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Pope Hilarius II
Nov 10, 2008

Blut posted:



Keeps with my "Brussels is bad" theme from last week I guess.

The England/Scotland huge difference is interesting, I wonder if thats down to London.

Not defending Belgium but these maps skew toward reports. In some countries it's not worth it to report a robbery. In some more countries still, it's the cops who rob you.

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Blut
Sep 11, 2009

if someone is in the bottom 10%~ of a guillotine

Count Roland posted:

Sweden being such an outlier is also interesting.

Sweden's had a pretty awful last 15 years for crime increases:





They're not doing well absorbing/integrating their recent immigrant wave at all:

quote:

This study conducted by Göran Adamson and Tino Sanandaji is the first purely descriptive scientific investigation on the matter in fifteen years. The investigation (from 2002 to 2017) covers seven distinct categories of crime, and distinguishes between seven regions of origin. Based on 33 per cent of the population (2017), 58 per cent of those suspect for total crime on reasonable grounds are migrants. Regarding murder, manslaughter and attempted murder, the figures are 73 per cent, while the proportion of robbery is 70 per cent.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12115-019-00436-8

SlothfulCobra
Mar 27, 2011

https://twitter.com/ritardatario1/status/1594359451779493888

Also more English subway map talk.

FreudianSlippers
Apr 12, 2010

Shooting and Fucking
are the same thing!


The one in northern Denmark is a big artillery battery and underground bunker complex the Germans built in WW2 so they could shoot anything entering the Baltic. In practice it became a place that well connected Germans could have their sons sent to get as far away from the action as possible. It's now a museum.





I'm guessing the dot directly across from it in Norway is its twin base.

Does that count as a castle?

Teriyaki Hairpiece
Dec 29, 2006

I'm nae the voice o' the darkened thistle, but th' darkened thistle cannae bear the sight o' our Bonnie Prince Bernie nae mair.
I've fought this internet argument before, a castle is just a fort

SlothfulCobra
Mar 27, 2011

Specifically a castle is supposed to be a fort that is also a primary residence.

ChubbyChecker
Mar 25, 2018

FreudianSlippers posted:

The one in northern Denmark is a big artillery battery and underground bunker complex the Germans built in WW2 so they could shoot anything entering the Baltic. In practice it became a place that well connected Germans could have their sons sent to get as far away from the action as possible. It's now a museum.





I'm guessing the dot directly across from it in Norway is its twin base.

Does that count as a castle?

what happened with the gun?

Pope Hilarius II
Nov 10, 2008

Blut posted:

Sweden's had a pretty awful last 15 years for crime increases:





They're not doing well absorbing/integrating their recent immigrant wave at all:

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12115-019-00436-8

Does the report make a difference between actual migrants and people who descend from immigrant families? Because I thought it was common sociological wisdom that immigrants themselves are actually less likely to commit crimes.

HisMajestyBOB
Oct 21, 2010


College Slice

SlothfulCobra posted:

Specifically a castle is supposed to be a fort that is also a primary residence.

Missile silos are forts for missiles.
Ergo, missile silos that have been converted into residences are castles.

Nissin Cup Nudist
Sep 3, 2011

Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land





I expected Britain to have a lot more castles

Judgy Fucker
Mar 24, 2006

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

I expected Britain to have a lot more castles

England had subjugated Wales (not to mention itself) for the most part by the time our conception of masonry castles had come into vogue. You can see the concentration of castles in southern Scotland.

i say swears online
Mar 4, 2005

what's with galicia? it wasn't a major front in the reconquista compared to central and southern spain

TinTower
Apr 21, 2010

You don't have to 8e a good person to 8e a hero.
Defence against the Aztec invasion.

DJ_Mindboggler
Nov 21, 2013

i say swears online posted:

what's with galicia? it wasn't a major front in the reconquista compared to central and southern spain

Santiago is a pretty important pilgrimage site, maybe church/religious order fortifications?

Blut
Sep 11, 2009

if someone is in the bottom 10%~ of a guillotine

Pope Hilarius II posted:

Does the report make a difference between actual migrants and people who descend from immigrant families? Because I thought it was common sociological wisdom that immigrants themselves are actually less likely to commit crimes.

Yes, the report only counts immigrants themselves, not descendants of such.

The common sociological wisdom that immigrants themselves are actually less likely to commit crimes is highly dependent on the immigrants region of origin, their education level, and their age/sex. The data shows crime rates differ hugely between say South-East Asian immigrants vs Middle-Eastern origin ones, in Europe at least that I know of, for example. And also that undereducated, single, young men are far more likely to commit crimes than say family units with parental college degrees.

The migrant wave to Sweden in recent years skewed much more heavily young, male and undereducated and from problematic regions than immigrants to Europe/the US have done historically on average which explains a lot of the subsequent integration problems.

This is for Denmark but shows the disparity in crime committed by immigrants by region of origin, and compared to natives, well:

King Hong Kong
Nov 6, 2009

For we'll fight with a vim
that is dead sure to win.

Isn’t the data for that “castle” map quite bad (in the sense that you are expecting it represent some sort of fortress as opposed to a chateau or anything that happens to have an equivalent term)? I wouldn’t read too much into it.

i say swears online
Mar 4, 2005

King Hong Kong posted:

Isn’t the data for that “castle” map quite bad (in the sense that you are expecting it represent some sort of fortress as opposed to a chateau or anything that happens to have an equivalent term)? I wouldn’t read too much into it.

yeah i google mapped some places in galicia and lots are like two-storey stone buildings with a smaller sqft than my house

i remember seeing a few in bavaria that were the size of closets

King Hong Kong
Nov 6, 2009

For we'll fight with a vim
that is dead sure to win.

Here's a much, much better interactive map for Spain that allows you to select by type (e.g. a castle vs. a tower) and era: https://www.elconfidencial.com/cultura/2021-10-13/castillos-conservacion-arquitectura-especial-datos_3303733/

See e.g.:

i say swears online
Mar 4, 2005

i'd like to think those two yellow overlapping circles near burgos was the result of a century-long lawnmowing dispute

SlothfulCobra
Mar 27, 2011

The majority of castles were wood and didn't leave any ruins either.

Private Speech
Mar 30, 2011

I HAVE EVEN MORE WORTHLESS BEANIE BABIES IN MY COLLECTION THAN I HAVE WORTHLESS POSTS IN THE BEANIE BABY THREAD YET I STILL HAVE THE TEMERITY TO CRITICIZE OTHERS' COLLECTIONS

IF YOU SEE ME TALKING ABOUT BEANIE BABIES, PLEASE TELL ME TO

EAT. SHIT.


The whole "immigrants do crimes" is at the core of the considerable Danish xenophobia espoused by all major politic parties and has been for over a decade at this point, so there's some scope to be sceptical.

Hence e.g. the legislation mandating that people from immigrant neighbourhoods face higher criminal penalties (lol, lmao).

NYTimes posted:

For decades, integrating immigrants has posed a thorny challenge to the Danish model, intended to serve a small, homogeneous population. Leaders are focusing their ire on urban neighborhoods where immigrants, some of them placed there by the government, live in dense concentrations with high rates of unemployment and gang violence.

Politicians’ description of the ghettos has become increasingly sinister. In his annual New Year’s speech, Prime Minister Lars Lokke Rasmussen warned that ghettos could “reach out their tentacles onto the streets” by spreading violence, and that because of ghettos, “cracks have appeared on the map of Denmark.” Politicians who once used the word “integration” now call frankly for “assimilation.”

That tough approach is embodied in the “ghetto package.” Of 22 proposals presented by the government in early March, most have been agreed upon by a parliamentary majority, and more will be subject to a vote in the fall.

Some are punitive: One measure under consideration would allow courts to double the punishment for certain crimes if they are committed in one of the 25 neighborhoods classified as ghettos, based on residents’ income, employment status, education levels, number of criminal convictions and “non-Western background.” Another would impose a four-year prison sentence on immigrant parents who force their children to make extended visits to their country of origin — described here as “re-education trips” —in that way damaging their “schooling, language and well-being.” Another would allow local authorities to increase their monitoring and surveillance of “ghetto” families.

Some proposals have been rejected as too radical, like one from the far-right Danish People’s Party that would confine “ghetto children” to their homes after 8 p.m. (Challenged on how this would be enforced, Martin Henriksen, the chairman of Parliament’s integration committee, suggested in earnest that young people in these areas could be fitted with electronic ankle bracelets.)

At this summer’s Folkemodet, an annual political gathering on the island of Bornholm, the justice minister, Soren Pape Poulsen, shrugged off the rights-based objection.

“Some will wail and say, ‘We’re not equal before the law in this country,’ and ‘Certain groups are punished harder,’ but that’s nonsense,” he said, adding that the increased penalties would affect only people who break the law.

To those claiming the measures single out Muslims, he said: “That’s nonsense and rubbish. To me this is about, no matter who lives in these areas and who they believe in, they have to profess to the values required to have a good life in Denmark.”

map:

Private Speech fucked around with this message at 01:41 on Dec 1, 2022

i say swears online
Mar 4, 2005

i assume good jobs with secure benefits are widely available for those communities and they just choose to Do Crimes of their own volition

Private Speech
Mar 30, 2011

I HAVE EVEN MORE WORTHLESS BEANIE BABIES IN MY COLLECTION THAN I HAVE WORTHLESS POSTS IN THE BEANIE BABY THREAD YET I STILL HAVE THE TEMERITY TO CRITICIZE OTHERS' COLLECTIONS

IF YOU SEE ME TALKING ABOUT BEANIE BABIES, PLEASE TELL ME TO

EAT. SHIT.


The "ghettos" also look pretty okay tbh.

Natty Ninefingers
Feb 17, 2011
They look like the loving projects to me

Starks
Sep 24, 2006

Natty Ninefingers posted:

They look like the loving projects to me

They look like cute little apartment buildings lol wtf

Starks fucked around with this message at 04:45 on Dec 1, 2022

Starks
Sep 24, 2006

*sees mid rise apartment building with gardens and bicycle racks* is this a screencap from The Wire?

Natty Ninefingers
Feb 17, 2011
Mid rise complexes, each a little island of concentrated poverty in a sea of grass? Little in the way of visible amenities, street life, defensible space, or connections to the greater city/town/whatever the heck?
There’s more funding and upkeep but the visible issues are pretty similar.

i say swears online
Mar 4, 2005

Natty Ninefingers posted:

Mid rise complexes, each a little island of concentrated poverty in a sea of grass? Little in the way of visible amenities, street life, defensible space, or connections to the greater city/town/whatever the heck?
There’s more funding and upkeep but the visible issues are pretty similar.

making up some projects in my head to get mad at

i say swears online
Mar 4, 2005

i don't see everything that's on my richard scarry blanket in that single pic and gettin' upset

Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?

ChubbyChecker posted:

what happened with the gun?

Well there were 29 robberies, not 0

Owling Howl
Jul 17, 2019

Natty Ninefingers posted:

Mid rise complexes, each a little island of concentrated poverty in a sea of grass? Little in the way of visible amenities, street life, defensible space, or connections to the greater city/town/whatever the heck?
There’s more funding and upkeep but the visible issues are pretty similar.

It's pretty well connected to the rest of the city. In any case it's a non-profit housing co-op managed democratically by the inhabitants themselves.

Natty Ninefingers
Feb 17, 2011

Owling Howl posted:

It's pretty well connected to the rest of the city. In any case it's a non-profit housing co-op managed democratically by the inhabitants themselves.

It looks a lot better in actual complex, rather than the lovely sad google maps photo. Still smack bang on the wrong side of the tracks, of course

Groke
Jul 27, 2007
New Adventures In Mom Strength

Starks posted:

*sees mid rise apartment building with gardens and bicycle racks* is this a screencap from The Wire?

One of the bicycles has fallen over; chaos reigns and the end is nigh.

Groke
Jul 27, 2007
New Adventures In Mom Strength

Starks posted:

They look like cute little apartment buildings lol wtf

Looks like any residential block in any Scandinavian city. Buildings are nicer on the outside than where I lived in Trondheim, otherwise you could take a very similar picture there; those were mostly inhabited by single adults and younger couples, turn around 180 degrees and walk one block and you would find a sequence of shops, restaurants, a park etc. No telling from that picture what the rest of the neighbourhood looks like.

Glah
Jun 21, 2005

i say swears online posted:

i assume good jobs with secure benefits are widely available for those communities and they just choose to Do Crimes of their own volition

The problem here is that we are talking about small countries, where well paying jobs need applicable education, language skills and of course the potential employee must not to stand out too much in the eyes of racist employers so the barriers of entry to job markets is high. And they are only becoming higher thanks to the economic situation in the EU. Combine that with the long ongoing project of slowly dismantling the welfare state and support structures, the situation for poor immigrants is very dire in the Nordics.

Denmark has taken the most reactionary path in the Nordics while Sweden has traditionally been the most liberal. This has lead to situation where Sweden has taken in a huge population of immigrants in recent years and thanks to reasons stated above, they've failed in integration with crime rates exploding and especially violent gang crime becoming a huge issue (at least relative to Nordic baseline). I think that something like 1 800 000 people in Sweden are foreign born (out of population of 10 500 000, so 17%), but part of those are EU citizens so not as "problematic" in racists eyes. And now all the reactionaries are pointing at Sweden saying 'now you don't want to end up like them, do you?' and they have a pretty clear contrast between liberal policies and their own reactionary policies to use in their messaging.

Situation is hosed up.

Jasper Tin Neck
Nov 14, 2008


"Scientifically proven, rich and creamy."

i say swears online posted:

i assume good jobs with secure benefits are widely available for those communities and they just choose to Do Crimes of their own volition

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010


It'd be interesting to see that broken down to smaller regions. Also, does it count non-permanent-residents (I guess not?)

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010

Natty Ninefingers posted:

They look like the loving projects to me

Such a North American post, lol. Like 90% of people living in cities in Europe live in places that look exactly like that. Including non-immigrants. Europe in general has an absolute poo poo ton more graffiti than the US, so the very small amount of graffiti in that photo isn't really meaningful either.

Saladman fucked around with this message at 10:43 on Dec 1, 2022

Count Roland
Oct 6, 2013


Once again Portugal is Eastern European

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reignonyourparade
Nov 15, 2012

Saladman posted:

Such a North American post, lol. Like 90% of people living in cities in Europe live in places that look exactly like that. Including non-immigrants. Europe in general has an absolute poo poo ton more graffiti than the US, so the very small amount of graffiti in that photo isn't really meaningful either.

I'm north American too and it looks like regular rear end apartments, that poster is just weird

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