|
see i never really had that but i also just kind of picked out the characters i wanted to use based on who i liked and didnt really take characters out unless i liked a new character more. i got basically everyones support ranks up with everyone else i was using who they supported with
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:18
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 00:04 |
|
|
Endorph posted:i mean, is the cast too many people? It's a normal size for a fire emblem game. Heck, it's a lot less characters than FE6. Again, I think people just aren't used to what Fire Emblem games are like after 4 years of 3H and Fates and Echoes having their own foibles. Really, in a lot of ways it's the first FE game to be like the FE6-FE9 era since, well, FE9. In FE6 80% of the cast got benched the chapter they joined, I felt like that was normal for those games though.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:23
|
|
|
Jesus Louis is a monster, even without the Mounted Emblem ring it still seems like there’d still be lots of situations where you could just throw him at guys with a lance and just watch everything lose massive chunks of health. They really should have at least not massively downplayed the former effects of the weapon triangle, at least to unbroken foes. Also Sommie is my new favorite Pokémon. And I think these people are all weirdos but I’m probably gonna support grind a lot after I beat the game to see all their weirdo conversations.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:34
|
|
|
i moused over the personal skill of the boss of chapter 11 and laughed
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:38
|
|
|
This game is a lot better about superfluous characters than say FE10 so I'm good with it
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:41
|
|
|
Three Houses also had every character chime in on the plot once a month as you walked around the monastary. Some of it helped flesh them out, but more importantly it kept everyone visible. Engage has a bit of that with the post-chapter walk abouts, but it's random who shows up and half of them don't even get their line because their line about Alear getting a level/them doing well in the battle/complaining that you're not using them takes precedence. I never know what Yunaka thinks of the plot developments because she always has to tell me how zappy she was in the fight. 
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:44
|
|
|
Endorph posted:see i never really had that but i also just kind of picked out the characters i wanted to use based on who i liked and didnt really take characters out unless i liked a new character more. i got basically everyones support ranks up with everyone else i was using who they supported with I do the same thing but still replace people semi regularly.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:45
|
|
|
I think character paralogues might have been nice to have. I get why the paralogues focus on the emblems this time around, but I did like the 3H thing where sometimes a pair of characters would share a paralogue, and not always a pair you'd expect (Mercedes and Caspar, for example). I imagine the characters would be better received if they'd done like 12 paired character paralogues instead of 12 emblem paralogues, but again I understand the emblems are kinda the focus this time around so I see why they did it how they did.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:49
|
|
|
FrickenMoron posted:In FE6 80% of the cast got benched the chapter they joined, I felt like that was normal for those games though. That's normal for basically every FE game except 3H. You're given an absolute shitload of characters to let you pick and choose the ones you like and also so you have sufficient backup choices in case people die or in case characters don't pan out. It's why they tend to give you two of every class and a prepromote of some sort. You're never intended to use everyone in a given FE game unless you do multiple playthroughs. 3H forces a lot more character usage because it has a normal FE cast size that's cut up and split to multiple routes, so you don't have remotely as much choice in who you're using unless you're going out of your way to pillage the other classes for recruits(at which point you're likely doing so to specifically bench people you don't like and that goes back to the "benching much of the cast" thing). It's pretty much impossible to write such a huge ensemble cast in a way where they all feel consistently integrated into the plot beyond the basic "I am a soldier and I exist in this army" unifying point. Even 3H - which had a much tighter and focused group of "canon" characters for each route - tended to focus on the actions and dialogue of a couple of main characters and had a bunch of obvious secondary characters like, say, Raphael and Ignatz, who just kind of exist to periodically nod and go "yes, I am here too and am definitely an important part of this discussion".
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:53
|
|
|
they could have had a couple characters pop up in the emblem paralogues but i also get they mostly wanted the emblem paralogues to be cute references to previous games rather than doing a lot of heavy lifting writing wise in general this game definitely feels meant to be a cute little game to celebrate the series anniversary. also, interesting note related to that, the internal files refer to the game as 'iron19,' the internal name for all the fe games is iron___. They count the satellaview fire emblem game (BS fire emblem), so what we'd know as FE7 is iron8, etc. The internal name for three houses was iron17. Three Hopes's internal files do not refer to it as iron18. So in other words, there's a game that started development after Three Houses but before Engage.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:55
|
|
|
Since I ate a big plate of crow about not believing the original Engage leaks as being real, I'm going to instead pendulum the opposite way and believe the persistent rumors that they've been working on the FE4 remake.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 14:59
|
|
|
Kanos posted:That's normal for basically every FE game except 3H. You're given an absolute shitload of characters to let you pick and choose the ones you like and also so you have sufficient backup choices in case people die or in case characters don't pan out. It's why they tend to give you two of every class and a prepromote of some sort. You're never intended to use everyone in a given FE game unless you do multiple playthroughs.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:01
|
|
|
More paralogues would be nice, but yeah for this game specifically it's all in on the Throwback Train
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:03
|
|
|
I didn't know that you get an upgraded attack if you do Edelgards engage next to Byleth. Any other combos like that?
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:04
|
|
|
The way recruiting seems to work in this, it seems pretty viable to do an iron man run this time around. I really, really wouldn't want to do that in Three Houses--you do all your recruiting in the first half and just about every unit is a trainee who needs a lot of investment over a long term--but here, hell I'm in chapter 15 and I already have like three times as many characters as I can field, and all but like two of them joined with perfectly capable levels and stats, if not better than the units I was already using.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:05
|
|
|
Also the first supports you get in this game are a deluge of Tea + Training whereas the later joining characters have a bit more meat to them.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:05
|
|
|
FrickenMoron posted:I didn't know that you get an upgraded attack if you do Edelgards engage next to Byleth. Any other combos like that?
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:06
|
|
|
Terper posted:Also the first supports you get in this game are a deluge of Tea + Training whereas the later joining characters have a bit more meat to them. This is true, I had little interest in Zelkov but then I saw his first support with Citrinne and I immediately had to know more about this guy.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:06
|
|
|
Endorph posted:they could have had a couple characters pop up in the emblem paralogues but i also get they mostly wanted the emblem paralogues to be cute references to previous games rather than doing a lot of heavy lifting writing wise Man iron18 must be a mess right now, given Engage seems to have been finished for a while going by the initial leaks but it started after 18.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:07
|
|
|
If it's the FE4 remake I wonder how much internal debate there was about trying to fix/balance the gameplay jank vs preserving it as is.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:08
|
|
|
GiantRockFromSpace posted:Man iron18 must be a mess right now, given Engage seems to have been finished for a while going by the initial leaks but it started after 18. It'd also explain Sigurd being the only Emblem besides Marth who really gets any sort of main story focus. It's not much but the idea of him being Lumera's friend/guardian is more than, say, Ike, gets.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:10
|
|
|
FE9 also had a lot of reactivity in the first act, where the non-main mercenaries got to chime in on things, and you'd get alternate scenes if they had died by then. The game can have a much grimmer tone if you ironman it. That kind of goes away once you get to the main plot, but there's at least base conversations to keep them around. This is also reflected in a few support conversations, like one where Makalov talks about his sister being mad at him getting replaced by him wanting to get flowers for her grave. I get why that's not a priority, and most players never get to see it, but it does make a lot of the cast disappear if they're benched. Dunno what the fix is, but Engage could definitely do with having more story-related chimes in on Somniel and letting you actually get the exploration phase dialogue after they've given you their bond crystals for the day.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:12
|
|
|
Do you lose units in events marked as training?
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:13
|
|
|
Yeah, one of the really weird choices is for battle performance to replace the cast's comments on the situation/location in postbattle. Just make them rotate between the lines or something.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:14
|
|
|
Spermando posted:Do you lose units in events marked as training? No. But every surviving unit gets bonus EXP at the end of it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:14
|
|
|
It might've also helped if the "secondary" royals were more present in the story after their introductory arcs, too. For example, we get plenty of Alfred and Diamant screen time, but Celine and Alcryst just kinda disappear once you leave their home countries. Not sure if the same is true for Fogado or Hortensia yet but I'm guessing it will be. That has the effect of making the main cast even smaller.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:15
|
|
|
Harrow posted:It might've also helped if the "secondary" royals were more present in the story after their introductory arcs, too. For example, we get plenty of Alfred and Diamant screen time, but Celine and Alcryst just kinda disappear once you leave their home countries. Not sure if the same is true for Fogado or Hortensia yet but I'm guessing it will be. That has the effect of making the main cast even smaller.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:17
|
|
|
FE3H did the solution of making every single character have a mini support every chapter in the monostary, in the same way Xenoblade 3 removed heart2hearts by just making them mandatory cutscenes instead. You can nitty gritty all you want about the quality or relevance what-have-you, but the ease and accessibility of peering into a character's evolving thoughts throughout the story was a huge and noticable approach. That was also what made Shadows of Valentia stick out a lot despite the fewest lines in a modern game, because you had the same concept on a smaller scale. Yeah, Fae had like literally 2 supports but I also never questioned or wondered what was Fae's deal because I also heard her anxiety and worry as the war marched on in between battles without grinding supports.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:17
|
|
|
For the record, as much as I gripe about things in here, I should note that this is probably the most fun I've had on a first playthrough of a Fire Emblem game, so as much as I criticize a few things I really am having a blast with this game. I'm even kind of enjoying the main story, as long as I don't pay too much attention to things like logistics in between scenes. And I like most of the supports I've seen, too.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:20
|
|
|
to be fair part of the issue there is that 3H was an evolving situation while in Engage's plot even if characters did react to the plot they wouldnt really have much to say but 'boy i hope we get the bad guys' outside of the chapter 10-11 situation, and maybe one or two other instances. in 3H's case they could react to things like having to fight other students, what edelgard might want/why they're siding with edelgard even after everything's going down, etc, but in Engage's case it's pretty clear what the bad guy wants (the rings, to do evil with) and why they're with you (because the bad guy is evil). So even if Engage had that stuff, I don't know if it'd really add much depth. Most of the cases where a character could have something interesting to say, they actually do. There is some locational dialog and a surprising amount of it, like if you talk to Celine throughout the solm arc she gets increasingly fed up with the heat, but it's not exactly deep, more just amusing.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:21
|
|
|
Endorph posted:It'd also explain Sigurd being the only Emblem besides Marth who really gets any sort of main story focus. It's not much but the idea of him being Lumera's friend/guardian is more than, say, Ike, gets. Speaking of this, I think one of the major missteps is the decision to have the Emblems be sleeping/sealed in the rings until a dragon comes along to talk at them instead of having them be active all the time and just like, Advice-giving Force Ghosts that have an influence on their respective countries and maybe something of a basic rapport with the royals like how Sigurd and Lumera seem to be familiar. Stuff like Morion/Diamant being super gung ho brave fighters in part because they grew up talking with and getting advice from Roy, etc. I know some people might groan and say "i don't want the throwback characters to be major plot influences", and I definitely get it, but we kind of have this weird halfway point where the emblems are incredibly important mcguffins that the entire plot revolves around but the fully sapient and important spirits within them basically don't exist in the plot or meaningfully weigh in ever. As far as literally everyone in the story except Lumera, Alear, and Sombron are concerned, prior to the events of Engage the rings are just fancy heirloom jewelry that some dragon told them to protect a millenium ago.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:23
|
|
|
Kanos posted:Speaking of this, I think one of the major missteps is the decision to have the Emblems be sleeping/sealed in the rings until a dragon comes along to talk at them instead of having them be active all the time and just like, Advice-giving Force Ghosts that have an influence on their respective countries and maybe something of a basic rapport with the royals like how Sigurd and Lumera seem to be familiar. I get not wanting to have the rings be super, super important but I think even 'this country was formed by people who had a strong bond with this emblem' would work. the status of emblems as like, religious figures or just some dudes who existed once is also left a bit vague.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:27
|
|
|
of course the dlc also muddles things because while you probably shouldnt think about the plot implications of DLC much, were edelgard/dimitri/claude just sealed in a ring for five billion years for no reason or were they actually in the evil dragon war
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:29
|
|
|
i just got to meet fogado and wow this game really is Awakening 2: This Time It's Good same basic character conceit, but with a couple of tiny tweaks and now it works. Chrom is the Crown Prince and is supposed to be responsible, yet he's off galivanting around with his increasingly frustrated retainer. He's not even mobilized to deal with the threat of the Risen, he learns about them the same time you do. Robin gets brought to meet the queen because, uh. plot. Fogado is just a Prince, and second sons are generally given carte blanch to just do whatever the gently caress, even before Solm's more free-spirited nature is taken into account. He's out protecting the border because there be monsters about and, as shown by Alear & the rest of the cast, it's really easy for people to get lost in the wastelands and die. Alear is brought to meet the queen because she introduces herself to everyone with "hello, I'm dragon jesus : )", and is therefore Important. Which makes it funny when the guy you assume to be the Captain of the Guard strolls up to the palace and goes "heeeeey guys, I'm hoome~!" Just tiny tweaks and suddenly it's fun and good!!
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:30
|
|
|
Yeah I do wonder if the bracelets existing is supposed to be "canon" or not. Also on the topic of characters from other worlds, I did enjoy the bond conversation I saw between Anna and Lucina where Lucina was like, "Anna? You came to this world, too?"
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:30
|
|
|
Tae posted:FE3H did the solution of making every single character have a mini support every chapter in the monostary, in the same way Xenoblade 3 removed heart2hearts by just making them mandatory cutscenes instead. You can nitty gritty all you want about the quality or relevance what-have-you, but the ease and accessibility of peering into a character's evolving thoughts throughout the story was a huge and noticable approach. I actually think this is why I feel like 3H has more characterization than Engage. After every chapter while wandering the monastery you could talk to everyone in your army to get their thoughts on the current situation (or just hear hanneman complain about manuela or something), while in this one if you wander around and talk to people you'll get something that could be used anywhere like "Whoa, I leveled up, how cool!" For a lot of this game we're traveling the world and checking out different places, it would be rad if we could get some characterization on like... the last time Boucheron visited Brodia. Or what kind of foods Chloe is hoping to find in Elusia. Or what kind of products Anna is selling in Solm. There's a lot of stuff that characters could comment on beyond the main story that could add that touch to this game. Harrow posted:Yeah I do wonder if the bracelets existing is supposed to be "canon" or not. I got something similar with Anna & Tiki
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:32
|
|
|
I wonder if the intention is that Elyos is like the Fire Emblem version of Sigil, the city in the D&D Planescape setting that is basically the gateway between all of the other planes. Elyos is this weird land that sits in an intersection between all of the other Fire Emblem worlds. And hell, if I'm going into weird speculation poo poo, maybe the Awakening kids even passed through briefly on their way to Fates or something.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:35
|
|
|
Harrow posted:Yeah I do wonder if the bracelets existing is supposed to be "canon" or not. and also hosed up that ephraim doesn't get any bond conversations but claude/dimitri do. Arrrthritis posted:For a lot of this game we're traveling the world and checking out different places, it would be rad if we could get some characterization on like... the last time Boucheron visited Brodia. Or what kind of foods Chloe is hoping to find in Elusia. Or what kind of products Anna is selling in Solm. There's a lot of stuff that characters could comment on beyond the main story that could add that touch to this game.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:35
|
|
|
On the topic of sheer accessibility that made FE3H more noticable to the normies, why the gently caress does supports not gain during enemy phase? I have Alcryst/lapis/citrine since they joined up to chapter 15 and like 1 one of them have a B support.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:43
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 00:04 |
|
|
Terper posted:Well Alear is "always" the best choice because Dragon is the strongest type. The question is if Corrin is good enough for Alear! But Byleth being on Alear means Tiki, the superior manakete, is not on Alear! Tiki is pretty much permanently stapled to mine.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2023 15:45
|
|
