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meatpimp posted:where did Megan Markle touch him? Not being critical of you as you probably not aware of this (I just want to be 100% clear on that, I am not referring to you or being critical of you), but her name is not Markle anymore and this has been one of the ways the media have sought to discredit and belittle her. As much as I loving hate nobility, she's correctly addressed as Meghan, Duchess of Sussex (Meghan for short) or Meghan Mountbatten-Windsor. Referring to her as her maiden name is such a dick move by the media and you see how it's just..... gone into public perception. It's very much like using the deadname of a transgender person and I personally think just as offensive, especially when it's being used to shape perceptions and narrative around a person the media clearly has a hateboner for. For all it's faults, the Wikipedia article on Meghan is a great example of how to handle her name change. It's very specifically Markle before the marriage and either Dutchess of Sussex or Meghan afterwards.
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Dec 18, 2022 00:29
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CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:Not being critical of you as you probably not aware of this (I just want to be 100% clear on that, I am not referring to you or being critical of you), but her name is not Markle anymore and this has been one of the ways the media have sought to discredit and belittle her. As much as I loving hate nobility, she's correctly addressed as Meghan, Duchess of Sussex (Meghan for short) or Meghan Mountbatten-Windsor. Referring to her as her maiden name is such a dick move by the media and you see how it's just..... gone into public perception. It's very much like using the deadname of a transgender person and I personally think just as offensive, especially when it's being used to shape perceptions and narrative around a person the media clearly has a hateboner for. I appreciate the effortpost, but she's a common public figure in the US and surnames are just not that important here, and comparing it to deadnaming is disrespectful, imo (edit3: I wanted to do some more research and it seems like it could be a US thing. Most, if not all, references use her old surname, since that's her stage name. I understand where you're coming from.) gently caress the monarchy and its traditions. Edit: On this note, my wife watched most of the Netflix series and I find the pair of Harry and Meghan to be nothing buy properly boring. I don't understand how anyone can get riled up in any direction about them, they seem as common as milk. meatpimp fucked around with this message at 01:25 on Dec 18, 2022 |
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Dec 18, 2022 00:31
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meatpimp posted:-- where did Megan Markle touch him? She probably didn’t and that’s what made him mad
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Dec 18, 2022 00:40
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meatpimp posted:I appreciate the effortpost, but she's a common public figure in the US and it's just not that important here, and comparing it to deadnaming is disrespectful, imo. gently caress the monarchy and its traditions. Agreed, and I also wouldn't put this on the same level as deadnaming a trans person in terms of how deliberately mean-spirited it is, but CAT INTERCEPTOR is definitely correct that it's a calculated move by the media to belittle her. These are journalists who certainly have APA/MLA style guides and other grammar rules drilled into them, it's not really something you forget. It's also not hard to just call people what they want to be called. There's some intention here. Meghan Mountbatten-Windsor (nee Markle). There, that was easy. But yeah I also don't really care about the monarchy, I'm posting out of sheer boredom at this point.
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Dec 18, 2022 00:46
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i'll call someone whatever name they want but i'll be hosed before i call someone with a PhD a doctor if they're not doing medicine on me
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Dec 18, 2022 00:51
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Mister Speaker posted:CAT INTERCEPTOR is definitely correct that it's a calculated move by the media to belittle her. Depends on your viewpoint, I guess. Looking at IMDB, it's still using Markle https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1620783/ Points out of all of this? Meghan has names. The drama around Harry and Meghan is stupid. The monarchy is stupid and has a profound history of really, really bad things.
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Dec 18, 2022 00:51
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didn't her and harry ditch the royalty? so the dutchess of whatever title should be null and she should just be mountbatten-windsor if she took harry's last name
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Dec 18, 2022 00:54
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meatpimp posted:I've despised Clarkson's politics for a long time, but this may be the event that pushes me to no longer watch TGT. I have tried to separate the "art from the artist," but he is absolutely a bigoted, boomer, class-blind shitheel. Nah, even worse he’s Tory slime. The sneering, “I’d run protestors over with my Land Rover”, Rule Britannia kind of Tory slime
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Dec 18, 2022 01:06
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Clarkson has gotten a pass in AI far past the line of many other idiots, and I'm not sure why. EDIT: I'm not saying everyone should stop watching the man, everyone is free to make their own informed choice, I just find it weird how for example someone upthread didn't watch the latest Gymkhana because there's a Black Rifle Coffee sticker on the car, but Clarkson whos been an unrepentant shitbag for years still seem to be on most peoples "ok to watch" list. Nidhg00670000 fucked around with this message at 01:51 on Dec 18, 2022 |
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Dec 18, 2022 01:34
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Nidhg00670000 posted:Clarkson has gotten a pass in AI far past the line of many other idiots, and I'm not sure why. because for a while Top Gear was that good and that formative to the hobby for a great many of the posters here
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Dec 18, 2022 02:00
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Large Testicles posted:i'll call someone whatever name they want but i'll be hosed before i call someone with a PhD a doctor if they're not doing medicine on me Whereas a dentist or a veterinarian is a surgeon, and is correctly titled as Mr/Mrs/Ms. Unless they are American, and think they should be called "Dr", in which case you should comply with their wishes with as much "oh, bless your heart" as you can muster.
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Dec 18, 2022 02:04
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Large Testicles posted:didn't her and harry ditch the royalty? so the dutchess of whatever title should be null and she should just be mountbatten-windsor if she took harry's last name The former HRH or Princess is void, not the dutchy. Now if you get rid of nobility entirely (and it should be gotten rid of) then it'll be Mountbatten-Windsor meatpimp posted:Depends on your viewpoint, I guess. Looking at IMDB, it's still using Markle https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1620783/ The point is that media is using her maiden name to other and belittle her and there is a fair bit of racism underlying that as well. This isnt at it's heart about wether royalty should exist, it's about a direct attack on a woman - of colour I'll add - for merely existing. Clarkson's unprovoked misogynistic attack is a long line of steaming poo poo Fleet Street and other media has been spraying at Meghan for years now albeit Clarkson really sank to a new level with this one.
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Dec 18, 2022 02:48
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InitialDave posted:Ooooh, ok, I get this in the American sense where people are loving pathetic about their titles, but someone who has earned a PhD very much is a doctor, and you should refer to them as such. I’m talking about non medical people who have a PhD and insist on being called doctor and are like “I didn’t spend 10 years in school to be called Mister.” They can go gently caress themselves. You’re not special.
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Dec 18, 2022 02:54
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Large Testicles posted:I’m talking about non medical people who have a PhD and insist on being called doctor and are like “I didn’t spend 10 years in school to be called Mister.” They can go gently caress themselves. You’re not special.
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Dec 18, 2022 03:01
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I never call anyone by titles, gently caress that
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Dec 18, 2022 03:19
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https://youtu.be/uq-gYOrU8bA
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Dec 18, 2022 03:19
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Large Testicles posted:I’m talking about non medical people who have a PhD and insist on being called doctor and are like “I didn’t spend 10 years in school to be called Mister.” They can go gently caress themselves. You’re not special. By all means, when this type of dickhead is out the gate and going off on one, by all means tell them "Sir, this is a Wendy's", but otherwise it's entirely possible to hate people who do this, and also agree that there are times and places (professional and academic) where those titles matter. There might be a medical doctor directing your cancer treatment, but it took someone with an engineering PhD to develop radiotherapy machines, MRI's etc.
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Dec 18, 2022 05:22
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BuckyDoneGun posted:By all means, when this type of dickhead is out the gate and going off on one, by all means tell them "Sir, this is a Wendy's", but otherwise it's entirely possible to hate people who do this, and also agree that there are times and places (professional and academic) where those titles matter. that's totally cool and all but even if your an actual doctor of medicine, if i meet you outside of an office where you're treating me or unless you're doing something like presenting at a conference where you're presenting something directly to your training and you expect me to refer to you as Doctor Soandso, eat the poo poo directly from my rear end you pretentious piece of poo poo. even D- students can become doctors. look at Ben Carson who is supposedly one of the greatest brain surgeons known to man e; sorry this is getting way off topic Large Testicles fucked around with this message at 07:14 on Dec 18, 2022 |
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Dec 18, 2022 07:10
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CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:The point is that media is using her maiden name to other and belittle her and there is a fair bit of racism underlying that as well. This isnt at it's heart about wether royalty should exist, it's about a direct attack on a woman - of colour I'll add - for merely existing. Clarkson's unprovoked misogynistic attack is a long line of steaming poo poo Fleet Street and other media has been spraying at Meghan for years now albeit Clarkson really sank to a new level with this one. I guess it's a country difference. In the US, her surname is her trade name and I notice no slight intended from any reputable news source (and all the reputable news sources used "Markle" as recently as this month). IMO, there is nothing here analogous to deadnaming. And Clarkson can gently caress off, and I'm sad to not watch anything new from Amazon with Hammond and May, but Clarkson is irretrievably in the chud pile.
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Dec 18, 2022 13:44
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Nidhg00670000 posted:Clarkson has gotten a pass in AI far past the line of many other idiots, and I'm not sure why. For decades Clarkson managed to walk a fine line between: CLARKSON: The boorish, jingoistic, anti-intellectual, anti-environment, power-obsessed car enthusiast who drove supercars sideways in a cloud of tyre smoke while shouting laddish metaphors. and: "Jeremy Clarkson: the self-proclaimed conservative ex-public school boy who could still write intelligent, insightful and witty car reviews, could be an engaging panel show guest, wrote and presented some highly-regarded documentaries about engineering and military history, did some genuinely meaningful conservation and environmental restoration work on his country property and consistently expressed support for European cooperation and integration. His first column written after the EU referendum result was a blistering, passionate take-down of the small-minded, reactionary, backward-looking mindset that he felt had taken grip of the country...but was apparently entirely oblivious that for the past 25 years CLARKSON the character had been one of the main pop culture drivers of exactly that sort of thinking. He doesn't seem to connect the referendum result he despised so much with the past two decades of his continual tub-thumping, flag-waving, barmy-Brussels-bureaucrats, lets-go-to-Germany-in-a-Spitfire antics. And like all people who play personas/characters with shittier views than they actually hold, it still speaks to something real in that they're willing to be a mouthpiece for awful opinions and views they (supposedly) don't hold. And the lines between reality and persona always seem to become blurred eventually, because there's not much tangible difference between being a dickhead ironically and being one for real.
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Dec 18, 2022 16:04
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FYI nobody in the US knows or cares what a Mountbatten-Windsor is so taking away the name that she made famous and giving her the name of her husbands incestuous ancestors is actually what would be considered offensive.
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Dec 18, 2022 16:15
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bird with big dick posted:FYI nobody in the US knows or cares what a Mountbatten-Windsor is please please please PLEASE PLEASE…it’s Saxe-Coburg and Gotha
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Dec 18, 2022 18:48
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c355n4 posted:On the subject of the UK. I enjoy watching Guy Martin's YouTube and he seems cool. But I also initially thought Mike Rowe was cool. Anything I'm missing? KozmoNaut posted:He's a Koch-funded anti-union shitheel. I'm assuming you mean Mike Rowe here, because all my time watching Guy Martin and reading his books give me the impression he's just a dude who makes enough money off of being a tradie, farming, and channel 4 and youtube stuff to play with his toys. I don't think I've ever seen him say anything about unions. Seems like he might be a little difficult to get along with or communicate with, but in at least one of his books he talks about and adult diagnosis of autism and how that and anxiety make it hard for him to interact with people. HenryJLittlefinger fucked around with this message at 19:41 on Dec 18, 2022 |
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Dec 18, 2022 19:39
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HenryJLittlefinger posted:I'm assuming you mean Mike Rowe here, because all my time watching Guy Martin and reading his books give me the impression he's just a dude who makes enough money off of being a tradie, farming, and channel 4 and youtube stuff to play with his toys. I don't think I've ever seen him say anything about unions. Seems like he might be a little difficult to get along with or communicate with, but in at least one of his books he talks about and adult diagnosis of autism and how that and anxiety make it hard for him to interact with people. Yes, Mike Rowe is the shitheel. Guy Martin seems to be a really chill dude who just wants to wrench, drink tea and race bikes.
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Dec 18, 2022 21:08
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Mike Rowe has been a huge disappointment for me. I loved dirty jobs, and his early push to lift up blue collar jobs and trade workers was cool, but when he (a television personality, ex opera singer, and qvc fake diamond shill) started leaning hard into the bootstrapping bullshit and pushing the crap about how everybody can get a job (two, even!) to lift themselves out of financial struggles I lost all respect. Somehow it's even worse to hear that from somebody who not only has never had to do lovely underpaid physical labor to make a living, but seemingly never even worked in a trade. I can see where my muscle head brother in law who actually did succeed at some level of bootstrapping believes it, but gently caress you, tv host guy in a denim shirt with a deep voice and smoker's skin pretending to be a hardworking son of the soil. But yeah, Guy Martin just seems great and I really like pretty much all his stuff. It's great how one of the fastest humans on earth in a bunch of different disciplines always seems to be wide eyed in amazement at everything he gets into. Or at least genuinely delighted. HenryJLittlefinger fucked around with this message at 21:37 on Dec 18, 2022 |
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Dec 18, 2022 21:33
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"oh no it appears I accidentally typed up a bunch of right-wing shitlordism which was quite rightly panned as such..." Note the distinct lack of anything approaching an apology. https://twitter.com/JeremyClarkson/status/1604826179999076352?t=GDerawPGkVRLC9cs7lcOLA&s=19
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Dec 19, 2022 15:03
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Mike Rowe was just on sundae conversation and trotted out the old "THERE ARE SO MANY JOBS TODAY BUT NOBODY WANTS TO WORK" republican classic from the last couple years
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Dec 19, 2022 16:02
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Nidhg00670000 posted:Clarkson has gotten a pass in AI far past the line of many other idiots, and I'm not sure why. I got very tired of the overdone cyber glitch transition nonsense long before I found out about the BRC sponsorship, so that one was easy, I just kept not watching it. I also have been not watching Clarkson be a bellend ever since shortly after he got fired for punching a cook and I realized he wasn't just being a loudmouth for the camera, he actually was that far up his own rear end. So again, easy.
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Dec 19, 2022 19:48
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:Mike Rowe was just on sundae conversation and trotted out the old "THERE ARE SO MANY JOBS TODAY BUT NOBODY WANTS TO WORK" republican classic from the last couple years That is incredibly disappointing.
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Dec 19, 2022 20:59
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Rowe's been an outspoken turbo-chud since, like, before Dirty Jobs even ended. It sucks, because he seemed earnest in the early years of the show, but then he outed himself as an utter dipshit pretty soon after. Looking back, it almost seems like an Undercover Boss kind of empty-headed puff piece where he pretends to exort the hard-working everyman, only to go back to relaxing in his office made of stacks of money while continuing to gently caress over the people who actually do the work.
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Dec 19, 2022 21:08
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:Mike Rowe was just on sundae conversation and trotted out the old "THERE ARE SO MANY JOBS TODAY BUT NOBODY WANTS TO WORK" republican classic from the last couple years That's always been his line. The entire point of Dirty Jobs was 'hey look at all these jobs that nobody wants because they're ~real work~'.
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Dec 19, 2022 21:40
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ishikabibble posted:That's always been his line. The entire point of Dirty Jobs was 'hey look at all these jobs that nobody wants because they're ~real work~'. He wasn't completely wrong in that (not that they're more "real work" than other jobs), and I think a lot of people (myself included) gained an appreciation for those people in part because of dirty jobs. I think watching that in high school and college was when I started to break free from the elitist belief that blue collar work was for lower castes and not for those with "real" education. I've never worked a trade because I always had means and support to do jobs I was more interested in, but now I've got way more respect for laborers, tradespeople, service industry, etc and really wish I'd had to spend some time working that kind of job at some point in my life. A whole lot of them make more money than I do now after my years of school. edit: And to be clear, that's a lesson I could have learned somewhere else from someone genuinely more sympathetic to working people. Just making the point that I think the premise of the show was a good one, unfortunately hosted by someone who is exploitative. I remember watching one of the earliest episodes about a commercial crawdad guy in Louisiana, and thinking "Man, this dude is a surly rear end in a top hat, Mike just wants people to see how neat his job is," and then watching it recently and thinking "Mike really rubbed this guy the wrong way at some point during the episode and I think I know how." HenryJLittlefinger fucked around with this message at 00:30 on Dec 20, 2022 |
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Dec 19, 2022 23:57
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ishikabibble posted:That's always been his line. The entire point of Dirty Jobs was 'hey look at all these jobs that nobody wants because they're ~real work~'. Even that was played up a bit. I worked at a sewage treatment plant, one of the dirtiest jobs you can have, and we never had trouble finding new hires. As we all know, what people want is a living wage. If you’re offering pennys AND the job is poo poo, no one’s gonna apply. Dirty jobs would have been 100x more enlightening and effective if they would have put the average salary of the job in question on the screen
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Dec 20, 2022 00:33
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HenryJLittlefinger posted:gently caress you, tv host guy in a denim shirt with a deep voice and smoker's skin pretending to be a hardworking son of the soil.
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Dec 20, 2022 00:41
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:Even that was played up a bit. I worked at a sewage treatment plant, one of the dirtiest jobs you can have, and we never had trouble finding new hires. I think part of the problem is that a lot of the jobs they did were well paying, and the people who owned their own businesses and worked for themselves were independently wealthy. Mike Rowe was fed a very curated view of America's blue collar working class, then fed that same view back to us. That view is a lie. Mike Rowe is too stupid to realize it. And the average viewer is told it's an educational show and believes the lie fed to them.
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Dec 20, 2022 01:35
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Blue-collar job can be a true description while also being extremely misleading (and with a show like that, almost has to be on purpose). More generally, working on an oil rig, owning your own construction business while still doing actual work, cleaning toilets, picking produce, all blue-collar jobs but the pay is vastly different. And that's where the pinch is, a lot of these jobs pay absolute dog poo poo for physically demanding/dangerous work. Which is why people bail on them when they can, and I can't blame them one loving bit, who wants to destroy their body/health for poverty wages if they have any other choice? But that's something these right-wing chuds never get, they can't see past their own entitlement to the labor of others.
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Dec 20, 2022 18:01
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Dec 20, 2022 18:10
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Just Winging It posted:Blue-collar job can be a true description while also being extremely misleading (and with a show like that, almost has to be on purpose). More generally, working on an oil rig, owning your own construction business while still doing actual work, cleaning toilets, picking produce, all blue-collar jobs but the pay is vastly different. And that's where the pinch is, a lot of these jobs pay absolute dog poo poo for physically demanding/dangerous work. Which is why people bail on them when they can, and I can't blame them one loving bit, who wants to destroy their body/health for poverty wages if they have any other choice? But that's something these right-wing chuds never get, they can't see past their own entitlement to the labor of others. Yeah, I mean, given a choice of making minimum wage at a gas station with heat, A/C and a chair to sit on, or shoveling waste oil into a dumpster in sub zero temperatures for the same money, most people are going to take the gas station job
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Dec 20, 2022 18:18
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:Yeah, I mean, given a choice of making minimum wage at a gas station with heat, A/C and a chair to sit on, or shoveling waste oil into a dumpster in sub zero temperatures for the same money, most people are going to take the gas station job Several years ago I interviewed at an offroad fabrication shop in one of the highest cost of living places in the country. I found out about the shop through one of the nurses from a surgery that it was her spouses business and he wasnt able to nail down reliable employees. The pay? $17/hr 1099, no bennies. Less than what Starbucks pays just down the street. Bonus that Starbucks doesn't require someone to bring in their own industrial espresso machine and the skill to keep it tuned up and running. More to the point. gently caress Rowe. He hasn't done poo poo for the tradesman. I too quit watching Clarkson after he punched the cook.
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Dec 20, 2022 18:34
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Just Winging It posted:Blue-collar job can be a true description while also being extremely misleading (and with a show like that, almost has to be on purpose). More generally, working on an oil rig, owning your own construction business while still doing actual work, cleaning toilets, picking produce, all blue-collar jobs but the pay is vastly different. And that's where the pinch is, a lot of these jobs pay absolute dog poo poo for physically demanding/dangerous work. Which is why people bail on them when they can, and I can't blame them one loving bit, who wants to destroy their body/health for poverty wages if they have any other choice? But that's something these right-wing chuds never get, they can't see past their own entitlement to the labor of others. the distinction of “blue collar” vs “white collar” also feeds into bullshit class definitions that usually help reinforce conservative worldviews for example, is a postdoc making $40k a year at age 39 blue collar or white collar? Where do their economic and class sensibilities lie? What about an adjunct professor with no job security making $5k more? What about a public school teacher or social worker? What about a trained musician or artist? Is somebody with an MFA who works a day job in the service sector blue collar or white collar? Conversely, what about somebody who works a trade and makes six figures doing it, or who is in management? Is the millionaire who built his own construction company blue collar or white collar? Oil rig guys make bank, and conservatives love to point at how salt of the earth and “real” that job is. What if you’re a PhD geologist working for an extraction company on a rig/at a mine site, are you blue collar or white collar? What if you make the same amount- or less- than the roughnecks do? Is nursing blue collar? Did it use to be? Is it still? What about professional athletes? Does it change if it’s a sport like American football or baseball vs a more “rich people” sport like equestrianism or sailing? What if you’re temporarily employed doing gig economy poo poo (ie you lost your old job and are seeking another)? Or you’re driving Uber/working at Amazon part-time to supplement your lovely income from another job (like if you’re a teacher)? How do they entertain themselves, what is their peer group and social circle like? What are their politics like? How do they see themselves vs other people? What class group do they think they belong to? Somewhat of a digression, but I’m reminded of an essay I once read that discussed the rhetorical differences between being “poor” and being “broke”, especially in a generational context relating to millennials and zoomers doing poo poo like living at/moving back home, not buying houses, working gig economy jobs with college degrees, etc. The thesis was basically that these were two distinct states, that poverty-at least in a Western context-is multigenerational and familial, whereas “being broke” was more individual. That these were distinctions visible in the way that different kinds of people viewed the world and navigated through it. That somebody who went to college and has some degree of familial wealth and support to fall back on is going to approach things like their own health and medical situations, workplace mistreatment, local politics, disputes with landlords/etc, legal poo poo, abuse and toxicity in relationships, and so forth in a very different way from somebody who doesn’t have those. Even something like having your car/car repairs or your smartphone or a place to crash provided by your parents is a huge difference vs somebody who has to materialize all of those things for themselves on a bottom-dollar income, never mind getting a little bit of “make ends meet” money every few weeks or a loan or whatever. To give a personal example: a few years ago I was stuck in a really lovely, abusive food service job, and I was able to quit and tell the manager to eat poo poo to his face because my parents helped me make rent until I found another job. I had coworkers that could not afford to do that and couldn’t go two weeks without a paycheck. I had a similar experience at a charter school a few years later—I would not have tried to unionize that place or called my bosses out for lovely practices if I’d been legitimately terrified of losing my job and known that I couldn’t coast for a few weeks. I’ve had surprise car repairs and healthcare costs that would’ve been absolutely life-ruining, if not for my parents’ help. Finally, I know multiple people who were able to flee an abusive relationship because they had an open door back home and the means to get them there, and they didn’t have to worry about poo poo like couch surfing or finding a shelter or food after bailing from their shared apartment. These are all little differences—at the end of the day nobody can afford poo poo—but they add up to big changes in how people behave, what options they have/think they have, and what their class consciousness is like. omg this is perfect. A perfect encapsulation of how a lot of people here think trilobite terror fucked around with this message at 18:49 on Dec 20, 2022 |
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Dec 20, 2022 18:45
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