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Xiahou Dun posted:It’s sounds like you’re still giving orders and the psychology is whether they follow those orders, which isn’t at all what I meant. I was talking more “”””realistic”””” battles where the player has control for initial set-up and command, but after that actual control of units becomes more restricted, e.g. some troops are out of command and fully subject to the AI with significantly less player control, possibly none. I was reading earlier today about Xenos Rampant, which does rolls to activate units, with the type of unit determining how hard the roll is by the different actions it can take. So you have to roll really high to get a lovely unit that hates melee to charge, but it might be easier to get them to shoot, or vice versa for elite berserkers. e: You could even finesse it by having alternate results for failure to activate.
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Nov 30, 2022 00:11
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Xiahou Dun posted:It’s sounds like you’re still giving orders and the psychology is whether they follow those orders, which isn’t at all what I meant. I was talking more “”””realistic”””” battles where the player has control for initial set-up and command, but after that actual control of units becomes more restricted, e.g. some troops are out of command and fully subject to the AI with significantly less player control, possibly none. "Come, play Warmaster Ancients m'lord"  You basically have control over setup, roll to issue orders via messenger, and the units can act on their own initiative when enemies are within a certain proximity. It's not 100% what you're describing, but it's probably the closest mainstream game you can find. Finding it is .. a pain. Your best bet would be to download Warmaster Revolutions, a fan-community produced version of the fantasy rules that incorporated developments made in the historical version. You may need to  army lists for whatever force interests you, because the books went oop. But at most you'll only need to find three pages of rules per faction.The game plays at 10mm, looks spectacular on the table, and was the basis for about a dozen other historical wargames you've maybe heard of.
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Nov 30, 2022 00:25
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https://twitter.com/TessFowler/status/1597379368124153856 Seems like some weird stuff is going on in Critical Role land. Tess later goes on to say that someone involved has actually been offering them money to sign onto whatever this NDA is, without explaining what the NDA is even for.
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Nov 30, 2022 00:29
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Xiahou Dun posted:I was talking more “”””realistic”””” battles where the player has control for initial set-up and command, but after that actual control of units becomes more restricted, e.g. some troops are out of command and fully subject to the AI with significantly less player control, possibly none. It's not common in historicals, but it's not all that rare. Take a look - https://thewargamingcompany.com/pdfs/QRGv3%20Final.pdf
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Nov 30, 2022 00:39
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Kai Tave posted:https://twitter.com/TessFowler/status/1597379368124153856 Seems like some weird stuff is going on in Critical Role land. Tess later goes on to say that someone involved has actually been offering them money to sign onto whatever this NDA is, without explaining what the NDA is even for. She posted another thread with some speculation about why this happened: https://mobile.twitter.com/TessFowler/status/1597676447761432576 I had no idea the company for CR was like this, it's really hosed up.
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Nov 30, 2022 00:42
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Ooo. Recommendations. Thanks, folks.
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Nov 30, 2022 00:46
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King of Solomon posted:She posted another thread with some speculation about why this happened: CR thread has multiple posts on this suggesting Tess Fowler is not a good source for this information. I wasn’t around for the drama discussed there when it happened, but I’d say wait until more people come forward before making any assumptions about CR. (For that matter “the company for CR” isn’t just one company.) Thread discussion starts here: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3982508&pagenumber=151#post528068913
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Nov 30, 2022 00:54
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I think that was what MOO3 was going for, but they couldn’t get the AI to be responsive enough to instructions. I’m sure I remember reading a review of some incredibly groggy computer wargame where you had to update the map yourself based on text reports, and give orders via a parser. Parse errors were not reported as the general would interpret the confusing orders, and in any case the runner taking them could be intercepted or killed, so they might never get them. Edit: it was Waterloo on the 16-bits. quote:It would be the same if you wanted to move the Division under the command a General Donzelot. Because Donzelot is subordinate to Corps Commander d'Erlon, it would be necessary to state: hyphz fucked around with this message at 06:08 on Nov 30, 2022 |
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Nov 30, 2022 06:03
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That whole Twitter thread sure is something. Of all the folks to stir things up with, oy. Maybe I just want to believe those folks are genuinely good, but surely SOMETHING would have come out by now besides this if the CR crew were shady. They’ve helped get a ton of folks’ feet in the door.
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Nov 30, 2022 07:43
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Saxophone posted:That whole Twitter thread sure is something. I would put more money on folks like Mercer paying no attention to business sides of things and getting in bed with lovely business people because they were the ones who had money to make things work vs actual abuse from the main CR folks. Historically that's happened before, with stuff like nerdist, wizard world conventions, and videogames live having previously employed or been a launching point for some of the CR people.
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Nov 30, 2022 08:41
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Saxophone posted:That whole Twitter thread sure is something. Things have come out before - this isn’t even the first time with Tess Fowler. There’s a reason she asked them not to use any of her art. Like, are you thinking she mocked up the legal did she was sent and is lying about this? Why the gently caress would anyone willingly make that poo poo up given how vehemently awful and aggressive their fanbase is to anyone who is even a little negative?
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Nov 30, 2022 11:11
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Cessna posted:Sure, but a big part of the problem is that sort of lesson often doesn't sink in with gamers. They'll happily throw away every single piece on the board if it means winning the game. They don't think of anything outside of the specific scenario being played unless there's some other sort of "victory condition" built in. Couldn't you just give them low defensive stats and/or charge modifiers to make them good at what they actually were in real life. And if they try to dig in they are still using their defensive stats rather than trying to hit first so they take heavy losses? Although the broader point about wargamers valuing what wargamers value and it overlapping what the SS did is a good one. Also it's worth remembering that the SS were not all equal. You can make a good case for SS Totenkopf or SS Das Reich having an elite level of battlefield performance - but SS Dirlewanger or SS RONA were of no military value.
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Nov 30, 2022 14:36
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Mors Rattus posted:
It's 2022 friend, shits wild and I honestly wouldn't put it past anyone on the internet to do the absolute pants on head dumbest thing possible. 
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Nov 30, 2022 14:53
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Saxophone posted:That whole Twitter thread sure is something.
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Nov 30, 2022 14:54
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neonchameleon posted:Couldn't you just give them low defensive stats and/or charge modifiers to make them good at what they actually were in real life. And if they try to dig in they are still using their defensive stats rather than trying to hit first so they take heavy losses? Although the broader point about wargamers valuing what wargamers value and it overlapping what the SS did is a good one. Yeah, that's the quandry of a tactical game- they're really usually battle construction kits which offer every side in varying levels of quality- see Advanced Squad Leader or Combat Commander, and they end up using a few generalities to flavor the different forces. In operational games, for example, Third Winter, the Waffen-SS units depicted are mostly quality formations- the Waffen-SS's units at that point in the war were either foreign legions or Panzer/Panzergrenadier divisions, and former varied wildly in quality, and for the period of 43-mid 44 at least, the latter were fairly consistently effective units. It's tough to talk in generalities for this reason. Stalingrad '42 has a lot of low-quality Soviet units, because, yeah, the Soviets were throwing a lot of stuff at the wall. Chuikov's 62nd army was grinding rifle brigades and divisions into paste holding a bridgehead in Stalingrad. The early counterstrokes often failed utterly because they were badly planned, and the early renewed tank corps just weren't very well balanced. I wouldn't call it playing into propaganda, so much as depicting a specific situation. They do get plenty of stuff to work with and can absolutely do Uranus, and the Axis have way too much to do in that game and not enough troops to do it. By the period of Third Winter (September 1943-April 1944), the Red army's armored formations in particular, have high action ratings and are quite capable. They have significantly improved over 1943.
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Nov 30, 2022 15:32
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Slyphic posted:That's exactly what I'm talking about. You have a literal proxy commander, yourself on the battlefield, issuing orders to his commanders. Those commanders receive orders and 'AI' carry out those exact orders until instructed otherwise, modified by the sub commanders own personality (impetuous vs cautious). i.e. you tell a brigade to advance to the hill to the Northeast and defend it. That brigade every turn activates and moves towards the hill, then deploy and dig in, engaging enemy units that come close enough but not charging out. If you want them to do something else, you have to perform a test to issue that order, with distance to the unit delaying the change, battlefield conditions further obfuscating it. And then once received, there's a command check again dependent on the status of the subcommander and status of the brigade, whether they're engaged in melee, facing an overwhelming force, if nearby allies have retreated. Ah my bad. Sorry, I just assumed I communicated poorly and I was on a phone at a doctor's office at the time so my ability to check up on the rules was pretty limited. I'mma check it out. Thanks!
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Nov 30, 2022 15:51
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neonchameleon posted:Also it's worth remembering that the SS were not all equal. You can make a good case for SS Totenkopf or SS Das Reich having an elite level of battlefield performance - but SS Dirlewanger or SS RONA were of no military value. Absolutely. And even the "low number" SS Divisions were a shell of their former selves by the later years of the war. I remember reading a book - I will try to find it - that brought up 1st SS (Leibstandarte)'s role in the 1944 Ardennes offensive, the Battle of the Bulge. Someone on the Division Staff brought up the fact that they'd advanced through roughly the same area in 1940 in the attack on France. They figured they'd try to find some of the soldiers who had been there to help give them some "local knowledge" from that era. When they surveyed the Division - at that point nearly 20000 troops - they found that less than a dozen had been there in 1940. The rest were dead, buried in shallow graves in the USSR. In many wargames units like that are given some sort of "Veteran" status - after all, they'd been fighting for years. But I think that's wrong - in reality, the incredibly high turnover meant that 99%+ of the "Veteran" troops were dead, and the unit was made up almost entirely of fresh replacements with no cadre of "veterans" to pass along experience.
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Nov 30, 2022 15:58
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Mors Rattus posted:Things have come out before - this isn’t even the first time with Tess Fowler. There’s a reason she asked them not to use any of her art. Like, are you thinking she mocked up the legal did she was sent and is lying about this? Look the thread dedicated to CR has decided she's scum and everything she says are lies, what more do you want???
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Nov 30, 2022 16:04
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Mors Rattus posted:Things have come out before - this isn’t even the first time with Tess Fowler. There’s a reason she asked them not to use any of her art. Like, are you thinking she mocked up the legal did she was sent and is lying about this? Has anyone asserted that she falsified the NDA? Based on a Nuggan post in the CR thread, here’s a plausible scenario: 1. Crit Roll puts together art books, including some Tess Fowler art. She starts putting “official CR art” on all her stuff. CR tells her she can’t, and she pulls all her art. 2. Time passes. CR develops business arms which now handle publications and the like. 3. Derrington Press decides to reprint some of the older stuff. Some intern is put in charge of communicating to contributors and setting everything up for the release. They know nothing about the individual artists or the past history. The contact info for contributors still includes Tess Fowler. (It is possible she was removed from one spreadsheet and not another, meaning that she didn’t get previous e-mail.) 4. Intern shares out the NDA to everyone on the list. Fowler receives NDA out of the blue despite having previously terminated her business relationship with CR. 5. Fowler communicates with intern, who has no idea of the last history, with a “WTF” and intern responds “If you want to get paid, you have to sign the NDA.” She interprets this as a bribe for her silence and tweets accordingly. I suppose CR could be just as abusive as Satine Phoenix to their collaborators, but I’m having trouble seeing a misunderstanding as a clear pattern of abuse. And I don’t see how this explanation constitues awful or aggressive pushback against negativity, though I’ve no doubt toxic Twitter fans are taking care of that at this very moment. I linked to the CR thread discussion because it includes some accusations about Tess Fowler’s own behavior and I’m in no position to assess the truth of them, but this can just be a reasonable misunderstanding that blew up because of the past bad-blood between her and CR in the past, without anybody being av villain. Narsham fucked around with this message at 16:18 on Nov 30, 2022 |
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Nov 30, 2022 16:06
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Cessna posted:Absolutely. And even the "low number" SS Divisions were a shell of their former selves by the later years of the war. Yeah, so, LSSAH itself was actually a quality unit, even at the Bulge- it didn't have many veterans from 1940, but it got first-line replacements. However, every bit of the staff above the level was quite bad- the 6th (SS) panzer army was prone to remarkably bad staff work and executed its part in the offensive almost by rote from Hitler's operational direction which resulted in failure almost from the start. In fact, the rather infamous wandering journey of Peiper down various roads was very much a function of combat capability far outstripping any kind of staff work. One of the big challenges of modeling veteran units is in showing the Allies at Normandy- units with long histories and seemingly a lot of carryover often underperformed there, so it's difficult to rate them.
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Nov 30, 2022 16:18
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Narsham posted:Has anyone asserted that she falsified the NDA? You realize this still makes Derrington Press/CR look bad, right?
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Nov 30, 2022 17:05
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joylessdivision posted:It's 2022 friend, shits wild and I honestly wouldn't put it past anyone on the internet to do the absolute pants on head dumbest thing possible. I’m gonna stick with “it is more likely CR is being lovely and she’s telling the truth rather than her making it all up so she can enjoy sticking her head into a beehive again”
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Nov 30, 2022 17:20
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Mors Rattus posted:I’m gonna stick with “it is more likely CR is being lovely and she’s telling the truth rather than her making it all up so she can enjoy sticking her head into a beehive again” Meanwhile I'm sitting here and wondering what this storm in a teacup is supposed to be about. Someone sent someone a non-confidential form document and this is meant to be evidence that Critical Role are evil because ???
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Nov 30, 2022 17:29
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ravenkult posted:Look the thread dedicated to CR has decided she's scum and everything she says are lies, what more do you want??? I dunno, that "took commission money from someone dying from cancer, then just pocketed the money and delivered nothing" coupled with all the other poo poo is not great.
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Nov 30, 2022 17:34
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neonchameleon posted:Meanwhile I'm sitting here and wondering what this storm in a teacup is supposed to be about. Someone sent someone a non-confidential form document and this is meant to be evidence that Critical Role are evil because ???  My entire exposure and knowledge of CR "very popular D&D podcast ; pretty generic content of ignoring the rules and improvising, so it's as good as much as you like the people ; show is absolutely unwatchable". Getting sent an unexplained NDA is definitely sloppy and dumb, but it's happened to me and it wasn't exactly nefarious. Lawyers are frequently outside contractors, so sometimes the explanation and the work can get separated. Am I missing something obvious here?
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Nov 30, 2022 17:35
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Megazver posted:I dunno, that "took commission money from someone dying from cancer, then just pocketed the money and delivered nothing" coupled with all the other poo poo is not great.
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Nov 30, 2022 17:54
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I admit, I also have not understood any of the CR controversies that have occasionally bounded through this thread and others. I say that as someone who does not follow CR at all and sincerely knows virtually nothing about them. I know it's an 'actual play D&D podcast' similar to Adventure Zone or Adventure is Nigh but I have never listened to any of those. Of course, we have seen in more large scale controversies that sometimes people use the 'default assumption of decency' or 'if they were bad we'd have heard by now' as a shield, so it's probably important to hear this sort of thing out.
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Nov 30, 2022 17:55
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they're not like absolute scum of the earth but hell, similar to the mcelroys and adventure zone stuff, they've had bad labor practices and hosed over artists on several projects and thrown up their hands and gone "aw jeez, we just didn't know, so sorry" when called out on this more than once. at a certain point it gets to be negligence, even assuming the best.
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Nov 30, 2022 17:58
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ravenkult posted:Look the thread dedicated to CR has decided she's scum and everything she says are lies, what more do you want??? MadScientistWorking posted:That's a loving non sequitor. "well, here's a bad thing she seems to have done" is not a non sequitur to "lol they seem to think she's not a good person for reason lol can u imagien"
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Nov 30, 2022 18:12
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Megazver posted:I dunno, that "took commission money from someone dying from cancer, then just pocketed the money and delivered nothing" coupled with all the other poo poo is not great. Yeah idk if I trust the dude telling the story considering he tried to raise $1000 to hire an artist to make 32 illustrations.
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Nov 30, 2022 18:18
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Panzeh posted:Yeah, so, LSSAH itself was actually a quality unit, even at the Bulge- it didn't have many veterans from 1940, but it got first-line replacements. To be clear, I'm not saying that unit was completely hopeless. They were given good recruits, good gear, and as good of a level of training as possible. But, that said, I think it's fair to point out that their reputation is over-inflated, especially by the Wehraboo types. They were decent soldiers, not uber-elites - but their reputation carries into a lot of wargames nonetheless.
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Nov 30, 2022 18:24
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The worst thing I can recall CR doing was not putting a muzzle on their Talks Machina guy Brian Wayne Foster who liked to sic Critters on the people he had his seemingly unending slap fights with on Twitter and he stuck around for a long time too because he is/was affianced to Ashley Johnson.
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Nov 30, 2022 18:33
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The crosstalk of Critical Role and nazi armor deployment going on right now is very funny.
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Nov 30, 2022 18:44
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Dawgstar posted:The worst thing I can recall CR doing was not putting a muzzle on their Talks Machina guy Brian Wayne Foster who liked to sic Critters on the people he had his seemingly unending slap fights with on Twitter and he stuck around for a long time too because he is/was affianced to Ashley Johnson. Yeah he should have been stopped/sacked a lot sooner.
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Nov 30, 2022 18:44
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ShutteredIn posted:The crosstalk of Critical Role and nazi armor deployment going on right now is very funny. keyleth is riding a column of SS tanks painted all black into the foundry to be converted into dice to be given to problematic people on twitter RIGHT NOW
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Nov 30, 2022 19:02
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Kanye changed his name again?
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Nov 30, 2022 19:05
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Halloween Jack posted:Kanye changed his name again? joylessdivision posted:It's 2022 friend, shits wild and I honestly wouldn't put it past anyone on the internet to do the absolute pants on head dumbest thing possible.
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Nov 30, 2022 19:42
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It's weird in that the only bad thing that's she's alleging in the tweets (that were posted, I'm not digging into her tweet history) is that CR published her stuff without permission. If that's the case, why are you posting on Twitter? CR is a multi-million dollar organization, get a lawyer and get paid. Baseline interpretation is that things don't make sense, which makes me think I'm not getting the whole story here. Edit: As far as the NDA itself, was it sent as the document only, no context? Someone hosed up an email list. Embarrassing, but a human mistake. Did it come with context specific to the artist? Possibly hosed up, but the artist isn't providing that info. PharmerBoy fucked around with this message at 21:11 on Nov 30, 2022 |
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Nov 30, 2022 21:01
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PharmerBoy posted:It's weird in that the only bad thing that's she's alleging in the tweets (that were posted, I'm not digging into her tweet history) is that CR published her stuff without permission. If that's the case, why are you posting on Twitter? CR is a multi-million dollar organization, get a lawyer and get paid. Looking a little at some of her subtweets and threads there I read it more like her position is "A big story is about to break about CR loving over artists, so they're scrambling to get every artist to sign new NDAs, but are really incompetent about it." But twitter is a mess to read, she could have had some evolving theories, or threw out the incompetence, bribe for silence, or damage control theories as all possible.
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Nov 30, 2022 21:08
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Splicer posted:I swear I keep hearing new things about CR being bad people, followed by "Well we'd have heard something before now surely", then six months later a new thing and "Well we'd have heard something before now surely". Do the things keep getting disproven or is my memory that bad or is it everyone else's memory? I think it's the hell storm of CR's aggressive cultivation of parasocial relationships with their fans, the geek social fallacies, and the D&D brand's reliance on shrugging off bad actors. If anyone gave a poo poo about who your dollar supports, D&D has given you an abundance of reasons to attrition out. It follows that D&D players in 2022 are just more resilient to garbage people at whatever company they support. PharmerBoy posted:. If that's the case, why are you posting on Twitter? CR is a multi-million dollar organization, get a lawyer and get paid. The million dollars company can and will have better lawyers that you. Always.
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