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Cousin Todd
Jul 3, 2007
Grimey Drawer

biceps crimes posted:

infrastructure doesn't magically scale, it needs to be intentionally designed to do so. And if you pile a ton of features and dependencies upon an old system that wasn't designed to easily scale, you incur a poo poo load of technical debt, where features which seemingly shouldn't be a problem or expensive are excessively so and would require a ton of rework and throwing out old poo poo while maintaining all of the current dependencies... yeah. i can easily imagine a scenario where the only way they can scale is to throw more hardware at the problem, and that is very expensive

Throwing more hardware at it is literally what scaling is. And it isn't a matter of losing money, just making slightly less profit, which can easily be offset by renting. They have an app you rent, retainers for rent, and they literally sell passes to bypass content. This isn't a crazy or even difficult idea, it's literally what they are already doing.

Mind you, I don't really care, but I always think it's very strange when people are willing to just chalk up these low level technology problems as if they were insurmountable or even difficult.

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ZenMasterBullshit
Nov 2, 2011

Restaurant de Nouvelles "À Table" Proudly Presents:
A Climactic Encounter Ending on 1 Negate and a Dream
This is a very strange argument to have when they literally are just adding more, as they semi regularly do.

Cousin Todd
Jul 3, 2007
Grimey Drawer

ZenMasterBullshit posted:

This is a very strange argument to have when they literally are just adding more, as they semi regularly do.

Fair point

iPodschun
Dec 29, 2004

Sherlock House

Chillgamesh posted:

Check out this little booger who I'm guessing drops in the new dungeon:


ZenMasterBullshit posted:

That's a crossover with the nier gacha isn't it?
Yeah it's Mama. They showed it during the live letter:
https://twitter.com/Nova_Crystallis/status/1606283346803392515

Zanael
Jan 30, 2007

Finn 3:16 says I just licorice
whipped your peppermint ass

Kwyndig posted:

So finally having done Netflix roulette again... it's not Netflix Roulette anymore. The new versions of Castrum and Prae are basically entirely new, completely standard dungeons with a sprinkling of cutscene before bosses. They cut almost all of the cutscenes that weren't bosses monologuing, no more patrols standing down or distant explosions.

The new ilvl sync of 60 makes even the trash deadly to an unprepared player and the new boss mechanics are completely modern and completely require you to be on your toes. In my Praetorium run we almost wiped to Gaius because I wasn't keeping up on healing, expecting a relatively simple tank and spank instead of a dance fight. None of the speed run strategies work anymore, not just because they would get you killed, but because they completely reworked the trash and put up the usual barricades to progress until you clear them. I was happy to see the death run gone from Prae, but the new march through laser barriers in Castrum is brutal to the unprepared.

All in all I got out of those instances in like 35 minutes compared to the hour they used to take.
I went from never doing those because of "waiting for HW to release and get my tomestone gear" PTSD back in 2.5 (and worse when they removed the skippable cutscenes) to doing them occasionnaly and not disliking the trip.
Castrum is the clear winner because they kept the cutscenes to the minimum and it's just a cool dungeon with huge pulls where you get the bliss of AOEing hits noises, Prae still has too much cutscenes including the Gaius laïus but it's bearable. The UW fight could cut a lot of the first phase but the second phase is nice and require your attention.
Also it introduces a lot of modern trials/raids markers to practice for sprouts. CT raids has been updated with these too in some places, it eases out the discovery of later more punishing fights.

Chillgamesh
Jul 29, 2014

That's great that it's from a crossover event, it'll be easy to get

DACK FAYDEN
Feb 25, 2013

Bear Witness

iPodschun posted:

Yeah it's Mama. They showed it during the live letter:
https://twitter.com/Nova_Crystallis/status/1606283346803392515
holy poo poo that cyber mandragora owns

Bruceski
Aug 21, 2007

The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core.

DACK FAYDEN posted:

holy poo poo that cyber mandragora owns

The trailer also showed it's a boss fight. I don't think we know from where though. Are we getting another criterion dungeon in 6.45? I'd guess that or treasure dungeons.

biceps crimes
Apr 12, 2008


Kharmakazy posted:

as if they were insurmountable or even difficult.

i don't think you know what you're talking about

parasyte
Aug 13, 2003

Nobody wants to die except the suicides. They're no fun.

Kharmakazy posted:

Throwing more hardware at it is literally what scaling is. And it isn't a matter of losing money, just making slightly less profit, which can easily be offset by renting. They have an app you rent, retainers for rent, and they literally sell passes to bypass content. This isn't a crazy or even difficult idea, it's literally what they are already doing.

Mind you, I don't really care, but I always think it's very strange when people are willing to just chalk up these low level technology problems as if they were insurmountable or even difficult.

They did just come off a long period where they could not acquire any more servers for quite a length of time, to the point that they stopped selling the game because it was so crowded it took an hour or two to get on a server. Luckily that has changed which is why new servers have finally opened recently with more to come.

Technical decisions were made long ago that housing wards are neighborhoods and will always be running rather than spinning up and down as people leave. There also seems to be a reluctance to touch any of the code related to housing; some of the plugin developers theorize most of the housing was done in a rush by contractors and the whole thing is a spaghetti mass that will make things keel over if you look at the code wrong.

It's technical debt that has to be paid down, which is their responsibility of course. But because of the technical decisions made back in 2013-2014 and because of the semiconductor shortage, it's still not as simple as throwing more hardware at it.

Bruceski
Aug 21, 2007

The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core.

biceps crimes posted:

i don't think you know what you're talking about

How much can server infrastructure cost, ten dollars?

Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010


The Great Twist

Bruceski posted:

The trailer also showed it's a boss fight. I don't think we know from where though. Are we getting another criterion dungeon in 6.45? I'd guess that or treasure dungeons.

The boss is from the new deep dungeon, which typically has minions as rewards as well.

Cousin Todd
Jul 3, 2007
Grimey Drawer

biceps crimes posted:

i don't think you know what you're talking about

Feel free to think that, I don't mind. It's not like literally every other large company on earth has this figured out or anything.

Bruceski
Aug 21, 2007

The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core.

Orcs and Ostriches posted:

The boss is from the new deep dungeon, which typically has minions as rewards as well.

Ah right, makes sense given that it is.

limp dick calvin
Sep 1, 2006

Strepitoso. Vedete? Una meraviglia.

DACK FAYDEN posted:

holy poo poo that cyber mandragora owns

Yeah I need it so bad. And a Matrix glam

Good Dumplings
Mar 30, 2011

Excuse my worthless shitposting because all I can ever hope to accomplish in life is to rot away the braincells of strangers on the internet with my irredeemable brainworms.

Kharmakazy posted:

Feel free to think that, I don't mind. It's not like literally every other large company on earth has this figured out or anything.

there's parts of the game that still haven't changed because removing the glamour dresser somehow breaks them, I get the feeling that even adding a new housing system that's completely independent from the old code is harder than it looks

plus the unspoken effect of it making diehards permasub so they can squat for a house, I get the feeling there's people in accounting that specifically don't want that patched out

Thundarr
Dec 24, 2002


Unfortunately, poorly thought out decisions made by a developer a decade ago, followed by other devs iterating on the poorly thought out decisions for years rather than scrapping them and starting over from scratch, can make fixing things without blowing up your entire live environment Really Hard sometimes.

It's basically my current work environment!

flatluigi
Apr 23, 2008

here come the planes
we know that the current housing setup was on the edge of how much they could support it, given that when they implemented islands using the housing system to support the instancing they ended up making housing unusable for like a week after patch day. there's also no reason to disbelieve them saying that they were extremely limited on how many servers they could physically buy for the game other than reflexively disbelieving anything a company says

Bruceski
Aug 21, 2007

The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core.

flatluigi posted:

we know that the current housing setup was on the edge of how much they could support it, given that when they implemented islands using the housing system to support the instancing they ended up making housing unusable for like a week after patch day. there's also no reason to disbelieve them saying that they were extremely limited on how many servers they could physically buy for the game other than reflexively disbelieving anything a company says

How did I forget about that? The new islands meant nobody could enter their houses.

hopeandjoy
Nov 28, 2014



Yeah the island thing makes it clear why they haven’t done the obvious “give everyone an instanced house” thing.

dyslexicfaser
Dec 10, 2022

Wow, that is some [Rak'tika spoilers]Looney Tunes poo poo going on in that ancient temple, huh

Thundarr
Dec 24, 2002


dyslexicfaser posted:

Wow, that is some [Rak'tika spoilers]Looney Tunes poo poo going on in that ancient temple, huh

I very much appreciated the meta gag with Rescue.

hopeandjoy
Nov 28, 2014



Thundarr posted:

I very much appreciated the meta gag with Rescue.

:same:

Blockhouse
Sep 7, 2014

You Win!


blackjack mount!!!!

Cousin Todd
Jul 3, 2007
Grimey Drawer
Looks kinda whaley

Shinjobi
Jul 10, 2008


Gravy Boat 2k

Thundarr posted:

Unfortunately, poorly thought out decisions made by a developer a decade ago, followed by other devs iterating on the poorly thought out decisions for years rather than scrapping them and starting over from scratch, can make fixing things without blowing up your entire live environment Really Hard sometimes.

It's basically my current work environment!

The forums will get better, I promise

Chillgamesh
Jul 29, 2014

No way the Blackjack isn't gonna be $42 but if they keep adding old FF Airships like it and the Lunar Whale to Mogstation I might fork over cash for the FF9 Invincible or FF7 Highwind.

Thundarr
Dec 24, 2002


I bought the Lunar Whale.
You can't stop me from getting the Blackjack.

...somebody stop me. Please.

Onean
Feb 11, 2010

Maiden in white...
You are not one of us.

Chillgamesh posted:

No way the Blackjack isn't gonna be $42 but if they keep adding old FF Airships like it and the Lunar Whale to Mogstation I might fork over cash for the FF9 Invincible or FF7 Highwind.

I'm 90% sure they said it was going to be an MGP mount. It may have just been the translators interpreting wrong, which is why I'm not 100% sure.

Thundarr
Dec 24, 2002


That would actually be ideal, since I'm hard capped on MGP with literally nothing left to spend it on.

Macaluso
Sep 23, 2005

I HATE THAT HEDGEHOG, BROTHER!
So are they going to be bringing back PVP rewards to be purchased later? I missed the boat on the fist pound emote and I can't get it now.

Vitamean
May 31, 2012

they haven't said if they would

Kerrzhe
Nov 5, 2008

Vitamean posted:

they haven't said if they would

i thought early on they said they would? like super early

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!
Yeah, they said that and have proceeded to not do that.

Countblanc
Apr 20, 2005

Help a hero out!

Thundarr posted:

I bought the Lunar Whale.
You can't stop me from getting the Blackjack.

...somebody stop me. Please.

you can simply not spend the dollars. buy chained echoes on steam and some good coffee instead

Vitamean
May 31, 2012

Kerrzhe posted:

i thought early on they said they would? like super early

I think it was a misinterpretation of them saying you could still redeem rewards from a season prior if you forgot.

I wouldn't count it out (it is only season 2 at the moment), but they just haven't said anything about it. I would hope they add them to the store alongside a general update to the stock, mainly because I'm constantly capped on trophy crystals and don't really wanna cash out on wolf collars or something.

TheWorldsaStage
Sep 10, 2020

https://twitter.com/aitaikimochi/status/1611229422891462656?t=uEZt1rEQM3e9rG0cXN2Xpg&s=19

I love it

Roluth
Apr 22, 2014

Thundarr posted:

I very much appreciated the meta gag with Rescue.

I still love the delay on the yank to make it consistent with how the actual button has lag issues.

Blockhouse
Sep 7, 2014

You Win!
NEW SITS NEW SITS NEW SITS NEW SITS

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Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

Blockhouse posted:

NEW SITS NEW SITS NEW SITS NEW SITS

Also a 'listen to linkpearl' emote! Which is probably going to be a limited-time PvP reward, like the other long-existent and requested but unavailable emotes.

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