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Played Oath for the first time in a long while the other day. We were all re-learning the rules, and the question of trading relics, favor and secrets came up. There hadn’t been an occasion to discuss this prior, as all players had been out for themselves, but in this game the Chancellor was powerful enough that the exiles were willing to pool resources to unseat them. My instinct was that trading is not allowed, because that’s just generally true in games, but there is nothing in the rulebook explicitly saying that you cannot trade freely with other players. What there is, is a confusing passage talking about “binding promises,” detailing that promises are not binding excepting in certain circumstances, namely promises of citizenship and specific denizen cards that explicitly permit the trading of certain resources as “binding promises.” The other players feel that the attachment of the term “binding” implies that unfettered trading is otherwise allowed with the understanding that you can get betrayed if you’re trading for a promise of fealty or services rendered. I disagree, because the game does outline fairly comprehensively the types of actions that players are allowed to take, and they’re pretty narrowly defined. How do you play, if you run this game? I acquiesced to the trading stuff in our game, and in that case it made for a raucous and fun session with a couple of dramatic turncoat moments. And it seems in keeping with the spirit of the game. In that session, it worked because the Oathkeeper began with an insanely stacked hand and position. But I could see it introducing a game ruining level of kingmaking, in ordinary circumstances.
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Jan 16, 2023 16:08
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Anonymous Robot posted:Played Oath for the first time in a long while the other day. We were all re-learning the rules, and the question of trading relics, favor and secrets came up. There hadn’t been an occasion to discuss this prior, as all players had been out for themselves, but in this game the Chancellor was powerful enough that the exiles were willing to pool resources to unseat them. I thought that there was a passage in the rules that states you cannot give each other anything, though I cannot find it currently. What I do know is there are specific cards that enable the passing of favor/secrets/relics between players, which seems to also imply that you cannot do it otherwise. E: This BGG thread goes through it a bit. It's unwritten in the rules of the game because you can only do what is explicitly allowed in the rules of the game, and there are no actions which allow exchanging between players. This is not my favorite style of rule but I guess it makes sense. It feels like it could ruin a lot of the tension of the game if you could trade freely, as sometimes people have to take risky moves just to get enough secrets to take a banner, for instance. Radioactive Toy fucked around with this message at 17:31 on Jan 16, 2023 |
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Jan 16, 2023 17:25
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Tinkers Fair is one card that enables exchange of resources, so yes, without that or another ability to enable it, you can’t trace them.
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Jan 16, 2023 17:56
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If someone steals the Sceptor, they can then include any kind of trades they want as part of the citizenship offer.
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Jan 16, 2023 19:22
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Had to sit on the margins and wait for a 2.5 hour game of Catan to play out last night because I couldn’t convince a group to play (in complexity order) Azul, Concordia, Tulip Bubble, TfM, Everdell, Root, Pax 2E, or Lisboa. For as much as Catan is credited for reigniting interest in the hobby it sure seems like plenty of people are happy to play Catan and never explore what else might be out there. I was very sad. It was interesting to read a book while they played and just listen to the rhythm of the game. Just two and a half hours of “ah poo poo, another four!” and “does anyone have any brick?” Over and over and over and over and over and over. Meanwhile my copy of Oath goes untouched 
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Jan 16, 2023 20:29
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I played Catan Starfarers once. Ended the game trading everything I had to the guy one point away from winning for one of his least valued resource. I felt the writing was on the wall and could maybe end the game next turn instead of in two more rounds of what had already been an extremely lengthy game. And if that's the good version of Catan than Jesus I'm not playing any other.
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Jan 16, 2023 20:39
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Mr. Squishy posted:I played Catan Starfarers once. Ended the game trading everything I had to the guy one point away from winning for one of his least valued resource. I felt the writing was on the wall and could maybe end the game next turn instead of in two more rounds of what had already been an extremely lengthy game. And if that's the good version of Catan than Jesus I'm not playing any other. Did that start a fist fight with the player who felt he was in second place? Also is this an incoming derail about kingmaking?
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Jan 16, 2023 21:12
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Jewmanji posted:Had to sit on the margins and wait for a 2.5 hour game of Catan to play out last night because I couldn’t convince a group to play (in complexity order) Azul, Concordia, Tulip Bubble, TfM, Everdell, Root, Pax 2E, or Lisboa. For as much as Catan is credited for reigniting interest in the hobby it sure seems like plenty of people are happy to play Catan and never explore what else might be out there. I was very sad. the most fun I can remember having with Catan was watching a bunch of people at my college board game club play a game that involved a guy camping on all the wood (which was rolled almost every turn) and grabbing the 2 wood for 1 any trading port and just running away with the game. I can still remember him going "more wood!" almost every turn.
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Jan 16, 2023 21:46
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Has anyone had a chance to play the Deep Rock Galactic boardgame yet?
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Jan 16, 2023 22:15
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Anonymous Robot posted:Played Oath for the first time in a long while the other day. We were all re-learning the rules, and the question of trading relics, favor and secrets came up. There hadn’t been an occasion to discuss this prior, as all players had been out for themselves, but in this game the Chancellor was powerful enough that the exiles were willing to pool resources to unseat them. No trading (except when offering citizenship), the only actions you can do are those specified on the player board. It's not written anywhere in the rules I don't think, but it's made clear with the Festival District edifice, which explicitly allows you to trade favor or secrets as an action. If you could trade freely without it, then it wouldn't make sense that it exists.
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Jan 16, 2023 23:01
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Jewmanji posted:Had to sit on the margins and wait for a 2.5 hour game of Catan to play out last night because I couldn’t convince a group to play (in complexity order) Azul, Concordia, Tulip Bubble, TfM, Everdell, Root, Pax 2E, or Lisboa. For as much as Catan is credited for reigniting interest in the hobby it sure seems like plenty of people are happy to play Catan and never explore what else might be out there. I was very sad. I was forced to eventually come to the conclusion that some people literally don't care what game they're playing and see board gaming mostly as an excuse to socialise, which is totally fine but it's confusing to do that when you can just do that part by itself without having a board game get in the way. So a simple game which you already know the rules for is best, and it's good if games take a while because the start and end of the game tend to be more distracting. Also that some people have really weird ideas about "ettiquette" (like, if you have a new game which literally nobody in the group has played before you're not supposed to try to win intentionally in the first few games)
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Jan 17, 2023 00:08
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grate deceiver posted:No trading (except when offering citizenship), the only actions you can do are those specified on the player board. It's not written anywhere in the rules I don't think, but it's made clear with the Festival District edifice, which explicitly allows you to trade favor or secrets as an action. If you could trade freely without it, then it wouldn't make sense that it exists. Yeah, this edifice actually is on the board currently and that was my reasoning too, but they got a bug up their asses about the term “binding” and its relationship to the language about “non-binding promises” in the rulebook. I’ll try and relitigate next time, and if they all still want trading, we’ll just play until a session when trading inevitably fucks things up and everyone gets mad about it.
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Jan 17, 2023 02:39
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Father Wendigo posted:Has anyone had a chance to play the Deep Rock Galactic boardgame yet? Mine should be here by end of the week, so I'll get back to you in 3 years when I finally get it to the table.
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Jan 17, 2023 03:06
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We got to October in Pandemic Season 0 last night and I am convinced the creators are loving sadists. Still completed 2/3 missions -- The fugitive missions (or whatever the ones with roadblocks are called) (e:especially when the first player draws an escalation card!) are drat near impossible I think. Oh yeah, we somehow managed to ace September too. Best thing about October, from the briefing notes: ignore the missiles -- they're a distraction Admiralty Flag fucked around with this message at 04:14 on Jan 17, 2023 |
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Jan 17, 2023 04:12
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Used markov chains to generate another batch of made-up boardgames:
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Jan 17, 2023 06:54
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Long Kong Kong and Fields of Soup are 
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Jan 17, 2023 06:57
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Azran posted:Long Kong Kong and Fields of Soup are Fields of Soup, for my family
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Jan 17, 2023 07:01
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GMT finally shipped my copy of The Mastern Mounta Monument World Wars of Crime Board Game of Whispers of Babylonial Sea, but now I have to find six friends to play it with.
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Jan 17, 2023 07:10
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Odin's War is my favorite, multiple opposing layers
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Jan 17, 2023 07:25
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Anonymous Robot posted:Yeah, this edifice actually is on the board currently and that was my reasoning too, but they got a bug up their asses about the term “binding” and its relationship to the language about “non-binding promises” in the rulebook. In my mind, the "binding" wording is there to make sure that all sides honor the trade, and not to differentiate it from "non-binding". There's no "non-binding" trades in Oath at all. There's also a couple more cards that explicitly allow trades. I prefer to not look at the world deck, so I can't name them off the top of my head, but I have seen them during play. Another argument you can use is that everything that you can "just do" at any time and no cost is covered by the free actions. If things like placing warbands on your site or looking at relics is mentioned, you'd think trading between players would be too. If it's not on the player board or your card/relics, then you can't do it.
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Jan 17, 2023 09:33
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Had a small 3 person game day yesterday. Each person brought one game and we played it. (Well, I brought a few extras, but that's because Concordia is very large so I might as well.) Started with Root. Lake map with Tower and Raft. Adset with Woodland Alliance, Keepers In Iron (me), and Corvid Consipracy. Hirelings being Furious Protector, Popular Band and Flame Bearers. I chose the Keepers over the Cats since I had not played them before, despite it being the only faction I did not understand how to play at all. Had a decent start but then the Furious Protector game around and both bopped away one of my warriors in my clearing a few times and while it was nice it couldn't destroy a relic, it also got around my -1 hit I would take from Devout Knights. More importantly, it also prevented me from Encamping or Decamping which super sucked. It crushed my card wealth and Recover ability because he showed up just as I was going to Encamp more than once. Then, Corvids getting Soup Kitchens actually managed to screw me hard because I couldn't Recover without losing cards anymore. I tried to use Exposure twice, but was wrong both times. It was a very bad game for me, and I didn't have all that much fun, but that's Root sometimes. I think I needed to recruit and move more aggressively at the start. I really like the dynamic of the Raft on the Lake map, and drawing a card is a nice little bonus. So far I don't know if I like any of the pink colored Hirelings except maybe the Furious Protector, but it just seems like a non-random The Exile which I am dying to try. The Flame Bearers is a super cool ability which I used to break up an entrenched Corvid stronghold and give the win to the WA.  I still really like this game, but it can be fragile. It's pretty quick at 3.Next played Wingspan in person for the first time. Have played it a few times on BGA, but this was the game's owner's first time. I am still enjoying this game, despite the mild goon resistance to it. Physically, I'm torn on it. Taking your cubes and going step-by-step down the stages of your engine is intuitive and satisfying. I found assessing my opponent's boards for end of round bonuses to be very simple. I had a lot of fun using a wetlands strategy to have a ton of bird cards that I then tucked into my grasslands birds. My opponents both put birds that generate food for all players in their forests, which let me relax on that a fair bit. I am still seeing birds I don't recall seeing ever, and birds are cool. The little dice tower is quite satisfying to use and is made of quality material. On the other hand, tucking birds for predator or flocks is a pain, especially since they may have eggs on them and some even tuck and then add an egg. I also engaged in the late game egg cannon, and ended up winning inn part because of it, but in this case it was not super overpowered or anything, and I got more mileage out of it due to a secret goal. Regarding the production, I don't know why on earth they made the rulebooks out of such a textured piece of paper. I hope it keeps it from getting dinged or something, because it does not seem like something worth spending extra money on especially since the rulebook is weirdly laid out for aesthetic reasons and is not necessarily clear. It reminds me of the La Granja glossary which also did not seem to contain reasonable questions people who played the game might have. Also, and most perplexing, was the fact hat it comes with 4 little plastic lidded plastic tubs when the game has 5 different foods, 5 different egg colors (for no gameplay reason, but it's aesthetically cool) and 5 different player colors. Why 4? Why not 5? Why are these not mentioned in the game materials in the manual? Unfortunately, my feelings can only be said in bird form now:  Ended the night with Concordia. While I quite like the two games I mentioned above and they are quite popular, I have absolutely zero reservations about this game. This game is terrific. Complete indisputable genius. We played just the base game with 3 players on Italia. Nothing fancy. It wasn't that crowded but we kept getting in each other's way. I went first and grabbed an early cloth, but there was another in reach of Rome with a brick city next to it which the second player got. Third player responded with Turn 1 Senator  I never got to Prefectus Magnus with my cloth region because my opponent was watching and waiting for me to Prefect that region to try and screw me, and I eventually just had to take the value, and he'd immediately Prefect. He got out 5 colonists and was just Mercator-ing his way to get what he needed with 2 Colonists for money. Late in the game, once I saw he could buy the last one which was stuck behind a cloth bonus cost, I Consul-ed it to steal it from him. When I started playing I think I over-valued Consuls in 4-5 player, but now I am wondering if I am undervaluing it at lower player counts. That Colonist interacted well with my Farmer and Smith (which was sitting uncontested for ages) and ended up getting all my land and sea colonists out. Our other opponent was methodically doing inefficient actions and then turning around with big Architect turns to make up the slack and kept pace well. Once I late-game Diplomated the Weaver for 1 cloth and then immediately Mercator-ed for 1 wine, the jig was up because I could Tribune and Senator to buy the last two personality cards. They didn't know if I still had my Senator, so they set up for 2 turns, which ended up letting them both play out all their buildings and I bought them up on the final turn. We like to do scoring in order of the gods in the pantheon, starting with Vesta and ending with Minerva for a little more excitement. Ended up being 128-121-121 with me victorious. They had each bought 6 cards and had 15 buildings out, but I had 10 and 9 cards. But that sort of shows the multi-dimensional aspect of scoring in this game. Think of it like the area of a rectangle; 6x15 = 90 = 9 * 10. You can expand your points base both by putting more stuff on the board or by getting more cards in your hand. It's satisfying yet mysterious. Every game of Concordia makes me I think I am losing the entire game because of this obfuscation. I literally cannot say enough good things about this game. If you haven't tried it, I highly recommend everyone try it.
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Jan 17, 2023 11:38
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Geekway Mini was this past weekend and I played SO MANY games I had to help setup on Thursday, but after setup my friends and I have a tradition where we play Giant Queendomino. It's great and barely fits on the table. The first play of the "actual" convention was Flamecraft. Which, while really good, not quite as good as I was hoping after two plays. Not sure I'll pick this one up, but I'll definitely play it more if someone I know picks it up and brings it to the table. It's fun, it's cute, it's got enough depth to keep me interested. Main strikes against it is that the replayability seems on the lighter side. There's lots of shops to change each game, but they don't exactly make the game that different. Roam is a new Ryan Laukat game. Kind of area controlly where you have to place tokens without rotating the pattern. Fun, lighter Laurat game. Same great artwork, but in a smaller package than the Near and Far/Above and Below/Sleeping Gods esque games. Framework is a new Uwe puzzle game. I probably wouldn't recommend this over some of his other games, but if you're an Uwe fan it's worth playing. It's a tile laying game where tiles have goals on them and you're trying to complete the goals by placing contiguous tiles of the same type. It's fairly ugly though, and doesn't have a lot of player interaction beyond the tile drafting. Quacks of Quedlinberg has always been a favorite of mine, and we got to play a kitchen sink game with all the features of the Mega Box. I loved the Alchemists expansion, much more than I liked the Herb Witches expansion. Akropolis is another tile laying game where you build districts of each color, which each score slightly differently. It reminded me of a lighter Taluva, except each player is working on their own board. Neat puzzle, but not one I'm going to pick up. I feel like other games do that better. Fyfe, however, I do want to pick up. It feels much like the puzzle of Calico except each round you're placing goal tiles as well as filling your board. Not as cute and cuddly as Calico, but just as brain burning and fun to puzzle out your tile placements. Birdwatcher seems to be late to the Wingspan craze but was pretty fun for what it was. You collect "photos" of birds and fill out your birdwatching journal. Pretty fun, had a good time with it and would definitely play again if given the opportunity. It felt pretty unique in the actions and mechanics. You take 3 actions on your turn to try and setup your board to take photos, but every action tends to help your birdwatching opponents as well. It's really neat. Twilight Inscription was the star of the show for me. I was really hoping to get this to the table, and ended up playing it twice and then buying it as soon as I got home. Everything I wanted in a Twilight Imperium game, with a much lighter and more friendly combat system (similar to 7 wonders: compare your combat score to the left and right of you and score points depending on win/loss). Completely insane roll and write with tons of comboing and decision making and variable setups and player powers. Really really good. If you're looking for a heavy roll and write, this is a perfect thing to scratch that itch. Reputation I went in expecting to hate. You play as CEOs of companies and your goal is to have both high reputation and high profits. The lowest two reputations can't win the game. On your turn you either bid on a public project that gives you reputation, or a private projec. The more people that bid on the public project, the less money it's worth and the more money the private project becomes worth. You use workers as your bidding currency, and when you spend them they come back to you slowly. It's a very good auction game. Saturday Night/Sunday Morning is our goblin hours. We get incredibly inebriated and play lighter affairs. For Sale is a favorite bidding game in our group. We can knock it out quickly and it's really hilarious watching people over bid and end up with lovely properties, or underbid and end up with a high valued property. Heavily inspired design on one of the games I'm working on. Cockroach Poker dumb, but when you're really inebriated it's a great time. It's a weird social bluffing game where you just try to convince your friends if you're lying or telling the truth about cards that get passed around the table. Heckin Hounds will be out to the public soon (hopefully by Geekway Prime in May) and I had my pre-production prototype with me so we played that. The game ended up being extremely close and ending in a tie between two players. There's really nothing like being wasted and playing your own designs with your best friends in the world. I love this game so much and I can't wait for it to be in more people's hands.
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Jan 17, 2023 16:25
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Frozen Peach posted:Games You’re the first person I’ve encountered who has nice things to say about Twilight Inscription. I adore For Sale. I should buy it.
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Jan 17, 2023 17:03
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CitizenKeen posted:You’re the first person I’ve encountered who has nice things to say about Twilight Inscription. I've heard others say they like it. It sounds anathema to me, but I hate R&W's in general. Good writeup overall, though! So hyped for heckin hounds.
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Jan 17, 2023 17:07
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CitizenKeen posted:You’re the first person I’ve encountered who has nice things to say about Twilight Inscription. Please allow me to be the second. My group loves it. It is far less complex to play than it seems like it will be when you're learning it, and it's nice to scratch that "epic" itch while still being a simple game. I really hope they release card packs with additional relics, objectives, agendas, and events, though. It'd be an inexpensive way to drastically increase replayability.
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Jan 17, 2023 17:09
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CitizenKeen posted:You’re the first person I’ve encountered who has nice things to say about Twilight Inscription. I'm not the "Twilight Imperium" audience by any stretch of the imagination, but I love a good roll and write, and this is does "epic roll and write" so much better than Dinosaur Island Rawr n Write. It's really intimidating at first, but everything is surprisingly straight forward once you know the gist of the rules. If you're a roll and write fan, I highly recommend it. If you're a Twilight Imperium fan you'd probably bounce off it.
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Jan 17, 2023 17:13
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Hempuli posted:Used markov chains to generate another batch of made-up boardgames: Mr. Walton finally survives
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Jan 17, 2023 17:16
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How did Millennium Blades Collusion turnout? I own the original, played it 2-3 times, thought it was cute but not amazing. Ended up grabbing Collusion because I heard it actually rewrote the rules to make the game more balanced and strategic, but then COVID happened, gaming stopped, and I never opened it. I was on the fence about selling MB + Collusion these past few years, but now there's an opportunity to try it again as I have a new group meeting with consistency. I'm wondering how people who have played Collusion felt it turned out? Are the new rules substantially better than the original edition? Does the game feel any more strategic or interesting with the money changes? If I thought the original was a fun experience, but nothing amazing, were the changes substantial enough to change my mind?
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Jan 17, 2023 17:23
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Magnetic North posted:Ended the night with Concordia. While I quite like the two games I mentioned above and they are quite popular, I have absolutely zero reservations about this game. This game is terrific. Complete indisputable genius... I'm going to recommend you get the Venus expansion for
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Jan 17, 2023 17:28
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I am also a fan of Twilight Inscription. It's not a game I'd play a lot but yeah it definitely scratches an itch for an epic scale roll and write
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Jan 17, 2023 17:59
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Frozen Peach posted:If you're a Twilight Imperium fan you'd probably bounce off it. Funnily enough, it was my first roll and write. I played the demo at Gen Con because I'm a huge fan of Twilight Imperium.
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Jan 17, 2023 18:04
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Well there we go. Sounds more enjoyed after all. How much interaction is there in Twilight Inscription?
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Jan 17, 2023 18:14
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The problem is that it’s not meaningfully more complex or deep than short roll and writes, so you end up playing a really long game of check boxes to check more boxes. That’s fine for 20 minutes, but I could not sit through2-3 hours of it, or longer according to some. It leans in to the worst parts of R&W design that ends up feeling like an analog Cookie Clicker.
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Jan 17, 2023 18:16
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Anonymous Robot posted:Yeah, this edifice actually is on the board currently and that was my reasoning too, but they got a bug up their asses about the term “binding” and its relationship to the language about “non-binding promises” in the rulebook. I'm trying to picture what a "non-binding trade" would entail. Wouldn't that just be an incredibly tedious dexterity game of giving/receiving components at exactly the same time?
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Jan 17, 2023 18:17
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PerniciousKnid posted:I'm trying to picture what a "non-binding trade" would entail. Wouldn't that just be an incredibly tedious dexterity game of giving/receiving components at exactly the same time? "Give me thing [now], and later in turn, I'll give you [value]." Binding means no reneging. Minimizes those Diplomacy bad-feels.
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Jan 17, 2023 18:19
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CitizenKeen posted:How much interaction is there in Twilight Inscription? There are three agenda phases throughout the game where you vote on whether option A or B of a card happens. There are three war phases throughout the game where you compare your strength on either side with your neighbors, Seven Wonders style. That's it. Bottom Liner posted:The problem is that it’s not meaningfully more complex or deep than short roll and writes, so you end up playing a really long game of check boxes to check more boxes. Having the four different boards that interact with each other, and having to choose which board you're spending resources on each phase, is something that I find tactically interesting. rydiafan fucked around with this message at 18:24 on Jan 17, 2023 |
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Jan 17, 2023 18:21
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Admiralty Flag posted:I'm going to recommend you get the Venus expansion Actually just got it quite recently, but didn't break it out yet since we only had an odd number. With that, I think I own everything non-duplicative for this game except the promo salsa tiles, since I still haven't tried it with tiles yet anyway. Honestly, might just grab them anyway to complete the set. I might also not have the Egypt / Crete map either, can't recall. I keep mixing up Cyprus and Crete, I think.
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Jan 17, 2023 18:33
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RabidWeasel posted:I was forced to eventually come to the conclusion that some people literally don't care what game they're playing and see board gaming mostly as an excuse to socialise, which is totally fine but it's confusing to do that when you can just do that part by itself without having a board game get in the way. So a simple game which you already know the rules for is best, and it's good if games take a while because the start and end of the game tend to be more distracting. I got the full extent of how being 'the board game person' can be a double-edged sword over the holidays. Busted out Quacks of Quedlinburg, and it was a hit! Everyone loved it! So if you want, I brought some other games we can try for a little variety...no? You want to stick with this one? Okay, well the ingredients have these different variations so you can...no? Don't want to learn any new rules? What if we just flip over our boards for a...no? Just this beginner's setup, twelve times in five days? Okay then, as long as we're getting something to the table.
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Jan 17, 2023 18:48
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Megasabin posted:How did Millennium Blades Collusion turnout? When I get to play my copy that I got years ago I'll let you know On the plus side, the extra box that it came with (in case you sleeved the thousands of cards like an obsessive psychopath) is great at holding all my Arkham Horror LCG stuff.
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Jan 17, 2023 19:48
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CitizenKeen posted:Well there we go. Sounds more enjoyed after all. How much interaction is there in Twilight Inscription? If my opponents all died during a game of Twilight Inscription, I would only notice when a war card flipped (I should be clear this would be for scoring purposes, it likely would not affect my strategy unless I was one the races that gets meaningful bonuses off warfare). I might notice when the vote cards flip three times per game, but that would depend again on the race I was playing. Most of the time I didn't care much about the outcome of votes. The game goes out of its way to make sure that if you just don't want to interact, it's fine. As harsh as that sounds, I think it's actually a good roll-and-write? If extremely low interaction and optimization puzzles are your thing, it delivers. I just hated the experience because it removes all that I love about gaming. I want people to be joking about things that happen and howling about opportunities they were denied and in Inscription thers's no emergent narratives and just a handful of people quietly scribbling on sheets in between the handful of times the game forces them to acknowledge each other. Like there is a game there. Just not one I need to ever play agaiin.
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Jan 17, 2023 19:53
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