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It's on the Monroney since those are independent entities, is my guess. Useless information incoming: Gulf States Toyota and Southeast Toyota are two independent distributors with exclusive territory rights - so they have rights to selling and marketing new cars, parts, etc across some pretty big parts of the country. If you buy a new Toyota in those territories, it was sold by a Toyota entity to GST or SET and then sold by them on to their own independent franchise dealer network. Nat'l is the Toyota company Toyota Motor Sales (TMS), which covers everything that the two independent distributors don't. So that's the west coast, mountain west, Midwest, Atlantic and Northeast. Back in the day, TMS was a west coast org bringing cars from Japan to the West Coast, so they didn't really want to mess around with setting up a dealer network in the South and so arranged for independent distribution and shipment of cars to Jacksonville (SET) and Houston (GST) to cut costs and complexity. A similar phenomenon exist with Subaru, where SNE (Subaru of New England) is an independent distributor with full territory rights in New England.
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Feb 5, 2023 17:25
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     kodiaq, 2 litre TDI, 6 speed manual, 4x4, edition model, 2019 plate, 41 thousand miles, three year approved warranty and it's all mine fuckin' loving it so far, thanks for the assist thread
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Feb 5, 2023 17:47
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Ah, thanks for the Prius “Natl” explanation. I’m not at the paying for random Carfax reports phase, and I was worried it was a retired fleet vehicle. I’m purposely eliminating those from anything I’m considering.
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Feb 5, 2023 18:14
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I've lurked the thread for a long time, and until this morning I had never heard of 'unhorsing', or the car financing falling through after the customer drives off the lot. Anyone ever had it happen to them?
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Feb 5, 2023 19:13
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There's a variety of reasons the standing thread advice is get preapproved by a local credit union but that is basically the most important reason. They aren't exactly doing credit due diligence on a Saturday afternoon. The article has a lot of peak abusive results but the usual story is you get surprise interest points added on a week later. You shouldn't get surprised by anything in the car buying experience because it is going to be for bad reasons and not good reasons. If you get preapproved you aren't going to get surprised by anything about down payment or interest rate.
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Feb 5, 2023 19:49
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I remember my brother buying a car from a dealership and something like this happening. I think it had something to do with his trade-in value changing and them requesting more money down or he would have to sign a new contract at a higher interest rate. This was like 20+yrs ago and he was and is a massive moron so who knows what happened during the signing of the contract prior to taking possession of the car.
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Feb 5, 2023 19:59
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Need a quick reality/expectations check - My Volvo roughly BlueBooks at a median of $817 for a trade in, but $1612 for a private sale. Looking at completed sales in the area on Craigslist and other places, I could expect closer to $2500 in a private sale with a floor of $2000. If paying "cash" at a used dealer, and trading in my car, could I expect to whittle off about $2k? Or am I dreaming? I've done used cars my whole life, and never paid the sticker price at a dealer, even for a beater. But I've also never had a car to trade. I'd welcome not having to deal with posting a $2.5k to $2k on Craigslist and dealing with all that bullshit.
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Feb 7, 2023 18:59
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Captain Log posted:I'd welcome not having to deal with posting a $2.5k to $2k on Craigslist and dealing with all that bullshit. Check CarMax. They gave me $1500 for my Honda that had a broken transmission.
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Feb 7, 2023 19:15
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There’s no margin left for the dealer if they pay at or near private party price. There are reasons a dealer may pay closer to private party, but none apply here.
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Feb 7, 2023 19:15
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Captain Log posted:Need a quick reality/expectations check - If something is grossly overpriced you might be able to haggle, but you aren't going to get someone to come down 25% on an $8,000 vehicle. Used market looks to be improving but it's still a sellers market as far as I know. Definitely get a quote from Carmax as Bank said and use that as your baseline. Also, some dealers might make it look like they are giving you a lot for your trade-in but it usually means you are overpaying on the car you are purchasing. It's important to haggle on the purchase price, and not the purchase + trade-in. Negotiate those separately but in today's world there likely won't be any negotiating at a dealer. Given your current car value and your cash budget for a new car, I would 100% recommend selling and buying private party to maximize your budget. Again, if your budget is $8,000 - $2,000 is a 25% difference if you can get $1,000 more on your car and pay $1,000 less on the next. It's more work, but likely worth it being on a fixed income. Loan Dusty Road fucked around with this message at 19:32 on Feb 7, 2023 |
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Feb 7, 2023 19:26
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Heard loud and clear, everyone. Any of the cars I’m interested in are getting BlueBooked, and almost all the dealers have their prices at the top end or over the suggested pricing. When I see most $8k cars, I’m knowing drat well that’s coming down at least $1k with cash, and hopefully more depending on the specifics. But yeah, private sale would maximize things. I just loathe the process.
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Feb 7, 2023 19:44
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Loan Dusty Road posted:Used market looks to be improving but it's still a sellers market as far as I know. I know the fact that I’m looking at diesels plays a part with the cost of diesel fuel, but I’m seeing a ton of price drops. Prices are still higher than they should be, but there’s an obvious correction happening in that market. Hopefully it continues to fall.
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Feb 7, 2023 22:42
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DesperateDan posted:kodiaq, 2 litre TDI, 6 speed manual, 4x4, edition model, 2019 plate, 41 thousand miles, three year approved warranty and it's all mine Awesome. You done good
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Feb 7, 2023 23:36
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Captain Log posted:Need a quick reality/expectations check - You're dreaming, unfortunately. Paying cash isn't an incentive as dealers can often get kickbacks on lending and if you aren't shopping at a BHPH, you not paying the loan is far more the lender's problem than the dealer's. A 2001 Volvo is not the kind of car most dealers want to be involved in reselling, so they'll only give you $auction for it because they're going to turn around and turf it at auction. The process sucks, but your price range on both ends is absolutely where private party transactions make the most sense.
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Feb 8, 2023 18:32
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Why are cars so boring and round looking nowadays?
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Feb 8, 2023 18:50
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There's only a few shapes that minimize aero noise and maximize MPG and they are all butts. The greatest revolution of 2010s car design imo is reintroducing things like lines and angles back into the butts without affecting the noise and MPG. Still butts, but slightly less.
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Feb 8, 2023 18:57
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I have a warranty question in regards to air suspension. Would it be worth it to by an extended warranty on a new vehicle with air suspension if I wanted to keep the vehicle for 8-10 years? Reading up on air suspension it seems like the compressor can go, but that's under 500 dollars to fix. The bags will go eventually in the lifetime of the vehicle, due to age, wear and tear, or both, and that can cost 1000-2000 dollars per wheel at a shop. Seems like the repairs are guaranteed, and will cost more than the warranty would. Paying upwards of 8k dollars out of pocket for repairs on an 8 year old vehicle doesn't seem worth it.
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Feb 8, 2023 20:10
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Hamelekim posted:I have a warranty question in regards to air suspension. Wouldn’t recommend the warranty, like a casino the edge is on the house that you won’t recoup the premium. The typical MO for depreciated vehicles with broken air suspension is to replace with normal non-air suspension. AFAIK.
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Feb 8, 2023 20:12
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Inner Light posted:Wouldn’t recommend the warranty, like a casino the edge is on the house that you won’t recoup the premium. Yeah I was reading about that as well. That can cost a lot as well, but I guess the cost moving forward would be cheaper, and probably easier to sell without air suspension. I still want that floaty ride in a vehicle once in my life, so maybe I will take the risk after I test drive with and without. I have read/watched a bunch of people online say not to own a Volvo outside of warranty, just like Land Rover. That seems to be the older XC60/90 and not the XC40. Not sure about reliability of the 2023+ models with the newer hybrid powertrain.
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Feb 8, 2023 20:20
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What is your projected use case that you can't afford a new vehicle 8 years from now but still must have air suspension
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Feb 8, 2023 20:44
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Hamelekim posted:I have read/watched a bunch of people online say not to own a Volvo outside of warranty, just like Land Rover. The solution to this is not "buy more warranty", it's "own it when it's new and get rid of it before it breaks too badly". Modern luxury vehicles are not designed to be affordable to maintain/repair once they get past the typical first owner's timeframe.
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Feb 8, 2023 20:45
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Mordiceius posted:Why are cars so boring and round looking nowadays? Swoopy cool cars with giant bulbous fenders from the 1930s lost favor to smaller fenders in the 1940s and mid 1950s aero became a thing (some tie in with jets) and fenders suddenly became one with the hood and main cabin The 70s and 80s had some boxy poo poo as the last dead cat bounce of interesting design but yeah ever since then it's been the slow steady march towards aero jelly beans If you're ok with never going more than 45mph you can always buy a Model A Ford, great family car, Edit: in my opinion part of what makes the jeep unique is it's one of the few cars on the road that still adheres to the "fenders don't need to be part of the hood and body" design language of the late 30s/early 40s as it traces it's design back to the 30s and 40s E1: Plymouth prowler, caterham super 7 etc too Hadlock fucked around with this message at 22:23 on Feb 8, 2023 |
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Feb 8, 2023 22:06
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Hadlock posted:it's been the slow steady march towards aero jelly beans Thank you for this information. It's super interesting. I just wish there were at least some cars out there that looks like weird future cars. Instead, we just get stuff that looks bland.
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Feb 9, 2023 00:43
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Throatwarbler posted:What is your projected use case that you can't afford a new vehicle 8 years from now but still must have air suspension I could afford a new vehicle then. Unless I become destitute or something. I want but don’t need air suspension. I don’t need much except a vehicle with good seats and a good tech package. But what want is different from what I need.
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Feb 9, 2023 01:03
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IOwnCalculus posted:The solution to this is not "buy more warranty", it's "own it when it's new and get rid of it before it breaks too badly". Are they more or less affordable than the extended warranty?
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Feb 9, 2023 01:06
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Hamelekim posted:Are they more or less affordable than the extended warranty? Depends on the deal you get. This is one of the only times "maybe lease it?" could be the right answer, but only through the manufacturer captive finance and only with the right brands and deal because they basically subsidize that. I don't know who's doing that kind of thing these days but it's been the case for Merc and BMW for a long time. Audi to an extent as well. I'm sure there are/were others.
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Feb 9, 2023 01:43
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Motronic posted:Depends on the deal you get. I guess as long as my costs don’t exceed the value of my vehicle it would be fine. Something to think on.
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Feb 9, 2023 03:32
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Hamelekim posted:I guess as long as my costs don’t exceed the value of my vehicle it would be fine. Something to think on. me, poking the sign that says "cars aren't assets" the value of your car is functionally meaningless. the only thing that matters is its utility. doing an expensive repair that keeps a car usable for a long time is a good investment.
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Feb 9, 2023 04:02
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has there ever been an air suspension setup that isn't a ticking timebomb of hilarious expense? i can think of many notoriously lovely ones, and no good ones
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Feb 9, 2023 04:09
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IOwnCalculus posted:You're dreaming, unfortunately. Paying cash isn't an incentive as dealers can often get kickbacks on lending and if you aren't shopping at a BHPH, you not paying the loan is far more the lender's problem than the dealer's. Sorry, but what's a BHPH? Google wasn't helpful. Yeah, unfortunately other folks seemed to reinforce your post. But I'll say this much - I'm researching out the rear end on anything that even vaguely catches my eye, and know which listings have some obvious cushion built into them. Many of these listings would clearly sell for at least a grand less than the sticker price. I just wasn't sure what leverage having a running, no big problem used car could bring. I live in the highest crime neighborhood in Portland, so I'm pretty invested in not having anyone come out to my condo if I do a private sale with my Volvo. Which is a hassle. I was just being too hopeful that I'd be able to dodge the process without costing myself too much money. -------- When all is said and done, there is exactly one car I'm extremely interested in purchasing. But like I mentioned, I'm going through changing banks thanks to Chime being a loving joke, so my funds are tied up until that sorts out. If this car ends up selling before I get to it, my search will probably go back into hibernation. A $4500 '13 Spark without problems, after whatever I recoup on the Volvo, is a very cheap upgrade in the grand scheme of things. But I'd still have to test drive it to see if it plays nice with my leg braces.
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Feb 9, 2023 14:32
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Buy Here Pay Here ie the lots you go to when your credit score is 500
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Feb 9, 2023 14:46
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Guinness posted:has there ever been an air suspension setup that isn't a ticking timebomb of hilarious expense? You don't hear about the good ones because they are drama free. I'm rolling on 18 year old german luxury suv air suspension that I regularly tow with and run new england forest rally every year on. It has failed exactly once, and it was my own fault because when changing the air filter I missed the hose for the suspension air pump intake, ran a rally for 2 days in dusty conditions and therefor trashed the pump. I repaired it with a $20 rebuild kit. E: no, I'm lying to you. It "failed" a second time. Truck was parked for a while and a mouse got in the back and gnawed on one of the plastic air lines. I had to repair that too.
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Feb 9, 2023 15:33
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Motronic posted:You don't hear about the good ones because they are drama free. I'm rolling on 18 year old german luxury suv air suspension that I regularly tow with and run new england forest rally every year on. It has failed exactly once, and it was my own fault because when changing the air filter I missed the hose for the suspension air pump intake, ran a rally for 2 days in dusty conditions and therefor trashed the pump. I repaired it with a $20 rebuild kit. It honestly seems like most of the cost is labour. The parts can be had for way cheaper on their own, but you need the time tools and space to change the suspension. From the videos I watched on a Mercedes the front is rather simple, the back a little more involved. The tools are basic as well, but you need the right lift and good luck if you park outside and it isn’t summer. In regards to the insurance. Seems like 55% of people never use their insurance, according to Edmonds. So it’s a coin flip as to whether or not you will need it for large repairs.
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Feb 9, 2023 17:53
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bird with big dick posted:Buy Here Pay Here ie the lots you go to when your credit score is 500 This. They're exceptionally bad all around and you might even be shopping them without realizing it because they are often the primary auto dealers that are willing to work with <$10k deals. They're the kind of place where when you buy your car it comes with a GPS tracker hacked into the wiring because they expect to repossess it in a matter of months when you can't pay the loan.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:00
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IOwnCalculus posted:This. They're exceptionally bad all around and you might even be shopping them without realizing it because they are often the primary auto dealers that are willing to work with <$10k deals. They're the kind of place where when you buy your car it comes with a GPS tracker hacked into the wiring because they expect to repossess it in a matter of months when you can't pay the loan. Any tips for dealing with these types of lots, when paying upfront? I’ve had success with them in the past, but this was primarily pre-GPS trackers being the size of a button.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:14
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IMO, You still should look at 2006-2012 Ford Escapes! there are a ton of those lil' guys around PDX. Nice boxy rear cargo style can fit a lot of stuff. This one 2 owner could probably weeze them down to $8k, V6 AWD, 6 speed auto https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=669956267 Private Party, 2 owner, could probably weeze them down to $8.5k but meh a 4cyl hybrid with cvt https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=670702831 I would avoid the post 2012 Escapes with the 4cyl turbo. Keyser_Soze fucked around with this message at 19:08 on Feb 9, 2023 |
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Feb 9, 2023 18:37
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Captain Log posted:Any tips for dealing with these types of lots, when paying upfront? They don't want your business if you're paying cash. If they reluctantly take it you're going to have to overpay. Understand these business are loan sharks first and used car dealers second.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:50
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Captain Log posted:Any tips for dealing with these types of lots, when paying upfront? I would avoid these businesses, their set of incentives is so crappy, they have little incentive to be honest with you if you ask them if the electrical system is hacked up or if there are trackers, etc.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:52
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Keyser_Soze posted:IMO, You still should look at 2006-2012 Ford Escapes! there are a ton of those lil' guys around PDX No bullshit, Escapes are one of my main searches. I really enjoyed them when I had a traveling job and got almost exclusively Ford Fusions and Escapes as my rentals. This was 2012-2013ish. Motronic posted:They don't want your business if you're paying cash. If they reluctantly take it you're going to have to overpay. Inner Light posted:I would avoid these businesses, their set of incentives is so crappy, they have little incentive to be honest with you if you ask them if the electrical system is hacked up or if there are trackers, etc. Heard loud and clear. I'll give any low end dealer a thorough Google-Stalking before considering anything.
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Feb 9, 2023 19:02
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Hamelekim posted:It honestly seems like most of the cost is labour. The parts can be had for way cheaper on their own, but you need the time tools and space to change the suspension. Insurance is not the same thing as an extended warranty
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Feb 9, 2023 19:08
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