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Khizan posted:Thanks for running this, it’s always a ton of fun. I'll be passing the title to you tonight
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Jan 23, 2023 18:59
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| # ? May 25, 2024 23:37 |
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Thank you for organizing as always Kenning! Great basho to watch  No biggie since I was a (VERY) late entrant but it doesn't look like I got a fantasy score this basho?
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Jan 23, 2023 19:52
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MalarkeyToboggan posted:If he has a Yusho or Jun Yusho in March then they have no excuse anymore. If a JY isn't enough, he's gotta be coming close to the Kisenosato perma-yoko run where a JY or even a 10-11 non-JY doesn't break it.
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Jan 23, 2023 20:18
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Kenning posted:Congrats also to tiny bug child, who got the jun-yusho by choosing Endo instead of Onosho and trailing by one point. Hell yeah, the Endo Gambit paid off. Thanks for running the show Kenning, and grats to Khizan for taking the cup. I'm disappointed we won't (yet) get to see what a Takakeisho yokozuna dohyo-iri looks like, but I don't think denying him the rope is a robbery. Back-to-back 12-3s aren't quite the level of dominance you want to see for a yokozuna promotion, especially given his so-so record versus the rest of the sanyaku. I think he's also getting a boost from the absence of Terunofuji and Asanoyama, and they'll both be back in the mix soon. If he keeps this level of performance up for another basho then sure, definitely give it to him, but right now I'd be worried his yokozuna career would be a short one given the number of 8-7s and withdrawals in his recent history. Though I was very impressed with all the throws he managed to pull off this basho! It does seem like he's trying to be less one-note in his technique.
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Jan 23, 2023 20:22
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thanks to kenning and to my fellow fantasizers for another exciting tournament. looking forward to the banzuke and to march!
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Jan 24, 2023 00:15
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I hope keisho's neck resolves itself in time for march. I understand the decision to not promote him. I also hate that decision. Mostly though, I'm worried that the nature of injuries in this sport won't give him another opportunity to make an unambiguous claim for the rope.
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Jan 24, 2023 00:48
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Marching Powder posted:I hope keisho's neck resolves itself in time for march. I understand the decision to not promote him. I also hate that decision. Mostly though, I'm worried that the nature of injuries in this sport won't give him another opportunity to make an unambiguous claim for the rope. You have perfectly summarised exactly how I feel about it. If he's even got an old coach saying "he probably should have gone kyujo he's just too tough" then it sounds like something that he really should be going kyujo for March
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Jan 24, 2023 02:30
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I could have contested the yusho if I traded Oho, but my dignity as a former yokogoona would not allow it.
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Jan 24, 2023 03:03
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Vargatron posted:I could have contested the yusho if I traded Oho, but my dignity as a former yokogoona would not allow it. I kept Oho definitely for honor and definitely not because it makes tracking my score myself more confusing than i can deal with.
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Jan 24, 2023 03:06
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Boogalo posted:I kept Oho definitely for honor and definitely not because it makes tracking my score myself more confusing than i can deal with. I keep a pretty simple spreadsheet that I'm willing to share if anyone was curious on formatting.
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Jan 24, 2023 03:53
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I'm not really surprised Takakeisho didn't get the rope here. He's put together 24 wins over two bashos as the only competitive ozeki, and if he had been a yokozuna over those two bashos he'd have given up three kinboshi. It's not the kind of dominant performance that screams yokozuna, to me. Sure, 24 wins is yokozuna promotion if that's two 12-win yushos, but it wasn't so it isn't. And the truth is that he doesn't have the a solid record of performance that would encourage them to give him the bump anyways. He's held ozeki for a long while, but it's been a rough while. He's frequently kadoban because of injuries, and often comes back just to scrape out an 8-7 to keep the rank. And despite breaking out a few throws this time around, he's still very much a one-note rikishi with a history of gassing out if his opponent can take that first charge. IMO there's even odds that if they gave him the rope he'd go out with an injury and come back with another pair of 8-7s, and if that happens then it would look like they overpromoted an underperforming rikishi so so that they could say they have another Japanese yokozuna.
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Jan 24, 2023 04:01
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whats for dinner posted:You have perfectly summarised exactly how I feel about it. If he's even got an old coach saying "he probably should have gone kyujo he's just too tough" then it sounds like something that he really should be going kyujo for March I don't like the fact that sumo treats injury exactly like poor performance as far as demotions go. I think it sets people up to risk worsening an existing or half healed injury and shortens careers... and that can't be good for the sport.
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Jan 24, 2023 04:30
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Fearless posted:I don't like the fact that sumo treats injury exactly like poor performance as far as demotions go. I think it sets people up to risk worsening an existing or half healed injury and shortens careers... and that can't be good for the sport. Seriously. If keisho had the privelidge of being able to go kyujo without losing rank and only ever fought at full strength, he'd be doing yokozuna sumo. Cest la vie.
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Jan 24, 2023 04:38
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Fearless posted:I don't like the fact that sumo treats injury exactly like poor performance as far as demotions go. I think it sets people up to risk worsening an existing or half healed injury and shortens careers... and that can't be good for the sport. Marching Powder posted:Seriously. If keisho had the privelidge of being able to go kyujo without losing rank and only ever fought at full strength, he'd be doing yokozuna sumo. Cest la vie. I think a lot about that rule they had for a while where a wrestler could sit out a tournament due to injury and provided they have a medical certificate their rank would be protected (kosho seido) and how they got rid of it in 2003 because people were "taking advantage of it." How much better would poo poo be if they just realised that the sport is at the point where people are getting injured fairly regularly because the athletes are all optimising to do one thing and one thing only? Takakeisho would be able to take time off to properly recover, Tochinoshin probably would've been able to properly rehab his knee, who knows what else.
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Jan 24, 2023 04:50
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whats for dinner posted:I think a lot about that rule they had for a while where a wrestler could sit out a tournament due to injury and provided they have a medical certificate their rank would be protected (kosho seido) and how they got rid of it in 2003 because people were "taking advantage of it." How much better would poo poo be if they just realised that the sport is at the point where people are getting injured fairly regularly because the athletes are all optimising to do one thing and one thing only? Takakeisho would be able to take time off to properly recover, Tochinoshin probably would've been able to properly rehab his knee, who knows what else. Technically Takakeisho is the only one that has that follows those rules. The protection was only for the tournament you got hurt in and the one after so like Takayasu could come sit out in March and come back in May and stay Sekiwake but longer than that and he'd fall. Takakeisho can still do that, albeit kadoban, but I think Takakeisho is confident enough that he doesn't give a poo poo about kadoban if he's healthy. And even if you promised Takakeisho that he could take as much time as he needed after he hurt himself this tourney, there's no way he would have stepped down because he was fighting for the rope and who knows when/if he'll get this close again. Would probably have helped Hoshoryu to know he didn't have to try and eke those 2 wins out to protect his rank though. And the main problem with rank protection is that it screws over lower ranked guys in Juryo and Makushita. A guy sitting out and hogging a spot in Makuuchi means a dude in Juryo doesn't get a jump up.
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Jan 24, 2023 05:44
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pseudodragon posted:And the main problem with rank protection is that it screws over lower ranked guys in Juryo and Makushita. A guy sitting out and hogging a spot in Makuuchi means a dude in Juryo doesn't get a jump up. Yeah imagine the logjam if guys like Kagayaki, Sadanoumi, Nishikigi and Takarafuji were sitting out every other tournament, not to mention the older past-their-prime rikishi like Myogiryu, Aoiyama, etc.
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Jan 24, 2023 07:07
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There should still be a middle ground somehow, so a wrestler can get the recovery they need without dropping way down the rankings. Maybe limiting the number of times a year they can sit out without loss of rank, and then have a slightly less punishing rank drop if they go over that. Just kinda spitballing.
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Jan 24, 2023 07:58
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Natto down, Jason next?
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Jan 24, 2023 13:45
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"People outside of Japan like our sport? Can't have that!!"
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Jan 24, 2023 18:07
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Natto claimed on his Ko-Fi supporters page that his latest takedown wasn't even a legit NHK copyright strike, it was someone with a grudge against them, trying to get him deplatformed on Youtube.
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Jan 24, 2023 18:18
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Goodguy3 posted:"People outside of Japan like our sport? Can't have that!!"
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Jan 24, 2023 18:36
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Bentai posted:Natto claimed on his Ko-Fi supporters page that his latest takedown wasn't even a legit NHK copyright strike, it was someone with a grudge against them, trying to get him deplatformed on Youtube. Pewds trying to eliminate the competition.
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Jan 24, 2023 18:58
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I know this forum is a small and very specific sample size but I can't help but think sumo could be an international sport and do very well in demographics that usual fight sports completely miss. But that would involve decision making and risk taking that would make old Japanese men very angry.
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Jan 25, 2023 00:03
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I think it would hinge much more on viral exposure or eq. Support from big western brodcast interests for whats already available would do magic - and without that I'd doubt it ever get the exposure needed to get mainstream, revisions by the council or no. The sport is fantastic already and the main thing missing for the rest of the world to get on feels like awareness?
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Jan 25, 2023 00:56
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to be fair a lot of this isn't directly the old sumo guys' obstinancy but just the poo poo that comes with intl broadcast rights for so many things . like i've heard it claimed that the company that keeps striking down the english stream that kinta uses is a british company that has the rights to a feed for that particular market which no other english speaker has access to. they seem happy to leave kinta alone at least
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Jan 25, 2023 01:00
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I think Sumo Prime Time is an acknowledgement that there is an English speaking audience out there, but taken in a vacuum it is quite weird. Imagine if it was your ONLY exposure. You'd see a handful of matches per basho. I know NHK does English highlights, but if you don't have full access to NHK or Abema is there any way to see all of the bouts?
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Jan 25, 2023 04:27
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Nativity In Black posted:I think Sumo Prime Time is an acknowledgement that there is an English speaking audience out there, but taken in a vacuum it is quite weird. Imagine if it was your ONLY exposure. You'd see a handful of matches per basho. I know NHK does English highlights, but if you don't have full access to NHK or Abema is there any way to see all of the bouts? Nope.
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Jan 25, 2023 04:33
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https://tachiai.org/2023/01/25/new-juryo-for-haru-3/ Juryo promotions are out: The People's Yokozuna, Tokushoryu Tomokaze Tamashoho The newest Miyagino-oyakata/Hakuho recruit who bodied the Makushita division at Ms15 with a 7-0 yusho, Ochiai No word about demotions, but it'll likely be: J13w Kaisho J11e Chiyosakae J10w Terutsuyoshi Bentai fucked around with this message at 05:28 on Jan 25, 2023 |
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Jan 25, 2023 05:23
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No word from Jason yet, but it looks like his YT channel's been nuked.
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Jan 25, 2023 05:33
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that is whack as hell
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Jan 25, 2023 05:35
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when were you when jason dies i was sat at home drinking chanko nabe when hiro morita ring 'jason is kill' 'no'
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Jan 25, 2023 06:17
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I know someone was trying to quickly archive as much as they could at 480p. Really hope they got all of it.
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Jan 25, 2023 06:20
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Bentai posted:I know someone was trying to quickly archive as much as they could at 480p. Really hope they got all of it. they did not :c they said they got everything from 2016 to now
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Jan 25, 2023 06:23
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https://twitter.com/Sumo_Jason/status/1618111920032342017 We can’t have nice things.
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Jan 25, 2023 06:24
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If you've ever been to Japan one of the most fascinating things is that despite their obsession with technology their usage of the internet is stuck in the dark ages. Japanese websites are insanely unreadable and dense looking like angelfire sites, and their adaptation to information like this is is archaic. It took years for their pro wrestling scene to recover due to just how drat difficult they made it to see the drat things and its still very hard to see a lot of it. Sumo is even worse. Even if they made a Sumo stream for NHK English available for profit I promise it would involve some byzantine structure that would make signing up a labour requiring a FAQ guide.
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Jan 25, 2023 06:38
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https://twitter.com/HakuhoSho69/status/1618109929814126592?s=20
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Jan 25, 2023 06:52
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The talk about kyujo protection and such has got me thinking about the sumo ranking system in general, and really I'm not sure that the problem right now is weakness at the top of the banzuke. My logic here is that sumo ranks are set up to reward clearly dominant rikishi. You get sekiwake by stringing together consecutive KKs, and you lose it as soon as you MK. You get ozeki by reaching Sekiwake and then averaging 11 wins per basho over three consective bashos. Getting these ranks just doesn't require you to be good, it requires you to be clearly and definitively superior. The current failure of anybody to put up an ozeki run doesn't really mean "none of them are good", it means that none of them are enough of an outlier to consistently dominate the others. Looking at things now,, in the sanyaku we have Takakeisho, the Waka brothers, Hoshoryu, Kiribayama, and Kotonowaka, with the joi-jin also being filled out with Tobizaru, Daieisho, Abi, Ryuden, and Tamawashi. That's a lot of good rikishi. IMO the problem might not really be that nobody is good so much as that everybody is.
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Jan 25, 2023 07:47
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I disagree with this because when Terunofuji showed up he proceeded to faceroll the entire division except for Hakuho and Takakeisho. If it was everyone it wouldn't have the kaiju wreck shop except for the other two strongest rikishi. I think it's fair to say the current banzuke is quite weak sometimes there are no one special.
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Jan 25, 2023 08:00
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Bentai posted:https://twitter.com/Sumo_Jason/status/1618111920032342017 Wish this was unexpected. AFAIK, the sole English-language NHK licensee that carries the full tournament is in the UK, and has been going hyper aggro the last two basho against streams. They were harassing mbovo last time, kept showing up in his stream to spam telling people to go pay for their service if they want sumo, apparently unable to grasp that they're talking to a bunch of mostly US and Australia people who couldn't if they wanted to. Liquid Communism fucked around with this message at 08:22 on Jan 25, 2023 |
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Jan 25, 2023 08:02
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Who even is it? I'm in the UK and by chance get NHK World on Virgin Media, but as far as I know that's the one way I can watch? Wack as hell, Jason owns 
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Jan 25, 2023 11:15
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