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There's always the option that Tiger has severe dyslexia or something along those lines, she doesn't have to be completely illiterate for her to have problems reading. Especially in a life or death situation like this.Junpei posted:Reminder: Tiger said she was homeschooled, back in the gym. Or just some really bad homeschooling, of course. "Just throw a couple of books at the kid, she'll learn to read." is not a valid teaching method.
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Nov 5, 2022 08:13
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Sketchie posted:That's certainly strange. Pig and Horse really seem they used their abilities: Pig moved 7 spaces, the exact number of people in front of her when her turn came. Horse used his ability to move 3 spaces. It's Monkey and Rooster that are a mystery: Rooster moved 4 spaces like his ability but he can't use it on himself, and Monkey can't have used hers since nobody did last round. So they either confessed or found some trinkets to help
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Nov 5, 2022 12:36
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 [BGM: Mousetrap]  I was on the 9th space. Ox was on the 9th space. Tiger was on the 8th space. Bunny was on the 9th space. Dragon was on the 7th space. Snake was on the 9th space. Horse was on the 11th space. Sheep was on the 5th space. Monkey was on the 10th space. Rooster was on the 12th space. Dog was on the 6th space. And Pig was on the 15th space.  What the hell is going on?! It's become complete chaos. Indeed. It seems the group's patience has been pushed to its limits, and many have begun to rush out for their own safety. We are rather disorganized now. How on earth did we even get this configuration? It appears that us three and Bunny did what we said we would, and of course the dead did not move. Horse moved three spaces, meaning he must have used his ability. Pig getting to the 15th space also adds up if she used her ability. The spaces match up. What I'm struggling to comprehend is how Monkey and Rooster got in the 12th and 10th space. That would mean Monkey moved 2 and Rooster 4. But neither of their abilities should've allowed for that. Did they lie about what they had? Perhaps, but that would be a rather odd lie. Anyways, that isn't exactly the main issue here, is it? Of course it isn't, our entire plan's up in smoke! Why did it come to this...[BGM: Silence]  Actually, I wouldn't say the entire plan is ruined. There's a way to turn this around and have all 8 of us survive. Er, 6 of us, considering that two of us are likely traitors. There is? What? Do you recall how I hid my ability in case things got out of hand? Of course. I had been wondering about that. Well, now is the time for it to shine. It's incredibly situational, I must admit, but we can get it to work.[BGM: Bullfighter]  If every other person, myself excluded, is on a different space when my ability triggers, they will all be brought to the space I am at. I am then brought forwards 5 spaces, but that's a minor enough difference that it won't affect us if we use the Trinkets as one. Woah! Then, if we find a token this round, we'd be able to pull together again and finish as a team. Precisely. But would we even be able to fulfill that condition of yours? Getting everyone on a different space is pretty tough. I will admit it is a bit tricky, but remember, the spaces are checked during my turn, that is, 6th in the order. Luckily for us, everyone after me is already in a different space. We just need to arrange you, Ox, and Bunny to be at different places. Since it doesn't check me, if you don't move Mouse, thing'sll be fine. But I have to take an action! Then use your SNEAKY RIDE on me, in which case you'll stay on your space until my ability triggers. If I use STAMPEDE I'll move to the 14th space, which should also work. However, you run into a problem with Bunny. Where can he go? Funny you ask that. I was suspicious of Bunny's ability from the start, so I later interrogated him about it. It turns out that he was still suspicious of us at that time, and lied about his real ability. That sneaky bastard! You have the right to be upset, but at least it will do some good now. Apparently, his real ability will move him one space forwards, and if there's someone occupying that space, it repeats. Basically, it's the perfect move to bring him to an unoccupied space. Then we can really pull this off! Yes, but we still must find another Trinket if everyone is to get out safely. Are you in agreement with this plan? It seems to be the only option. This is going to work. It has to! Then get to finding that last Trinket. Preferably this round. I'll go find Bunny and convince him to act accordingly. Very well, then. Remember: the only thing that matters now is finding a Minor Trinket. You got it!And just like that, we had regrouped from despair with a plan to save the day. So long as we found a Trinket, everyone would be saved! Thank God for Snake's ability, huh? Indeed. I must say, as much good as it's doing us, that's a pretty useless ability. What? It's saving our asses right now! Perhaps, but the fact that we're in a spot where we can arrange such a thing is a miracle. It may not look it, but everybodey being on a different spot is an incredibly difficult condition to pull off. Considering that, bringing everyone to one place and moving 5 spaces isn't even that big of a payoff. I feel like 'balance' wasn't the biggest concern in Brian's mind when he made this game. Probably not. Anyways, I think we should focus on finding a Trinket. It'd be best if we split up. Isn't that dangerous? Perhaps, but not finding a Trinket is even more so. I guess you're right. But be careful.[BGM: That Pesky Rodent]  Be careful yourself. And find a Trinket. I will!When we split up, I was filled with determination. I went through classrooms at an even greater speed. Part of me was afraid that by rushing through them, I was ruining the possibility that I would miss something. But I didn't have time to worry about that! As much as I tried to focus on looking for Minor Trinkets, I wasn't completely able to dismiss the annoyance in my stomach. Why didn't everyone stick to the plan? Yeah, things might've been scary, but to turn their backs on the group without telling anyone like that... It made me livid. No, I shouldn't blame them. They were just scared. They had every right to be. All I needed to do was fix it. I could fix it, right?  As I thought this, I ran into Pig.  Ah! Mouse! Pig! There you are. You're looking really mad right now. Are you mad? Hell yeah I'm mad, you completely didn't stick to the plan! I'msorryI'msorryI'msorry. I promise, I'll just run this turn. Well that's all fine and good, but that doesn't make up for the fact that you're way ahead! I know! I'm sorry! Look, there's a plan at the moment to fix things, but we'll need that final Minor Trinket. Have you found it? … I should've guessed as much. I can get back to looking though! Yeah, do that. I still don't know why you'd do something like that though... I was scared! So? Look, I was just talking with Snake, and he was saying all these big things about how bad things were, and about how someone could betray us. So what, you're saying Snake made you do it? No, no, I'm not trying to blame someone else. I'm just explaining myself. See, after that conversation, I started worrying about how the ambitious player might be able to start rushing ahead of us. And I thought that if I got closest to the finish line, you know, maybe that would help? What?! I don't know, like maybe by giving them competition or something- Spare me the nonsense. You wanted the option to abandon us and get to the finish line by yourself if everything went wrong, didn't you?  Well when our plans have been this bad, can you blame me? Yeah, I can. I am! I'm sorry! Just... Just make sure you only run this turn. I will, I swear. And I'll find a Trinket for you, too!And with that, Pig ran away from me. She clearly didn't mean to upset me. But I got the feeling she wasn't truly that sorry about what she did. She was so worried about her own safety that she thought what she did was necessary, not something to be ashamed of. I was only angrier after that conversation. But I couldn't let that distract me. I needed to focus on what was important. Minor Trinkets. [BGM: Silence]  In my search, the only thing I found was another empty safe. Again, I was walking over previously trodden path. This was what happened when our teamwork fell apart. What shattered it? Was it the announcement after Round 3? Well, that definitely didn't help. But no, that wasn't it. It was how we handled the aftermath of Sheep's death. We weren't enough of a group. And everything spiraled out of control from there. I checked the time. The round was almost over. I should make my move and hope someone else found a Trinket. If that didn't happen... We'd figure something out. I had to use my ability. I should use it on Snake, right? But... If I used it on Ox, I could get far ahead. Was it really right to just bring everyone together and stick to the plan? Wasn't that a sucker's game? Could I really trust that things would work out? If I rushed forward, then maybe on my own... I had a really bad feeling about just blindly sticking to the plan. Everything that had happened, all the conversation I had heard replayed in the back of my mind. And doing so, I came to a realization about how to survive. So then... this is right, right?Who to hitch a ride on? 
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Nov 7, 2022 17:03
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Also yes, this is a vote. 
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Nov 7, 2022 17:03
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Hahaha I love Snake's ridiculous JUST AS PLANNED reveal here. Let's hitch a ride with Snake to see how it all falls apart.
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Nov 7, 2022 17:15
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snake
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Nov 7, 2022 17:17
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yeah, let's go with snake's plan and see how it blows up beautifully
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Nov 7, 2022 17:24
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Ox. We are, I suspect, being set up. Ox is correct in pointing out that Snake's ability seems to be miraculously useful here...and he could easily be lying about it. Stating that Bunny lied about his ability is even more suspicious. The further problem is that Bunny and Snake are the two most suspicious people here. The murders were all traps or ambushes; all but Tiger's were set up to be locked room mysteries. Rather than solving the mysteries, I think it's better to follow Ox's advice and ask, "Who would set up a locked room mystery?" I'm not sure anyone but Snake would even try. Snake has also been putting ideas into our head from the start, and in this last update we have a pretty clear idea that he's been manipulating folks as everyone's been split off. He manipulated Pig into using her ability it seems, and I have little doubt he did the same with Horse. The real tell is Monkey and Rooster's movements, though. It could be secret confessions, but the most likely explanation is it's the result of Snake's ability. His original reason for refusing to share his was its potential to sow distrust in the group; this makes zero sense if his ability is what he stated it was, as it would never be possible to use while following the plan. Bunny is also a bit suspicious, so I wonder if they're working together. It was him that suggested we assume there's only one killer after all (due to the assumption that only one person would know how to fold an origami cat), and no one's suggested a very reasonable inference about the cat origami figures: that the most likely the killer would leave them is to throw people off the trail. Dog's death is very different from the others--the method was almost immediately figured out by Mouse, and if Bunny is trying to get away with murder he has a pretty good reason to get rid of Dog, who's very cunning and also knows him. His behavior and guesses in general seem to be just less reasoned than I'd expect from him. ZCKaiser fucked around with this message at 18:22 on Nov 7, 2022 |
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Nov 7, 2022 17:59
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I'm also gonna vote Ox. I suspect we're running into multiple grand master plans here, so we may as well throw our own into the mix! There's no way Snake's ability is that convenient. Right? (Although giving the "everyone needs to cooperate or it's useless" ability to the shifty guy trying to manipulate people would also be kinda fitting.)
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Nov 7, 2022 18:09
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Yeah, unless Snake was trying to pull some sort of wacky reverse psychology on us, it seems like the best thing to do is the opposite of what he says and, just as in the Zodiac Race legend, go for a sneaky ride on Ox.
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Nov 7, 2022 18:25
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There HAS to be a catch with Snake's ability - it's just way too convenient and suspicious. Let's use Sneaky Ride on Ox! It may save our skin. Hopefully.
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Nov 7, 2022 18:33
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There's also a big detail hinting at the murderer: Why did every victim die once per round, which just so happens to put them all in different positions to let Snake use his ability? And of course the fact that "if everyone is on a different space, I move 5" is pure bullshit given abilities like "can move another player 4 spaces" or "can move 3 spaces at no cost". Take a nap over Ox, gently caress Snake's smug plan.
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Nov 7, 2022 18:36
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Voting for Ox. This is all far too convenient for Snake, especially when it is clear that he manipulated Pig into panicking. Also, as mentioned, it matches with the original tale so we get a meta-theming bonus for doing it.
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Nov 7, 2022 18:39
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GiantRockFromSpace posted:There's also a big detail hinting at the murderer: Why did every victim die once per round, which just so happens to put them all in different positions to let Snake use his ability? And of course the fact that "if everyone is on a different space, I move 5" is pure bullshit given abilities like "can move another player 4 spaces" or "can move 3 spaces at no cost". Take a nap over Ox, gently caress Snake's smug plan. It was likely a huge gamble for Snake. Assuming he's the traitor, that is.
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Nov 7, 2022 18:46
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Snake is totally manipulating Pig and very probably Mouse too. I don't think rushing ahead ourselves gets us much in and of itself, though. It might cause Snake to reveal himself as one of the traitorous roles, but if his a-little-too-tailor-made ability is legit then I have to hand it to him for managing to orchestrate a situation where he can actually use it. Mostly I just want to see Snake's endgame, whatever it is. Thus, we should hitch a rid with Snake? Snake!? SNAAAAAAAAAAAKKKEEE.
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Nov 7, 2022 20:15
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Also, while a poisoning might not have been dragon or tiger's style, it sure as hell feels like snake's.
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Nov 7, 2022 20:35
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All said it's funny that the most trustworthy thing Snake said is Bunny's true ability, with Snake being so obsessed with getting everyone on separate positions it's the only way he can get Bunny out of the way since otherwise any move they make will keep them in the same lane as someone else (unless it's a trinket). It does fit as a bunny ability as well, and dodges the whole "worse Horse" thing. Although then we have to assume people could have lied about theirs too. Pig and Horse are probably what they said given the spaces, but Rooster could have lied about not being able to use it on himself.
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Nov 7, 2022 20:36
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By the way I want you all to know you tied with two of the route votes, which I honestly didn't think would happen considering how many there still all, but honestly the two you tied on are pretty good together so what I did was flip a coin for which one we'll do first, then just move straight into the other tied one next.
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Nov 7, 2022 21:10
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I want to see what happens if we ride with Snake, but he seems like the Ambitious culprit this time. His ability probably takes him straight to the end. This sounds great for Mouse, but we have to remember that the rest of Snake's ability could force Hateful into last place. Meaning Mouse would die from riding along with Snake. Let's reluctantly ride with Ox. Even if we're wrong, we can afford to waste a round before executing Snake's plan.
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Nov 8, 2022 02:30
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NeoRonTheNeuron posted:His ability probably takes him straight to the end. This sounds great for Mouse, but we have to remember that the rest of Snake's ability could force Hateful into last place. Meaning Mouse would die from riding along with Snake. Wait, doesn't Mouse's ability trigger after Snake's turn is done? If Snake ends up at the end one way or another, then Mouse would be along for the ride. If Snake's ability does what he says it does, Mouse will join him 5 spaces ahead. Either way it's a really good deal for Mouse I'd think?
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Nov 8, 2022 03:38
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Dirk the Average posted:Wait, doesn't Mouse's ability trigger after Snake's turn is done? If Snake ends up at the end one way or another, then Mouse would be along for the ride. If Snake's ability does what he says it does, Mouse will join him 5 spaces ahead. Either way it's a really good deal for Mouse I'd think? Yeah, I'm not quite sure what to think about this deal. Snake is 100% suspicious but asking Mouse to use the ability on him makes no sense if he's hateful, right? They would end up tied for last place if Snake could force the game and I don't think Jade Emperor would be so generous to allow a tie for last place. Otoh if he is ambitious and this is a game winning move, it makes sense for Mouse to hitch a ride but this is screaming a trap. I'm not sure what is about to happen here.
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Nov 8, 2022 04:02
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Dirk the Average posted:Wait, doesn't Mouse's ability trigger after Snake's turn is done? If Snake ends up at the end one way or another, then Mouse would be along for the ride. If Snake's ability does what he says it does, Mouse will join him 5 spaces ahead. Either way it's a really good deal for Mouse I'd think? I am implying that Snake is lying. His ability could force everyone else to the same point AND move his token all the way to the end zone (instead of just 5 spaces). Mouse could choose to ride along with Snake, but the person who is Hateful would probably end up in last place. Assuming Snake is Ambitious, only he and the Hateful one get to survive. Mouse would die, despite reaching the end. That's why it would be safer to tag along with Ox. It prevents Snake's win condition from triggering and could expose his plan to others. We saw in the Dog route that he's a gloater, so he might break character too soon. In the off chance that Snake was telling the truth, we'd be able to try his plan next round.
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Nov 8, 2022 21:25
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NeoRonTheNeuron posted:I am implying that Snake is lying. His ability could force everyone else to the same point AND move his token all the way to the end zone (instead of just 5 spaces). Betraying Snake would piss him off though, if he's telling the truth. Not sure if he'd try something else There's one question about personalities: does it count if the "must lose" one dies but is last? Cause in either case unless the Hateful one is Sheep (not likely) or Monkey (not likely cause hers is absolutely Sicko) there would be no risk of Hateful shenanigans. And if Snake does move to the finish line and Mouse Sneaky Rides, it would depend on how poo poo works. Does the game instantly end when someone reaches the goal? Or does it process all turns first? In the first case everyone but Snake dies because you need to tie with him if Ambitious. In the second case Mouse does survive because her and Snake have the same position so she'd move to the finish line with him.
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Nov 8, 2022 22:41
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That's a good point, I had not considered Snake being ambitious and working to make the hateful one end up being last. In that case, even if Mouse rides Snake straight to the end, she still dies.GiantRockFromSpace posted:And if Snake does move to the finish line and Mouse Sneaky Rides, it would depend on how poo poo works. Does the game instantly end when someone reaches the goal? Or does it process all turns first? In the first case everyone but Snake dies because you need to tie with him if Ambitious. In the second case Mouse does survive because her and Snake have the same position so she'd move to the finish line with him. We basically know the answer to this. If it immediately ended when the first person crossed the line, only one winner would be possible and we know that's not the case, on Dog's route, the survivors all make it out.
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Nov 8, 2022 22:52
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Marluxia posted:We basically know the answer to this. If it immediately ended when the first person crossed the line, only one winner would be possible and we know that's not the case, on Dog's route, the survivors all make it out. Oh that's true. In that case Snake apparently likes Mouse enough to let her live with him, since even if everyone is taken to Snake's lane she'd move to the finish line with him. I mean she's also necessary for the stratagem to work on the first place but he could have manipulated people in other ways.
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Nov 8, 2022 23:07
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GiantRockFromSpace posted:Oh that's true. In that case Snake apparently likes Mouse enough to let her live with him, since even if everyone is taken to Snake's lane she'd move to the finish line with him. I mean she's also necessary for the stratagem to work on the first place but he could have manipulated people in other ways. From what he was saying, he needs her to stand still. He could have suggested that she confess and say nothing, I suppose, or hitch a ride with a player below him, but asking her to hitch with him is a lot more palatable to mouse. But yeah, the hateful thing throws a giant wrench into the works.
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Nov 9, 2022 01:36
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 The thread voted to break from the plans and hitch a ride on Ox, so that's what we're going to do. [BGM: Slithering]  I didn't make this choice because I wanted to betray anyone. I made this choice because I realized just what I was dealing with. My conversation with Ox. My conversation with Pig. And my conversation with Snake. All of these put together, I had realized what was really happening here. And I knew how to stop it. I walked to the cafeteria with confidence. Most everyone was grouped at the center, though once again I noticed Snake making a move at the chessboard. Hey everybody! Mouse. Did you find a Minor Trinket? I'm worried that by the tone of that question, no one else has. So we all failed, huh? Hey, we don't need to worry. After Snake brings things together, we can search as a group! We still have time. I'm not sure about that. Let's keep things optimistic, okay? We can't give up hope! For now, let's turn our attention to the screen. I believe the round is about to commence.Snake was right; the speakers kicked on moments later.   Round 9 has ended. Now, let us see how the race has progressed. The Rat has hitched a SNEAKY RIDE on Ox. The Ox has begun to STAMPEDE and moved to the 14th space. Thanks to the SNEAKY RIDE, The Rat also moves five spaces. The Tiger has failed to make a move. The Bunny has begun to HOP and moved four spaces. The Dragon has failed to make a move. The Snake has attempted to SERPENTINE. The SERPENTINE has failed! The Snake does not move. The Horse has RUN one space. The Sheep has failed to make a move. The Monkey has RUN one space. The Rooster has RUN one space. The Dog has failed to make a move. The Pig has RUN one space. Now, Round 10 has begun. Do your best, and choose wisely.[BGM: Mousetrap]  As expected, I was immediately faced with outrage.  Mouse, what the hell is this? Hey, I thought we were going to let Snake do their Serpentine thing and all fall back in line? Why'd you change your mind, Mouse? Because if I hadn't, we'd all be dead. Isn't that right Snake? Wh-what?! Oh my. What a claim. I'm not quite sure what you mean, Mouse. Would you care to elaborate on that?Breathe. I was the leader of our mock trial team. This was just a debate. I had this. [BGM: Dance of the Snakes]  Oh, I'll elaborate alright. In fact, I'm going to give you a beautiful grand finale just like you wanted. Right here, right now, I'm going to expose everything about this stupid race. Well please, go ahead. I am quite curious by what you mean. Let's start with explaining why you decided to not follow the plan. Right, right. Your plan. I must say, it was awfully convenient that everyone after you in the order decided to start freaking out like that.  I heard from Pig that she did it because you made her afraid of the possibility that the traitor would be able to rush ahead and win the race. Oh? Pig, you blamed me for your defection? I-I- No, no she didn't. She simply said that she grew more worried after talking with you. I wonder, did anyone else have a similar experience? Now that you mention it, Snake did pop by when Monkey and I were searching together and said some scary poo poo. ...Not that I was scared, of course. But perhaps he was deliberately priming us to betray the group.  He talked with me, too. Didn't tell me to start sprinting. But I chose to after our conversation. Interesting pattern there, Snake. Care to comment? Well, I suppose when you frame it like that, you could construe ill-content. However, I was merely talking with anyone I came across as I searched the school. I was worried about what might happen if the person with the ambitious personality decided to start acting out, and I shared those fears with my teammates. In truth, I was also gauging their reactions to see if I could figure out who it was. But still, it's a stretch to try and pin the blame on me for the actions they took because they were scared. Besides, I question the point of all that work just to bring everybody back to the same space. You're right, it is a lot of work. It doesn't really make sense to me. Then we are in agreement? No, not really. Because it does actually make sense if you weren't trying to bring everybody back to the same square. Sure, that's what you said your ability does. But as you've pointed out, people can lie about their abilities pretty freely. Ah, I see what you're getting at. That's why you said 'everyone would be dead'. Let me see if I can guess what you're about to say. 'The only reason someone would go through all this trouble would be to try and survive. My ability must let me instantly go to the finish line if everyone besides me is on a separate space. 'That's why I deliberately goaded the people after me to break formation, and then I came to the people before me to clue them in to a false plan.' There's a certain amount of sense to your story. But unfortunately, a story without evidence would be categorized as fiction. Unless, of course, you have some evidence about my ability's true nature? I don't have evidence per se, but I do have something to bring up. It is a tremendously difficult task to get everyone on a different space. With such a high-skill requirement, it would make sense for the reward to be something stronger than 'everybody goes to the same space and you get a 5 space lead'. That's your reasoning? Mouse, I hate to say it, but Brian has never been the best when it comes to game balance. Surely you can look at other abilities and see how wildly uneven in terms of strength they are. Why can the same not be said of me? Sure, some abilities might be a bit stronger than others, but your supposed ability is miles weaker than anything else! Perhaps he simply has a grudge against me. Mouse, this can't be it, can it? You've ruined our chance at teamwork due to suspicions built with such slim evidence? Hold on, there's more. We come at last to the final branching point for this route, but it's not a simple binary [X or Y] choice- no, this time we're in a deduction, and whether we can properly suss out what's really been going on on this route and ask the right questions/take the right actions each time we're prompted is what determines what path we go down. ...That being said, it's kind of hard to get a forum thread to successfully deduct things when the questions give away some of the context, so we're just going to successfully deduct everything here, and in the bonus update post-route I'll go into the actual deduction breakdown, as well as show off what happens if you get it wrong. Therefore...  What if I could prove your desperation to separate us onto different spaces was beyond reasonable. Prove that if the ability really was what you said it was, you'd have no good excuse in acting the way you did. Seeing as I haven't once acted to separate us, I'd be curious as to how you would go about doing that. Please proceed. It really is a difficult thing, having us land on 11 different spaces, especially since we were working as a group for so long. You barely did it when there were 7 of us active. You had no chance when there were 11 of us. Mouse, you're not about to say what I think you are, are you? drat right I am.[BGM: Constriction]  Snake, I'm accusing you of the Origami Cat Killings! And I believe your motive was to separate the rest of us onto separate squares, by force if needed! Furthermore, the reason you needed to do this was because your ability allowed you to instantly get to the finish line if we were all separated. And you wanted to get to the finish line before us because you have the 'ambitious' personality type! For real?! No way! There's no way that's true, right? Mouse, you're saying this is the rear end in a top hat behind all those killings? That's exactly what I'm saying. Oh my. Mouse, I'm afraid I may have indulged your delusions a bit too long. I know you're searching for neat answers to difficult problems, but you can't really believe I murdered those 3 people, do you? I don't. I believe you murdered those 4 people. Well then. I suppose I have no choice but to listen as you try to prove it. Frankly, I'd be impressed if you even managed to tell a story that halfway made sense. But I am intrigued as to what you'll try. So go on then. Mouse, are you sure about this? Trust me, I'm certain. I guess I'll start at how I started suspecting you to be the killer in the first place. Ox told me to think about who would commit these murders in this way. And when I started thinking about that, I realized something about these murders. There was an awful beauty in these murders. What? The bodies were all unmarred, killed without much injury, killed almost instantly. Each time a body was found, there would be an origami cat nearby, and each time it was found in some bizarre state. I can almost picture it now- in a demonic school, the Cat moved like mist and peacefully killed us in impossible ways. Wouldn't you say there's something poetic in these murders? Poetic? I don't get what you're referring to. Murder is murder. There's nothing beautiful to be found in it. Perhaps, but think of it this way: even if you dislike poetry, you'd rather read good poetry than bad, no? Tch. You're right, Snake, that what I've been saying is ridiculous, but deep down you agree with what I've been saying, don't you? I find it a preposterous leap to suspect me over something like that. The murders were all bloodless simply because messy murders would leave more evidence. The locked-room setups were meant to sew doubt and put us in a state of paranoia where we couldn't think straight. Those were likely all motivations as well, but this wasn't the only way to solve those problems. At your core, Snake, you're an idealist. If you had to kill, some part of your subconscious wanted it to be in a seemingly 'elegant' method. Unharmed bodies. Unsolvable mysteries. A calm and methodical battle of wits, not vicious and reprehensible murder. If Horse were to kill us all, he'd start swinging a knife without restraint. If Bunny wanted to kill us, he'd grab a pistol and ambush us one by one. If Rooster wanted to kill us, he'd hit someone over the head with a bat and run. But if you wanted to kill us, you'd use poison and trickery. Plus, you're obviously the only one who can fold an origami cat. As I've told you, I do not possess such skills. I respectfully disagree. Do you have anything of substance in your accusations? Theorize about motives all you want, but the fact of the matter is these murders were, as you called them, 'bizarre impossible situations'. Take Sheep's death for instance. How on earth could I do something like that? You all saw the room, it was impossible to enter unless you had a key. One key was with Tiger at all times, the other inside the room. This crime is impossible for me to commit. And with that, your accusation crumbles. Impossible, you say? That may be the case if everything was as we believed it to be. However, we made one false assumption! We thought Sheep was dead before you and Dragon came across her body laying limp in the room. Of course we'd think that! Of course you would! It's correct. No, it's not. She wasn't killed until after Dragon left the room!
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Nov 9, 2022 17:25
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[Samurai Woman playing in the distance] 
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Nov 9, 2022 17:38
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Finally, time for Mouse to shine with her Ace Attorney experie- I mean, law degree. I would have pointed out that Snake forcing Bunny to reveal his true ability is also a point against him, without it he would have never been able to try Serpentine, so why try to bring it up if it's a meh strat it might have not worked?
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Nov 9, 2022 18:00
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Ah, I think I see. If Sheep wasn't dead when Dragon and Snake first saw her, she was probably being a sleepy Sheepy.
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Nov 10, 2022 15:26
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To be fair, Snake being the one to use poison is a little on the nose, isn't it?
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Nov 10, 2022 15:50
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 content warning: suicide [BGM: Constriction]   Mouse, that's impossible! Why would Sheep be lying like that if she wasn't dead? And even if she was alive, how does that change anything? Here's how it happened. Sheep was a very suggestible girl. Snake is a very convincing man. A number of scenarios could have taken place, but let's say... Snake approached Sheep, claiming he was concerned about Tiger having the key. Snake said he questioned if she could be trusted. Sheep advocated for Tiger, so Snake proposed they put it to the test. Sheep was to go in the room and pretend to be dead. Snake would bring in someone, and they'd see the body together. Snake would then tell the other person to get the key from Tiger. If Tiger really just gave the key to this other person without question, she would be deemed too gullible to keep the key. However, if she went along with the other person, then she would be fine. An extreme way of testing her to be sure, but Snake is quite persuasive, and Sheep is easily pushed around. So Sheep goes along with the plan, and Snake brings Dragon into the room. He makes sure Dragon checks both the chain and the window. After Dragon runs away, Snake uses the speaker to tell Sheep to unlock the door and come back out. After all, they wouldn't want to scare the others for too long, so when they got back they'd need to see Sheep alive and well. Sheep complied, and unlocked the chain. However, earlier, when the two were preparing this test, Snake pocketed the poison. As soon as Snake got the chance, he sunk his poisoned fangs into Sheep and pushed her back down to where she lay before. Snake re-locked the chain and dropped the key in Sheep's pocket. Then he unlocks the window and returns to the intermediate room through there. He quickly shuts the window and acts casual. We run in right after that- he doesn't have that much time, so the timing of all this is likely quite tight. Dragon insists Tiger quickly unlock the chain, and everybody bursts into the room. Dragon in the front, Tiger and myself behind her. ...And you in the rear. As we all panic over Sheep's death, you quickly and subtly re-lock the window from the inside. And with that, an impossible murder has occurred. Whoa... Mouse, that was incredible. Yes, indeed, a truly logical explanation you have provided. I must commend you- I was dubious of how you'd go about it, but you pulled it off! You have successfully strewn together a scenario in which I could have killed Sheep. Spectacularly done. I say with all sincerity that that was a most impressive effort. However, I'm afraid to say it simply isn't true. While I grant you that that is a completely possible scenario, I still must ask you provide any evidence towards your claim. Evidence? How else could you explain that murder! How else? Why, I could think of a number of ways. Perhaps Tiger was the murderer. She might not have had a clear motive, but killers rarely do. Or perhaps Dragon. Yes, there was an origami cat by her crime scene, but perhaps she had made it in advance as she prepared to kill someone. But then maybe the tables were turned on her, and her killer used the previously prepared calling card against her. That would explain why there was no cat near Tiger, yes? Or perhaps Brian decided to interfere with the game and commit some murders himself. There's no rule against it. Perhaps Bunny lied, and there were three keys to the chain. Perhaps the poison wasn't actually the instant-acting one stolen, but a slower-acting chemical combination concocted in a science lab, and Sheep locked the chain and sat and died all on her own. We can all make up stories, Mouse. But that won't make them true. Fine. Let's move on, then. We already discussed how the second murder took place. Your killing intent slithered through the wire, through the door, into Dog's hand. You tried to divert suspicion by solving it with me, but you knew that such a simple method would be cracked easily. You even pretended to comfort me while avoiding the circle of accusations the others were making at each other. Are all my actions, benign or not, somehow devilish in your world, Mouse? Now we can look at Dragon's death. And again we reach an impossible scenario. I am eager to see how you write me the killer here. It's really pretty simple. There was really only one answer to this mystery all along. You stacked that tower from inside the room. That would be the presumption, yes. Then you hid inside that room and waited for someone to discover the body. This sort of thing is usually a risky gamble, but with everyone so scattered around, it actually wasn't much of a dangerous play at all. I hid inside the room? Forgive me if I'm wrong, but did you not look around the place when you entered? That I did. And you didn't see anyone, right? I did not. Then where on earth could I have hidden? There aren't many places to hide. There aren't, but there was one place. The closet. The closet? Mouse, all the closets in the school have been locked. Hey, maybe Snake found the key to that closet somewhere! Is that what you believe, Mouse? No, I doubt there's anything like that around. I'm pretty sure those closets were never intended to have anything to do with the game. They were just locked with keys that teachers would have. ...Which is why Snake should've been able to hide there. Come again? Don't play dumb with me! You're actually a teacher at this school, aren't you? Goodness. Now this is certainly an interesting accusation. I do believe I've said this before, but I am an artist. You might also be that. But you're definitely a teacher here. And how did you come to this conclusion? Earlier, when we talked about the scene Dragon was dead at, you called it 'Mr. Golloday's Classroom'. An odd way of referring to it, wouldn't you say? I'd sooner call it an accurate one. How would you know whose classroom it was? As I said then, it was written on the whiteboard. But why would you remember that when in a room with a murder victim? My memory isn't quit eidetic, but it's close. Even still, that's not how you'd refer to this room if you had no idea who 'Mr. Golloday' was! No one else called it that, they all said 'the classroom Dragon died in' like normal people. I would consider my speech a bit more eloquent than normal people's. That's not all the evidence I have. You recognized Brian due to his Butterfly tattoo, right? Yes. I believe Monkey did as well. It makes sense why Monkey would recognize it. She's his therapist. What doesn't make sense is why you would recognize it. By your own admission, you had no real connection to this case. You were just some random witness. So how would you know immediately that the son of a man who was executed based on your testimony years ago had a butterfly tattoo there? Did you not recognize the artistry in the tattoo? It was actually done by a friend of mine. When she was showing off some of her work, I thought I recognized the boy who got the butterfly tattoo. Out of curiosity, I asked about him, and realized who he was. That's a fairly notable memory, and hence why I could identify him so quickly. What a lovely story. Why did none of this come out when we first talked about it? Why would it? No one asked, and I hardly thought it a relevant contribution to the discussion at the time. Is it not because you had him as a student? Could that teacher-student relationship have more to do with why you were chosen than your prior testimony? There are plenty of people here for seemingly weak reasons. Are they all a part of the teaching staff, too? There's more. Throughout the day, there's been plenty of moments where you've been more familiar with the school than you should've been. Again, all hearsay. You're a teacher, and you have a master key to the closets! After setting up those books, you slunk away to a hiding spot and waited for more prey. Suppose for a second you are correct. Then how do you explain Tiger's murder? Will you blame that on me, too? drat right I will. Admittedly, changing up your pattern did throw me off for a bit. But that's just it, isn't it? A change in the pattern. What happened? Were you out of ideas for locked room mysteries? Or did you just want to shake things up to confuse people? I believe those are the questions you are supposed to be answering now. Here is another one to ponder: how on earth did I manage to kill Tiger? Certainly such a task is beyond my capabilities, wouldn't you think? Tiger's strong, but she's not immortal. You were able to easily strangle her by using one simple thing. You took advantage of the crime scene to strangle her! The crime scene you say? This is certainly a new one. It's obvious that she was strangled with a wire. Perhaps one found in an art classroom, used for making sculptures. Perhaps. But instead of just wrapping it around Tiger's neck, you formed a noose with that wire. You held the neck of the noose in your hand, and dropped the rest of it down through one of the railings in the top floor of the stairwell. When Tiger walked by, you distracted her somehow, maybe made her turn around. All you had to do was get the noose around her neck, and it was curtains. You think I had the strength to strangle her while she fought back? How highly you think of me. You didn't have the strength, you had the weight. As soon as the noose was around her neck, you jumped over the railing and gripped onto the wire. Your weight suddenly slammed Tiger's neck to the ground, and your entire weight pulled against her throat as her head leaned against the railing. She could probably lift your weight, but at that angle and having happened so suddenly, there was nothing she could do to fight back. Like a cobra, you roped your way around her neck and strangled tightly. You were able to choke out someone who was three times stronger than you, and four times the fighter. What lovely creativity on display. Truly, Mouse, if you were to murder us all, I would never be able to catch you.[BGM: Silence]  But here's the moment of truth: did your words convince anyone other than yourself? Well, let's find out. How about it people, do you think her story credible? There are some weird parts here and there, but everything adds up. I don't know how else it could have happened. I was convinced as soon as you accused him of being a teacher here. I too have thought it strange how he referred to certain things. Now I have an explanation. I called him being a killer from the start! How could a creep like this not be a murderer? Yeah, it's definitely Snake! Good job catching this guy, Mouse. Personally, I am not fully convinced. Such an accusation wouldn't stand up in court. However, if it were a civil case, I would rule in your favor. In other words, Snake, I'm siding with her on this one. I see, I see. So there you have it.Snake stood there with this eyes closed for a few moments. Then he began to pace the floor. Are you going to say something?He stayed silent for a few beats more, and then spoke in just as calm a tone as ever. [BGM: Slithering]  I was surprised when I realized Brian had chosen me for this game. I wasn't surprised when I realized Brian had made the game, this is very much his style. Overly dramatic, mechanically complex, artfully violent, that all checked out. But I was a little offended that he thought me worthy of this twisted revenge game. Even more so when I saw that my personality was 'ambitious'. So I was right! Why were you offended? If you were his teacher, didn't Brian show signs of hating you in class? At first, certainly. In fact, he confronted me about it quite early on. He accused me of horrible stuff, of fabricating testimony, of being an agent of evil. But I calmly explained to him that I only said what I had seen. Everything in my testimony was supported by numerous other people, and the only way I could be lying is if a number of others were in on it. From there, he seemed to soften his view on me. Even more so when I said I agreed that his father might have been innocent. You think that? I certainly entertained the possibility. I'll be the first to admit that chance a slight one, but certain things never sat right with me. For instance, I also saw Mr. Morris leaving the scene. And unlike Tiger's testimony, I would not describe his expression as particularly angry or scared. Confused, if anything. Then again, I was further away from him than Tiger, so maybe I didn't get as good a look. So I entertained Brian's theories, and got to know the boy. I would have described our relationship as rather good. Hence, I was slightly offended after realizing what had happened.Snake took a few more steps.  In case it isn't clear, Mouse was largely right in her deductions. I tried to make the murders perfectly orderly, but of course things didn't all go to plan. Nothing does in life. I thought I had learned that lesson long ago. Before I was in the military, when I was starting out as an artist, I was obsessed with the idea of perfect art. I focused on being as fully in control of my brush strokes as possible. I'd throw out pieces with the slightest imperfection. So when I ended up in the military due to various circumstances, for a while things made sense to me there. It was an incredibly orderly environment. Everything was where it needed to be. Entirely unlike the chaos of the battlefield. It was there I learned that as much control that you might think you have, you can't control everything. In time, everything falls to chaos. I adopted that philosophy into my art. Even the piece I ended up giving to Bowen, that sculpture was made up of broken pieces from my past failed projects. In teaching as well, I was a strict teacher to those who sought that and a relaxed teacher to the rest. I knew that enforcing order where it wasn't wanted was a fruitless task. What the hell are you talking about? I thought we were on why you murdered all those people![BGM: Silence]  Ah, yes. I suppose I did get a bit off track there. As could be expected, my parting thoughts are a bit rambling. But for why I chose to prioritize my life over ten of yours? Well, this will ring a hollow justification, and in many senses it is. I've not nearly the evidence backing my belief that should be required. Simply put, I could not trust you all. Trust us? I didn't trust that even without my interference, there wouldn't be a villain who would not only kill the rest of you, but go on to kill more. How could you think that? Who would do something that horrible?Instead of answering my question, Snake took a few more steps and ended up near the chess table once more. He took a move, then clicked his tongue. [BGM: Hear No Evil]  I see it now. Incredible. Mate in 9... no, 10. To have decided the game so long ago, Black truly is wondrous. Hey, stop dodging the question! Why didn't you trust us? I didn't trust you for one simple reason. For all the games he likes to play, I happen to know that Brian doesn't play a lick of chess. What? What does that have to do with anything? Where would the fun be if I just told you everything? If you figured me out, surely a puzzle this minor is no match to you.With that, Snake tossed three tokens on the floor. Minor Trinkets. One is the one you gave me earlier. I found another myself during the searching. Kept it to myself for obvious reasons. The other belonged to Tiger. I think she had just found one before I got to her first. Lucky me. This should bring your count up to 9. Although, I guess the 7 we started with will be more than enough without me. Without you? Oh, Mouse. I intend to take a graceful leave. I very much doubt history will remember me with much honor, but I wish to at least have an honorable death.From his pocket, Snake pulled out an ornate golden knife. That knife... I found it in Dog's boot when I went back to look at the body. Thought it might be useful. And with this, Brian will not have murdered a single person. A small grace, but a grace nonetheless. Hey, hold on! You don't have to do this! Oh, but I do. Not for any moral reasons, but because the alternative is to be executed. If you wish to do me any favors, Mouse, try and spin the story you tell the world to have some mercy on me. I know in your eyes I have no good reason to deserve it, however... I am more sure than ever that if I had not done something, we'd have ended in an even worse spot. So let's end things on a light note, shall we? Plaudite, acta est fabula![BGM: Silence]  With that last cry, Snake slashed his own throat in a single swipe with the knife, sending blood spattering everywhere. But it wasn't a beautiful death. It wasn't a fast or painless one. I heard him slowly sputter out, spitting blood on the floor, spasming for far longer than he had intended to. His death was ugly. As ugly as all deaths are. … [BGM: A True Foal]  Mouse, have you inputted your action? Yeah. Yeah, I did it at the start of the round. Okay, okay. Just checking.It was Round 12. Using the Trinkets, we were on track for everyone surviving to cross the finish line together. With Snake gone, we had no problem forming a sense of unity once again. Our only concern was the person with the hateful personality. However, after checking the tablets, we discovered that the person with that personality was actually one of Snake's victims. Everyone with a special win condition was gone. We could freely work together. It didn't take much maneuvering to get everyone back together. And on the last turn, we could all make it to the finish line. It was fine. We'd all make it out alive. ...no, that wasn't right. Because 5 of us were dead.  So, are you okay? Do I look okay? You know, you saved us with that whole Snake thing. There's nothing to feel bad about. I know, but... I don't feel good about him killing himself like that. Why? He was a remorseless serial killer who put himself above others. I don't know about 'remorseless'. I think he felt really bad, he just wasn't good at expressing that. Okay, fine, remorseful. Still doesn't make it right. I know that! But I don't know if he's a bad person because of all that. It's not like he'd ever normally kill someone. He's as much of a victim of this stupid game as anyone else. Perhaps. But I would mourn those he killed and not him himself. Of course I feel lovely about the victims! Sheep, Tiger, Dog, Dragon, not a one of them deserved to die! Then why are you focused on Snake? I'm not. It's just... I still don't get why he did it. He made up some justification so he wouldn't feel bad about the fact that he killed people to survive. It's not some grand mystery. But what was he saying about chess? Does it matter? No, I think it does! He was talking about this earlier. The chess boards are supposed to be put away during Thanksgiving Break. He must have known that for certain because he was a teacher. And yet there was a game in progress when we got here...You only get this bit of dialogue if Snake was one of the people you first hung out with at the start. So what? Well, if he's right that Brian doesn't play chess, then who played that game? Did some random kids break in during Thanksgiving Break just to play chess? And wasn't he moving the white pieces throughout the race? It was like he was playing against someone.I turned to the group. Hey! Was anyone moving the chess pieces during the game?I was only met with blank stares. If that's the case, then who was he playing against? Mouse, I think you're thinking about this too much. What matters now is that we're getting out of this alive. I guess you're right...There wasn't much to think about. We had won. This was our happy ending. Round 12 eventually came to a close, and everyone alive crossed the finish line. Our collars came off, and we escaped the school. [BGM: Silence]  In the end, myself, Ox, Bunny, Horse, Rooster, Monkey, and Pig escaped alive.  Ending - 7 of Spades  If nothing is found in the first three rounds but weapons and Trinkets, Snake will be assigned a role that forces him to act. If he's given a good opportunity, he will begin to take measures against the group by murdering them one at a time. Someone smart like Mouse may eventually catch him and lead the group to get out safely, but only after a number of participants are dead. There are certainly far worse outcomes, but this path is a bit too unpredictable and deadly. Surely Mouse can make better decisions than this, right?
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Nov 10, 2022 18:44
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Yeah, I'm actually really enjoying this game. Snake's insistence that Brian not commit any murders himself is really interesting.
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Nov 10, 2022 19:13
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Snake is an interesting bastard and I like him very much. This game is really impressing me so far, but maybe that's just because I'm seeing it in contrast to Quantum Suicide... Even though the setup is pretty cliche, the characters and mystery are compelling. (I'm in the middle of talking myself into/out of picking it up and playing it myself.)
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Nov 10, 2022 19:25
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So either Sheep or Dragon were Hateful. Awfully convenient that Snake killed the Hateful person before removing himself from the game as well (but it makes sense for a character-route-type narrative, since having a whole additional bit of story at the end where they rout out the Hateful person would kind of detract from the climactic Discovering-the-Snake-in-the-Grass scene). I agree with Leraika that it's interesting that Snake wanted to offer Brian the "grace" of not directly killing anyone via the collars--Snake still seems to care for his student (especially since Snake seems to have concluded--probably correctly--that there's another person behind the scenes that's running this death game).
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Nov 10, 2022 19:31
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Snake's route was actually the first route I completely in my playthrough of the game. It immediately cemented Snake as one of my favorite characters in this game.
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Nov 10, 2022 19:33
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So that's what Snake's ability can do. I can understand why Snake would rather keep it to himself; he could be very hard to trust otherwise which can throw their "escape together" plan into chaos. However it still does not explain how exactly Rooster and Monkey moved. They may have lied about their abilities, but who knows. I guess we'll never find out outside other endings/routes. I am looking forward to the other "endings" Snake has. However I am not sure what exactly 7 of Spades is supposed to show. To me, it looks like you're looking at someone from behind that's wearing an overly elegant cloak for a king. Or some sort of a boot with a pointy heel. EDIT: It's the origami cat, just distorted. Sketchie fucked around with this message at 19:53 on Nov 10, 2022 |
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Nov 10, 2022 19:48
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it's the origami cat but distorted
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Nov 10, 2022 19:48
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Mix. posted:it's the origami cat but distorted 
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Nov 10, 2022 19:50
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| # ? Jun 1, 2024 23:45 |
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Junpei posted:Snake's route was actually the first route I completely in my playthrough of the game. It immediately cemented Snake as one of my favorite characters in this game. good track record for people named Snake in escape games tbqh.
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Nov 10, 2022 19:51
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