, it's competitive with the very best air coolers but is supposed to be a fair bit cheaper than most. probably not for as cheap as the ak400 but a whole lot better and hopefully not as much as other high-end ones
lih fucked around with this message at 07:23 on Nov 7, 2022 |
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Nov 7, 2022 07:18
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Yes, but just barely. The 7600X is gonna run up to 95C because that's generally what it does unless you have overkill cooling, and the 13600K can pull something like 185W during a very heavy multi-threaded load, which is on the edge of what the AK400 can do (maybe a little beyond, even). Both chips can be undervolted and/or power limited with little to no loss in performance, making single-tower coolers more viable. I personally find it incredibly stupid that Intel is letting an i5 pull so much power at stock and think everyone should limit that sucker down to 140W or less. The 12600K pulled only 126W in TechPowerUp's blender test, for reference. Yikes. I heard about Zen 4 regularly running at 95°, but I missed just how much the 13600k draws under load. I know it's a lot more powerful, but it's very weird to think about how much more power it takes compared to my i5 6500. It's probably more than triple, quickly judging from the 6600k review I found. I'm alright with setting manual power limits, so I'll keep that in mind. lih posted:idk what availability is like in canada (it seems to be kinda weird in general) but you might be able to find the thermalright peerless assassin 120 for a good price, it's competitive with the very best air coolers but is supposed to be a fair bit cheaper than most. probably not for as cheap as the ak400 but a whole lot better and hopefully not as much as other high-end ones
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Nov 7, 2022 08:07
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unpronounceable posted:Yikes. I heard about Zen 4 regularly running at 95°, but I missed just how much the 13600k draws under load. I know it's a lot more powerful, but it's very weird to think about how much more power it takes compared to my i5 6500. It's probably more than triple, quickly judging from the 6600k review I found. I'm alright with setting manual power limits, so I'll keep that in mind.
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Nov 7, 2022 09:22
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mobby_6kl posted:My desktop Ivy Bridge 3470 has a TDP of like 70 but only seems to pull like 35-40W in Cinebench lol. Like the Dr. said, it's mostly a weird (well not so weird, they want top spot in benchmarks) decision to let the CPU draw as much power as it can without destroying itself. TDP is not always 1:1 watts, and on older intel chips that TDP number was the max boost number, which the chip would only sustain in little bursts sprints. Now, intel chips just boost all out all the time at max power.
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Nov 7, 2022 13:46
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Pilfered Pallbearers posted:TDP is not always 1:1 watts I didn’t know that! What units is TDP specified in if not watts?
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Nov 7, 2022 14:14
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Subjunctive posted:I didn’t know that! What units is TDP specified in if not watts? Oh, it's specified in watts—AMD and Intel both just make up the figure. It doesn't mean anything when it comes to CPUs.
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Nov 7, 2022 14:19
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I've come across a cheap (140 Euro) refurbished system with these specs: i3-7100 8gb DDR4 128gb SATA SSD which I think would make for a decent Plex Media Server (they recommend 7th gen or newer intel CPUs because of Quicksync) but I'm a bit worried about the power consumption of this PC as Intel lists that CPU as having 51w TDP. Would it be prudent to go for something more expensive like a NUC or some system with a T cpu to get lower power draw for a system that would be running 24/7?
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Nov 7, 2022 16:44
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If power is your main concern then yes.
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Nov 7, 2022 16:46
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Incessant Excess posted:I've come across a cheap (140 Euro) refurbished system with these specs: Will that system run plex? Sure, but it won’t run it well or efficiently. You’re gonna max out the CPU transcoding most stuff, and 128gb is too small for the SSD. You want the whole plex system on an SSD which includes metadata, covers, etc etc. NUCs are good. If power efficiency is what you’re aiming for though a NAS that supports plex out of the box is likely to be a lot more power efficient that running a windows box, especially if Plex is the systems only purpose. There is a plex thread (that I don’t frequent anymore) that can probably point you better at a prebuilt solution.
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Nov 7, 2022 17:15
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:The only GPU that has limited availability right now is the brand new RTX 4090. Everything else is in stock and are at least near their launch MSRPs. As usual, for 4K gaming, my baseline recommendation is an RTX 3080. It's faster than the consoles and will be at least reasonable at 4K for a little while. The RTX 3070 or the RX 6800 XT are also acceptable lower-cost alternatives, though you're going to be making more sacrifices to visual fidelity to get them to run smoothly at 4K, especially the 3070. The 6800 XT's performance will be closer to the 3080 except for when you turn on ray tracing, at which point it falls pretty far behind. Here's an example "budget" 4K gaming system with a 3080. It's based off of a list I made earlier where the goal was to essentially maximize 4K gaming performance while spending as little as possible on anything else. You can leave the RGB unplugged on the RGB fans that come with the selected case. That build list also uses a fast NVMe storage drive, which should minimize game load times. I finally had time to go back and look at the suggested builds you linked again. This is the first one you linked: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/DpgHsL This seems good to me. Nice video card and 32GB RAM and a fast HD So I know this is a total bonehead newbie question but what do most people do in terms of buying? Do I roll over to Microcenter and hand them this list or do I just buy everything myself individually online and start putting it together?
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Nov 7, 2022 17:36
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Elephant Ambush posted:So I know this is a total bonehead newbie question but what do most people do in terms of buying? Do I roll over to Microcenter and hand them this list or do I just buy everything myself individually online and start putting it together? Go to microcenter and buy whatever is on the list that you can get there for cheaper/the equivalent price. Iirc they give you a discount for buying the motherboard and CPU at the same time. Order everything else online.
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Nov 7, 2022 17:49
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Elephant Ambush posted:I finally had time to go back and look at the suggested builds you linked again. If Micro Center is an option, I'd buy the parts online and pick them up in store. It's a lot less of a headache than dealing with an array of retailers or getting each display case unlocked as you schlep through the store. If there's anything you're unsure about, say the case, you can take a look and decide then, but I would let them pick the rest for sure. They price match components too, so if you do find something cheaper online, I'd have the page loaded up on your phone, and talk to them about it at checkout.
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Nov 7, 2022 17:52
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nitsuga posted:If Micro Center is an option, I'd buy the parts online and pick them up in store. It's a lot less of a headache than dealing with an array of retailers or getting each display case unlocked as you schlep through the store. If there's anything you're unsure about, say the case, you can take a look and decide then, but I would let them pick the rest for sure. Butterfly Valley posted:Go to microcenter and buy whatever is on the list that you can get there for cheaper/the equivalent price. Iirc they give you a discount for buying the motherboard and CPU at the same time. Order everything else online. Thanks. I'll check their website and see how easy it is to order everything ahead of time and then just go pick it up
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Nov 7, 2022 18:02
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Pilfered Pallbearers posted:Will that system run plex? Sure, but it won’t run it well or efficiently. You’re gonna max out the CPU transcoding most stuff, and 128gb is too small for the SSD. You want the whole plex system on an SSD which includes metadata, covers, etc etc. My understanding is that the HD 630 is the same GPU as the UHD 630, the latter just being a rebadge, and it would be powerful enough for Plex thanks to it's Quicksync capabilities as outlined here, however due to power draw concerns I will look at other options first.
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Nov 7, 2022 18:03
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