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Rusty posted:Returnal Is really an amazing game from the looks, sounds design, guns, everything except for the part where I have to play the same level over and over. Part of it may be that I am bad, but I think I have played about 3 hours and am about done. Not a big fan of the meta progression type games like this. There are so many roguelites out there that I would drop dozens of hours into if they were just regular games with permanence and progression  Hopefully the fad fades out a bit, but they're so easy for devs to make...
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Feb 23, 2023 01:52
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that's sorta funny to see since I feel like roguelikes with metaprogression are way more common than those without.
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Feb 23, 2023 01:54
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Sab669 posted:There are so many roguelites out there that I would drop dozens of hours into if they were just regular games with permanence and progression As a fan of roguelikes: I agree completely. It feels like a fad where some devs realized it's much easier and cheaper to and variation and rng to a game than it is to add 3-10x of the linear content, and we've since seen no end of games that are neither good to play-once-and-be-done, nor are good roguelites.
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Feb 23, 2023 01:57
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much like publishers chased GAAS not realizing that people only have time in their life for one or two GAAS they can return to, i feel like the thousands of roguelites are oversupplying the demand. even if you looooove roguelites, you probably do not play 500 of them, yet 500 of them are released every year hoping to be The Next Big Hit and that is not a hyperbolic number. 11 games with the roguelite tag were published on Steam in the last 48 hours. 58 this month. one of them is a Book of Demons spinoff. did any Book of Demons fans even know it exists, let alone came out? The 7th Guest fucked around with this message at 02:09 on Feb 23, 2023 |
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Feb 23, 2023 02:05
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yeah the problem is they're all trying to be infinite-replayability "forever games" but I only have one forever
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Feb 23, 2023 02:07
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People just like roguelikes right now so devs are making them. Its not necessarily easier to stretch a single digit hour game idea into a roguelike, but it does mean that you might have a shot in hell of getting by. The market for short, linear indie game experiences is even harder to succeed in than the oversaturated roguelite market.
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Feb 23, 2023 02:09
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The 7th Guest posted:and that is not a hyperbolic number. 11 games with the roguelite tag were published on Steam in the last 48 hours. 58 this month. one of them is a Book of Demons spinoff. did any Book of Demons fans even know it exists, let alone came out? Oh yea, that and the RL tag is being applied to absolutely everything regardless of merit, probably much like the souls-like tag (bug I'm less informed about that game). Like just during the nextfest, the demo for DROP (a 'hacking' game) had the rogueliketag applied to it. It's since been removed, but like wtf, there where zero similarities between the two, no matter how hard you squint.
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Feb 23, 2023 02:13
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Serephina posted:Oh yea, that and the RL tag is being applied to absolutely everything regardless of merit, probably much like the souls-like tag (bug I'm less informed about that game). metroidvania is still probably the least accurately used tag, although "immersive sim" is rocketing up the charts because zoomers think it refers to trucking/mowing simulator games to the point where some developers have "immersive sim" bundles that are just those games
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Feb 23, 2023 02:15
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Lol my favorite was last year's Roguelike sale, which included exactly 0 roguelikes in the front page lineup. Even in the 'traditional roguelike' category!
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Feb 23, 2023 02:20
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For people playing Atomic Heart, where were you supposed to find the code to get into the controls for the moving bubbles? It was the first door code that was a like 20 option set of buttons that you were supposed to put a pattern in. I'm curious because I hit a random combination of buttons and it worked the second attempt. So it's either bugged or I'm extremely good at guessing.
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Feb 23, 2023 02:38
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I don't recall what you mean by "moving bubbles", but assuming you meant it was like some lock picking mini puzzle that looked sorta like this: Yea there was an NPC or a scrap of paper or something nearby that tells you what the pattern is And I'm pretty sure that was the only hacky door puzzle of that variety (so far?)
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Feb 23, 2023 02:43
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Sab669 posted:I don't recall what you mean by "moving bubbles", but assuming you meant it was like some lock picking mini puzzle that looked sorta like this: Yeah thats the one, good drawing. I guess I just accidentally got it right because I plugged in two codes just to poke at it and then the lock fell off.
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Feb 23, 2023 02:56
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The 7th Guest posted:much like publishers chased GAAS not realizing that people only have time in their life for one or two GAAS they can return to, i feel like the thousands of roguelites are oversupplying the demand. even if you looooove roguelites, you probably do not play 500 of them, yet 500 of them are released every year hoping to be The Next Big Hit Even worse than that, I feel like we ended up in the world where the two of these got mixed, so now people also expect the hundreds of roguelikes/lites to be constantly updated as though they were GAAS.
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Feb 23, 2023 02:58
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Valve just announced all the major sales/events for 2023
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Feb 23, 2023 03:15
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Why do they do major sales in late November and late December?
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Feb 23, 2023 03:23
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That's a lot less events than have been occurring in specifically the last two weeks, but that's still a lot of stuff happening.
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Feb 23, 2023 03:24
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Another reason to get cracking on my backlog of demos. Now at...741 partially thanks to back-to-back fests! (me and my digital hoarding  )
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Feb 23, 2023 03:25
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I didn't know that steam sales were a thing you could know about in advance.
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Feb 23, 2023 03:31
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CuddleCryptid posted:I didn't know that steam sales were a thing you could know about in advance.
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Feb 23, 2023 03:32
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ultrafilter posted:Why do they do major sales in late November and late December? Late November is to catch "Black Friday", the day after American Thanksgiving and a major date for both in person and online shopping and "sales". In recent years it's been creeping around, expanding across the weekend to the next Monday too. December is, of course, the christmas season. Lots of people buying stuff over the holidays both as a gift and with holiday money.
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Feb 23, 2023 03:38
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CuddleCryptid posted:Yeah thats the one, good drawing. Was the answer some cluster in the top left? IIRC it was for me. I wonder if this game does that trick where it generates the code/image on the fly or if it's just some hard coded thing.
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Feb 23, 2023 03:50
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The 7th Guest posted:the devs kind of have to know so that they can participate yeah they used to inform developers about upcoming sales privately but with the bar to publish on steam being so low now it's impossible to keep those details from leaking, so valve just posts them publicly now
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Feb 23, 2023 04:09
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Interesting, it looks like they're making bigger changes to Remnant 2 than I expected. For one, your class matters a lot more. https://fromtheashes.remnantgame.com/en/news-article/11537003
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Feb 23, 2023 04:09
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Sab669 posted:Was the answer some cluster in the top left? IIRC it was for me. I wonder if this game does that trick where it generates the code/image on the fly or if it's just some hard coded thing. It was kind of a diagonal line on the top left of the circle yeah
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Feb 23, 2023 04:19
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Mordja posted:Interesting, it looks like they're making bigger changes to Remnant 2 than I expected. For one, your class matters a lot more. That's cool, I was a little nervous until they mentioned that you can eventually switch your character between classes and even combine two into a dual-class, sounds really sweet
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Feb 23, 2023 04:43
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Regarding roguelites and game development: for the sake of comparison, Waves of Steel has no procgen content in it. I made 40 missions, by hand, and it looks like most people are completing everything the game has to offer in 10-20 hours. Which, to be clear, is just about ideal for how long I wanted the game to take. But those 40 missions took me the better part of two years to make! In comparison, Peglin has a pretty standard modern roguelite structure, and I have 30 hours logged in it. I probably could have nearly halved my development time, and made the game more addictive, if I'd used the roguelike structure. That kind of structure is very good at tickling the reward receptors in peoples' brains, and at encouraging them to play the same content over and over again. From a business standpoint, if you can make your games more cheaply, while still making a game that people feel like they're getting their money's worth out of, you need a strong reason not to do that. Whereas, if I'd just cut off my hand-created campaign at, say, the 8 mission mark, most players would feel like they weren't getting enough game for their money, and I would have been wrecked in reviews and community response.
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Feb 23, 2023 05:02
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Mordja posted:Interesting, it looks like they're making bigger changes to Remnant 2 than I expected. For one, your class matters a lot more. "The choice you make before starting the game, when you have no information to base the decision on or even context for how the game plays, is now harder to change" doesn't exactly sound like an upgrade to me. Give me more games like Monster Hunter where you don't choose a drat thing before you start playing, and can in fact bring ten different weapons/classes on your first ten hunts and it doesn't set you back in any way.
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Feb 23, 2023 06:11
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I want to second that both Heat Signature and Severed Steel are loving amazing.
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Feb 23, 2023 07:05
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Spider Man update oc PC is pining Windows Defender with a wacatac trojan detection. They've yoinked it and reverted game to the previous version.
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Feb 23, 2023 13:18
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New Jeff Minter game Akka Arrh came out on Tuesday, any impressions? Though to be honest I’m enough a fan of llamasoft weirdness that I’ll probably pull the trigger this weekend anyway. https://store.steampowered.com/app/2005680/Akka_Arrh/
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Feb 23, 2023 13:52
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Regarding roguelites and game development: for the sake of comparison, Waves of Steel has no procgen content in it. I made 40 missions, by hand, and it looks like most people are completing everything the game has to offer in 10-20 hours. Which, to be clear, is just about ideal for how long I wanted the game to take. But those 40 missions took me the better part of two years to make! In comparison, Peglin has a pretty standard modern roguelite structure, and I have 30 hours logged in it. This is a pretty good take, and pretty reasonable. For me, I am an Old Gamer™ - and roguelikes do a great job of fitting into my erratic kid-driven lifestyle. Short, incremental sessions, with a meta progression, and if I die/get distracted/have to put it down - it literally doesnt matter. Whereas with a more traditional game, stopping points are much less readily available (ymmv, of course); and starting a session feels "heavier" for lack of a better word - so sometimes I'll skip on something like Dead Space when I've got an uncertain amount of time, and Roguelikes fit this REALLY well. For me, it's not so much the dopamine hits (though totally cool), but rather a genre that fits into my life as my lifestyle has changed over time Walked fucked around with this message at 15:07 on Feb 23, 2023 |
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Feb 23, 2023 15:04
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Morter posted:Did someone say horny? 
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Feb 23, 2023 16:37
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So far in Returnal, I feel like I am losing less progress in dark souls, than I do in Returnal. The game spams weapons at you that are exceptionally marginal in difference, meaning it doesn't matter so much what weapon you use besides it being a shotgun or pistol or whatever, it has some bonuses with negatives, with the risk of damaging your inventory or making it otherwise harder to progress, with some not hard choices to make, except some rare combinations are more obviously bad. If you die, you have to deal with a somewhat lengthy by comparison reload, and there's no checkpoints so you start the whole level over, with nothing but some permanent items. If you're really far into the map, this is nothing but frustrating. At least in dark souls you can get your items back on the way to running back to the boss and skipping the level. So, so far while it's pretty and the lore is what I want, the game play is a bit frustrating especially since each level, if you want to completely explore it, which I do, because dopamine, then you run the risk of starting completely over. Also, if you don't, you may be stuck with lovely items and weapons. To a point, I know, get gud, but I also think I don't really have the patience for that kind of frustration anymore. Maybe for Pro Gamers it makes them feel good, but I'm kind of tired of being angry when gaming.
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Feb 23, 2023 16:56
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I feel that a lot of people want Returnal to be a completely different game than what it is, which obviously is a completely legitimate thing to feel, but then you don't actually want Returnal. If you take out the roguelite elements, the death penalties and all that jazz you'd be taking away what makes the game tense and enjoyable in my opinion. I also think it's a bit reductive to imply that the roguelite aspects are part of a trend or whatever. It is a roguelite, but that's just what it is.
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Feb 23, 2023 17:07
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Unfortunately, I don't know of other games that give the same random loot and abstract drip fed lore, that aren't dark souls adjacent.
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Feb 23, 2023 17:26
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https://www.fanatical.com/en/bundle/safe-in-our-world-charity-bundle-2023 Fanatical-Safe in our world charity bundle ($12 minimum, you can choose to donate more.) quote:Plate Up!
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Feb 23, 2023 17:31
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I can't believe this flash in the pan roguelite fad is still going on after ten years.
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Feb 23, 2023 17:34
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No Wave posted:I can't believe this flash in the pan roguelite fad is still going on after ten years. There's plenty of average joes that are still discovering the slow dopamine drip feed of a roguelite metaprogression system. There was this one boomer shooter not too long ago, I don't remember what it was called but you were playing as a patient in an asylum, that people were raving about, despite it using the worst loving mechanics of the roguelite fad, purely because it was those people's first expose to the systems. Jack Trades fucked around with this message at 17:43 on Feb 23, 2023 |
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Feb 23, 2023 17:41
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I'm actually just trolling, roguelites are staying they're amazing. They're a reversion to a more historical norm where games were hard and an hour long and you played through the same content repeatedly. But with lots of spice and randomness to make it funner.
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Feb 23, 2023 17:45
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No Wave posted:I'm actually just trolling, roguelites are staying they're amazing. They're actually a reversion to a more historical norm where games were hard and an hour long and you played through the same content repeatedly. But with lots of spice and randomness to make it funner. The parts you're talking about are very good and make for interesting games. And also not the reason why those games are popular.
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Feb 23, 2023 17:46
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