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They should nerf roadhog by making his hook slower but also go through walls
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Dec 15, 2022 22:22
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Give me the old hook back goddamnit
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Dec 15, 2022 23:09
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https://twitter.com/GW_Alec/status/1603510069760442368
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Dec 15, 2022 23:14
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Inept posted:i think people have some rose tinted glasses about double shield and 2cp Nah, double shield was trash but 2cp was superior to push, imo. Aside from double shield, everything about OW1 has been more fun than 2 for me.
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Dec 15, 2022 23:14
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I don't think 2CP was an inherently bad mode, I just think the map design for it was mostly terrible.
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Dec 15, 2022 23:46
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2 CP was terrible. Attack is the worst mode now, but it's miles ahead of 2 CP. The worst thing about 2cp were those games on offense where you knew you were going to lose, but you just barely managed to cap first and then got shut down for 5 minutes straight on second. Sometimes, you pulled out the miracle push at the last moment, but that just shifted the crap feeling to the defense team. The new mode at least gives measurable progress for good team fights and still allows for the miracle push to snatch victory at the last second. But the actual best part of the new mode is that there is effectively a mercy rule built in so that the really bad games just end and you can move on.
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Dec 15, 2022 23:59
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I'll take 2CP over Push any day.
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Dec 16, 2022 00:01
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Kirkio nerf seems more aimed at pros than normies since you already have to have pretty good timing to create immunity from a big ult, at least it seems to me.
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Dec 16, 2022 00:09
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Good nerfs, but Looks like they still refuse to accept and change the part of Soujorn's kit that is problematic. Someone on the dev team is a stubborn baby
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Dec 16, 2022 00:44
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The primary fire spread increase by almost 30% indirectly nerfs her secondary fire because it will take longer to build. But, yeah, that ability is busted and really needs to be taken down a notch.
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Dec 16, 2022 00:48
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The railgun being broken is also affecting Mercy in that she is putting out better statistics (which is all the dev team cares about, it seems) than her actual worth merits. So i'd like to see that poo poo gone, so mercy gets the buffs she deserves.
BabyRyoga fucked around with this message at 01:53 on Dec 16, 2022 |
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Dec 16, 2022 00:58
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AtillatheBum posted:The new mode at least gives measurable progress for good team fights I'd debate this, you can win a team fight but be so far behind that it doesn't matter, the other team will respawn (often multiple times) before you have a chance to catch up. If one team takes a decent lead it's extremely rare for the other team to stage a comeback.
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Dec 16, 2022 10:13
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Gravitas Shortfall posted:I'd debate this, you can win a team fight but be so far behind that it doesn't matter, the other team will respawn (often multiple times) before you have a chance to catch up. If one team takes a decent lead it's extremely rare for the other team to stage a comeback. Also every map is "yo, push along low ground while we give everyone high ground to contest you" so pushing is an inherent disadvantage. Usually you'd see one team get a good push off and then the other team will win a fight (because high ground) and then get hosed on returning (because they don't have high ground) except they haven't been able to push as far.
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Dec 16, 2022 10:49
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The worst thing about Push is that at no point are you ever not flanked and you only have one tank.
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Dec 16, 2022 11:00
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The new assault map fuckin sucks. So visually busy and a nightmare for supports. Give me back Havana
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Dec 16, 2022 13:02
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i have a very hard time even seeing pharah on shambali, and also for some reason echo on the lit up version of that one dustbowl map. i do have a legit perception problem though
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Dec 16, 2022 19:17
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I had to uninstall. If it’s not idlers or throwers I’m just losing every game because of bad matchups or maybe I’m just bad. It’s making me angry and I think being angry because of video games is dumb and I cannot allow this anymore.
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Dec 17, 2022 05:06
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do not set your goal to win the game when you queue into a multiplayer online video game you are only setting yourself up for guaranteed disappointment
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Dec 17, 2022 08:55
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If a game has good matchmaking you will only win 50% of your games. So your goals should be ranking up and generally getting better. This game is pretty terrible at rewarding those though as both matchmaking and ranks are broken.
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Dec 17, 2022 09:14
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I found a really interesting video that talks about the streaky matchmaking and to my mind absolutely explains it to a T. This guy is not a good presenter at all, which is a shame, as his message is really on point about how the system probably works. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=taf5iAhszRg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBeqo9o-I-s TLDR: Every indication is that Blizzard don't look at actual win and loss rates to estimate how good you are, they look at your individual performance on the hero you're playing against all other people playing that hero, and they weight particular stats very, very strongly. This estimation of your performance level is separate to your actual MMR. If your performance in those stats is better than where your current MMR has you pegged, you get put into a queue weighted to give you easy wins to elevate your MMR to where it 'should' be based on their estimation of your performance. If your performance in those stats is worse than where your current MMR has you pegged, you get put into a queue weighted to give you very difficult games to win to lower your MMR to where it 'should' be based on their estimation of your performance. However, this adjustment trails your actual performance so it's difficult to correlate with what you just did to cause it. And it's also self-reinforcing because it's very hard to generate good performance stats in the unfavourably weighted games, and in the favourably weighted games you're competing against other people for those stats. The biggest single stat appears to be deaths. Die less and your skill estimation goes way up. Damage dealt is another big one, especially solo damage dealt. Eliminations not so much. Another one appears to be using your abilities as much as possible, so holding your cooldowns for long periods of time if there's no good opportunity for them or no need to because your fights are all won without them will actually penalise your estimated skill. Using your ult as many times as possible and getting at least one kill will drive your skill estimate up, while sitting on it waiting for a good opportunity can hurt you. In other words, if you are learning a new hero or playing something you're unfamiliar with for fun, or have a match where you're just taking it easy, you will probably have your MMR estimation get adjusted downwards, and get put into queues to push you towards that level. If you are playing to win matches and making risky plays where you get lots of progress on the objective, but die for it, you'll get penalised. In other words Blizzard are so far away from using an actual ELO type system that your estimated skill level may as well be entirely divorced from the apparent goals of the game. If you lose every single match but play to never die, use your abilities on cooldown and do a bunch of damage, the matchmaking algorithm will think that you're a god. Makes me go "hmmm".
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Dec 17, 2022 09:17
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I wish this game would show me weekly stats so I knew which roles I've won 10 games in, for gently caress's sake. EDIT: While I'm pointlessly wishlisting, - Allow me to favourite skins, then randomize between my favourites - Allow me to make cosmetic sets that I can easily switch between. - Allow me to "equip to all heroes" on weapon charms and sprays. Gravitas Shortfall fucked around with this message at 09:21 on Dec 17, 2022 |
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Dec 17, 2022 09:19
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Gravitas Shortfall posted:I'd debate this, you can win a team fight but be so far behind that it doesn't matter, the other team will respawn (often multiple times) before you have a chance to catch up. If one team takes a decent lead it's extremely rare for the other team to stage a comeback. The bot running back is progress or at least undoing the enemies. Yeah sometimes you will have to win more than one teamfight for actual pushing of the barricade but then that isn't any different from payload. I disagree with the second part of your post, most of my games end with the lead switching 3 or more times. dogstile posted:Also every map is "yo, push along low ground while we give everyone high ground to contest you" so pushing is an inherent disadvantage. IME almost all my games of Push start like this: Team A wins the middle contest(but loses some players in the process) and pushes the barricade like 20 meters. Team B then wins the next team fight because they respawn closer and as you said they have the high ground and then they push it ~35-40 meters and take the lead. After that it can go anywhere but at this point those first two parts feel almost scripted. AtillatheBum fucked around with this message at 09:39 on Dec 17, 2022 |
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Dec 17, 2022 09:19
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Mostly good patch. Ramattra getting movement in Nemesis is exactly what he needed. Felt like rock lee when he took his training weights off, and now he's actually a ton of fun although he really needs Kiriko to cleanse anti.
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Dec 17, 2022 09:29
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SadisTech posted:I found a really interesting video that talks about the streaky matchmaking and to my mind absolutely explains it to a T. This guy is not a good presenter at all, which is a shame, as his message is really on point about how the system probably works. This is both true and false. There is to some extent MMR gains and losses based on performance, but it isn't as big as you'd think. Also, it goes away almost completely at diamond at above. It mostly exists to circumvent smurfing to the extent that smurfs will likely be hitting higher ranks within 15 or so games on a new account playing ranked for the first time. This is all assuming the system is the same as it was in OW1, which there was no indication that it wasn't at first. With how fucky the games have been lately, it seems like what happened is it should be operating at roughly the same level as OW1, but whatever adjustments they keep making at the end of seasons to try and place players in lower ranks after placements aren't working properly because they hosed up the algorithm. Also there is something going on where players are getting wildly varying internal MMRs and SSRs which are two different values that ideally would be the same, but are getting spread really far apart due to the algorithm screw-ups. It doesn't seem like the game knows how to deal with it. You'll see players who ended in like bronze in season 1, and are plat in season 2 in games full of masters+ players now.
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Dec 17, 2022 10:38
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The end of season adjustements sometimes lead to hilarious results. I played exactly 7 wins on open queue for the points and got to something like bronze 2. It got adjusted into Silver 2, because why not. It ended up being my highest rank after the adjustment. My gold 2 tank dropped to like silver 4 and DPS/SUP went to bronze.
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Dec 17, 2022 11:19
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had a QP game where the opposing Pharah let us all know he was recording the match for his YouTube channel, so looking forward to edited highlights where he doesn't mention his Mercy pocket or the fact that we won.
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Dec 17, 2022 13:51
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https://twitter.com/spex_j/status/1604091226399166464?s=46&t=v13oGQu1_ciNg27jQzof8A
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Dec 17, 2022 14:40
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 Looking forward losing to SK/US.
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Dec 17, 2022 15:10
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Pattonesque posted:https://twitter.com/spex_j/status/1604091226399166464?s=46&t=v13oGQu1_ciNg27jQzof8A gently caress YEAH
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Dec 17, 2022 15:42
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It’s more or less the same matchmaking as OW1 on the backend, but new game and dynamics, and mechanics are a little snowbally between people being easily tilted, strong new characters, and ultimates. I love Push, but the only good point I’ve seen made against it is the fact that it’s a best of 1 and there’s no chance for a mental reset like in other modes. https://youtu.be/N8ruvBVyP5o If anything, the game is more aggressive at putting you against people of your MMR, which means if your team makes a few too many mistakes early then the enemy team is always at the minimum level where they can punish that hard.
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Dec 17, 2022 15:53
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Proven posted:It’s more or less the same matchmaking as OW1 on the backend, but new game and dynamics, and mechanics are a little snowbally between people being easily tilted, strong new characters, and ultimates. I love Push, but the only good point I’ve seen made against it is the fact that it’s a best of 1 and there’s no chance for a mental reset like in other modes. This is all seems entirely untrue to me. They are intentionally and unintentionally putting people at SRs that are way below their MMR. Because of this, you run into people at all kinds of various stages of the season climb, including first seasonal games when they are way underranked. The game is less ult dependant, more swingy in game (especially push vs 2cp). You can pretty much always recover (skill differences aside). Actually the real reason matchmaking is weird right now is because people that were good at OW1 and bad at OW2 and the other way around are moving a lot right now. Also a bunch of people coming back after years off and drifting around. I just don't see how you can interpret OW2 this way. headcase fucked around with this message at 17:20 on Dec 17, 2022 |
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Dec 17, 2022 17:13
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It would surprise me if they were doing stat based mmr again because they tried that before and it sucked.
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Dec 17, 2022 17:43
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Pattonesque posted:https://twitter.com/spex_j/status/1604091226399166464?s=46&t=v13oGQu1_ciNg27jQzof8A as someone who didn't follow competitive OW1, what makes this tournament series worth being excited about compared to OWL and its various permutations? is it not run by blizzard so they're free to do different formats or rulesets? e: oh i just saw OW's official account tweet about it so i guess it is run by blizzard then. so yeah, what's the appeal over OWL? Countblanc fucked around with this message at 18:12 on Dec 17, 2022 |
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Dec 17, 2022 17:59
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Countblanc posted:as someone who didn't follow competitive OW1, what makes this tournament series worth being excited about compared to OWL and its various permutations? is it not run by blizzard so they're free to do different formats or rulesets? Instead of fake-bs teams, national teams actually represent something real. There's also change to showcase new talents against owl players, as countries like Germany or Finland won't have full rosters of OWL players.
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Dec 17, 2022 19:56
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headcase posted:This is all seems entirely untrue to me. They are intentionally and unintentionally putting people at SRs that are way below their MMR. Because of this, you run into people at all kinds of various stages of the season climb, including first seasonal games when they are way underranked. The game is less ult dependant, more swingy in game (especially push vs 2cp). You can pretty much always recover (skill differences aside). Part of the reason I can easily believe this is because of what they themselves have said: https://overwatch.blizzard.com/en-us/news/23857518/initializing-systems-updating-competitive-play-for-overwatch-2/ quote:Skill tier and division aren’t completely aligned with the matchmaking rating we use to determine matches. To this end, this screen has been redesigned so you can instead display your name cards and titles. There was the Bronze Rank bug, but that shouldn’t have had an effect with MMR. Multiple Unranked to Gm streams where after a dozen games or so, they are already playing against Masters average at minimum when their Skill Tier still shows at Platinum or Diamond. And again: https://twitter.com/playoverwatch/status/1600565858132062208 All games are made based off MMR. Rank is not tied to MMR. It is likely performance has an effect on your gains because that’s how it worked in OW1 for everyone below Diamond. But winning matches will still be the biggest determining factor. It probably doesn’t help that supports are now the ones being pulled into games further out from their skill level, compared to Tanks near the end of OW1. Support role as a whole has a larger mechanical requirement to doing well in OW2 compared to the average in OW1. Even Mercy has more mechanical expression now. But the effect of a good support player in an even skill lobby is the most invisible to everyone, including the average support player.
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Dec 17, 2022 20:31
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Proven posted:Part of the reason I can easily believe this is because of what they themselves have said: Yeah after digesting that seagull video, I see where is is coming from, but I think there are a lot of people who's MMRs are probably jacked up like doom one tricks are making a U shape. People who are bad with positioning but good at other things are getting wrecked. People trying to learn tanking that never have before. ETC
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Dec 17, 2022 20:54
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You can quote any tweet, or source the information from any place you want, the fact that literal bronze players are ending up in games with literal GM players is pretty much proof that the system is BUGGED, and is not working correctly. Any number of twitter or blog posts trying to explain the way the game is intended to work isn't going to provide you with accurate information when the game is literally not working correctly. It seems dumb to me to even be trying to discuss how the matchmaking is supposed to work at this point, when everything since the start of s1 has been noticeably hosed up, as per the anecdotal evidence of probably every single person who reguarly posts in this thread posting at one point or another about the system seeming weird, games being extremely swingy, going on INSANE losing streaks, etc. In season 1, the algorithm that was supposed to "place players at a slightly lower rank than they are used to" was putting players from pretty much any rank under diamond into Bronze 5, sometimes to the extent that they were stuck there permanently (I assume this means it actually set their MMR to 1, and they would need to win many dozens of games straight without any losses to be ranked up to bronze 4). They admitted it was broken after insisting for several weeks that it was working correctly. It seems like it is even more hosed up and random in season 2, and they are still insisting it is working properly when it is very obviously hosed. You know how hosed it is? I was at a party last night, and a random buddy of mine who knows that I play OW told me he was probably gonna quit because the matchmaking is hosed up and he just loses game after game. It doesn't work. Period. No Blizzard post should convince you otherwise, as they will continue to not communicate with the community and insist it is working properly. Also, I feel like you can't really take the perspective of players in Masters/GM/higher for face value on any of this, because it doesn't really apply to them. No matter how hosed up their games are, they will pull weight and rank up. They are just that good; this issue affects mostly players who suck rear end to players who are pretty good, but nothing special. BabyRyoga fucked around with this message at 02:56 on Dec 18, 2022 |
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Dec 18, 2022 02:53
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I'm really surprised people haven't been sniffing around in the code looking for definitive data on ranking up and down in the matchmaking system. I thought for sure by now someone would have made up some program that would allow you to track your progress outside the game or something. I'm seeing a lot of YouTubers make a lot of definitive statements on how the matchmaking system works but I haven't seen anything to back it up beyond "in my personal experience". I'm sure there's some modicum of truth to them, but it's hard to figure out who's accurate. That squirrel king guy seems to be the most confident in his theories, and I'm going to give his method a try for myself because why not at this point.
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Dec 18, 2022 04:39
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Had a great time with the first season. Played nearly every day with friends. Since I owned the original I had the new characters unlocked and got to play them and figure out how they work. Had no problems Though this new season is getting me pretty sour. I'm not paying for battlepasses I might not finish and it's holiday season so it aint gonna happen. So I don't get Ramattra until I get to level 45. Which pushes me to wanna complete weeklies. Which all focus on me queueing flex (ie 90% support) and needing to win. It pushed me into this poo poo mindset and losing sucks because all I want to do is get through these weeklies so I can unlock a character and just play normally again. I don't know or even care if Ramattra is good or bad. I just have literally no idea how he plays. I can watch videos and read some stuff but I only really know how a character plays once I play them myself. I accidentally copied one while I was playing Echo and had absolutely no idea what I could do and promptly died in 3 seconds. Basically all I'm saying is I'm not a fan of this unlocking character roster metagame poo poo that I didn't have to do before and it's making the game feel bad for me.
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Dec 18, 2022 04:41
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DarkAvenger211 posted:Basically all I'm saying is I'm not a fan of this unlocking character roster metagame poo poo that I didn't have to do before and it's making the game feel bad for me. agreed it is very stupid. you can practice him in the practice range and he also works in the winter event team elimination game
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Dec 18, 2022 05:21
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