Companies Circling The Drain: What about Chapter Elevenses?

The Something Awful Forums > Main > Post Your Favorite: Carefully Curated > Companies Circling The Drain: What about Chapter Elevenses?

«‹›629 »

djssniper: Jan 10, 2003

Coasterphreak posted:

Or, more importantly, having to take money out of the salary budget

Like, professional captioning in multiple languages for a 90 minute movie runs in the tens of thousands of dollars, which doesn�t seem like a lot until you realize that a lot of festival films are made on less than 2 mil.

Yep pretty much, professional translations, then video captioning for that amount of time, plus the multiple languages will cost a pretty penny, and not to mention the timescale

djssniper has a new favorite as of 01:31 on Jan 24, 2023

# ? Jan 24, 2023 01:18

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Jun 8, 2024 10:28

Dylan16807: May 12, 2010

SerthVarnee posted:

Having to raise the price to cover the cost of the captions being done to a professional standard is my guess.
Which would then potentially cost them sales or something?
I suppose they just decided to cut down on sales instead of waste money on having a bigger market.

That doesn't really make sense. Once they reach that point, they're going to sell at the price that makes them the most money, regardless of how much they already spent.

Coasterphreak posted:

Or, more importantly, having to take money out of the salary budget

Like, professional captioning in multiple languages for a 90 minute movie runs in the tens of thousands of dollars, which doesn�t seem like a lot until you realize that a lot of festival films are made on less than 2 mil.

"It's expensive" is an easy to understand reason. But it's not the reason they gave.

# ? Jan 24, 2023 01:21

Subjunctive: Sep 12, 2006; ✨sparkle and shine✨

Dylan16807 posted:

"It's expensive" is an easy to understand reason. But it's not the reason they gave.

The bit about it costing them sales was from buyers, not the filmmakers, no?

# ? Jan 24, 2023 01:25

Vegetable: Oct 22, 2010

Terrible Opinions posted:

Why would captions hurt a film's asking price?

My guess is it makes the film seem a bit more foreign or it affects the distributor people�s viewing experience. I don�t know how true that is; that�s why I used the word paranoia.

# ? Jan 24, 2023 03:18

je1 healthcare: Sep 29, 2015

Vegetable posted:

My guess is it makes the film seem a bit more foreign or it affects the distributor people�s viewing experience. I don�t know how true that is; that�s why I used the word paranoia.

I think that might be the reason why most people watch films without captions (when it's in their own language)

# ? Jan 24, 2023 04:18

Laterite: Mar 14, 2007; It's Gutfest '89; Grimey Drawer

also people, especially americans, don't want to read at the movies. i remember friends going apeshit at the opening scene in ingluorious basterds

# ? Jan 24, 2023 04:25

SerthVarnee: Mar 13, 2011; It has been ~~two~~ zero days since last incident.; Big Super Slapstick Hunk

Dylan16807 posted:

That doesn't really make sense. Once they reach that point, they're going to sell at the price that makes them the most money, regardless of how much they already spent.

It doesn't have to make any sense, it just has to be a hill for someone who hasn't thought it through to die on.

# ? Jan 24, 2023 11:12

smellmycheese: Feb 1, 2016

With regard to subtitling and versioning films. Just saw this on Twitter

https://twitter.com/sneakyzebra/status/1617494748331122688?s=46&t=7wgb9SigqDT60W-8eg84bw

# ? Jan 24, 2023 18:19

Agents are GO!: Dec 29, 2004

Laterite posted:

also people, especially americans, can't read

FTFY

# ? Jan 24, 2023 18:25

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Subtitles are not free. But they really aren't that expensive. We're talking about something where a whole feature length film can be captioned for less than $200, by a human; when the average budget for a Sundance film is $750,000, they can find that $200 somewhere. And if you put it on the CC layer you don't have to worry about it affecting international sales because anyone who doesn't want the captions just turns them off. Further, most of the big streaming services require captioning anyway so you're going to have to do it at some point anyway, and if your film has been selected for Sundance, there's a solid chance it's going to get some form of digital distribution.

# ? Jan 24, 2023 18:52

AceOfFlames: Oct 9, 2012

smellmycheese posted:

With regard to subtitling and versioning films. Just saw this on Twitter

https://twitter.com/sneakyzebra/status/1617494748331122688?s=46&t=7wgb9SigqDT60W-8eg84bw

I remember hearing that this film (Fall) did use deepfaking to remove all the swearing to make it PG-13 and not have to do expensive reshoots. Didn't know about the dubbing in other languages though (though it could be a proof of concept).

# ? Jan 24, 2023 18:57

credburn: Jun 22, 2016; President, Founder of the Brent Spiner Fan Club

smellmycheese posted:

With regard to subtitling and versioning films. Just saw this on Twitter

https://twitter.com/sneakyzebra/status/1617494748331122688?s=46&t=7wgb9SigqDT60W-8eg84bw

Wow, that's incredible. Honestly, moving toward getting rid of actors altogether and replacing them with AI models is an inevitability that should be embraced. Let actors be on the stage and keep the cinema for AI-created movies designed with algorithms using data fed from nonstop trend studies for a perfect never ending dopamine drip.

Honestly though Hollywood actors are a loving bizarre thing that needs to end. I like Tom Cruise, but nobody needs to be paid that much for doing the same job someone else could do. Or any of the actors in an Avengers movie; 99% of the film is in front of a green screen so why not just replace the actors as well? You save a ton of money.

# ? Jan 24, 2023 19:10

MarcusSA: Sep 23, 2007

Rick posted:

Subtitles are not free. But they really aren't that expensive. We're talking about something where a whole feature length film can be captioned for less than $200, by a human; when the average budget for a Sundance film is $750,000, they can find that $200 somewhere. And if you put it on the CC layer you don't have to worry about it affecting international sales because anyone who doesn't want the captions just turns them off. Further, most of the big streaming services require captioning anyway so you're going to have to do it at some point anyway, and if your film has been selected for Sundance, there's a solid chance it's going to get some form of digital distribution.

Yeah I�m gonna need to see your math on this one champ because there�s no drat way it�s $200 lol

# ? Jan 24, 2023 19:18

hallo spacedog: Apr 3, 2007; this chaos is killing me
💫🐕🔪😱😱

MarcusSA posted:

Yeah I’m gonna need to see your math on this one champ because there’s no drat way it’s $200 lol

Actually, this is what I was paid in like 2007 to do a script subtitle timing for a DVD so I do honestly think you might be able to get it done for $200

# ? Jan 24, 2023 19:28

Ape Has Killed Ape: Sep 15, 2005

credburn posted:

Wow, that's incredible. Honestly, moving toward getting rid of actors altogether and replacing them with AI models is an inevitability that should be embraced. Let actors be on the stage and keep the cinema for AI-created movies designed with algorithms using data fed from nonstop trend studies for a perfect never ending dopamine drip.

Honestly though Hollywood actors are a loving bizarre thing that needs to end. I like Tom Cruise, but nobody needs to be paid that much for doing the same job someone else could do. Or any of the actors in an Avengers movie; 99% of the film is in front of a green screen so why not just replace the actors as well? You save a ton of money.

Every movie becomes a horror film. I say go for it.

# ? Jan 24, 2023 20:34

Old Surly: Dec 8, 2004; and all of your troubles are solved and gone

teen witch posted:

Also go watch Crip Camp it�s really cool.

I grew up with a disabled parent and this was pretty eye opening for me even if I knew the broad strokes. Great film, still on Netflix.

# ? Jan 24, 2023 21:16

je1 healthcare: Sep 29, 2015

credburn posted:

Honestly though Hollywood actors are a loving bizarre thing that needs to end. I like Tom Cruise, but nobody needs to be paid that much for doing the same job someone else could do. Or any of the actors in an Avengers movie; 99% of the film is in front of a green screen so why not just replace the actors as well? You save a ton of money.

Wow, I can't believe that Hollywood beancounters never considered this. It seems so obvious!

# ? Jan 24, 2023 21:17

Zugzwang: Jan 2, 2005; You have a kind of sick desperation in your laugh.; Ramrod XTreme

je1 healthcare posted:

Wow, I can't believe that Hollywood beancounters never considered this. It seems so obvious!

Maybe they should pivot to anime?

# ? Jan 24, 2023 21:21

susan b buffering: Nov 14, 2016

credburn posted:

Wow, that's incredible. Honestly, moving toward getting rid of actors altogether and replacing them with AI models is an inevitability that should be embraced. Let actors be on the stage and keep the cinema for AI-created movies designed with algorithms using data fed from nonstop trend studies for a perfect never ending dopamine drip.

Honestly though Hollywood actors are a loving bizarre thing that needs to end. I like Tom Cruise, but nobody needs to be paid that much for doing the same job someone else could do. Or any of the actors in an Avengers movie; 99% of the film is in front of a green screen so why not just replace the actors as well? You save a ton of money.

# ? Jan 24, 2023 21:33

hawowanlawow: Jul 27, 2009

separate AI movie only theaters and channels that adapt to what the audience wants

they would all eventually just show trains

# ? Jan 24, 2023 22:14

Decrepus: May 21, 2008; In the end, his dominion did not touch a single poster.

Games Done Quickly by a TAS

# ? Jan 25, 2023 00:00

Zero One: Dec 30, 2004; HAIL TO THE VICTORS!

Can we all agree that if Marlee Matlin is a judge and you fail to provide captions for her then you hosed up?

# ? Jan 25, 2023 00:31

Biplane: Jul 18, 2005

I will have to wait until I actually can watch an entire AI generated movie to really know how I feel about it of course, but right now I'm honestly mildly instinctually revolted by the idea.

# ? Jan 25, 2023 01:58

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

MarcusSA posted:

Yeah I�m gonna need to see your math on this one champ because there�s no drat way it�s $200 lol

Like obviously these people have a vested interest in this since they're advocating for the profilirataion of captioning but their quote is $165 for an hour.

quote:

Let�s assume we pay $15 per hour.

Transcription. At five hours for $15 per hour, transcription costs $75.
Synchronization. At 1 hour for $15 per hour, synchronization costs $15.
Quality Review. At 1.5 hours for $15 per hour, quality review costs $22.50.
Management. At 3.5 hours for $15 per hour to determine workers, training, and oversight, management costs $52.50.
In total, the cost of in-house captioning is $165 per hour of content.

Just to spotcheck some of the assumptions in that article though the first website I clicked was offering to do it for $1.25 a minute so at least that part checks out.

# ? Jan 25, 2023 02:42

doctorfrog: Mar 14, 2007; Great.

Biplane posted:

I will have to wait until I actually can watch an entire AI generated movie to really know how I feel about it of course, but right now I'm honestly mildly instinctually revolted by the idea.

I'm looking forward to being able to tell an AI to just repackage a 3 hour movie into a 2 minute version for me, and people it entirely with anthropomorphic animals. Maybe then I'll finally see Rocky or Top Gun.

# ? Jan 25, 2023 03:18

Foxfire_: Nov 8, 2010

Rick posted:

Like obviously these people have a vested interest in this since they're advocating for the profilirataion of captioning but their quote is $165 for an hour.

I would generally expect someone doing a decent professional captioning job, especially someone who is running a business and needs to cover things like slack time between jobs and the non-wage parts of employing someone (employer side taxes, health care, office rent, utilities, ...) to be charging more than $15/hr. You could charge maybe charge like that for some countries, but it's going to barely buy you a minimum wage US/UK/French/German/Spanish/Portugese/etc person, let alone a professional.

# ? Jan 25, 2023 03:58

Voyager I: Jun 29, 2012; This is how your posting feels.
🐥🐥🐥🐥🐥

1.5 hours of quality control for a 1 hour product means they are budgeting enough time for one person to carefully watch it once.

# ? Jan 25, 2023 04:59

1stGear: Jan 16, 2010; Here's to the new us.

credburn posted:

Wow, that's incredible. Honestly, moving toward getting rid of actors altogether and replacing them with AI models is an inevitability that should be embraced. Let actors be on the stage and keep the cinema for AI-created movies designed with algorithms using data fed from nonstop trend studies for a perfect never ending dopamine drip.

Honestly though Hollywood actors are a loving bizarre thing that needs to end. I like Tom Cruise, but nobody needs to be paid that much for doing the same job someone else could do. Or any of the actors in an Avengers movie; 99% of the film is in front of a green screen so why not just replace the actors as well? You save a ton of money.

Counterpoint: AI-generated stuff is an abomination that is going to be used by capitalism to completely remove any humanity from art and generate tasteless pablum that's even less interesting and evocative than capeshit. It should all be destroyed and it's proponents driven into the sea.

# ? Jan 25, 2023 05:42

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Foxfire_ posted:

I would generally expect someone doing a decent professional captioning job, especially someone who is running a business and needs to cover things like slack time between jobs and the non-wage parts of employing someone (employer side taxes, health care, office rent, utilities, ...) to be charging more than $15/hr. You could charge maybe charge like that for some countries, but it's going to barely buy you a minimum wage US/UK/French/German/Spanish/Portugese/etc person, let alone a professional.

Voyager I posted:

1.5 hours of quality control for a 1 hour product means they are budgeting enough time for one person to carefully watch it once.

I mean I'm sure you can pay for more expensive captioning that pays their employees better and has better quality control. The point is that doing it at the base level is not this super expensive thing, and a much better alternative than "no subtitles at all" which is the current state people who have films with much higher than the average are opting for at Sundance.

# ? Jan 25, 2023 06:40

credburn: Jun 22, 2016; President, Founder of the Brent Spiner Fan Club

1stGear posted:

Counterpoint: AI-generated stuff is an abomination that is going to be used by capitalism to completely remove any humanity from art and generate tasteless pablum that's even less interesting and evocative than capeshit. It should all be destroyed and it's proponents driven into the sea.

What is capeshit?

I don't disagree with you, but there's nothing that can be done to stop it so

# ? Jan 25, 2023 09:42

AceOfFlames: Oct 9, 2012

credburn posted:

What is capeshit?

Superhero movies I assume. Going to start using that word now, lol.

EDIT: I admit that for a split second my brain parsed that word as "movies showing endless footage of geographical capes".

# ? Jan 25, 2023 09:55

GhostDog: Jul 30, 2003; Always see everything.

credburn posted:

I don't disagree with you, but there's nothing that can be done to stop it so

Sure there is:

1stGear posted:

It should all be destroyed and it's proponents driven into the sea.

# ? Jan 25, 2023 13:00

Voyager I: Jun 29, 2012; This is how your posting feels.
🐥🐥🐥🐥🐥

Rick posted:

I mean I'm sure you can pay for more expensive captioning that pays their employees better and has better quality control. The point is that doing it at the base level is not this super expensive thing, and a much better alternative than "no subtitles at all" which is the current state people who have films with much higher than the average are opting for at Sundance.

The example you listed was some frictionless vacuum hypothetical with as much connection to reality as those Walmart employee finance guides that assume you don't own a car or heat your apartment.

It's not a useful reference point for the actual starting costs of captioning. I'm not arguing against captioning, but that's not a realistic example.

# ? Jan 25, 2023 14:05

Alaois: Feb 7, 2012

1stGear posted:

Counterpoint: AI-generated stuff is an abomination that is going to be used by capitalism to completely remove any humanity from art and generate tasteless pablum that's even less interesting and evocative than capeshit. It should all be destroyed and it's proponents driven into the sea.

you have a league of legends avatar

# ? Jan 25, 2023 15:11

TotalLossBrain: Oct 20, 2010; Hier graben!

Curious. I'm very smart.

# ? Jan 25, 2023 15:46

1stGear: Jan 16, 2010; Here's to the new us.

Alaois posted:

you have a league of legends avatar

That was drawn by a person who's spent thousands, if not tens of thousands of hours to master their craft so they can have their work stolen by a talentless rear end in a top hat who spent about five minutes resizing it in Paint to make it into an avatar for a dead gay comedy forum. Mashing keywords into an imagebot will never replicate that level of passion and skill.

_{The artist goes by France Mansiaux, they post neat stuff.}

# ? Jan 26, 2023 09:42

arsenicCatnip: Dec 23, 2022; :33< i KNOW, i was speaking metafurrikitty :33

AI 'art' is automated thievery peddled by musk-worshipping dipshits mad that artists won't work for them for exposure, but on the other hand League of Legends is very bad and very stupid so who's to say who's in the right

# ? Jan 26, 2023 13:05

the holy poopacy: May 16, 2009; hey! check this out; Fun Shoe

arsenicCatnip posted:

AI 'art' is automated thievery peddled by musk-worshipping dipshits mad that artists won't work for them for exposure, but on the other hand League of Legends is very bad and very stupid so who's to say who's in the right

unironically yes

# ? Jan 26, 2023 16:25