Ukraine: The Aristoblyats

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Internet VFW > Ukraine: The Aristoblyats

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; by Fluffdaddy
(and can't post for 3 days!)

Flyinglemur posted:

Re: carrier chat

A carrier fresh out of the shipyard with newly retooled screws is way faster than you would imagine. Way.

Source: me, an old retired submarine SONAR Tech

What's the weirdest stuff you ever heard via hydrophones?

# ? Feb 26, 2023 17:55

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# ? Jun 7, 2024 08:07

My Spirit Otter: Jun 15, 2006; CANADA DOESN'T GET PENS LIKE THIS

SKILCRAFT KREW Reppin' Quality Blind Made American Products. Bitch.

Goddamnit. The goddang tankie admin squad closing the gbs thread has made this thread move too fast.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 17:57

Generation Internet: Jan 18, 2009; Where angels and generals fear to tread.

That's the number I recall from the exercises I've done. All the urban ops instructors I've had have always emphasized that 'green army' urban operations (as distinct from special forces) consist of sending entire platoons at a time into a meatgrinder.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:02

bulletsponge13: Apr 28, 2010

Historically, MOUT/FIBUA suffer 70% casualties- the US Army MOUT manual at one point said plan for that.
That doesn't mean killed- that means hit in some fashion that made them combat incapable; that doesn't mean they can't fight, but they aren't going to be hitting the next building.

One Marine Platoon took 90% casualties crossing a single street in Hue.
Personally, I've dont think I've ever felt so vulnerable as driving through Sadr City and seeing every loving place that could stack sandbags was a fighting position. Even Fallujah was mostly leveled to retake it. Having experience in assaulting a city- unless you level that loving place, it's an exhausting exercise in repeating fear. It's a pre-planned line of defenses, pre-built for the defender. Urban warfare is 360° in a way that most isn't; sewers, basements, easily to transit high ground, plenty of concealment, a little less cover, but that is what dirt is for.

A squad of men who are willing to put in work, the tools to work, and the time to set up, could bleed a company dry, and that's before they get devious with the dastardly poo poo. You tell someone that there are no rules, and the gloves are off? poo poo, I can think of a dozen defenses that would make the Hague cringe.

An overlooked aspect of Urban warfare is how much security it really needs. You can't clear buildings, and leave them unoccupied or unguarded- the enemy will filter back and gently caress your lunch meeting sideways.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:07

Deus Ex Macklemore: Jul 2, 2004; Zelensky's Zealots

Rust Martialis posted:

What's the weirdest stuff you ever heard via hydrophones?

Your mom

I'm sorry, that was mean. It was your aunt.

I heard some Paganini way the hell out in Pearl. That's also a lie, I was never in the PAC fleet.

Boing fish is the real answer.

My Spirit Otter posted:

Goddamnit. The goddang tankie admin squad closing the gbs thread has made this thread move too fast.

I'm over of these posters, sorry.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:08

Murgos: Oct 21, 2010

Valtonen posted:

An assault company with a single embedded MBT is very much sounding like return to submitting tanks to infantry command circa 1930s. Which, in the most AT-saturated area of the planet reads to me like �we have no idea how we could make this work so we are just throwing poo poo at the wall and seeing If it sticks�

While individual organic tank support to your company sounds like the best thing to help the grunts since sliced bread it also means any tank combat that tank is always piecemeal devoured by the enemy.

Isn�t this the raison d��tre of the MPF concept though? I guess actually that proves the point in calling it MPF and not a tank which was the internet focus a few weeks ago. �It�s not a tank so don�t try to fight tank battles with it� probably applies equally to a tank supporting an infantry platoon as in its not a tank unit so don�t fight tank battles with it.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:13

armpit_enjoyer: Jan 25, 2023; my god. it's full of posts

Hello, another GBS thread poster here.

I'm not entirely clear on whether policy/"diplomacy" discussion is welcome here, but: China proposed a "12-point plan to end the war in Ukraine" and it's, uh, Not Great!

https://twitter.com/TheIntlMagz/status/1629562328386510848

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:19

BadOptics: Sep 11, 2012

Murgos posted:

Isn�t this the raison d��tre of the MPF concept though? I guess actually that proves the point in calling it MPF and not a tank which was the internet focus a few weeks ago. �It�s not a tank so don�t try to fight tank battles with it� probably applies equally to a tank supporting an infantry platoon as in its not a tank unit so don�t fight tank battles with it.

It gives all those T-62's something to do at the very least.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:21

Power Khan: Aug 20, 2011; by Fritz the Horse

More calls

https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1629804546036776962

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:27

FrozenVent: May 1, 2009; The Boeing 737-200QC is the undisputed workhorse of the skies.

armpit_enjoyer posted:

Hello, another GBS thread poster here.

I'm not entirely clear on whether policy/"diplomacy" discussion is welcome here, but: China proposed a "12-point plan to end the war in Ukraine" and it's, uh, Not Great!

https://twitter.com/TheIntlMagz/status/1629562328386510848

Like anything else, it�s fine if no one�s being an idiot about it.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:36

zone: Dec 6, 2016

https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1629881909030387712
Igor's one year review of the military situation so far. To sum up, he believes now that it's impossible for the Russian armed forces to win. There was also a lot of coping about the disastrous result in Hostomel, the Kherson "goodwill gesture", Ukraine buying sufficient time to gain back the initiative and military equipment supplied, and then striking back at Russia. He freely admits that they're in a much worse position now than they started off at during the height of summer last year. Finally he added that in the event of Ukraine deciding that Transnistria should be freed from Russian forces, it would be impossible to do anything about it.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:42

Shaman Tank Spec: Dec 26, 2003; *blep*

mlmp08 posted:

Anyway, I hope the newfound lurkers and readers like long-ish, boring policy updates full of things like �Not much this update, USAI process means this is months out.�

Love 'em. Hope you guys in turn will put up with a Finnish Defence Force reservist who isn't super into the fascist country next door who keep threatening to invade or nuke us and would like to see Ukraine kick their asses.

On that topic, Finnish Broadcasting Company posted a four page long article about how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has changed the political discourse about Russia in FInland.

YLE posted:

Russia is being spoken of at the highest levels of Finnish politics very directly, more directly than at any time since World War II. In an interview recently published in the American CBS TV channel's 60 Minutes program, Prime Minister Sanna Marin estimated that Russia poses a threat to all of Europe.

- They invaded another country, are murdering civilians, destroying infrastructure. Russia is a threat to us all, and thereforce we must ensure that Ukraine triumphs.

In Ilta-Sanomat (a Finnish tabloid), in April 2022, Marin criticised Russia's leader in a way we are not accustomed to.

- He is acting in a completely insane way. His actions are completely senseless and without any humanity. He has revealed his true face of evil.

Finland's government has never before spoken of Russia this directly, without euphemisms or watering down the message.

The change has also shown in President Sauli Niinist�'s use of language. For instance, in his traditional New Year's Eve speech Niinist� compared his eastern colleague Putin to the bloodiest dictator in the Soviet Union's history, Josef Stalin.

The chair of the Parliament's Foreign Affairs Committee, Jussi Halla-aho (True Finns) has spoken in a direct fashion about Russia.

- The war in Ukraine won't end until enough Russian soldiers have been killed to make continuing the war impossible, either politically or militarily, to Russia's leadership. Therefore it is a good thing to kill Russian soldiers, and Ukrainians must be aided in killing them, Halla-aho wrote in January.

Professor of Communications at the University of Helsinki, Anu Kantola, calls this change of tone historical.

- The tones used have definitely become stricter, because Russia's invasion of Ukraine is such a remarkable action. The invasion closed the door on any possibility to negotiate any kind of settlement. Behind this tone is also the quickly submitted NATO application, which revolutionized Finland's security situation.

Professor of Communications at Tampere University, Pekka Isotalus, agrees with Kantola.

- The rhetoric used by Finland's leadership changed overnight. So did our entire relationship with Russia. Therefore the rhetoric is perfectly in step with our policies.

The discussion in the Institute of Foreign Affairs' 2006 report on Finland's foreign threats is illustrative.

- Russia is more willing, able and motivated to use military power to further its political and economical goals.

At the time of publication the report didn't really interest many people. Instead it was criticized for being too narrow and for scaring people with Russia.

Similar reprehension was directed at Jyrki Hakamies (National Coalition) who can be considered the champion of more direct speech about foreign affairs. When he acted as Minister of Defence, H�k�mies gave a speech during a visit to Washington where he outlined Finland's foreign threats: "Russia, Russia and Russia". This speech in September 2007 caused concern and offense and electrified Finland's political atmoshere.

It wasn't even a year later from this speech in Washington when Russia was already fighting a war in Georgia.

Widespread military actions were started in Georgia late on the 7th of August in 2008. It's quite telling that Finland didn't outline its official position on the crisis in Caucasus until three weeks after the war had started. This delay was blamed on a busy travel schedule for Finland's top politicians. Then prime minister Matti Vanhanen (Central Party) was watching the Olympic games in Beijing, and president Tarja Halonen traveled to the same location as Vanhanen returned to Finland.

And so on. As some people no doubt know from the existence of Finlandization as a term, we've basically been in Russia's (and the Soviet Union's) pocket despite being notionally independent since 1917. Our policies towards Russia have been those of appeasement and pretending we're all good friends, while trying to ignore the constant air space violations, threats of invasion and even nuclear threats. It all changed last year, and it feels pretty good. Appeasement is not a solution.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:55

A.o.D.: Jan 15, 2006

Shaman Tank Spec posted:

Love 'em. Hope you guys in turn will put up with a Finnish Defence Force reservist who isn't super into the fascist country next door who keep threatening to invade or nuke us and would like to see Ukraine kick their asses.

On that topic, Finnish Broadcasting Company posted a four page long article about how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has changed the political discourse about Russia in FInland.

And so on. As some people no doubt know from the existence of Finlandization as a term, we've basically been in Russia's (and the Soviet Union's) pocket despite being notionally independent since 1917. Our policies towards Russia have been those of appeasement and pretending we're all good friends, while trying to ignore the constant air space violations, threats of invasion and even nuclear threats. It all changed last year, and it feels pretty good. Appeasement is not a solution.

An inside Finnish perspective on Finnish-Russo relations is very welcome.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 18:57

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; by Fluffdaddy
(and can't post for 3 days!)

Shaman Tank Spec posted:

Love 'em. Hope you guys in turn will put up with a Finnish Defence Force reservist who isn't super into the fascist country next door

Hey, as a resident of Denmark, I understand the feeling here, but in times like this we simply need to put up with Sweden.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 19:23

Power Khan: Aug 20, 2011; by Fritz the Horse

Deliveries incoming

https://twitter.com/LivFaustDieJung/status/1629910596190625807

# ? Feb 26, 2023 19:27

EorayMel: May 30, 2015; WE GET IT. YOU LOVE GUN JESUS. Toujours des fusils Bullpup Fran�ais.

Forgotten Weapons also has a relaxed 27-minute compare/contrast video on Russia VS Finland regarding Russia VS Ukraine, whether or not some of you already saw it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sbmgOiQWjc

# ? Feb 26, 2023 19:29

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; by Fluffdaddy
(and can't post for 3 days!)

If one of those just fell out, does it have some arming distance or is he.... quite?

# ? Feb 26, 2023 19:29

Computer viking: May 30, 2011; Now with less breakage.

Rust Martialis posted:

Hey, as a resident of Denmark, I understand the feeling here, but in times like this we simply need to put up with Sweden.

Yeah, hard times require hard sacrifices. :norway:

# ? Feb 26, 2023 19:30

Karma Comedian: Feb 2, 2012

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1629908533146681344?t=6Q5haoVBHeJGoYB51EOJcg&s=19

Ope

Just a couple idiots bragging about war crimes under the warning.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 19:41

zone: Dec 6, 2016

There's no medicine for regret in the world. At least they'll be treated fairly in a POW camp.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:03

CommieGIR: Aug 22, 2006; The blue glow is a feature, not a bug; Pillbug

EorayMel posted:

Forgotten Weapons also has a relaxed 27-minute compare/contrast video on Russia VS Finland regarding Russia VS Ukraine, whether or not some of you already saw it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sbmgOiQWjc

Sadly I no longer frequent Forgotten Weapons due to Ian's recent spat deciding to side with Rhodesian Apologists and Bigots.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:24

Soul Dentist: Mar 17, 2009

There was also that big flattering profile of Azov Battalion with the Nazi symbols on the compound gate etc. that happened right before the war popped off

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:28

BadOptics: Sep 11, 2012

CommieGIR posted:

Sadly I no longer frequent Forgotten Weapons due to Ian's recent spat deciding to side with Rhodesian Apologists and Bigots.

Yeah, it was a pretty cool channel to see weird one-off guns or the evolutionary ancestors of modern-day ones, but Ian's had too many "incidents" concerning associating with or almost publishing far-right/supremacist types. (Here's hoping that Battle Order is chill as that's a cool channel on military organization both historical and current....)

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:28

My Spirit Otter: Jun 15, 2006; CANADA DOESN'T GET PENS LIKE THIS

SKILCRAFT KREW Reppin' Quality Blind Made American Products. Bitch.

Ok, are rhe fuckin azovs nazis or not. Half the people say yes and half the people say no. with russia saying yes, im inclined to believe no but who fuckin knows at this point

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:30

FrozenVent: May 1, 2009; The Boeing 737-200QC is the undisputed workhorse of the skies.

My Spirit Otter posted:

Ok, are rhe fuckin azovs nazis or not. Half the people say yes and half the people say no. with russia saying yes, im inclined to believe no but who fuckin knows at this point

They sure love Nazi imagery. So yes, they are Nazis.

Now it�s fairly likely that most of the deeply Nazi people who joined for the ideology are dead and a lot of the current members are just people from Azov who joined to defend their homeland. But, you know. Nazi imagery.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:32

Philonius: Jun 12, 2005

armpit_enjoyer posted:

Hello, another GBS thread poster here.

I'm not entirely clear on whether policy/"diplomacy" discussion is welcome here, but: China proposed a "12-point plan to end the war in Ukraine" and it's, uh, Not Great!

https://twitter.com/TheIntlMagz/status/1629562328386510848

So their peace plan basically boils down to 'Why don't we just talk it out guys' , and 'economic sanctions are never ok, even if some random country, could be anyone really, decided to invade Taiwan'.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:32

Generation Internet: Jan 18, 2009; Where angels and generals fear to tread.

My Spirit Otter posted:

Ok, are rhe fuckin azovs nazis or not. Half the people say yes and half the people say no. with russia saying yes, im inclined to believe no but who fuckin knows at this point

Yes and there's a subset of extremely online Ukranians who will call any journalist who has at any point covered the far-right in Ukraine a Russian shill, including Eliot Higgins/Bellingcat.

I think it's a testament to Brown Moses' work that he can get CSPAM and Azov to hate him equally.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:36

Just Another Lurker: May 1, 2009

EorayMel posted:

Forgotten Weapons also has a relaxed 27-minute compare/contrast video on Russia VS Finland regarding Russia VS Ukraine, whether or not some of you already saw it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sbmgOiQWjc

Sorry man, he turned bad... or finally showed his true form in the past few weeks. :rolleyes:

Unsubbed and no longer watch him.

edit: on the plus side; your avatar is now officially evil.

Just Another Lurker fucked around with this message at 20:49 on Feb 26, 2023

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:40

mikerock: Oct 29, 2005

Isn't Azov a totally different organisation now than it used to be? My understanding is that it was definitely ultra-nationalist when it was raised as a volunteer battalion after the Crimean annexation and the Donbas invasion/insurgency in 2014, but it was brought into the regular forces, reorganised, and purged of the far-right elements a few years later.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:42

Soul Dentist: Mar 17, 2009

Weren't they holding that plant for a long time and sustaining heavy casualties? I'd bet one way or another most of the people who started the war wearing Nazi insignia are dead now. As for how many new joiners? Couldn't tell you

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:47

RoyKeen: Jul 24, 2007; Grimey Drawer

Just Another Lurker posted:

Sorry man, he turned bad... or finally showed his true form in the past few weeks.

Unsubbed and no longer watch him.

Is there any info/link on this? Did some phone googling but didn�t find anything specific.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:48

Pine Cone Jones: Dec 6, 2009; You throw me the acorn, I throw you the whip!

https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1629930159422808066?t=iHoVLiUdSMDpTFrV47gCxA&s=19

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:53

Just Another Lurker: May 1, 2009

RoyKeen posted:

Is there any info/link on this? Did some phone googling but didn�t find anything specific.

edit: this page, hope i did it right this time: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3894692&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=317

Just Another Lurker fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Feb 26, 2023

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:53

zone: Dec 6, 2016

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1629916420992540675
POW exchange happened.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:55

Humbug Scoolbus: Apr 25, 2008; The scarlet letter was her passport into regions where other women dared not tread. Shame, Despair, Solitude! These had been her teachers, stern and wild ones, and they had made her strong, but taught her much amiss.; Clapping Larry

Whole bunch of stuff in this thread, here's a sample...

Beeb posted:

Sounds about right

Also Ian just wholesale severing with Karl and InRange and throwing in with Brownells after Karl and Sinistral got booted off arfcom for pushing back against violent shitheads.

Apparently this has been an ongoing thing for a while.

Tempted to message Karl in a few days and gently suggest he use this as a teachable moment to get Phagan to break from kiwifarms, since the overlap mentality there and arfcom is a flat loving circle.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:58

Nuclear Tourist: Apr 7, 2005

CommieGIR posted:

Sadly I no longer frequent Forgotten Weapons due to Ian's recent spat deciding to side with Rhodesian Apologists and Bigots.

I stopped watching Forgotten Weapons because I got tired of the youtube algorithm flooding my recommendations with extremely sus right wing gun fetishist channels every time I watched a video of his. Doesn't surprise me that he's chummy with that kind of crowd.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 20:59

EorayMel: May 30, 2015; WE GET IT. YOU LOVE GUN JESUS. Toujours des fusils Bullpup Fran�ais.

Humbug Scoolbus posted:

Whole bunch of stuff in this thread, here's a sample...

I didn't know this. I should've. Sorry for any potential derailing. gently caress. :smith:

# ? Feb 26, 2023 21:04

Just Another Lurker: May 1, 2009

Pine Cone Jones posted:

https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1629930159422808066?t=iHoVLiUdSMDpTFrV47gCxA&s=19

If it was Ukraine then Belarus would have to show they were doing something, very lucky partisans.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 21:08

McNally: Sep 13, 2007; Ask me about Proposition 305

Do you like muskets?

Nuclear Tourist posted:

I stopped watching Forgotten Weapons because I got tired of the youtube algorithm flooding my recommendations with extremely sus right wing gun fetishist channels every time I watched a video of his. Doesn't surprise me that he's chummy with that kind of crowd.

Now I'm starting to worry what kinds of things I'm lumped in with through the aLgOrItHm

# ? Feb 26, 2023 21:09

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# ? Jun 7, 2024 08:07

RoyKeen: Jul 24, 2007; Grimey Drawer

Thanks for the FW/Ian details. Off to unsub.
Sorry for the derail.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 21:10

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