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Hellioning posted:Oh yeah, I don't want to say that all the tragical girl stuff was bad. I enjoyed Symphogear. I just prefer more traditional magical girl stuff and I wasn't really getting it aside from PreCure. "Aside from PreCure" is a pretty big asterisk. "I'm only getting my genre fix from a show that is so popular and consistently at least decent that whenever a series ends they immediately start up a sequel" is a very lucky position to be in.  Even Gundam fans don't have a drip feed that consistent.
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Feb 8, 2023 18:33
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It was like 5 years between ibo and gwitch! I guess 86 can be thrown in the middle there as "basically the same tonal appeal"
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Feb 8, 2023 18:48
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Kanos posted:"Aside from PreCure" is a pretty big asterisk. "I'm only getting my genre fix from a show that is so popular and consistently at least decent that whenever a series ends they immediately start up a sequel" is a very lucky position to be in. Fair!
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Feb 8, 2023 19:04
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Symphogear pulls a lot more from Mecha/Precure/Kamen Rider/Nanoha than Madoka in the end. And while I get bouncing of the shows that chased Madoka the amount that got made really didn't match the level of Evangelion chase shows (probably cause the isekai/trapped in a video game boom hit shortly after and just way more stuff to adapt) Anyway Granbelm is a show that has lots of stuff I like but it just doesn't mesh into a series that really works for me. It's not bad but I don't think it hits its potential
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Feb 8, 2023 19:45
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I describe Symphogear as being the Super Robot Magical Girl anime to Nanoha's Real Robot Magical Girl anime. And you know I never put it into perspective that Madoka hit right as Isekai blew up, that does make sense.
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Feb 8, 2023 19:49
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SatoshiMiwa posted:Symphogear pulls a lot more from Mecha/Precure/Kamen Rider/Nanoha than Madoka in the end. And while I get bouncing of the shows that chased Madoka the amount that got made really didn't match the level of Evangelion chase shows (probably cause the isekai/trapped in a video game boom hit shortly after and just way more stuff to adapt) I think Granbelm is very good up until the final fight with Anna and her death, after which the personal stakes are way reduced and it's just not really as gripping. Aoi Yuki acting her rear end off salvages the final villain to some degree but the character and motivations are boring.
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Feb 8, 2023 19:51
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Omnicrom posted:I describe Symphogear as being the Super Robot Magical Girl anime to Nanoha's Real Robot Magical Girl anime. I'm a amused by this since I remember an old Nanoha / Zeorymer crossover video that seems to have been taken off of youtube.
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Feb 8, 2023 21:52
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ninjewtsu posted:It was like 5 years between ibo and gwitch! Build Divers and Re Rise were in the middle, along with several movies, tons of manga, and a couple games.
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Feb 8, 2023 22:00
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The newer build stuff doesn't exist in the same way the live action Disney remakes, or movies like CODA exist; They don't, regardless of how many people watched or liked them they've had less than zero impact on the community, large or small
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Feb 8, 2023 22:05
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Re:Rise is legitimately great and is almost as good as the original Build Fighters, though I can't really blame people being put off trying to watch it because of it sharing a name with Build Divers. But yeah, people generally only think about "main line" Gundam shows/AUs.
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Feb 8, 2023 22:11
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Schwarzwald posted:I'm a amused by this since I remember an old Nanoha / Zeorymer crossover video that seems to have been taken off of youtube. lmao i must see this
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Feb 8, 2023 22:18
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Gaius Marius posted:The newer build stuff doesn't exist in the same way the live action Disney remakes, or movies like CODA exist; They don't, regardless of how many people watched or liked them they've had less than zero impact on the community, large or small I dunno, the community does seem to have latched onto Sei's mum pretty hard.
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Feb 8, 2023 22:20
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Look, we’re just happy the weirdo perverts are lusting after a grown woman this time
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Feb 8, 2023 22:22
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Darth Walrus posted:I dunno, the community does seem to have latched onto Sei's mum pretty hard. He did say the newer Build stuff, so I assume he means Build Divers, Build Divers: Re-Rise and the battleogues, and not the original Build Fighters and maybe Build Fighters Try.
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Feb 8, 2023 23:28
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Whatever happened to that Battlelogue series? I remember the first episode and then I saw basically nothing else.
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Feb 8, 2023 23:38
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Arc Hammer posted:Whatever happened to that Battlelogue series? I remember the first episode and then I saw basically nothing else. The original had five episodes, going with various Build Fighters and Build Fighters Try characters. Episodes 3 and 4 were amusing, with 4 having the Renato Brothers get very irritated at someone not taking things seriously, and 3 being a precure gag setup. Later, Re:Rise got a Battlogue of its own (ending with a Rocky 3 moment between Barbatos and Strike Freedom), and one of the Mobile games got its own six episode Battlogue crossing over with Gundam Breaker 3.
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Feb 9, 2023 00:35
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Hellioning posted:There's a difference between (Sailor Moon spoilers) 'the main cast all die at the end of season 1 but get resurrected in the next episode' and (Madoka Magica spoilers) 'the entire show is based around the inevitable death of our protagonists, the closest thing to a good ending we have is our protagonist ascending to godhood and getting forgotten by almost everyone in order to ensure those inevitable deaths are as painless as possible, and the movies even ruin that happy ending. Yeah Madoka is loving poo poo and is a terrible influence on the medium and pop culture at large
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Feb 9, 2023 01:10
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Sorry they don't make your favorite genre or whatever but that's a hell of a take.
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Feb 9, 2023 01:18
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I'll admit I do have a personal bias against Madoka that goes beyond it going against my personal tastes, I watched a large chunk of it(including the ending) while hanging out with friends at one of the low points of a depressive episode I was having and the show's absolute miserable bleakness just quintupled my depression
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Feb 9, 2023 02:28
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people coming into the mecha thread to let everyone know they hate popular anime puella magi madoka magica i guess the current reason appears to be "because it's bad when shows are sad" which seems like an odd opinion to bring into the mecha thread but ok. i think i had an easier time sympathizing with "because it was a fad for a while"
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Feb 9, 2023 03:48
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drrockso20 posted:Yeah Madoka is loving poo poo and is a terrible influence on the medium and pop culture at large Madoka? Its just Kamen Rider Ryuki for people who think Tokusatsu is for children.
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Feb 9, 2023 03:49
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Madoka is good and it is not the show's fault that everyone, including the people who made it, wanted to chase its success.
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Feb 9, 2023 03:50
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Fivemarks posted:Madoka? Its just Kamen Rider Ryuki for people who think Tokusatsu is for children. I have always hated this comparison because of how completely off base it is. Hellioning posted:Madoka is good and it is not the show's fault that everyone, including the people who made it, wanted to chase its success. This.
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Feb 9, 2023 04:07
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The worst possibly madoka-inspired shows I can even vaguely remember are just two random LN adaptations, everything else I can think of is pretty hopeful.
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Feb 9, 2023 04:09
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There are far, far, less trashy "dark magical girl" shows than trashy isekai, or even trashy mecha shows.
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Feb 9, 2023 04:17
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only 3 of the super edgy ones got animes yeah. some people act like it was this huge trend but it just wasn't. it's 3 shows
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Feb 9, 2023 04:18
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All the Urobuchi shows I've seen seem very concept forward, character trailing; resulting in flat characters who just kind of wander around through the vast machinations of plot happening around them. I think about his quote regarding Lilla's death in Zeta a lot, and how he seems to have taken her death in exactly the wrong way, mistaking the Tominian Realism of the randomness of death in war for the navel gazing nihilism of someone like Celine. I think about the comparison between Kafka's The Trial and Nabokov's Invitation to a Beheading, there's a lot to be said about how different the means and ends of the novels are despite both involving a man entrap against his will by a society that seems set to condemn him. The basic difference between the two is that Kafka is, if not life negative, than at least suspicious of the ability of the Human animal to live happily in the world; Nabokov in contrast, even in his works touching on the most heinous aspects of humanity, is always life affirming. To make it clear Urobuchi is Kafka without the craft to truly investigate the artifice he creates, and Tomino is Nabokov with less condescension.
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Feb 9, 2023 04:46
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Blaming Madoka for the bad dark magrical girls shows would be like blaming Tomino/Gundam for bad dark real robot shows Also there is nothing wrong with having good dark magical girl shows. It can support looking at darker themes done well along with happy fun action/romance/girls dating each other. Just like mecha can support dark themes done well and robots punching robots!
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Feb 9, 2023 07:36
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SatoshiMiwa posted:Blaming Madoka for the bad dark magrical girls shows would be like blaming Tomino/Gundam for bad dark real robot shows I don't blame Madoka for dark magical girl shows. I don't even blame Madoka for creepy poo poo (tm) in magical girl shows. I blame Madoka for poo poo like Magical Burst, the same way that I blame Evangelion for Adeptus Evangelion and Bliss Stage.
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Feb 9, 2023 14:48
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I've just been exposed to this page of an unknown manga, so now I will expose the rest of you to it: I used to think Gundam was weird about rape, insofar as writers fell back on it way too much as a motive for female characters but now I'm starting to think Macross is weirder because it's writers seem to just...brush rape off as inconsequential. Isamu ignoring Guld's rape of Myung in Macross Plus before essentially equating it to a schoolboy prank is bad enough, but I at least thought it was a single, isolated incident (i.e. I memory holed the entire thing with Mylene in Dynamite 7) that had good motives behind it (i.e. forgiveness of past crimes) even if the execution was clunky, but now I found out there was a manga where Mylene apparently meets back up with the music producer who tried to roofie and date her as if it they hadn't just tried to rape her and then accepts an apology dependant on "crime of passion" (despite it needing some degree of preparation to drug her) as a momentary awkwardness; seemingly after another woman (or women) just realized how bad that producer is, and that's just loving horrifying. It's just a side story manga, and there's probably at least one example of Gundam being really lovely about rape in a manga or something too, but jesus that's loving rough. tsob fucked around with this message at 19:24 on Feb 9, 2023 |
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Feb 9, 2023 19:09
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tsob posted:I've just been exposed to this page of an unknown manga, so now I will expose the rest of you to it: Isn't that just Trash?
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Feb 9, 2023 19:27
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AtheistMantis posted:Isn't that just Trash? Nope, it's Mylene Beat now that I've gone looking, and the context isn't as bad as I'd first thought. The page in question actually comes before the producer (named Ms. Sazabi oddly enough; speaking of Gundam) has attempted to date rape Mylene. The entire manga appears to be a story around that incident, and at a guess the reason that plot point is done so quickly in the OVA may have been because the manga was always planned to be about that entire incident? Or maybe the manga was just made to try and give it a bit more depth? Not sure off hand. Regardless, what the producer is actually apologizing for is because in the first issue Mylene has a collaboration with the Jamming Birds (the manufactured pop group the UN Spacy tries to push at one point in the show) and their producer immediately acts as if Mylene is one of her artists afterwards. The reason the women at the top of the page are looking so angry is because Ms. Sazabi has just told them point blank that they're inconsequential next to Mylene, and that she can find someone with their talent any time she wants without issue while Mylene is singular. It's basically all leading up to explaining Sazabi's motives (a big crush on Mylene as a beautiful talent that is the only woman deserving of her and vice versa), and going a bit more into depth on how Mylene was saved. There's still some oddity about rape in that (a) the story exists at all, because loving why?, but also (b) the Jamming Birds girls are clearly aware that Ms. Sazabi is somewhat of a sex pest (or "dangerous" as they put it), but when one of them warns Mylene, all she does is say something akin to "watch out around her; she's dangerous", rather than actually saying "that woman's likely to sexually assault you in some fashion" and it's only later another of the band tells Ray that the producer is likely to rape Mylene. It's not "hahah, rape? Am I right" as I'd first thought though.
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Feb 9, 2023 19:37
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Flower Girl was the best character
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Feb 10, 2023 05:08
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I did love seeing Flower Girl finally deliver, but I remain forever disappointed that Veffidas didn't start singing to support Basara in the finale of Macross 7 when everyone else does.
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Feb 10, 2023 11:15
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Mecha and magical girls are overlapping genres
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Feb 10, 2023 17:01
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Stairmaster posted:Mecha and magical girls are overlapping genres Several shows make the overlap a lot more explicit, like the aforementioned Symphogear and Nanoha.
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Feb 10, 2023 17:08
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tsob posted:Several shows make the overlap a lot more explicit, like the aforementioned Symphogear and Nanoha. Also Granbelm and (to go back much, much further) Rayearth.
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Feb 10, 2023 17:24
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mai-hime seems like a major ancestor of a lot of that stuff, especially its ending arc
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Feb 10, 2023 18:03
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Mai-hime, Precure and Nanoha all airing the same year is pretty amazing even if Mai Hime didn't matter much in the long run (both cause the sequel going over poorly and Code Geass taking a lot of what Mai Hime did and taking it further)
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Feb 10, 2023 18:06
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The studio that did My-Hime also basically became permanently assigned to the Love Live industrial complex
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