Nonsense posted:

Военный Осведомитель posted:

The first confirmations have appeared about the presence of new 125-mm armor-piercing sub-caliber 3BM60 "Svinets-2" shells in the ammunition of Russian tanks.

Previously only the significantly outdated 125 mm Mango APFSDS, which no longer met the necessary criteria for a modern ammunition, were seen in the combat kits of Russian tanks. Now, however, with the introduction of the latest Lead-2 projectiles in the ammunition, Russian tank crews will be able to engage supplied Western tanks in frontal projection from a much greater range.

The 3BM60 "Svinets-2" BOPS has a tungsten core and is used together with the 4Zh96 "Ozon-T" throwing charge as part of the 3VBM23 round, providing an estimated penetration of about 700mm homogeneous steel from two kilometers at right angles. The 740-mm projectile length, which is nearly the limit for domestic automatic loaders, allows it to be used only in newer tanks like the T-90A, T-90M, T-72B3, and T-80BVM.

@milinfolive

Военный Осведомитель posted:

Interestingly, back on November 2 last year, Sevastopol Governor Mikhail Razvozzhayev, at a meeting with Vladimir Putin, suggested creating unmanned maritime vehicles based on city enterprises, such as Sevmorzavod. If we summarize today's attack on the Ukrainian bridge in the Odessa region and this news, it is possible that the development of domestic sea-based kamikaze drones was given a go-ahead in the fall.

We can also assume that the "base" for the development of the Russian drone was the Ukrainian kamikaze drone thrown ashore in Crimea in the fall, which in its entirety could be studied by our specialists for further developments.

The most interesting and intriguing thing is probably the targets for these items. The Ukrainian Armed Forces do not have a full-fledged fleet, so the area of application of these drones is significantly narrowed. It is possible that in the future these drones will attack Ukrainian bridges and port infrastructure, which will cause significant damage to the AFU, but the BPA (unmanned underwater vehicle) in such a case should be much larger and more powerful.

@milinfolive

Turtle Watch posted:

I can understand not liking this war, it sucks a lot, but what I can’t understand is anyone not liking this thread. I just don’t get it.

Danann posted:

_{(from t.me/milinfolive/96822, via tgsa)}

Mango ammo being phased out in favor of Lead ammo.

_{(from t.me/milinfolive/96850, via tgsa)}

The drone used in the attack on the Zatoka bridge may have been derived off of the drones that were captured in Sevastopol.

Ytlaya posted:

It's pretty easy to understand. If you assume this war is literally the equivalent of fighting Nazi Germany (where Nazi Germany is Russia and they're going to literally genocide all Ukrainians), then any position other than outright enthusiastic support for Ukraine is profoundly immoral.

Turtle Watch posted:

I can understand not liking this war, it sucks a lot, but what I can’t understand is anyone not liking this thread. I just don’t get it.

Frosted Flake posted:

Which are in turn, the British and American mine clearing ones that made their debut in… BALTOPS22, when Nordstream and possibly Crimea rehearsals took place.

OctaMurk posted:

aint nobody playin World of Peacecraft, Peace Game: European Deescalation or World in Peace tho

Corky Romanovsky posted:

lolling as i watch a group chat slip into fascism

Danann posted:

_{(from t.me/milinfolive/96822, via tgsa)}

Mango ammo being phased out in favor of Lead ammo.

quote:

_{(from t.me/milinfolive/96850, via tgsa)}

The drone used in the attack on the Zatoka bridge may have been derived off of the drones that were captured in Sevastopol.

Horseshoe theory posted:

Is this like when Fred Christ Trump 'accidentally' attended a KKK rally in Queens?

Frosted Flake posted:

Danann posted:

_{(from t.me/milinfolive/96822, via tgsa)}

Mango ammo being phased out in favor of Lead ammo.

_{(from t.me/milinfolive/96850, via tgsa)}

The drone used in the attack on the Zatoka bridge may have been derived off of the drones that were captured in Sevastopol.

GlassElephant posted:

This shows a completely different location than the twitter thread counting the armour losses. This is along a road, and the vehicles in the pictures were in the middle of a field. Are they thinking about a different twitter thread? Is there a part of the video where the tanks drive out of the field they forgot to attach? They also seem to have cut the video right after it shows artillery hitting the area observed.

indigi posted:

takes a lot of guts to stand up to the woke mobsters by calling them retard, you're very brave

Horizon Burning posted:

shut the gently caress up retard

speng31b posted:

heres my hottest take, war is super bad. do less war and do more peace imo

Ytlaya posted:

How about...no??

Grognan posted:

people spun up by warlust and/or propaganda coming into the thread and having their say has been really amusing and interesting, and I appreciate the fact that I do not have to see violence or gore posted without explicit warning.

Turtle Watch posted:

I can understand not liking this war, it sucks a lot, but what I can’t understand is anyone not liking this thread. I just don’t get it.

e:

indigi posted:

woke mobsters

GlassElephant posted:

This shows a completely different location than the twitter thread counting the armour losses. This is along a road, and the vehicles in the pictures were in the middle of a field. Are they thinking about a different twitter thread? Is there a part of the video where the tanks drive out of the field they forgot to attach? They also seem to have cut the video right after it shows artillery hitting the area observed.

quote:

I am a big fan of J.R.R. Tolkien and his work. This admiration spans for almost a quarter of a century, however, this dedication is nothing more than a hobby without any academic aspirations. So when the Russians were starting to be called orcs after the invasion, a friend of mine half-jokingly asked me to explain the possible relevance of this metaphor in terms of Tolkien mythology.

quote:

Back then, I laughed at this idea, any op-ed on this issue would be simply regarded as ‘trolling’ and not a serious analysis. However, the thought never truly left my mind as I kept finding striking parallels between the two stories. Sometimes, the parallels were evident: it seemed as if the Russians deliberately tried to portray themselves as the antagonist orcs from the books of the professor.

After the first reports of atrocities in Bucha and other towns in the Kyiv region, I realized that Tokien’s depictions actually help us understand the nature of our enemies and see further risks with which we might meet in the long run.

quote:

The orc label was already used on the Russians since the first day of the large-scale invasion of Ukraine. Their appearance and character approved this notion – the invaders resembled a savage, angry horde, nothing in resemblance of people or even an army. This is exactly what Tolkien had in mind when writing the “Lord of the Rings,” a force of stupid and underdeveloped elements from one hand, savage and brutal from another.

This could be the end of discussion here, as presented, but this was actually an accurate metaphor that inspired the struggle against its dark forces. Nonetheless, a further analysis of Tolkien and his orc portrayal allows us to further deconstruct the Russians and see what we have refused to see before. However, prior to this, we must resolve a few philosophical dilemmas along the way.

J.R.R. Tolkien was a Catholic.

quote:

The Land of the Orcs

We should get back on track and remind ourselves why we entered the realm of fantasy – to outline the purpose in our investigation of the origin of Tolkien’s orcs, as the striking parallels can actually be seen with an existing (unfortunately), Russian threat. In fact, we can split the Russians into three groups. The first being orcs of the Maiars – the spirits which helped them take the shape they subsequently exist in, an entity which was supposed to be working for the good, but turned into evil. In this case, these are Russian intellectuals, people who have been mandated by the commoners to intervene in foreign affairs, to question the overall direction and strategy of the country and determine its values.

Russia of the XXI century exhibits the return of this intellectual class, also known as the Intelligentsia – educated individuals, who in turn do not in this case have influence (and make no attempt to) on the developmental direction of society. Even the status of ‘intellectual’ is put under doubt here as a much more fitting Soviet label ‘workers of intellectual labour’ would be a lot more appropriate. The same can be said about vloggers and online personalities, which focus on the popularization of science and other educational domains, some of which have large audiences. They are those who have achieved a lot in their lifetimes, but wasted it upon siding with evil or by staying silent.

The second group are common people that sided with evil. Using Tolkien’s mythology, these can be directly assigned to the orc label – originating from humans or elves. The third group are creatures with certain ‘upgrades’. This group is simple to comprehend – they are sadistic and psychopathic elements of Russian society who would under alternative conditions (e.g. if they would not be participating in the invasion) would be harassing their loved ones, neighbors, children and many others. Due to the Russian government’s efforts however, they received the opportunity to carry out this harassment during the so-called ‘special military operation’ in Ukraine.

How did Melkor manage to attract elves, humans and Maiars alike to the side of evil? Tolkien listed three main methods this was done. Firstly, through the process of torture and suffering, or simply the fear of imminent suffering. ‘Switch to my side and the suffering will end!’ – this was the main message voiced by Melkor. Secondly, through the use of all evil that resides in the human race’s spirits – ‘join my side and you will be able to satisfy your desires, you will gain authority, power and wealth.’ Thirdly and unsurprisingly, this concerns the appeal to the good in their hearts and souls.

This happens in the manner of appealing to the remainders of good. For example, Tolkien often outlines the motive of executing justice. The three pillars all work when the forces of evil distort the vision of the outside world. It is due to the ‘fake news’ of Melkor that he was able to convince humans and even elves to join the forces of evil. What a close resemblance to modern Russia, right? However, the most striking point is yet to come. Tolkien often outlined that the orcs served Melkor because he convinced them that humans and elves were a greater evil – orcs who have been captured by them were subject to horrifying deaths (e.g. they were eaten alive). One can say that Tolkien almost predicted the myth of the ‘crucified child’ (a Russian propaganda stunt spread a while back) 60 years ago. The same method was used to demonize the enemy and subdue the population into believing they are up against evil. As stated before, the relevant analogies of this kind are abundant.

quote:

And here, my inner Tolkienist yields to my inner sociologist. Despite the Russians demonstrating inhumane behavior, we cannot refute the fact that they are homo sapiens. Studies of the past 70 years have shown that humans are social creatures, able to avoid conflict with other humans. This notion underlines the purpose of the Stanley Milgram obedience experiment and Hannah Arendt’s A Report On The Banality of Evil book.

quote:

The Ring of Power

Yet again, it is necessary to return to Tolkien and his orcs. He continued to see the humane side of the orcs. We must do the same with Russians. Tolkien was interested in seeing the humanity in orcs, but we must investigate the opposite – where did the humanity of the Russians disappear? In other words, what happened to a group of homo sapiens who seemed to have lost empathy and their social capabilities? This question seems to be too abstract to answer in light of the current military conflict, as Ukrainians continue to die from the hands of the Russian invaders. However, we must still remember this question.

Through the use of Tolkien’s metaphor, a victory over Russia, the toppling of the regime is analogous to the victory of Suaron in the Second Era in the Lord of the Rings. Sauron’s source of power was the ring, and if it was not itself destroyed, Sauron would rise from the ashes again.

The source of Putin’s power is the ability to deprive his subjects of anything humane – a Hobbesian society, a state of chaos, a war of everyone against everyone. Today, in Russia, this is very much observable. The government is totally indifferent to the affairs of its citizens, but the citizens themselves do not see this problem, as they are too busy hating one another. Hence, comparisons of Putin’s Russia’s and Nazi Germany are false. Hitler built his support based on the cohesion of society at present.

quote:

Holodomor

quote:

There are other attempts to explain this: ‘Russians were always like this, throughout their entire history!’. This statement however can be either racist (i.e. the claim that Russians are genetically predisposed to sadistic tendencies) and the refusal to explain anything at all (the Russian case is unique). However, we need to understand how the Russians came to this state of inhumanity.

We must also look into the depth of the cause – how social, cultural economic and political factors led to a society which lives in the state of war of everyone for themselves, a society which stands by the brutal invasion of its neighbor as well as having a complete lack of interest of their own losses. Of course, this takes place under the guidance of an iron fist, which directs these attacks against its neighbor. Without this iron fist, Russian society would simply dissolve into chaos where everyone would attack one another.

Until we uncover the reasons of why Russia ended up like this, moreover – how to confront this successfully, new ‘putins’ will emerge across the world. Especially around us. Without the understanding of this distorted and monstrous authority, which can deprive people of their most basic human characteristics and without the construction of mechanisms of countering it, deputinization of Russia is improbable. And hence, the security of Ukraine is improbable as well, and in the long run – the security of the world as a whole.

Turtle Watch posted:

Putin: Worse than Sauron and Hitler…

Turtle Watch posted:

Finally found a good editorial on the war from the mainstream news:

SOCIOLOGY OF EVIL: WHY UKRAINE’S NEW LANGUAGE OF WAR USES TOLKIEN’S METAPHOR TO EXPRESS RUSSIAN BRUTALITY
https://www.milwaukeeindependent.com/syndicated/sociology-evil-ukraines-new-language-war-uses-tolkiens-metaphor-express-russian-brutality/

DancingShade posted:

Holy poo poo. One of them actually read a book that wasn't Harry Potter.

Nonsense posted:

Turtle Watch posted:

Finally found a good editorial on the war from the mainstream news:

SOCIOLOGY OF EVIL: WHY UKRAINE’S NEW LANGUAGE OF WAR USES TOLKIEN’S METAPHOR TO EXPRESS RUSSIAN BRUTALITY
https://www.milwaukeeindependent.com/syndicated/sociology-evil-ukraines-new-language-war-uses-tolkiens-metaphor-express-russian-brutality/

sorry but as a fellow orcheologist gonna call BS on the friend asking part

To defeat the orc we must understand the orc…

Some more lore happens…

This was where I started to become impressed. Anyone can call a Russian an orc but not all are ready to adapt the entirety of The Silmarillion…

bingo card keeps fillin up…

Putin: Worse than Sauron and Hitler…

…

Doesn’t quite stick the landing. Railing against orcs for pages and then trying to not sound racist at the very end. The only interesting question of the piece: how did Russians turn into orcs? The answer: I dunno lol, the end. At least there were a few paragraphs describing Melkor’s creation of the orc.

I enjoyed this, this is the pinnacle of American security state nerdistry. More people need to dig down into orc lore to discover the secret of the Russian mind using the template of racist caricatures created by beloved children’s author JK Tolkien.

DancingShade posted:

Holy poo poo. One of them actually read a book that wasn't Harry Potter.

Frosted Flake posted:

I think the point is that Ukraine wants it to happen, and that alone is dangerous and will become more dangerous as things progress.

Russian commentators draw particular attention to the 101st and Odessa but I think placing a tripwire force there as faint accompli would be so dangerous a move that even in a Ukrainian total collapse it wouldn’t be worth it.

The idea of having a peacekeeping force rapidly enter to create facts on the ground does not seem so different from Pristina Airport, and I’m sure there are senior leadership on both sides who remember that. We need Ed Sheeran commanding a recce company pronto.