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Kalli posted:With this, they're up somewhere over $14 billion in the last decade in penalties and fines for not following the remedies they agreed to. They absolutely should not exist anymore. If a bank is forcibly closed, what happens to people that (hypothetically) owe the bank money?
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Dec 20, 2022 20:58
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Triskelli posted:If a bank is forcibly closed, what happens to people that (hypothetically) owe the bank money? they now owe the money to the banks the bank owed the money too
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Dec 20, 2022 21:00
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Triskelli posted:If a bank is forcibly closed, what happens to people that (hypothetically) owe the bank money? Those debts are still on a balance sheet somewhere and will get bought up by other lenders.
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Dec 20, 2022 21:03
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Triskelli posted:If a bank is forcibly closed, what happens to people that (hypothetically) owe the bank money? if you owe money to a bankrupt company, you owe money to a company that is now controlled by its creditors, who have not gotten paid and would really like to get paid what do you think happens?
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Dec 20, 2022 21:10
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Elon might have lied about his stalker situation and now police are looking for a member of his security detail because he ran the stalker over and drove away. https://twitter.com/nycsouthpaw/status/1605304063813615617 quote:Twitter CEO Elon Musk tweeted last week that a “crazy stalker” followed a car carrying one of his children in Los Angeles last Tuesday night, “thinking it was me,” and that the stalker blocked the car from moving and climbed onto its hood.
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Dec 20, 2022 22:26
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projecthalaxy posted:Nothing bad has ever happened from intentionally getting law enforcement involved in your life! Back the blue! I don't think a bunch of uniformed cops are going to show up if you report your employer to the city or state for wage theft. Most likely, investigators will show up.
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Dec 21, 2022 00:06
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small butter posted:I don't think a bunch of uniformed cops are going to show up if you report your employer to the city or state for wage theft. Most likely, investigators will show up. It would be nice to see a few corporate offices get the full no knock warrant treatment. Imagine one of those dumb battering ram tanks plowing through Walmart HQ.
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Dec 21, 2022 02:07
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https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/1605368996492083200?t=TvRvGhcdu9-m4Vi1ncj1Kg&s=19 This is unexpected isn't it? I haven't been following the tax stuff lately
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Dec 21, 2022 02:12
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cr0y posted:https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/1605368996492083200?t=TvRvGhcdu9-m4Vi1ncj1Kg&s=19 At long last, we'll finally learn that Donald Trump isn't anywhere as rich as he claims he is and committed a bunch of financial crimes that no one gives a poo poo about prosecuting.
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Dec 21, 2022 02:15
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nine-gear crow posted:we'll finally learn that Donald Trump isn't anywhere as rich as he claims he is This will hurt him more than anything that has ever happened to him
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Dec 21, 2022 02:21
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And also possibly puts him between a rock and a hard place in whether he lied to state and federal revenue services or he lied to investment banks. There's just something refreshing about being able to point to a spreadsheet and say this is what you said you lost to one party and said you profited to another and those numbers are not the same therefore guilty.
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Dec 21, 2022 02:30
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cr0y posted:And also possibly puts him between a rock and a hard place in whether he lied to state and federal revenue services or he lied to investment banks. Yeah, can't wait for that to happen. Anyyyyyy day now. Gonna be so cool when he gets prosecuted. mmhmm. Like to see him wriggle his way out of this one! (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 21, 2022 02:36
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Elon might have lied about his stalker situation and now police are looking for a member of his security detail because he ran the stalker over and drove away. To be fair the last part sounds like normal Tesla behaviour.
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Dec 21, 2022 03:25
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haveblue posted:This will hurt him more than anything that has ever happened to him At this point I am open to literally any course of action that might possibly break his spirit, because he's such an utterly strange human being that I have no idea what's gonna be the thing that does it. Just try everything and see what happens. Like somehow even the whole Twitter thing seems to have turned out pretty bad for him? Whatever. Let's go with it.
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Dec 21, 2022 04:37
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cr0y posted:https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/1605368996492083200?t=TvRvGhcdu9-m4Vi1ncj1Kg&s=19 quote:After the vote, the committee revealed that the Internal Revenue Service had failed to audit Trump’s returns during his first two years in office despite a rule mandating such reviews, and never completed any audits while he served.
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Dec 21, 2022 06:36
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Phlag posted:Geez, the IRS didn’t start their mandatory presidential tax audit on Trump until Congress asked about it 2 years in, and slow walked it after that: Who is responsible for that?
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Dec 21, 2022 11:14
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cr0y posted:And also possibly puts him between a rock and a hard place in whether he lied to state and federal revenue services or he lied to investment banks. He definitely lied to both
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Dec 21, 2022 11:29
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Elon might have lied about his stalker situation and now police are looking for a member of his security detail because he ran the stalker over and drove away. Guess that's why he was so trigger happy on bans the moment any journalist started to dig for the slightest bit of information. Pretty bad look when your staff is involved in hit-and-runs after accusing someone else of stalking them.
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Dec 21, 2022 13:20
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Phlag posted:Geez, the IRS didn’t start their mandatory presidential tax audit on Trump until Congress asked about it 2 years in, and slow walked it after that: drat, I wonder who the least popular guy in the IRS office was. quote:The IRS began its first audit of Trump’s returns on the same day that Rep. Richard E. Neal (D-Mass.), the Ways and Means chairman, sent a written request in April 2019 for the information, and then assigned the bulk of the work to just one agent, the panel said. Even in an under-budgeted and understaffed agency, that's a dick move.
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Dec 21, 2022 13:44
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Sir Lemming posted:At this point I am open to literally any course of action that might possibly break his spirit, because he's such an utterly strange human being that I have no idea what's gonna be the thing that does it. Just try everything and see what happens. Like somehow even the whole Twitter thing seems to have turned out pretty bad for him? Whatever. Let's go with it. Yeah I'm not holding out hope for prison bars so I'm just going for maximum pain, no matter how petty. If they reveal something embarrassing about his habits and that crushes him, I'll loving take it
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Dec 21, 2022 13:48
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According to the House report, Trump paid $0 in taxes in 2020 and didn't start actually paying taxes until he became President and his paychecks had taxes withheld by the treasury. Edit: With one exception - he reported $24.1 million in income in 2018 and paid $1 million in taxes. That is the only year he paid income tax on any income not earned as his Presidential salary. Every other year between $0 and $750. Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 14:03 on Dec 21, 2022 |
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Dec 21, 2022 13:58
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:According to the House report, Trump paid $0 in taxes in 2020 and didn't start actually paying taxes until he became President and his paychecks had taxes withheld by the treasury.
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Dec 21, 2022 13:58
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:drat, I wonder who the least popular guy in the IRS office was. Either a dick move, or someone saw the opportunity to have the most laid back job there. Either the task is so monumentally epic in size that there's no way for one person to handle it (so no reason to bust your rear end over it until they assign more people) or you're given carte blanche to work slower but more thorough so you don't burn out over it. I don't know if it's SOP for one agent to work on a specific case at a time, but I can also kind of see the logic behind having one main agent per case rather than having multiple people work on different aspects of a case and potentially overlook more suspicious activity. I guess the real question is where would you even start tackling Trump's taxes. Just go from the beginning and work your way forward?
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Dec 21, 2022 14:36
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Randalor posted:but I can also kind of see the logic behind having one main agent per case rather than having multiple people work on different aspects of a case and potentially overlook more suspicious activity. This is typically described as having a "team lead with resources," not assigning all the work to one person.
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Dec 21, 2022 14:42
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So when are the full returns just going to be posted online?
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Dec 21, 2022 15:36
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:So when are the full returns just going to be posted online? I'd give it by EOB Friday.
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Dec 21, 2022 15:36
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:So when are the full returns just going to be posted online? The House already released a report that has a lot of the information in there, but not the full returns. https://int.nyt.com/data/documenttools/jc-treport-full/f668ccce9e46c975/full.pdf
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Dec 21, 2022 15:38
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:The House already released a report that has a lot of the information in there, but not the full returns. I'm probably too jaded here but I'm having a hard time believing anything less than a full, total reveal can possibly Mattertm.
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Dec 21, 2022 15:44
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I'm probably too jaded here but I'm having a hard time believing anything less than a full, total reveal can possibly Mattertm. Sure, but God drat if it isn't funny that trump had income on the order of ~20 mil annually, somehow always reporting a loss
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Dec 21, 2022 15:54
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I mean that's just the tax system being gamed to poo poo for the ultra wealthy. The Waltons just bought the Broncos because the ultra rich get to amortize the "loss" of value of owning a sports team. That purchase means they get to report a $300m loss yearly on their taxes for the next 15 years.
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Dec 21, 2022 15:58
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There is only one cure for being a broke brain mega wealthy person.
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Dec 21, 2022 16:10
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Going through the returns report now. A lot of this could technically be cleared up by Trump providing the substantiating paperwork and isn't direct proof of anything on its own, but all of it together is pretty suspicious and his attorney has been fighting the IRS's requests that he needs to provide substantiating documents for them for the last 7 years. Some highlights: - Trump and Melania combined said they earned only $14k in salary or wages in 2015. He claimed to have lost $105,157,825 that year and had $0 in taxable income. - He reported $51k in "income" from loans to his children every single year, which appears to be a way to evade gift taxes while also clearing the taxes he owed on the "income" from loans with his large write-offs. - 2016 also reported $0 in taxable income. He claims to have lost ~$34 million that year. - He made a ton of charitable donations to his own foundation. He didn't directly pay himself back with the charity, but the charity appeared to do very little charity. - None of his returns from 2015 through present have had a finished audit performed. - He was lying in 2016 and 2020 when he said he wasn't allowed to release his tax returns because they were under audit. - Trump listed $747,622 in deductions related to "material improvements" made to his hotels in Vancouver and Hawaii, but didn't substantiate the costs. That same year, Ivanka Trump was paid $747,622 for "consulting" on the hotels in Vancouver and Hawaii. The IRS noted that this was suspicious, but Ivanka Trump was employed outside of the Trump Organization at the time, so it was technically an expense. - Trump has an enormous amount of pass-through entities, loss carry forwards, and deductions that aren't verified. The IRS has been working to verify some of them, but has a "contentious relationship with the Trump Organization Tax Attorney" and haven't been able to finish the review for any tax return since 2015. - There are suspicious instances of “Large unusual questionable items” (“LUQs”) that Trump's tax attorney has been fighting the IRS to not have to prove. They include a $55.2 million unexplained loss for "DJT Holding Company," $12.1 million in consulting and legal fees for the Trump Organization, $800,000 in loans to and from the Trump Organization. - Trump has $2.4 million in write-offs for charitable contributions that he cannot provide proof he made. - In 2017, Trump had a $4.1 million deduction for "Misc. Expenses" that is unexplained. - Some of Trump's minor companies, like "DJT Aerospace LLC" suspiciously had the exact same amount of expenses as they did costs for two years in a row, and therefore did not owe any taxes. - Trump has over 400 pass-through entities established that his income goes through before it technically is paid to him. Those entities earned $80.64 million in 2017, but Trump received minimal official compensation from them, instead it was mostly spent by putting it back in the business and local business taxes. Despite claiming minimal compensation from those companies, Trump wrote off all of their loses against his personal income. - Trump claimed a foreign tax credit for $1.3 million, but did not provide proof of a tax receipt paid to another country. - When Trump was President, the IRS agreed to not hire any accounting specialists or outside legal counsel in their disputes over the audit with Trump's tax attorney. They also agreed to limit any potential audit to the tax years of 2017 through 2018. - When Trump was President, the IRS also agreed to a proposal from Trump's tax attorney to assume that the numbers submitted were all correct if they were signed off by a professional tax attorney and accountant - this is particularly wild, because you would assume that every single audit of a high-income individual or someone with complicated taxes would involve a lawyer and accountant. Under that logic, basically everyone should just be assumed to be telling the truth about the numbers they submitted and the only thing to look into is whether you qualified for specific deductions you claimed. Leon Trotsky 2012 fucked around with this message at 16:14 on Dec 21, 2022 |
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Dec 21, 2022 16:10
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Kalli posted:I mean that's just the tax system being gamed to poo poo for the ultra wealthy. The Waltons just bought the Broncos because the ultra rich get to amortize the "loss" of value of owning a sports team. That purchase means they get to report a $300m loss yearly on their taxes for the next 15 years. ProPublica has a great piece on how this works: https://www.propublica.org/article/the-billionaire-playbook-how-sports-owners-use-their-teams-to-avoid-millions-in-taxes
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Dec 21, 2022 16:15
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Going through the returns report now. Fraud. You've described fraud.
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Dec 21, 2022 16:23
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This is a hilarious burn from the NYT:quote:The reports also showed that Mr. Trump continued to collect large sums of interest income, a total of $38.1 million during his presidency. They do not disclose the source of that income, but the tax returns previously obtained by The Times showed that through 2017 nearly all of his interest income came from his share of profits earned by a partnership that is controlled by Vornado Realty Trust.
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Dec 21, 2022 16:29
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He 100% did tax fraud through his fake charity, the one that he had to shut down That’s not even getting into the mountain of shady poo poo beyond that
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Dec 21, 2022 16:30
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skylined! posted:Fraud. You've described fraud. Only if you can prove it was intentional and that it was fake. Turns out that being able to choose the person who runs the IRS makes it easy to get them agree to terms where they just take your word for most of it. Then, the parts where they won't take your word, you just fight for 7 years against the underfunded agency who also coincidentally agree to not hire any specialists our outside lawyers to help them on this case as soon as you become President.
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Dec 21, 2022 16:35
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TPM just put up an article 13 minutes ago that summarizes what I was saying much better. But, I got it first! So, technically, SA scooped them!quote:Trump Got Stunningly Lax IRS Treatment While POTUS, House Finds quote:For years during Trump’s presidency, the losers and haters wondered: might there be a conflict of interest in having a famously tax-averse President be audited by an IRS that he controlled? quote:The IRS dozed through most of its obligations to audit Trump during his presidency, the panel found, concluding that it violated an agency program which mandates that the tax returns of every President be audited annually. In Trump’s case, the returns weren’t audited for his first two years in office — when Republicans held a governing trifecta. quote:During the first two years of his administration, Trump filed his tax returns for 2015, 2016, and 2017. Per policy, but not statute, that should have triggered an automatic IRS audit. quote:The IRS did not examine Trump’s personal tax returns for 2017, 2018, and 2019 until after he left office. quote:The IRS only began to audit Trump at all under the program on the same day that the House Ways and Means Committee asked for Trump’s returns: April 3, 2019. quote:Trump delayed audits by filing FOIA requests, refusing to “provide all the facts needed to resolve certain issues,” and by threatening to appeal. quote:The IRS recorded “animosity” between its representative and Trump’s attorneys in a memo, with Trump’s counsel purportedly expressing “dislike for our counsel” which “ma[d]e the examination a little more difficult.” Trump also described the IRS increasing its agents on the case from one to three as a “300 percent” increase in scrutiny. quote:The IRS took exceedingly few steps to substantiate the returns that Trump filed, and never gained a complete picture of the business entities tied to Trump, nor did it determine all of the deductions that Trump claimed across his returns. https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-got-stunningly-lax-irs-treatment-while-potus-house-finds
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Dec 21, 2022 16:40
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Here's the IRS procedure for presidential examination, for reference https://www.irs.gov/irm/part4/irm_04-002-001#idm140457028493376 edit: some parts of that manual, the IRM, aren't public- idk if that includes the section linked above Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 18:34 on Dec 21, 2022 |
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Dec 21, 2022 17:54
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None of this makes any sense. I've been repeatedly yelled at about the IRS's bias against conservatives, after all.
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Dec 21, 2022 18:29
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