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NikkolasKing posted:The high school kids in P2 having cell phones was so wild to me. Granted, I was poor, so maybe other American high schoolers had cell phones in 1998, too.
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Jan 23, 2023 23:04
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P5 Harem Team is OP. Why are all the non-Joker dudes just not that useful in battle? Ryuji can't do anything other than Unga Bunga, but he has to Charge for maximum effect while Haru can just stack both of her Gun Amp passives. Yusuke is just Worse Ryuji, and to add insult to injury almost nothing is weak to Ice. Absolute worst combatant in the whole squad. Baton Pass damage bonuses are relevant in exactly one and a half fights. Morgana is like a hybrid of Ann and Makoto while being worse than both. His attacks suck, status isn't that useful (teching off it requires Psi), and Makoto is an equivalent healer. Meanwhile: Ann is the most powerful caster, has the single most useful buff/debuff skill (attack debuff), can single-target full-heal, and also has good status spells. Probably the best non-Joker combatant. Makoto is the engine room of the squad. Powerful heals, expensive but useful defense buff, good casts with Nuke Amp, and a decent status spell. Solid jack-of-all-trades. Prone to running out of SP though. Haru inflicts heavy gun damage and Psi lets her tech off of every status effect inflicted by everybody else. Massive force multiplier for any team.
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Jan 24, 2023 01:54
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Ryuji is flatout the best physical damage dealer in the entire game besides Joker, even having to waste a turn to charge he's going to do more damage than Haru will attacking every turn with gun skills + passives. Hell you can even have Ryuji attack every turn by having somebody else buff him instead with Tyrant's Will off the Ring of Pride. Yusuke definitely suffers from being worse Ryuji, this is fixed a bit in Royal by shuffling his kit around and also giving him access to the Jazz Club. Morgana can be pretty useful situationally with miracle punch and he gets better healing skills a bit faster than Makoto, but yeah unless you're fighting a lot of wind weakness enemies he tends to just end up being Makoto but worse. My non-third semester "default" team once I have access to the full party is usually Joker-Ann-Makoto-Ryuji.
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Jan 24, 2023 02:04
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My yuske has higher attack than my ryuji and they both know charge
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Jan 24, 2023 02:10
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Royal makes Yusuke work by making Baton Pass worth a drat so his gimmick of getting absurdly powerful hits off with Baton Pass actually work, so he's fantastic for dungeon crawling. Slap Charge on him and he will absolutely wipe the floor with random mobs.
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Jan 24, 2023 03:10
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Fox has great attacking stats but is mainly held back by his fragility. Charge+Arms Master+Ali Dance via Jazz Club turns Fox from a glass cannon into the best Physical attacker outside of Hassou Tobi. His trait also pairs really well with Skull making them a real wrecking ball duo. Skull's advantage is that all he really needs is Arms Master, and you can get that from an accessory. Same with Panther and Spell Master, which i gave via Jazz Club. I gave the Spell Master accessory to Queen since she has a lot of SP-demanding skills, and all Noir really needed was a Black Moon R for Apt Pupil to maximize her One-Shot Kill crit rate. anakha fucked around with this message at 04:42 on Jan 24, 2023 |
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Jan 24, 2023 04:33
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Does anyone have else prefer the random dungeons of 3 and 4 over 5? I like being able to turn off my brain and just wack thing and having to solve puzzles and pay attention kind of takes me out of that though 4 had a bit of that.
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Jan 24, 2023 06:35
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Absolutely not. Tartarus was abysmal. The dungeons of 4 were better because they had actual themes but I like being able to have set pieces and puzzles and all that.
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Jan 24, 2023 06:47
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cheesetriangles posted:Does anyone have else prefer the random dungeons of 3 and 4 over 5? I like being able to turn off my brain and just wack thing and having to solve puzzles and pay attention kind of takes me out of that though 4 had a bit of that. I remember Persona 3 and 4 having their own puzzles like the Lovers and Yukiko's Castle respectively. Of course, the puzzles are less complex than what we get in Persona 5. That being said, Tartarus in Persona 3 is essentially like Mementos in Persona 5. Do you just hate the puzzles, or do also you hate the lack of "randomness" in the floor layout of Palaces in Persona 5?
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Jan 24, 2023 07:02
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cheesetriangles posted:Does anyone have else prefer the random dungeons of 3 and 4 over 5? I like being able to turn off my brain and just wack thing and having to solve puzzles and pay attention kind of takes me out of that though 4 had a bit of that. I do. Most of 5's dungeons were kinda tedious, and 4's weren't designed any better than randoms. The dungeon crawling is just a vehicle to get into combat anyways. The puzzles and events in the latter ones weren't generally interesting enough to warrant their own thing.
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Jan 24, 2023 07:13
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cheesetriangles posted:Does anyone have else prefer the random dungeons of 3 and 4 over 5? I like being able to turn off my brain and just wack thing and having to solve puzzles and pay attention kind of takes me out of that though 4 had a bit of that. gently caress no. Tartarus (so far) and the P4 dungeons are just worse versions of Mementos and Mementos itself was a pain in the rear end until all the QoL changes in Royal. At least now it has a purpose for degen minmaxers like me.  Give me the themed puzzles, the ability to insta-kill and overall ambience of the Palaces over recolored mazes anyday.
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Jan 24, 2023 07:54
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P5's dungeons are definitely better on a first playthrough since they involve some actual puzzle solving. On replays they can get a bit tedious at points, in particular Palace 3 (Either the money rooms section or the tumbler safe section needed to be drastically cut down) and Palace 5 (even with the keycard bit cut WAY down from vanilla the mid section meanders for way too long) felt like slogs last I played. P4 is a bit better on replay since you can just bulldoze dungeons without too much thought, although you do occasionally have to remember weird arbitrary gimmicks like getting the required key items during Void Quest.
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Jan 24, 2023 08:03
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cheesetriangles posted:Does anyone have else prefer the random dungeons of 3 and 4 over 5? I like being able to turn off my brain and just wack thing and having to solve puzzles and pay attention kind of takes me out of that though 4 had a bit of that. Nope, SMT has always been a dungeon crawling series at heart and like all the non-Persona games, Persona 1 and 2 also had you exploring big hand-designed dungeons so it felt like a massive step back that they removed them from 3 along with other series staples like enemies being the standard demons you can talk to, having control of your party members (lol), etc. I think it's been said in interviews that the random dungeons in 3 and 4 were less of an intentional design decision, and more that they had to devote the limited development resources that would have gone into dungeon design into developing other aspects of the game like the new life-sim, calendar, social link etc side of the game that was introduced in 3. So it's nice that in 5 they used the long development time to combine the social type stuff from 3-4 with the big hand-crafted dungeons that are a feature of the rest of the franchise including P1-2. Persona 5 really felt to me like a blend of a lot of things that were good/unique about both the old and new games so I was glad to see actual dungeon design return to the series after 2 entries without it. While some sections of the palaces in P5 can feel tedious or overly long if you are trying to blitz through them in one day, just even within P5 itself, the difference between exploring Palaces and Mementos is like night and day.
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Jan 24, 2023 08:46
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cheesetriangles posted:Does anyone have else prefer the random dungeons of 3 and 4 over 5? I like being able to turn off my brain and just wack thing and having to solve puzzles and pay attention kind of takes me out of that though 4 had a bit of that.
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Jan 24, 2023 09:07
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Maybe it's because I played Persona 5 and Royal combined like 5 times but I just find them so tedious.
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Jan 24, 2023 10:14
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That post about P4 and millennial activities just made me feel a billion years old, goddamn.
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Jan 24, 2023 11:28
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Commander Keene posted:No, 3's dungeon was worse than the personalized themed dungeons of 4, which were worse than 5's largely crafted dungeons, IMO. I absolutely loved being able to sneak around and ambush shadows, and the setpieces broke things up. P5R made it so you didn't even need to sneak which felt a little weird Like the first time I played the base game I definitely used cover all the time and snuck around and everything. This time in P5R I just ran face first at everything and got them with the baton (or jumping on them before they fully triggered). And then once I got to a high enough level I didn't even need to fight anything other than the bosses because Ryuji's instant kill + being able to get double XP from mementos just completely broke the levelling curve. It sorta made the actual dungeons feel pretty boring. And aside from killing the reaper at around level 50 twice I didn't go out of my way to break the levelling curve. I only went to mementos like.. maybe 6 times over the course of the game? Probably less. I'd definitely have preferred at that point shorter simpler dungeons that I can just blast through without thinking about. Though overall I liked the specific dungeons better than the random ones frytechnician posted:That post about P4 and millennial activities just made me feel a billion years old, goddamn.  everytime I see something like that I'm forced to remember just how old those games are. I played P4 the first time after I had graduated university, so old..
Weird Pumpkin fucked around with this message at 15:19 on Jan 24, 2023 |
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Jan 24, 2023 15:14
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My main issue w/ the design of P4 and P5 in general is that the three portions of the game (story, social links, and dungeons) are optimally played bunched up. I get totally sick of weeks long story sections, then get totally sick of dungeons (cause they're best done all in one day), then get totally sick of the confidant grind. I really liked the thing that happened in P5 where you had to do something in the real world to unblock a dungeon, I think breaking up the dungeons like that was one of the biggest improvements the game made over P4.
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Jan 24, 2023 15:21
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No Wave posted:My main issue w/ the design of P4 and P5 in general is that the three portions of the game (story, social links, and dungeons) are optimally played bunched up. I get totally sick of weeks long story sections, then get totally sick of dungeons (cause they're best done all in one day), then get totally sick of the confidant grind. I really liked the thing that happened in P5 where you had to do something in the real world to unblock a dungeon, I think breaking up the dungeons like that was one of the biggest improvements the game made over P4. I'm a huge advocate for P6 returning to dungeon diving taking multiple days and getting it's own time slot for exactly that reason. I think upthread a few people mentioned they really hated it, but I'd actually really like to return to the P3FES system where people get tired and have to drop out of the dungeon, and if you go too long you get tired and sick and lose time slots. Optimally, I'd pair it with the ability to do side activities like training/working out as a team to increase the time you can be in the dungeon or something, similar to how they had those optional activities in P5. Basically, make it so trying to single dive dungeons has consequences, and stop penalizing the player for not doing it in a single day. But provide the option to work towards doing that if you really want to via the social/life-sim activities. But honestly if they made one change, just making the dungeon portion have its own time slot so you can do both social/life-sim stuff and progress the dungeon in the same day would fix the issue. I'd definitely do multiple dives to pace it better if it didn't feel so punishing.
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Jan 24, 2023 15:28
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It's more that the summer vacation periods in these games always feel like an absolute slog, and 5's takes the cake. - Knock out Pyramid palace - Three weeks of social sim while the target is in a coma - Long plot section leading up to the beach - Plot section where everybody goes on a pointless trip to Hawaii - Introduce Space palace but don't actually explore it because Morgana is throwing a shitfit - Plot section where you recruit Haru and reconcile with Morgana - Something about Makoto downloading data from her sister's laptop in there somewhere as well There's too much stuff going on dragged out over too long an on-rails time period with too many plot contrivances and everybody is being gullible and/or an rear end in a top hat as well. It's a major low point. All of this stuff could have been trimmed down and spread out more evenly instead of cramming it into the whole of August.
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Jan 24, 2023 15:42
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I'm in the middle of the royal content and the section where you have to walk through station square eight times to have a bland conversation with one confidant per day was the low for me. And it's after you had a bland conversation with each confidant one by one in the velvet room prison cells section! My moonlight carrots have been sitting on the rooftop for three weeks at this point! I did like the nice version of Haru's dad at least. No Wave fucked around with this message at 15:55 on Jan 24, 2023 |
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Jan 24, 2023 15:48
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Prowler posted:I'm playing on normal, and the difficulty has been fine, aside from two really HP spongey bosses (the first one, and the Big Bad Bear--the latter of which was a 20 minute slog). I have this really strong feeling that I'm performing even worse on the social-link stuff in this game because there's less FOMO since the rewards/progression is less obvious for anyone other than team members. If there's any specific things I should watch out for--or people to max-- please let me know. There are a couple deadlines. Make sure Justice and Hierophant are done by the end of October. I forget the exact date, but it's around there. It sounds like you're not having an issue with this, but I think you need your party (except Star, which levels on its own) all done by the end of November if you're going to max out. Hermit takes a while in terms of days because it's all about sidequests but opens up some Really Good poo poo once you get into it so it's worth jumping through those hoops. Your social stats are mostly relevant for unlocking other links and activities. Proficiency is particularly tedious to raise and important to have high for...something I forget. Take this post with a grain of salt as I've only played base P4, but I don't think Golden significantly changes anything here.
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Jan 24, 2023 16:24
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fatsleepycat posted:It sounds like you're not having an issue with this, but I think you need your party (except Star, which levels on its own) all done by the end of November if you're going to max out. I messed this up on my playthrough and still had to finish Fox in third semester, the game did let me complete the social link and get the final thing, but it was close so definitely better to just do it early!
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Jan 24, 2023 16:28
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Man. I am struggling with P3P a lot. The fact of not being to walk around anywhere but Tartar Sauce just makes most nights with no confidant related event go: click map -> move to thing -> click thing -> social stat go ding! Makes it hard to play for longer sessions. After 30 mins of that "gameplay" "loop" I'm bored outta my gourd. That being said, I like most of the social links so far. Really like both Yuko and Chihiro. I'm around 4 with both, iirc. The teacher obsessed dude never gives me a way to convey as much "yeeeeah good luck with that dude" as I feel. Also: I am using a spoiler free guide, but like...how am I supposed to have all these Personas on hand for early social links? After finally reaching lvl 21 in Tartarus, I finally had ONE Persona show up that wasn't Pixie/Apsaras. Otherwise, I'm up to my eye teeth in Pixies. I fused where I could, but with no compendium unlocked at the time, that wasn't really a solution, as I couldn't fuse anything I didn't want to lose. Also: same guide also wants me to play arcade games most nights, but where's all this money coming from? And yes - I did clear all the floors of Tartarus every time I went, and even did a bit of grinding specifically for money but I still run out. Then again, the guide is just flat-out WRONG in places*, so maybe it just sucks. If anyone knows of a GOOD spoiler-free walkthrough, I'm all ears. * mostly for stuff like "go visit the School Nurse", except I'm not sick/tired., and I'm a level behind on Chihiro because the guide wanted me to start it on a day she was definitely not anywhere to be found, so v  v
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Jan 24, 2023 17:19
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HaB posted:Also: same guide also wants me to play arcade games most nights, but where's all this money coming from? And yes - I did clear all the floors of Tartarus every time I went, and even did a bit of grinding specifically for money but I still run out. The answers to these to are related, you are supposed to grind a lot when you are doing Tartatus runs, both so you get money and so you get tired, then the guide expects you to save scum the day transition so you keep being tired/sick, because that's what lets you get a courage bonus from the nurse. The gameFAQs guide for FeMC explicitly brings this up, but I'm not sure if it's actually strictly necessary.
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Jan 24, 2023 17:31
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iirc the 100% max confidant run for P3FES was actually extremely tight on days, like you legit only had one day that you could do something else otherwise you couldn't complete it? I'm not sure if that's still true however in the P3P version of the game.
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Jan 24, 2023 17:37
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Encouraging doing the dungeons in several parts would be better but multiplying gates that must be opened through a real world action could really well feel gimmicky if they do it too much. Making it so that progressing through the dungeon consumes a particular resource (either time or energy) would allow for more flexibility in how you schedule activities. Also please none of that P3 mechanic where you're encouraged to visit the bathroom every day for a small chance at a "Great" status, complete with unskippable animation that's like 10 seconds long.
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Jan 24, 2023 20:19
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Weird Pumpkin posted:iirc the 100% max confidant run for P3FES was actually extremely tight on days, like you legit only had one day that you could do something else otherwise you couldn't complete it? the original P3 was like that, I think FES loosened it up a little
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Jan 24, 2023 20:23
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Fishing for great status was always a waste of time. You could guarantee it by not studying at night and even then, 90% of battles were an alpha strike in the surprise round or whatever.
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Jan 24, 2023 20:27
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The best use of time at school was going to the weird professor's hours long classes on tarot or kabbalah or whatever.
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Jan 24, 2023 20:33
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cheesetriangles posted:Does anyone have else prefer the random dungeons of 3 and 4 over 5? I like being able to turn off my brain and just wack thing and having to solve puzzles and pay attention kind of takes me out of that though 4 had a bit of that. Not really but they could've removed the puzzle parts in P5R and I'd been happy since even looking for a guide each time I felt oh no not again often. I just want to dream about being free from puzzles one day. Also, my main team was Skull, Fox, and Mona who was a great healer since I completely forgot to add healing skills to mine so I felt pretty terrible each time he vanished because of reasons. Also, I'm like I know why Crow can't join us much earlier because of the story but maybe in the far future, there could be a mod letting everyone join at a better time. One day. https://twitter.com/bwannoli/status/1588542835929665536 Alder fucked around with this message at 21:21 on Jan 24, 2023 |
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Jan 24, 2023 21:11
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My endgame P5R team had no true healer because that's what all those Bead Chains I bought were for. And also because I was so done with the game by the end and just wanted to watch the story so I just Izanagi-no-Okami'd the last last last boss.
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Jan 25, 2023 01:32
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Sapozhnik posted:P5 Harem Team is OP. Why are all the non-Joker dudes just not that useful in battle? First you're missing Crow. Who actually has the single most useful buff/debuff skill outside Third Awakenings. (Debilitate). Second you're seriously overrating Haru. Gun skills scale with spells, not with physical attacks and she needs boost and amp to keep up. Her gun skills are therefore not a match for either Ryuji or Yuske's physical skills unless she crits and you can't crit bosses. Haru is not good in boss fights other than her own. She also has the worst gun which actually matters in Royal. Her strength is in farming; Psy combos well with the Chaines Hook and in the very late game with non-sleep debilitates, but she's basically a walking psi-ring. (Amarita Shower is rarely enough used that consumables more than cover it). Tentarafoo is an AoE and therefore unreliable while Heat Riser should be good - but there's not much gap between you getting it and Joker being able to fuse Attis (and then probably fuse Attis into something) for the Thermopylae/Vitality of the Tree combo to give everyone triple-buffs off a single action. Haru's main place outside her dungeon is as part of the farm team (and honestly anyone can hang there) in the late game. You're also underestimating Ryuji for some of the same reasons. And Charge is king. 2.5 times damage multiplier for low SP and a single action. There are ways to get Charge onto a non-Ryuji party member - but then Yuske takes the lead. And the best controlled condition is dead. Also in a vacuum Electric is the best damage type because everyone has guns to technical off it while leaving the enemy debilitated and it's completely debilitating. And the guys normally IME (and especially in the late game) have better armour in Royal. That said you're right that Ann's the highest damage spellcaster, and Makoto's a great swiss army knife who makes Morgana pretty redundant (matching the plot).
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Jan 25, 2023 03:07
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Ryuji and Yusuke are extremely good, but so is Haru
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Jan 25, 2023 03:48
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Weird Pumpkin posted:
Same here, I played it very soon after graduating college in 2008. It's nostalgic in a way that is actually kind of uncomfortable, because it reminds me of much better time in my life.
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Jan 25, 2023 04:05
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Fortunately there's no real stinkers mechanically in the Persona casts and you can make a team with any combination of goobers you want. I used Yusuke a lot in vanilla because I was Baton Passing all the time to conserve Joker's SP and his skills getting boosts from Baton Passes meant that even when he wasn't strong against the enemy he could end the chain with a big attack and probably delete someone.
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Jan 25, 2023 04:34
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So I started over using a different guide that actually says things like: "make sure you have 50,000 yen before you leave Tartarus" and since y'all explained I'm supposed to grind until I'm tired, things are making more sense. Been just having to fuse personas I need for upcoming stuff, then going back until I find another Pixie/Apsaras to start a chain with. RNGesus seems to hate me in this game. But that being said - what influences tiredness? I ground for about 2.5 hours last night and everyone is still showing as Good. I still have a ways to go as I'm around 37,000 yen, but yeah - how long before we all get tired? or I do?
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Jan 25, 2023 15:38
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if its p3p, you dont get tired until you get out of tart house
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Jan 25, 2023 15:42
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In P3P your party will only get tired once they actually leave Tartarus. This is a change from FES where they would get tired after fighting a number of battles (which increased with level) and when you went back to the lobby they would straight up go home if they were tired. In exchange though going to the lobby was a free full heal.
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Jan 25, 2023 15:43
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Ok so I'm playing FES for the first time in like 13 years and boy did I forget how bullshit most of the tower sub bosses are. Take the floor 57 one, Intrepid Knight: -Drains Wind and casts Wind spells so Junpei is out and Yukari is demoted to healbot. No weaknesses either. -Casts Mind Charge in combination with Magarula which does stupid amounts of damage at this level--around 20. Or, he can cast it with Garudyne(!) all but guaranteed to kill its target unless it's Yukari or the MC with Wind res. -Will sometimes cast Hama, draining your revive items or giving you a game over, depending. No joke, it opened with this in my first try and took out the MC. -In case you got too complacent it will cast Kill Wave, killing multiple people. -Mitsuru will waste exorbitant amounts of time casting Marin Karin but it her credit it will actually land sometimes. -Spells miss WAY too much in this game, extending battle time. Even spells you cast out of items. And I know there are worse bosses to come!
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Jan 25, 2023 17:45
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