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Notty posted:Movement is weak in the early game when you have access to Sigurd on smaller maps with weaker enemies. You still have an almost inexhaustible supply of warp, rewarp, and rescue staves and two dancers. Plus several of the plot maps limit movement severely anyhow. Maybe by mid game you mean chapters 18-20, because, clearing 17, it hasn't been particularly necessary.
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Feb 9, 2023 17:37
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Thanks for the advice, going Lance/axe! I was thinking Great Knight over General just from my past experiences with FE, I usually end up slowing down my whole team to make sure the General can be in front where they're needed, that or I'm just not able to get them there, and it makes me play in a more turtley, less fun, manner. The map design so far is pretty good and makes me move out of my comfort zone more than the 3H or Awakening ones too, so I anticipate really missing the Move if I go General. But yea I can always seal him over.
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Feb 9, 2023 17:44
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Notty posted:Movement is weak in the early game when you have access to Sigurd on smaller maps with weaker enemies. A lv 30 Louis on maddening will have a whole 2 more def as General so yeah it barely matters. I'd only change him to general if you want to tape Sigurd to him permanently and even then you're going to feel the lost of that 2 move more times than not. GK also synergizes better with momentum which Louis appreciates for one shotting mages
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Feb 9, 2023 17:47
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 it'd be so easy... cruel? perhaps... but funny
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Feb 9, 2023 17:47
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Perfect Potato posted:A lv 30 Louis on maddening will have a whole 2 more def as General so yeah it barely matters. I'd only change him to general if you want to tape Sigurd to him permanently and even then you're going to feel the lost of that 2 move more times than not. GK also synergizes better with momentum which Louis appreciates for one shotting mages Oh yeah, stat wise, it hardly matters at all. Great Knight even has a more flexible stat arrangement than general in general. Great Knight seems like it is a very good class overall, which feels like a weird sentence, because I am not sure if that has ever been true in a Fire Emblem I have played. But base movement, outside of maybe flying, is kind of meaningless.
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Feb 9, 2023 17:54
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https://twitter.com/roywolt/status/1623585898351718400?s=46&t=5TAupDM7tSAWe1y5Vzk6lA
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Feb 9, 2023 17:56
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All boots belong to the dancer.
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Feb 9, 2023 17:56
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The main benefits I can see for General over Great Knight is that Great Knight loses break immunity and gains an extra weakness (armored and mounted weaknesses, while General just has armored weakness). In return Great Knights get +2 Move and a second weapon type. For me, that +2 Move was enough, and it was never really that big of a deal if Louis got broken on enemy phase since I wasn't relying on him to kill everything he fought.
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Feb 9, 2023 17:57
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I think movement is still a really good stat actually it’s just more equally distributed by crunching it down. Nothing like warp and rewarp really gets worse by also having good movement on top of them
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Feb 9, 2023 17:57
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Tbh given how horny the AI is for chasing breaks, to the point they’ll go for them over damage or even kills, I don’t know if being unbreakable is even that much of a clear advantage, lol
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Feb 9, 2023 18:06
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Notty posted:Tbh given how horny the AI is for chasing breaks, to the point they’ll go for them over damage or even kills, I don’t know if being unbreakable is even that much of a clear advantage, lol True, I've had enemies go for Louis over someone they could deal like 10x the damage to just because they can break him, and then the next one goes for him again because he can't counterattack
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Feb 9, 2023 18:09
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Notty posted:Tbh given how horny the AI is for chasing breaks, to the point they’ll go for them over damage or even kills, I don’t know if being unbreakable is even that much of a clear advantage, lol There was one level where there were enemy Fracture wielders, who moved dead last every turn, who still spammed them on everyone in range even though it would never do anything at all
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Feb 9, 2023 18:10
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My maddening run is with knowledge since it's my second go in the game, I find mid-game onwards Louis even less appealing. There's a very low deployment slot for the next couple chapters after 11, and then you are given yet more amazing units with good base stats in Merrin, Pannette, Fogado, and Pandreo (The middle which go from decent to amazing into warrior reclass). Not to mention carrying over from the recent god trio of Ivy/Kagetsu/Zelkov. I could never justify running Louis over someone else, especially when that someone else could be like Pannette+Ike who, as a warrior, actually has good speed to not be doubled by most enemies outside of dagger/swordmasters.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:15
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Tae posted:My maddening run is with knowledge since it's my second go in the game, I find mid-game onwards Louis even less appealing. There's a very low deployment slot for the next couple chapters after 11, and then you are given yet more amazing units with good base stats in Merrin, Pannette, Fogado, and Pandreo (The middle which go from decent to amazing into warrior reclass). Not to mention carrying over from the recent god trio of Ivy/Kagetsu/Zelkov. Out of curiosity, how much harder does maddening feel compared to hard? I felt like 3H maddening was too big a step up from hard to be fun for me without NG+ bonuses, but Engage's seems maybe balanced in a way I'd enjoy more.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:18
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I ditched him on maddening the instant I had enough deployment slots to do so but that's cause I wanted to be a hipster and prove that you didn't have to rely on him if you didn't want to The chapter 5 and 6 bosses would be extremely annoying without him though, they're very very overtuned
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Feb 9, 2023 18:20
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Maddening Louis is basically a much, much, much better Jeigan than Vander is. He's a monstrously powerful beast early game who completely alters your approach to situations in the early stages, then tapers off into normalcy as other characters have a chance to start catching up to his enormously lopsided stats and enemies start hitting hard enough to actually damage him substantially. Even then, he doesn't stop being good and useful, he just goes from S tier super god to normal character with strengths and weaknesses. Even once he starts to fall off, he has a strong niche due to being one of the only characters who can actually survive using smash weapons without setup, and he's still a very solid choice for pulling packs of physical enemies even if he can no longer completely no sell them.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:29
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I’m kind of torn because I did my first playthrough without any DLC because I wanted the base game experience, but the DLC emblems seem hilariously overtuned and even if they weren’t, the Ch.10 spoiler ensures that just having them will significantly affect the Maddening experience. Maybe I’ll do a DLC Maddening first and a vanilla Maddening later…
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Feb 9, 2023 18:30
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I just... have never needed the movement. There's a reason no one talks about Paladins or Royal Knights. (I'm the only person I've seen mention deliberately making a Royal Knight, and I don't think I have seen anyone talk about making someone a Paladin if it's not their default) Armor gets you weird fringe bonuses from seemingly a lot of emblems, including the excellent freeze breath on Tiki. But even on Maddening, armors will get extra defense from a few sources, (even more than other units, for instance, with Ike) and be able to give it out. Byleth, for instance (although, he won't have Alear's sicko mode +3 to everything, +5 defense to either instruct or dance targets is pretty drat good.)
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Feb 9, 2023 18:33
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paladin has really good growths so i could see making jean one
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Feb 9, 2023 18:35
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I don't think anyone talks about royal knights because they're filling literally the exact same niche as griffin knights except they're on a horse instead of flying. Similar caps, similar growths, same weapon access.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:41
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There are a lot of characters that I was tempted to move into Paladin and then just.... didn't. And native "cavalry as an ability kinda really sucks" is the main reason. And that hurts to say, because I loved Cavalry in every other Fire Emblem I actually played. On another note, is it possible to play Maddening Casual, or is Maddening restricted to Classic? I was thinking another benchless run, but with randomized classes on everyone could be fun, but there's no way I want to play that on classic, but there's also no way I want to play casual on hard.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:41
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Anyone who can be a Paladin or a Royal Knight probably just wants to be a Griffon Knight instead, because it has Staff access over the former, Flying over the latter, and higher base stats over both.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:42
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Pretty sure you can do maddening casual, yes.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:43
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Louis no longer becomes the unstoppable juggernaut he was past Elusia, but he's still very effective in select circumstances. GK Louis + Ike can solo the entire left side of Chapter 14, and Louis + Leif (Resolve inherit optional) can also still solo some enemy clusters. Less of a one-stop answer to everything and more of a specialized counter you apply to certain maps. Sigurd can also still allow him to have some offensive presence with Momentum and Override, and GK is more or less the best Override user. Of course, another issue is that as a tank he'd be almost entirely outclassed by Goldmary when you get her, who when reclassed into GK has a bit less Str and a bit more Def compared to Louis, but way more Spd, because Goldmary's stats are completely cracked.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:46
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Notty posted:I’m kind of torn because I did my first playthrough without any DLC because I wanted the base game experience, but the DLC emblems seem hilariously overtuned and even if they weren’t, the Ch.10 spoiler ensures that just having them will significantly affect the Maddening experience. “Overtuned” isn’t the word I’d use for the DLC; I still don’t think they’re better than what the best emblems have to offer. If Byleth and Micaiah are S tier, then the DLC would be around A, A+ if that makes sense.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:46
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Notty posted:Anyone who can be a Paladin or a Royal Knight probably just wants to be a Griffon Knight instead, because it has Staff access over the former, Flying over the latter, and higher base stats over both. Flying does trump the only thing Cavalry has going for it, but at the cost of a much worse weakness. I'm like the biggest flying hater ever, but I largely agree with you. There's no point. And similarly, why be a paladin when you can be a wyvern knight, and have both better movement, better stats, and a better skill.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:48
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Kanos posted:I don't think anyone talks about royal knights because they're filling literally the exact same niche as griffin knights except they're on a horse instead of flying. Similar caps, similar growths, same weapon access. Royal Knights are also a Lance Fighter promotion, a class the game has no characters start with so you have to go out of your way to SS to that or use Mauvier who comes late On another note I finally realized the reason for Clanne's somewhat high STR growth, his "canon" promotion is Mage Knight (simce he starts with Sword prof but not Staff) and IS probably wanted him to be usable with Phys weapons (when Levin Sword exists).
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Feb 9, 2023 18:50
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I think the main problem with having all the DLC emblems will be that they completely negate the gameplay shift that happens after chapter 10. Also, a Camilla!Mage Knight completely usurps Ivy’s main niche…
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Feb 9, 2023 18:50
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I've been running Alear as a sword paladin in my game and she's doing fine. She's not optimal by any means, and not one of my highest performers, but she's doing fine.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:51
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I think the Cavalry unit type could've used some help. It really feels like the only one that doesn't really pull its weight--Flying just outdoes it in every way, and if you're going to have a unit be grounded, you'd probably rather them have one of the infantry unit types that offers actual bonuses. The only mounted class I actually used much was Great Knight, though I think Wolf Knight is also good (largely on the strength of daggers). If they ever do unit types again (and I really, really hope they do, it's an excellent system), maybe Cavalry could just have inherent 2-tile Canter instead of Canter being a learnable skill. If there's no Canter for infantry or flying units and it's inherent to cavalry I think that would give cavalry a good extra bit of movement flexibility and make being on a horse more valuable.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:51
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Wolf Knights have been strong for me as a Calvary class with their movement and access to knives.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:55
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Move is still very important, it's just that backup is a great unit type that more than makes up for -1 move compared to cavalry and flying. A hypothetical 6-mov backup class would probably be incredibly centralizing. You can already see this a bit with warrior because longbow gives the extra range, though it's not as good as a true extra point of movement.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:56
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Harrow posted:I think the Cavalry unit type could've used some help. It really feels like the only one that doesn't really pull its weight--Flying just outdoes it in every way, and if you're going to have a unit be grounded, you'd probably rather them have one of the infantry unit types that offers actual bonuses. The only mounted class I actually used much was Great Knight, though I think Wolf Knight is also good (largely on the strength of daggers). I agree with everything you have said that isn't specific to your playthrough, and the general consensus that Wolf Knight is probably just a better option than Paladin.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:56
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They should put less canter in these games not more
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Feb 9, 2023 18:57
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ROFL Octopus posted:“Overtuned” isn’t the word I’d use for the DLC; I still don’t think they’re better than what the best emblems have to offer. If Byleth and Micaiah are S tier, then the DLC would be around A, A+ if that makes sense. Edelgard is pretty nuts and enables some very stupid poo poo and is probably worthy of S tier, but yeah, Tiki is probably A tier. Her giant +5 stat boost crushes the early game flat, but it doesn't scale, and the transform weapons are very good but aren't as good as the forged/engraved weapons you get access to later and crucially she's stuck at range 1, which is a problem because unlike every other engage she can't use normal weapons while engaged. She has good abilities; Starsphere, Geosphere, and Lifesphere are very strong, but none of them provide exceptional field utility like some of the nuttiest main game emblems. Starsphere itself takes a long time to have a payoff on fixed growths; it's worth +3 stats over 20 levels, which is very powerful but that's also half the game worth of levels and requires either marrying that person to Tiki forever or dumping a titanic amount of sp into having it. She's definitely better than some of the more limited emblems like Celica, but she's definitely not as good as Corrin/Byleth/Micaiah/Ike.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:58
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RME posted:They should put less canter in these games not more Well yeah, if Canter was inherent to cavalry units and only cavalry units that'd be less canter than we have now or in 3H.
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Feb 9, 2023 18:58
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Harrow posted:Out of curiosity, how much harder does maddening feel compared to hard? Depends entirely on how much you're willing to ditch characters and embrace Backup Emblem. My life is a lot easier than Hard at times, because I'm fully embracing having 4-5 back-up characters, replacing my entire early game party with Kagetsu and future recruits, putting Corrin on Alear, etc. The stat inflation, so far as I just beat chapter 17, isn't that high. A 17 speed Pannette is not getting doubled by most enemies outside of swordmasters and Thief/wolf knights. Now people hit loving hard on the other hand, Framme is a huge weakness with her 34 hp because enemies easily one shot you.
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Feb 9, 2023 19:00
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Miftan posted:Would Jean be good even as a martial master? I'd really like someone to be able to Fist All Day but I'm not sure it's viable at all on maddening. I made him one on hard and he murders every dude. He also got a ton of str, not sure how Maddening would do it with the fixed growths or whatever
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Feb 9, 2023 19:00
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The other thing killing movement in this game is just how aggro enemies are. Most enemies in this game will come to you of their own accord, or, at the very least, if you enter the outside edge of their range.
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Feb 9, 2023 19:02
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Blackbelt Bobman posted:Amazing. They had like 100 units they could have pulled from Fates and they chose titty sister lmao Most of them suck tho. Like who else were they going to choose? AZURA?
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Feb 9, 2023 19:02
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